Provisionals turning into a joke in both hurling nd football Munster hurling about all that's keeping it alive!
Leinster football Dublin so fare ahead of everyone it's a joke pretty much same in Munster football kerry really pulling away from cork nd tipp somewhat!
I know Mayo beat Galway this year but how long have Mayo dominated for ulster football cat to watch because they all play tactical nd it's tactical against tactical!
Hurling provincial the same Leinster Kilkenny winning every year Galway put it up to them every so often just shows how much a joke when u hav a Munster team playing in Leinster come on gaa stop living in past!
Got to go to league format division one nd two no other sport in world is as uneven as the provincials?

galwaygal9 (Galway) - Posts: 202 - 18/07/2016 03:29:00    1885183

PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1903 - 18/07/2016 10:27:43    1885298

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/07/2016 18:25:19    1885782

the Provisionals aren't going away you know ;-)

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2385 - 18/07/2016 19:04:52    1885806

KennellyAirways (Tyrone) - Posts: 33 - 18/07/2016 19:42:03    1885827

MedwayIrish (Wexford) - Posts: 2324 - 18/07/2016 20:36:26    1885864

The provincial councils will not be getting rid of the provincial championships unless they can see some guaranteed numbers of what other money they will bring in. A number of people have mentioned it before and I fully believe that running the provincials in the spring as a knock out competition instead of the league is where it belongs. The winners should be rewarded with some extra points going into a new championship format. What format that would be, who knows but the current one is broken and doesn't work.
Why the powers that be can't see the sense that it's simply time to draw a line between what is the top flight and second flight is beyond me especially when they've done it in hurling for such a long time. I understand why the likes of Leitrim or Carlow want the right to play for the all ireland but it's time to cut the cr*p here, they ain't going to win it. Any fan out there wants to see teams play each other that are on the same level as one another. Surely teams in divisions 1 and 2 (just for argument sake) should play in their own championship in some sort of round robin or league format with the top 8 going on to compete in the quarter finals on. Those in divisions 3 and 4 would play in the secondary championship with the top 2 getting promotion to play in the top championship while the bottom 2 from said championship play in the secondary competition the following year.
Yes we won't have the upsets occurring like Tipp beating Cork this year but that doesn't mean that Tipp won't ever have the chance to play in the top flight, they will if they get promoted. People will say that it's not fair but is the current format fair? Should we be paying the amount of money that we're paying to watch so many landslide victories? Is it fair that Dublin and Kerry waltz into All Ireland quarter finals while Ulster teams have to play so many hard games to get to the same position?
From my own point of view, those who want to keep the existing format is for more nostalgic reasons than those who want to see the game prosper and become a stronger sport in the country. For the last 10 years or more, the hunger for higher quality games has been so evident, just look at attendances for games in the McKenna cup in January. People want to see their county players play in top games, so why are we denying them? All because of some people who like to think of the good old days and think that maybe just maybe, unlike the other 100 odd years, they might just win this one!!

keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 18/07/2016 21:35:19    1885902

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 18/07/2016 22:59:26    1885947

Alright let's keep the provincials nd watch Dublin beat every team by 20points same with Kilkenny in hurling!
We are living for Munster hurling championship?

galwaygal9 (Galway) - Posts: 202 - 19/07/2016 00:02:58    1885971

Some commas wouldn't kill you, galway gal.

My main bone of contention with the post is that the Munster hurling championship was brutal this year.

But yeah, Munster hurling and Ulster football are the two rocks on which any proposals for championship reform will inevitably perish.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 19/07/2016 00:49:34    1885980

Keithlemmon your post does not make sense in a number of ways firstly there are about 5 top teams and about 5 bottom teams everyone else is a similar enough level I don't see how an idea of a top 16 bottom 16 would do anything to help that the bottom 5 teams are not to win the b competition and with 2 getting promoted you are not even going to have a final. You see longford beating 2 division 1 teams and having a had a great chance to beat another.
You can't just demiss the viewpoint of the likes of leitrim and carlow players the are the ones training for there counties for little or no reward. You say that counties playing similar counties will attract crowds this is rubbish leitrim had about 18 times the crowd at the roscommon game then the bad at a winnable Waterford qualifer game. The reason people go to McKenna cup games is for the local rivalry the ros mayo fbd game had a big crowd as well.
You want to diminish the provincial championships which would deminish the local rivalry as well. I always laugh when I see people say football should do the same as hurling, ignoring the lower tier hurling finals get played on front of a few hundred with visually no media attention stook on a Saturday evening in early June and off course no team has come up from ring to make any impact on the McCarthy cup competition. There would be massive damage done to counties who find themselves in a bottom 16

ros1 (Roscommon) - Posts: 1211 - 19/07/2016 01:47:56    1885985

Provincial championships used to feed into an All-Ireland series of 4. This expanded to 8 with 4 qualifiers making the quarter-finals.

I think the All-Ireland series should be expanded to a Round of 16. Ireland has 32 counties. Allow 50% representation from each province in the final 16:
Munster - 2 finalists and 1 qualifier.
Connaught - 2 finalists and 1 qualifier.
Ulster - 2 finalists and 2 or 3 qualifiers.
Leinster - 2 finalists and 3 or 4 qualifiers.
* Ulster and Leinster would need an arrangement for sharing a qualifier spot. It could be 1 county entering the other's qualifier section. If Ulster has 3 qualifiers, a Leinster team would enter the Ulster qualifiers. If Leinster has 4 qualifiers, an Ulster team would enter the Leinster qualifiers. They could alternate the extra qualifier spot every year.

Draw provincial winners at home against a qualifier.
Draw provincial runners-up against the remaining qualifiers with separate draw for home team.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7840 - 19/07/2016 08:03:10    1886001

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4217 - 19/07/2016 12:19:49    1886168

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4217 - 19/07/2016 12:31:43    1886183

A league format wouldn't really work either in our games.

It has to be knock out or you won't get players sticking around to fulfill dead rubber fixtures.

Best idea I can come up with to get more meaningful games between the top teams is to link league and championship a little more.

3 tiered league

Div 1 10 teams
Div 2 10 teams
Div 3 12 teams

Introduce a new championship for division 2 and 3 teams.

Play the provincials.

Have qualifying criteria for AI series.

Division 1 teams qualify
Provincial finalists qualify
Finalists of division 2/3 championship qualify.

You'll have a varying number of teams with at least 12 teams plus any provincial finalists not already qualified.

Teams get byes and seeded then based on their league position.

Division 2 and 3 get completed before the provincial series. With their championship played in parallel to the provincial series.

The last 4 rounds of division 1 get played in parallel to the provincial series in weeks when the second tier competition is getting played.

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4217 - 19/07/2016 12:47:51    1886201

i like the provincials myself - but understand why other disagree - some of the advantages

- in general the teams are closer together so easier for travelling fans.
- local derbies will get bigger crowds
- a provincial final is a showpiece occasion - would a 3rd round game between roscommon and galway get same crowd as connacht final -probably now
- for a lot of team a provincial title is the a realistic piece of silverware they can chase -remember limerick football 2003-2010 so close to winning munster - were never all ireland contenders but that chance of munster glory kepy players and fans going.
-even for limerick hurlers a munster title (in any of the grades) is a coveted prize

i hope they are kept - so if there is change maybe go along with the jim mcguinness or sean kelly formats

janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 19/07/2016 13:20:26    1886253

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4217 - 19/07/2016 13:35:52    1886274

ROS1 - Couple of things on your post that doesn't make sense to me. I haven't fully specified a format, I think you're coming to some conclusions about a format I'm not actually proposing. I said 2 teams could get promoted but I'd be open to 4, maybe more, I'm just working in the hypothetical here. However, I do believe that there needs to be a cut off between the teams that can realistically compete against one group of teams than another. Going by your logic, it's better off that say Waterford, for example, consistently get beaten by a cricket score by Kerry and bring in a crowd than for Waterford to perhaps have a realistic chance to win some games. Would you not think that maybe if Waterford managed to pull some wins together during the summer months, it might just give them some hope for the following season, give them something to build on? Training all year to play 2 matches in the summer won't inspire people in their counties to make the sacrifices into the future but give them something realistically attainable and that might change. You mentioned that my layout would diminish the chances for the lower teams to develop even more so? How could it be worse than the current format?
It's not just local rivalry why big big crowds are attending McKenna cup games, there's also a huge appetite out there, not just in Ulster, but amongst a lot of county supporters who just want to see their teams play competitive games?
The example I used for hurling was to show that there is a tiered system. Hurling is a much more difficult game to play compared to football so naturally the gulf between the 1st, 2nd and 3rd tier would be greater. Hurling support in counties is quite selective too. However, would you see any benefit if the likes of Carlow, Derry and Mayo played in the senior hurling championship and got destroyed by the likes of Kilkenny or Tipp just so they can have that one chance to win against the big boys? Of course not, so why do we do it in football?
There is no magic formula to fix the championship. People on this site have gone on at lengths to state what advantages one crowd has over the other but the fact is that there is a gulf in ability between the top teams and the lower teams. Just because Longford got a couple of wins this year against some higher ranked teams doesn't mean that the current format works. I'm not saying that my hypothetical proposal would work either but it wouldn't be any worse than what we currently have

keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 19/07/2016 13:44:44    1886277

If the B Championship that offered Division 4 counties a qualifier spot by making a provincial final or the following year by winning the B Championship didn't even make congress, it's hard to see stricter second tier competitions being approved.

Waterford lost out to Tipperary this year. They would have been better off in the proposed B Championship. They are still included in the provincial championship. Getting out of and avoiding Division 4 has an added incentive. Leading to more competitive Divisions 3 and 4. The B winner has the carrot of guaranteed qualifier spot in the following year.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7840 - 19/07/2016 14:03:59    1886296

How do we overcome the lack of local derbies??? Its going to take away a lot

witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1604 - 19/07/2016 14:08:25    1886304