Once again the inadequacies of the All Ireland competition are shown up, for Donegal/Tyrone to win the All Ireland they will have to play at least 7 games while Mayo/Kerry/Cork can do it in 5. This is nonsense. This age old argument will be for Ulster to remain as they are but for the sport to go forward, a major rethink is needed badly. The League should be combined into the championship where, a certain time frame can be allotted to County football and give a more definite time period to clubs. I suggest that the structure of the championship be divided into 2 tiers of competition, strongest 16 on one side drawn into two lots of 8, 7 games for each team. Home receipts from each game be divided into 3/4 for home county 1/4 to home province. Gates will be up as they will have more relevance, more games/better weather etc.
top 6 in each division of the top 2 divisions end up in last 16, top team in each of the bottom 2 tiers also qualify automatically. 7th placed teams in each of the top tiers play the 2nd place teams in the lower tiers for a place in the last 16. Each province should get 2 last 16 games which will boost their coffers greatly if there is a need to pander to these organisations. All quarterfinals will be in Croke Park. Extra time if needed for all knock out games bar the final. 7 weeks of league games followed by a playoff weekend, 2 weekends to run the last 16, one weekend for the quarter finals, one weekend for the semi finals and one for the final. replays would only be required for 5 rounds. 15 weekends in total could run off the entire championship. Scrap the league as it is. Provincial titles to replace McKenna/FBD/McGrath and O Byrne cups.

bananapublican (Leitrim) - Posts: 878 - 11/10/2014 10:35:51    1662581

Have the league and championship played simultaeneously,like the pro 12 and the heineken cup, with the championship going back to old style knockout, and the league divided into 2 tiers of 16, each team plays once, whoever gets the most points wins. this would mean at least 16 games a year for each county.
leave hurling chamo the way it is, and have two groups of 8, with each team playing eachother twice (home and away), and again play both competitions simulteaneously.
This would mean loads of action during the Summer and early autumn (about 5 months), leaving the rest of the year for club duty.

The way it is at the moment is ridiculous. the intercounty season stretches out about 9 months and in that time, most counties will only play about 3 or 4 important games (keeping in mind the fact that GAA teams dont care about the league).

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 11/10/2014 15:50:25    1662666

Major surgery won't be approved.......but as I look at the 2015 draw, I have another idea for all you round robin fans.
Think of the 2015 provincial football as teams divided into 3-team sets.
Munster and Connacht have 3 teams on each side of the draw after NY is beaten.
Leinster has 3 teams in each quarter of their draw (except KK is out).
Ulster has a 3 team quarter - but let's reconfigure the 3 pairs into two 3 team sets as well - so we have 3x3.

Now, to bring variety, let each of the three 3 team quarters in Leinster, play one three from each of the other provs (LvU, LvM, LvC).
Likewise, the remaining half in both Muns and Conn play the remaining Uls trios.
After 3 games, top team in each section goes to traditional prov SFs and Finals.

omahant (USA) - Posts: 2591 - 11/10/2014 18:33:09    1662707

Change will be subject to attendance of games and nothing else.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 11/10/2014 18:51:35    1662713

Simply scrap qualifier rounds 3 and 4. Bring in a round of 16 instead. It'll streamline the championship.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 11/10/2014 20:06:57    1662740

It is laughable that the GAA constantly boasts about the equity in the organisation but in fairness the whole structure of the championship is any but, the best teams do not always come to the fore, big gaps between games, short gaps between others, no competitive games for teams until the quarter finals and the list goes on.

bananapublican (Leitrim) - Posts: 878 - 12/10/2014 11:12:19    1662796

12/10/2014 11:12:19
bananapublican
County: Leitrim
Posts: 596

1662796
It is laughable that the GAA constantly boasts about the equity in the organisation but in fairness the whole structure of the championship is any but, the best teams do not always come to the fore, big gaps between games, short gaps between others, no competitive games for teams until the quarter finals and the list goes on.

1. Provincial Preliminary Rounds
2. Provincial Quarter-finals
3. Provincial Semi-finals & Qualifier Round 1
4. Provincial Finals & Qualifier Round 2
5. All-Ireland Round of 16*
6. All-Ireland Quarter-finals
7. All-Ireland Semi-finals
8. All-Ireland Final

* Provincial winners drawn at home to a qualifier county.
* Provincial runners-up draw against a qualifier county with a separate draw to determine the home team.

All problems sorted. Just the small matter of someone bringing this to congress, getting a two-thirds majority and getting on with the championships.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 12/10/2014 11:37:26    1662801

11/10/2014 20:06:57
legendzxix
Simply scrap qualifier rounds 3 and 4. Bring in a round of 16 instead. It'll streamline the championship. No as that doesn't go far enough to solving issues with the championship. Much more is needed

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 12/10/2014 11:39:14    1662802

12/10/2014 11:39:14
ormondbannerman
County: Clare
No as that doesn't go far enough to solving issues with the championship. Much more is needed

I would see fairness in provincial groups but there is a belief that some teams will get tanked more often.

In rugby you have your 3 leagues and the top teams going into the premier competition. The provincial championships can be retained with the top half of teams in each province progressing to the All-Ireland series. The endless debate really is in how to implement something that can get an agreement by two-thirds at congress. The amateur status of the game has to be kept in mind as does the club championships. There cannot be any more weeks given to inter-county football.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 12/10/2014 12:18:49    1662824

Football - 3 leagues, 3 levels. Top 4 teams in each level go through to semi-final and final for that level. The Top level final is your All-Ireland Final.

Play your provincial championships throughout the league (cup weekends) Loads of different sports do it this way and its successful. Look at Irish Rugby, English Premiership

Similar model for hurling

Imagine the competitive games you'd have week-in week-out.

This system has proven to be fair, and the Provincial Councils are kept happy! This system may even spark the odd CupSet in the Provincial Cups, something which we are going further and further away from because the game is now virtually professional for the teams aiming to claim the top prize.
This system will also give every County a very definite season.

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 12/10/2014 12:42:23    1662827

1. Provincial Preliminary Rounds
2. Provincial Quarter-finals
3. Provincial Semi-finals & Qualifier Round 1
4. Provincial Finals & Qualifier Round 2
5. All-Ireland Round of 16*
6. All-Ireland Quarter-finals
7. All-Ireland Semi-finals
8. All-Ireland Final

* Provincial winners drawn at home to a qualifier county.
* Provincial runners-up draw against a qualifier county with a separate draw to determine the home team.

All problems sorted. Just the small matter of someone bringing this to congress, getting a two-thirds majority and getting on with the championships.

I like this. It keeps enough games going on the ground for smaller teams to have a chance, albiet whatever chance they have. An extra game would be a better way of putting it. There would be less meaningless fixtures. This would free up club fixtures at grass roots level too 2 weeks earlier for counties. It would keep a quota of games going that would keep attendances up and thus the gaa happy. It would also keep provincial structures in situ that would mean that they would not necessarily lose their appeal.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 12/10/2014 12:52:24    1662832

12/10/2014 11:39:14ormondbannerman
No as that doesn't go far enough to solving issues with the championship. Much more is needed

12/10/2014 12:18:49 legendzxix
I would see fairness in provincial groups but there is a belief that some teams will get tanked more often.
In rugby you have your 3 leagues and the top teams going into the premier competition. The provincial championships can be retained with the top half of teams in each province progressing to the All-Ireland series. The endless debate really is in how to implement something that can get an agreement by two-thirds at congress. The amateur status of the game has to be kept in mind as does the club championships. There cannot be any more weeks given to inter-county football. There could easily be a few more weeks given to inter county football but proper management of club competitions is needed. Club competitions cannot be halted because the county team are doing well.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 12/10/2014 13:03:09    1662835

That is still only 2 championship games for 8 teams. Not enough for the sacrifices made, never will improve that much if your summer is constantly cut short. It really needs a combination of the league and championship to free up more weekends for clubs. I really think the champions league type format had great merit. Open draw, 6 games each, 3 home/3 away. Could even then have a shield/trophy/ Sam McGuire competition from the remainder of the counties as they end up in their respective divisions. All the older people want no change but the resistance to change within the organisation has always been a thorn in the side of progress.

bananapublican (Leitrim) - Posts: 878 - 12/10/2014 14:14:27    1662851

The Round of 16 is an option within current structures.

If people want a group stage, the games will have to be taken from the league. A group stage at the final 16 stage means less games for the other 16. The lesser 16 will not want group games in a secondary competition.

If a group stage was implemented, I don't see a need for home and away games. One off group games would do, keeping competition fresh without too many repeat fixtures.

If the league was lessened to 5 regular league games and a final, weeks are freed up for a group stage after the provincial championships. Provincial finalists could be seeded in the first pot. Provincial semi-finalists in the second pot and then all the rest in the remaining pot. Provincial winners could be drawn in every second group ensuring they cannot meet prior to the quarter-finals. Teams could get one home game each, with a group double header then in Croke Park giving all teams at least one game in GAA HQ.

Needless to say these format discussions are a never ending debate. It all depends firstly on what direction people want the championship to take and then on getting motions passed Congress.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 12/10/2014 18:22:12    1662934

Regards the Round of 16 option, if 8 counties still having 2 games is a cause of concern, counties outside the final 16 of the championship and also outside of the top two divisions in the league could enter the Tommy Murphy Cup as an opportunity to regroup. Teams from the top two divisions outside of the final 16 could have the option. As I've suggested before, the Tommy Murphy Cup could return with the carrot of the winners being brought over to take on New York in an all expenses paid trip.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 12/10/2014 18:34:26    1662937

1. Provincial Preliminary Rounds
2. Provincial Quarter-finals
3. Provincial Semi-finals & Qualifier Round 1
4. Provincial Finals & Qualifier Round 2
5. All-Ireland Round of 16*
6. All-Ireland Quarter-finals
7. All-Ireland Semi-finals
8. All-Ireland Final

* Provincial winners drawn at home to a qualifier county.
* Provincial runners-up draw against a qualifier county with a separate draw to determine the home team.

This is just a rehash of the same not making any attempt to tackle the biggest problem which is mismatches between counties.

Cut league groups to 6/& per division. 5 matches each, 6 in divisions 5 & 6 - having only 6 teams means all matches will mean something, no league finals
Start Provincial championship early (open draw everywhere) max 4 matches per county
Top and bottom sixteen into groups of four - 3 matches each - top sixteen picked based on last 3 years championship results
These groups can be weighted to have some groups with stronger team and more qualification places into last 8. This provides more even matches, could also provide re-entry for Tommy murphy winners if necessary


Total matches per year is 5 league + 4 provincial + 6 all Ireland = 15 for successful county from ulster prelim round
Total matches per year is 6 league + 1 provincial + 3 Tommy Murphy = 10 for worst county in country

Jan preseason
Feb & March for intercounty league
April, May & June for Club champ
July for intercounty provincial champ
Aug & Sept for all ireland and Tommy Murphy
Oct & Nov for prov and all Ireland Club champ
Dec Off season


Currently maximum is 7 league + 7 championship for Div 1 ulster county drawn in premlim round
Current minimum is 8 league + 2 championship for worst team in country

tirawleybaron (Mayo) - Posts: 1109 - 13/10/2014 11:07:03    1663100

There's some good ideas here but any revamp has to keep the Provincial Championships. It's just the reality of the situation. Also here isn't the place for this. Get your ideas sent into Paraic Duffy.

The Face (Monaghan) - Posts: 890 - 13/10/2014 15:10:42    1663205

In Down we would be glad of a revamp - 20 years since we won Ulster and still no home match in the first round - away to Derry again, love that about Ulster you always get handy matches hahaha

Tim_Burr (Down) - Posts: 460 - 13/10/2014 15:21:24    1663210

Knock out football - Open Draw.

Rd 1 - London v New York

Rd 2 - 31 others v winners of Rd 1.

Rd 3 - Last 16

QF

SF

Final

WildPundit (Tipperary) - Posts: 1709 - 13/10/2014 15:48:11    1663229

Its time the GAA had an up front debate on a number of issues from scheduling, structures, promotion etc and put in place more solid measures that buries these issues for a generation.
As it is in both football and hurling we have lopsided provincial championships leaving a sour taste for many. The scheduling makes no logical sense. Some teams get to play at home all the time, some play entirely in neutral venues and some have home & away agreements. We have county ground either getting lots of use or none at all and going into disrepair. Some counties play in mickey mouse hurling competitions and many are being threatened with something similar in football. Match day experience isn't given a second thought and the overall marketing is a shambles.

RoyalBadger (Meath) - Posts: 571 - 13/10/2014 16:01:14    1663232