Limerick Forum

Limerick v Kilkenny

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I have never posted here but I always read the Forum. I was gutted and so disapointed for this group of players walking out of Croke Park on Sunday. We just fell short to KK on Sunday, it could have gone either way. One thing that I have to disagree with is on some comments in saying we are just short/need more players in order to break through and win an All Ireland. It's always good to think about improving the team etc, but we have to look at it as two great chances of winning an All Ireland have gone. We seem to be forever looking foward to the next year, or, waiting for under 21's or minors to come in and make it happen...fact is, we had a good enough team to win this year and last year. I was very proud to be a Limerick man on Sunday evening, we have a great team and management set up.

LMKmaninTIPP (Limerick) - Posts: 2 - 12/08/2014 21:02:50    1636001

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LMKmaninTipp - I see where you're coming from but I'd slightly disagree. I agree that we can't be looking towards the following year and that we need to really go for it every year - and that's exactly what Limerick did. Limerick left everything behind them in both Pairc Ui Chaoimh and in Croke Park, but we were just short on both occasions. That's no coincidence. If we were good enough to win the All Ireland we would have won those games. We can't be filling ourselves with regret and feeling sorry for ourselves and coming out with hard luck stories. Limerick have been doing that since 94 and it needs to stop.

Look, we played 4 championship games - won 2 lost 2. Yeah, maybe we could have pipped Cork and maybe we could have pipped KK. But we didn't. And we need more players to become better than Cork and KK. We need to get to the stage where we're not looking for a lucky break to beat those teams. We have to get to the stage where no matter what Cork and KK throw at us they won't beat us. We're not there yet but we're not far off.

We have a huge foundation built but we're not quite there yet. We have to add a few players next year. The same 15 next year won't do. We have to keep going forward or there's a danger we will end up the way Dublin did this year. Two more top quality backs and one more top class forward and we could do it.

poc_saor (Limerick) - Posts: 203 - 12/08/2014 21:39:16    1636033

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Think we need new players to freshen things up but I agree with limk man living in tipp( welcome) we were good enough to win it last year.

We could have won last Sunday n would really fancy ourselves against tipp or cork.

So he is right we have lost 2 chances.

However it not all doom n gloom. We have improved hugely on 2013 in particular on management side. Now if we can add few new players we can push on. However we will have to close it out. Third time lucky hopefully.

disillusiondfan (Limerick) - Posts: 4279 - 12/08/2014 21:57:06    1636050

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updewell, I completely agree with you re experimenting players in 1B and possibly sacrificing promotion. We need to blood new players and give them game time - that's far more important than doing well in the league. The likes of Seamus Hickey and Graeme Mulcahy don't need much game time in the league. I couldn't care less about the league to be honest - although it is an important way to blood new players, but 1b is fine for that. We didn't give players a chance in the league this year and I think it cost us.

Let the Div 1a teams tear into each other in Feb and March and we can build up slowly towards another championship onslaught in 2015.

poc_saor (Limerick) - Posts: 203 - 12/08/2014 21:58:01    1636053

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Pocsaor, I'd like to commend your initial post and I want to take a few excerpts from it;

'We need to really go for it every year'
'We need to get to the stage where we're not looking for a lucky break to beat those teams'
'We're not there yet but we're not far off'
'We have a huge foundation built but we're not quite there yet'
'We have to add a few players next year'.

Pocsaor, you absolutely hit the nail on the head there. For me, we should draft in at least 5 of the current minors on the panel next year, I'm not saying onto the team directly, but I am saying onto the panel. I'm referring specifically to Cosgrave, Cian, Ronan, Morrissey and Nash. Draft them in and get them learning, create the environment.

We're so not far off this. I always think of Padraig Harrington in these circumstances. He was craving a major for many many years and his psychologist told him that it's not about going out at the start of each year to win a major. It's about going out at the start of each year to put yourself in a POSITION to win a major. KEEP DOING IT CONSISTENTLY AND YOU'LL WIN MULTIPLE MAJORS. He won three in the end. I believe that Limerick will win two of the next five All Irelands. I'm not saying we'll win it next year, but I am saying that we'll put ourselves in a position to win it, and we'll keep doing that. We'll get some breaks in Croke Park during those five years that we didn't get last Sunday - it's called the law of averages.

TJ has been given three years and listens guys, he's very sharp. It's not always that you see managers make substitutions at the right times, it's a pet hate of mine that managers delay those vital substitutions by about 10 minutes by which time the game had slipped away. TJ never did that this year, Kevin was taken off after 5 minutes of second half last Sunday - point in case. This makes me firmly believe that TJ is certainly shrewd enough to know where we have weaknesses, and we have probably two in the backs and two in the forwards, if not three in the forwards. I would give Breen the number 14 jersey by the way, I think he's a bit limited out the field.

But we have the players coming through to slot in and we'll continue to have players to slot in, our schools systems which is finally up and running will ensure that. It's a very optimistic time for us. Remember it's about putting ourselves in the POSITION to win each year. We have been doing that for the past two years where we had no foundation to start with. We'll do it for the next five years with a very solid foundation.

Is mise le meas.

Limk_for_Life (Limerick) - Posts: 30 - 13/08/2014 08:40:55    1636064

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Have to agreed with Batman on Tom Condon. Probably himself, Downes, O'Brien and O' Mahony didn't reach the levels they are capable of this year but they are proven inter county players and definitely not ones that we can afford to be without. Condon is a class player on his day. Poor Downes looked like he lost all confidence by the KK match. Hurling is a cruel game at times but he has the talent so i have no fear that he will be back
Just on the league, hopefully with a 3 year term now in the bag TJ can really plan long term and take a serious look at new players in the league. Some of the Na Piarsaig boys never got a real break last year and there really is no excuse in 1b for that

dingo1 (Limerick) - Posts: 281 - 13/08/2014 09:49:40    1636087

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please post this message, its my views/opinions i'm not out to slate anyone.

i think Kevin should have been taken off after 10 minutes of first half, or even on the basis of performance he would have struggled to start the game under a more ruthless manager.

lets face it i think TJ needs help in there, he's appointed now so of course i'll back him but he wouldnt have been my choice.

we need someone that can make the changes- the small changes that win games! i fear this is where TJ is limited.

of course we've had a great year, fantastic, but in the words of Hickey we're sick of moral victories!

our back 3 i think are solid,
half back line i'd keep faith with along with mid field.

its up front we need to change a few things

low ball to dowling __- didnt work not sure he has the pace for this tactic.!

mulcahy to me had a great year compared to last few.

dissapointed in ST in the club scene he's more feared than anyone but he just cant translate that to county team.

Breen also should have been taken off at half time on sunday, saying that he has had a great year and i think he has loads to offer but it just didnt happen last sunday for him.

also when we got on top last sunday we reverted to playing short ball, this was when we needed to kick on!

TJ and panel, thanks for a good year.

mackeystand (Limerick) - Posts: 157 - 13/08/2014 10:11:27    1636099

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It was a great effort on Sunday and could have been won. I don't want to be negative but some tactics/decisions are worth highlighting.

1. Delay it making substitutions: It was obvious that Downes was struggling from the start and should have been taken off earlier.
2. Colin Fennelly marking: He scored 3 point and set up 2 more in the first half. Wayne did not closely mark him. It seems he was told to hold his position. This gave Fennelly enough space to get his scores and set up the others.
3. Own puck outs: Not enough variation with these. Mostly sent Breen's direction. Why not use our two very good midfielders and put more their way.

mantalk (Limerick) - Posts: 107 - 13/08/2014 10:53:26    1636123

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13/08/2014 10:11:27
mackeystand
County: Limerick
Posts: 154

1636099
please post this message, its my views/opinions i'm not out to slate anyone.

i think Kevin should have been taken off after 10 minutes of first half, or even on the basis of performance he would have struggled to start the game under a more ruthless manager.

lets face it i think TJ needs help in there, he's appointed now so of course i'll back him but he wouldnt have been my choice.

we need someone that can make the changes- the small changes that win games! i fear this is where TJ is limited.

of course we've had a great year, fantastic, but in the words of Hickey we're sick of moral victories!

our back 3 i think are solid,
half back line i'd keep faith with along with mid field.

its up front we need to change a few things

low ball to dowling __- didnt work not sure he has the pace for this tactic.!

mulcahy to me had a great year compared to last few.

dissapointed in ST in the club scene he's more feared than anyone but he just cant translate that to county team.

Breen also should have been taken off at half time on sunday, saying that he has had a great year and i think he has loads to offer but it just didnt happen last sunday for him.

also when we got on top last sunday we reverted to playing short ball, this was when we needed to kick on!

TJ and panel, thanks for a good year.
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TJ is by far the best man to take this team forward. We are playing a proper style of hurling unlike that handball garbage under the other fella.

Half back line is far and away the biggest issue and anyone that does not see that is blind.

Dempsey needs games also as Condon had a very poor year also. I think Alan is a better hurler all round and will take his spot in the next year given the opportunity.

People talking about substitutions, what bench were ye looking at lads. Tobin and Ryan far from set the place alight when on. Tobin should have goaled and Ryan made no impact. Give me Kevin Downes any day of the week ahead of the two lads. Seanie is on the panel a long time and in truth, himself, Allis and a few others will be looking over their shoulders next year.

Hoover78 (Limerick) - Posts: 865 - 13/08/2014 11:45:47    1636168

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Hard luck to Limerick last Sunday, The only difference was that Kilkenny scored 2 goals at crucial times. As an Offaly man-with Limerick roots- I was hoping Limerick would pull it off, it would have been great for them, and for hurling if they reached the All Ireland Final.
It all starts from scratch again in 2015 for everybody, maybe Liam will be heading to Shannonside.
Hello to Disillusioned Fan, hope it happens for you next year.

thelongridge (Offaly) - Posts: 1215 - 13/08/2014 13:06:55    1636251

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I totally understand peoples frustrations with K Downes but I'd say no one is more frustrated than himself.Anyone agree with me thinking though dowling did a great job at 14 downes is a more out and out 14 and I feel the team would be better with dowling at 10,12,13 or 15 and downes at 14.In short I think dowling can play in a few positions but not so sure about downes.

someday (Limerick) - Posts: 1090 - 13/08/2014 14:04:56    1636338

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Tobin and Downes made debut in 2011 v Waterford if memory serves me right, have a look at their scores since then and come to a conclusion. Both players have huge potential and anyone that thinks otherwise or think they can't or won't deliver is dillusional. Too many people on this site are rash with judgements the same fellas who said james Ryan and David Breen were not good enough for years and now they praise them. Kevin and Sean are absolutely good enough, they are great hurlers and fast and can score, confidence is what they need but they will come right.

Is there anywhere where a scoring chart can be got of players?

gilbert (Limerick) - Posts: 27 - 13/08/2014 17:29:05    1636516

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Thanks Limk_for_life. I like your comparison to Padraig Harrington. We have to keep banging at that door until we get over the line to win an All Ireland. We won't do it by standing still though. We need to add players. I'm sure that TJ knows that and that he'll be watching the rest of the club championship with that in mind.

poc_saor (Limerick) - Posts: 203 - 13/08/2014 20:11:55    1636597

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