Mayo Forum

Club Championship - Release of club players

(Oldest Posts First)

I heard yesterday that the Mayo mgt team have scheduled Mayo Snr training for Tuesday evening, meaning that Mayo players will not be available to train with their clubs on the week before the championship. This is a total disgrace. This is an important week for clubs as some maybe out after this weekend.

Feel especially sorry for clubs like Castlebar, Ballintubber, Breaffy, Aughamore that have numerous players on the county panel.
How are club managers supposed to prepare for Championship without their full panel.

3 years ago a Snr Club got a motion passed that county players HAD to be released back to the clubs for the full week before championship and was brought up again at the last county board meeting.
Mayo County Board are washing there hands of this again.

Also, Mayo mgt team organised training for the Tuesday before the last championship weekend, against the motion that was agreed.
County Board need to protect the clubs and cancel Mayo training.
It would probably be good for mayo players to get back to their clubs for a week. No game for 3 weeks anyway.

mayoman01 (Mayo) - Posts: 5 - 20/06/2016 12:23:29    1869514

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The county team should take preference in a situation like this. At the end of the day, those teams have strong squads and are still in the group stages of the championship, they are good enough to manage without the group of players in the mayo matchday squad. Fact is a lot of those teams will be coming up against the same problem, so it balances out to a certain degree.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 20/06/2016 12:42:33    1869540

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How does the county team take preference at this stage? The county team borrows the players from the clubs. Its a championship week for the clubs not the county. If the clubs can survive without their county players then why bother planning the county championship around the Connacht and All Ireland championship.

smillyrilly1 (Mayo) - Posts: 5 - 20/06/2016 13:02:06    1869564

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Replying To TheMaster:  "The county team should take preference in a situation like this. At the end of the day, those teams have strong squads and are still in the group stages of the championship, they are good enough to manage without the group of players in the mayo matchday squad. Fact is a lot of those teams will be coming up against the same problem, so it balances out to a certain degree."
Clubs with county players ONLY want to have their county players for training on 6 occasions (max) in a full year. That is if they get to a county final. 3 group games, QF, semi-final and final. They don't see their county players only before championship games and now this has changed too. . It's not as if the clubs are doing anything only training. All the club manager wants is to prepare the best they can with their best players and their starters. How do you prepare for a game if the players don't even know the tactics etc? Not too much to ask for.

mayoman01 (Mayo) - Posts: 5 - 20/06/2016 13:07:05    1869572

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Replying To TheMaster:  "The county team should take preference in a situation like this. At the end of the day, those teams have strong squads and are still in the group stages of the championship, they are good enough to manage without the group of players in the mayo matchday squad. Fact is a lot of those teams will be coming up against the same problem, so it balances out to a certain degree."
County should never take preference over club! EVER!

number_1 (Mayo) - Posts: 64 - 21/06/2016 10:23:42    1870044

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The county team does not exist without the club. There are a bandwagon of GAA fans out there in most counties that wouldn't be able to find the front gate of their local club. A release to their clubs will be no harm.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 10417 - 21/06/2016 11:09:17    1870077

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Bearing the Galway game in mind, I don't think the county management are being unreasonable in this case.
So long as they don't dog the players at training tonight.

pdempsey (Mayo) - Posts: 1313 - 21/06/2016 11:18:00    1870080

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You simply cant have it every way. Dublin are willing to push their club championship off without issue. They have way more clubs than we do, but they are willing to accommodate the county team, even if that means making things harder for themselves. That is the price of winning things. We talk about wanting to win so much, but not if we have to actually be put out in the slightest way ourselves it seems. If we aren't willing to do those things - the things other teams are willing to do - then we are talking through our hats about wanting to win, and furthermore, others are more deserving of winning than we are.

Like how can we ask the players to keep going to the well, to keep doing more than other teams, when we wont do anything ourselves for their cause when the opportunity arises?

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 21/06/2016 11:56:17    1870105

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Replying To TheMaster:  "You simply cant have it every way. Dublin are willing to push their club championship off without issue. They have way more clubs than we do, but they are willing to accommodate the county team, even if that means making things harder for themselves. That is the price of winning things. We talk about wanting to win so much, but not if we have to actually be put out in the slightest way ourselves it seems. If we aren't willing to do those things - the things other teams are willing to do - then we are talking through our hats about wanting to win, and furthermore, others are more deserving of winning than we are.

Like how can we ask the players to keep going to the well, to keep doing more than other teams, when we wont do anything ourselves for their cause when the opportunity arises?"
I think you might find that in Dublin they have a huge issue with running their senior championship of over a 6 week period where games are crammed in. Alan Brogan has highlighted this in an article in the Irish independent about his return to club football and he even stated that he didn't realise at the time when playing for Dublin how little time he spent with his club. County teams and club teams in hurling and football have all proven its not about the amount you do, it's the quality and effort applied to what you do. Having a vibrant and competitive club championship is a key part of been real contenders for an All Ireland. I think getting the players back with their clubs gives them a chance of not going to the well. it'll do the lads good rather than over analysing a performance that was out of character.

smillyrilly1 (Mayo) - Posts: 5 - 21/06/2016 12:51:24    1870154

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Kilkenny seem to have no issue releasing players back to clubs during the intercounty season.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 10417 - 21/06/2016 14:19:43    1870228

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Replying To number_1:  "County should never take preference over club! EVER!"
100 % correct

Robroy1 (Leitrim) - Posts: 121 - 21/06/2016 14:48:01    1870250

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Replying To smillyrilly1:  "I think you might find that in Dublin they have a huge issue with running their senior championship of over a 6 week period where games are crammed in. Alan Brogan has highlighted this in an article in the Irish independent about his return to club football and he even stated that he didn't realise at the time when playing for Dublin how little time he spent with his club. County teams and club teams in hurling and football have all proven its not about the amount you do, it's the quality and effort applied to what you do. Having a vibrant and competitive club championship is a key part of been real contenders for an All Ireland. I think getting the players back with their clubs gives them a chance of not going to the well. it'll do the lads good rather than over analysing a performance that was out of character."
I think you will find that Dublin push back their championship to suit their county team, which was exactly my point - they are willing to do that. The clubs are willing to take on that hardship for the greater good of the county. As for alan brogan, that seems a bit of a populist article to me. How could he not be aware of where his own time was being spent?

Also, do you not see your point contradicts itself? Dublin have 3 sams in 5 years, they prioritise their intercounty team over club championship every year, to the nth degree. So much for this spiel about a vibrant and competitive club championship being important... Furthermore, has it hindered Dublin clubs? They certainly have contested enough all Ireland club semis and finals of late to suggest otherwise.


Im not suggesting that we push it all back or go as extreme as they go, Im simply saying we need to be willing to play a round of group games - where many teams who are playing each other are in the same boat anyway - for the good of the county team. Either that or cancel them for again. It isn't that big of an ask in fairness.
Personally, Id be for playing them - gaa is a team game. The best squads will prevail. It isn't as if these teams cant field, they are by in large all big senior clubs - many have 2 teams. Now the easiest thing in the world to do here is get up on a high horse about the clubs being this and that and whatever else you want to claim. Or we can use our heads and take the pragmatic approach - like Dublin have - and ask ourselves the question, do we want to win or just want to talk about wanting to win?

You can spin it as many different ways as you like, but that is what it comes down to - are we willing to match what others are doing?

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 21/06/2016 15:21:33    1870281

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Replying To TheMaster:  "I think you will find that Dublin push back their championship to suit their county team, which was exactly my point - they are willing to do that. The clubs are willing to take on that hardship for the greater good of the county. As for alan brogan, that seems a bit of a populist article to me. How could he not be aware of where his own time was being spent?

Also, do you not see your point contradicts itself? Dublin have 3 sams in 5 years, they prioritise their intercounty team over club championship every year, to the nth degree. So much for this spiel about a vibrant and competitive club championship being important... Furthermore, has it hindered Dublin clubs? They certainly have contested enough all Ireland club semis and finals of late to suggest otherwise.


Im not suggesting that we push it all back or go as extreme as they go, Im simply saying we need to be willing to play a round of group games - where many teams who are playing each other are in the same boat anyway - for the good of the county team. Either that or cancel them for again. It isn't that big of an ask in fairness.
Personally, Id be for playing them - gaa is a team game. The best squads will prevail. It isn't as if these teams cant field, they are by in large all big senior clubs - many have 2 teams. Now the easiest thing in the world to do here is get up on a high horse about the clubs being this and that and whatever else you want to claim. Or we can use our heads and take the pragmatic approach - like Dublin have - and ask ourselves the question, do we want to win or just want to talk about wanting to win?

You can spin it as many different ways as you like, but that is what it comes down to - are we willing to match what others are doing?"
If you push back a county championship for the good of a county team does not guarantee an All Ireland win. That Dublin team have been dominant for a lot of other reasons than pushing back the club championship. Do you not think that having a strong club championship is important?
What are we "claiming" the clubs to be , something they are not? I think this current Mayo set have more than matched what others are doing, especially over the past 5 years, so much so that the rest of Connacht have stood up to us and tried to emulate the Mayo set up.

smillyrilly1 (Mayo) - Posts: 5 - 21/06/2016 16:38:38    1870346

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Replying To smillyrilly1:  "If you push back a county championship for the good of a county team does not guarantee an All Ireland win. That Dublin team have been dominant for a lot of other reasons than pushing back the club championship. Do you not think that having a strong club championship is important?
What are we "claiming" the clubs to be , something they are not? I think this current Mayo set have more than matched what others are doing, especially over the past 5 years, so much so that the rest of Connacht have stood up to us and tried to emulate the Mayo set up."
If you push back a county championship for the good of a county team does not guarantee an All Ireland win.

Nobody claimed it did. Nothing guarantees you an all Ireland to be fair.
It definitely lowers possibility of injury and gives guys more time to prepare as a group though, which would increase the chances of winning, would it not? Are you not willing to give them every chance we can?


That Dublin team have been dominant for a lot of other reasons than pushing back the club championship. Do you not think that having a strong club championship is important?

But who says it wouldn't be strong because they have to play one group game? It would still be strong either way. Dublin clubs have been dominant countrywide using their system. How can it be claimed that their club system isn't strong? There is no correlation between moving a round of games and a weak county championship. Try as you might to make that connection, the evidence tells us that it isn't there.


What are we "claiming" the clubs to be , something they are not? I think this current Mayo set have more than matched what others are doing, especially over the past 5 years
smillyrilly1


Ah come on. How can you claim we have 'more than matched what others are doing', when you are making the point to not do what the all Ireland champions are doing in the same breath? You cant have it both ways. Clearly we aren't more than matching anyone, when we have guys not making points as to why we shouldn't match them...


You aren't addressing any of my points head on. You are just talking in generalisations as far as I can see. But you can dance around it all day. The bottom line remains the same. Are we willing to do everything in our power or not? That is a genuine question by the way.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 21/06/2016 17:03:23    1870362

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Replying To TheMaster:  "If you push back a county championship for the good of a county team does not guarantee an All Ireland win.

Nobody claimed it did. Nothing guarantees you an all Ireland to be fair.
It definitely lowers possibility of injury and gives guys more time to prepare as a group though, which would increase the chances of winning, would it not? Are you not willing to give them every chance we can?


That Dublin team have been dominant for a lot of other reasons than pushing back the club championship. Do you not think that having a strong club championship is important?

But who says it wouldn't be strong because they have to play one group game? It would still be strong either way. Dublin clubs have been dominant countrywide using their system. How can it be claimed that their club system isn't strong? There is no correlation between moving a round of games and a weak county championship. Try as you might to make that connection, the evidence tells us that it isn't there.


What are we "claiming" the clubs to be , something they are not? I think this current Mayo set have more than matched what others are doing, especially over the past 5 years
smillyrilly1


Ah come on. How can you claim we have 'more than matched what others are doing', when you are making the point to not do what the all Ireland champions are doing in the same breath? You cant have it both ways. Clearly we aren't more than matching anyone, when we have guys not making points as to why we shouldn't match them...


You aren't addressing any of my points head on. You are just talking in generalisations as far as I can see. But you can dance around it all day. The bottom line remains the same. Are we willing to do everything in our power or not? That is a genuine question by the way."
Master all your point are based on the county winning an all Ireland and thats what every mayo man wants. Thats a point we can agree on. The issue that was raised in this thread was the release of players to their clubs and not the moving of championship games. There has to be some give and take from the county and the clubs I agree.This however can be overly one sided in my opinion. I still stand by my belief that this week the players should have been released back to their clubs for championship. I am sure you know the answer to your question, everyone involved with Mayo is doing their upmost to achieve the ultimate of lifting Sam. We will see how things pan out over the coming weeks. It'll do the lads good to get back into some club action and move on from the defeat against Galway.

smillyrilly1 (Mayo) - Posts: 5 - 21/06/2016 22:20:34    1870522

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Replying To yew_tree:  "The county team does not exist without the club. There are a bandwagon of GAA fans out there in most counties that wouldn't be able to find the front gate of their local club. A release to their clubs will be no harm."
Great point and especially true in Mayo where we are the best supported team in the country but generally only get at most 1500-2000 people at our county final. Longford typically gets 5000.

BuffyBoffy (Mayo) - Posts: 244 - 22/06/2016 10:04:03    1870607

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