I started to ask this question in another thread but I don't want to take it off topic. Would Pat Gilroy have had the capital better prepared for the JMcG challenge?

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 11/09/2014 08:05:10    1650799

had connolly taken his goal chance pat gilroys name wouldnt even be on the radar
dublin didnt take their chances
donegal did
end of story
no great tactics just simple maths

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 11/09/2014 09:46:22    1650821

No question about it as far as Im concerned. He had a superior tactical knowledge. Even in 2013, look at the team that starts the final, and struggled. McCaffrey, Mannion etc all replaced. The team that actually made the difference was far more Gilroy-esque as regards lineup and set up. Dublin wouldn't have been caught the way they were against Donegal under Gilroy. The panic we seen creep in at the end, to me displays incorrect preparation. They hadn't expected to be behind at any stage. Even against Kerry in the semi the warning signs were there, the kevin mc goal that dragged them back into it was very fortunate and had that not gone in we could have had a very different narrative. You will always hammer poor teams playing like Dublin do under gavin, but against good teams who believe they can beat you, you will get caught.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 11/09/2014 09:50:11    1650824

Yes.

We still would have won though as ye wouldn't have scored as much.

squareball_1988 (Donegal) - Posts: 343 - 11/09/2014 09:52:55    1650827

Hi Hill16No1Man: On the day, Dublin werent good enough to take their chances, Donegal were. As you say, end of story.

AudiMan (Donegal) - Posts: 648 - 11/09/2014 10:26:28    1650846

They still wouldn't have won so no.........

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3734 - 11/09/2014 10:52:18    1650862

Some kerryman has been looking at my thread on the Dublin board methinks!!!

Regards,

Snufalufagus....Laochra Gael

Snufalufagus (Dublin) - Posts: 8100 - 11/09/2014 11:00:21    1650864

No way of telling. Hypothetical.

Ifs, Buts, Could of, Should of......Irrelevant.

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13650 - 11/09/2014 11:14:03    1650866

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 11905

1650824 No question about it as far as Im concerned. He had a superior tactical knowledge. Even in 2013, look at the team that starts the final, and struggled. McCaffrey, Mannion etc all replaced. The team that actually made the difference was far more Gilroy-esque as regards lineup and set up. Dublin wouldn't have been caught the way they were against Donegal under Gilroy. The panic we seen creep in at the end, to me displays incorrect preparation. They hadn't expected to be behind at any stage. Even against Kerry in the semi the warning signs were there, the kevin mc goal that dragged them back into it was very fortunate and had that not gone in we could have had a very different narrative. You will always hammer poor teams playing like Dublin do under gavin, but against good teams who believe they can beat you, you will get caught.

So Mayo or Kerry didnt believe they could beat us in 2013 !!! One AllIreland and 2 div1 leagues so far, id say you wish Horan had that incorrect preparation.
Donegal was one of those games and fair play to them they took their chances we didnt , (although that doesnt tell the full story).

AthCliath (Dublin) - Posts: 4347 - 11/09/2014 11:30:53    1650876

11/09/2014 11:00:21
Snufalufagus
County: Dublin
Posts: 7870

1650864
Some kerryman has been looking at my thread on the Dublin board methinks!!!


If that's in reference to myself, I've never been on it. Can you add a link to the thread?

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 11/09/2014 11:40:05    1650881

Athcliath........ So if it doesn't tell us the full story, would love to hear the full story

ben1977 (Donegal) - Posts: 364 - 11/09/2014 11:43:51    1650883

If that's in reference to myself, I've never been on it. Can you add a link to the thread?

_____________________________________


Go find it yourself you lazy git :)

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13650 - 11/09/2014 12:03:12    1650892

Legendtrix can you not find your way onto the dublin page yourself! its an easy enough thing to do' even for a kerryman!

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts: 932 - 11/09/2014 12:15:12    1650895

Yes he would have had them ready and won, the same way Pat Gilroy would have kerry ready and primed on sunday week.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 11/09/2014 12:24:48    1650902

legendzxix
County: Kerry
Posts: 3700

1650799 I started to ask this question in another thread but I don't want to take it off topic. Would Pat Gilroy have had the capital better prepared for the JMcG challenge?

No. Gilroy was found out tactically in 2012 v Mayo when he put out a team with 1 cornerback, 4 forwards and 4 midfielders against Mayo and fell 10 points behind before he put on a few forwards. They would have won that match if they started with the team that finished the game.

Dublin: S Cluxton, M Fitzsimons, R O'Carroll, C O'Sullivan, J McCarthy, G Brennan, K Nolan, E Fennell, D Bastick; P Flynn, MD Macauley, B Cullen, C Kilkenny, D Connolly, B Brogan.

Subs: A Brogan for Cullen, P McMahon for Fitzsimons, E O'Gara for Bastick, K McMemamin for A Brogan

tirawleybaron (Mayo) - Posts: 1109 - 11/09/2014 12:32:49    1650907

It's against my footballing religion to go on to the forum and homepage of other counties.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7846 - 11/09/2014 12:38:38    1650911

AthCliath
So Mayo or Kerry didnt believe they could beat us in 2013 !!!

No I already went into both of those games in my original post. Mayo were beaten by Gilroy's template and Kerry were beaten by 2 stroke of luck for k mc's goal. The point on those matches was the warning signs were there in both games, particularly the Kerry one.


One AllIreland and 2 div1 leagues so far, id say you wish Horan had that incorrect preparation.

Not really the point. The question was asked about Gilroy, Im simply answering that question. This infantile ethos of 'attack the poster's county' serves no purpose. Gilroy won an AI also, one where nerves were jangling and the pressure was obvious. Just like mayo stuttered on the cusp of breaking their duck, Dublin were the same with Gilroy, but he handled that pressure, I don't think gavin had them prepared to handle similar pressure this time around as regards being behind and not playing well.


Donegal was one of those games and fair play to them they took their chances we didnt , (although that doesnt tell the full story).

One of those games... where they were poorly prepared for what they were facing. Fair enough they had a goal chance with Connolly (I could make a similar point re O'Connor in the first Kerry game, but it doesn't tell the full story either). The reality is there was still an hour to play after that goal chance, so it doesn't explain everything. The question posed on this thread was would Gilroy have made the same mistake... I don't think he would have.

Here is a question for the guys attributing everything onto the genius of McGuinness, what would you say if Kerry turned around and beat Donegal?

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 11/09/2014 12:45:18    1650915

9-4 up and cruising. Gilroy would not have let a double-scores lead slip. Pat would hav locked down the Dubs' 45 at that point. Mind you under Pat, there's no way would we have hit those scores in the first place as he would never have committed those bodies forward never mind encouraging them to strike from 45-50m out from the sticks. I think there's a middle ground and Jim stubbornly stuck to the only game plan that he has used since taking the helm. I think we'll see Jim tweaking his tactics, depending on the opposition, next year. A huge and necessary lesson learned by a rookie manager.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 11/09/2014 12:52:12    1650918

Joxer, was it committing bodies forward that got those scores though? They were kicked by orthodox forwards from distance, I don't see a connection with that and guys bombing forward from the back, in fact I see the opposite, where they had enough space to drop into a pocket and get a kick at goal away.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 11/09/2014 13:14:12    1650932

The Master, Gilroys template wasnt anything like our game in 2013 against ye or Kerry.Gavin brought in the u21s and played with attacking wing backs , droped our captain from 2011 with a couple of other guys, Gilroy done brilliant in 2011 but had a poor year in 2012 ,(maybe hangover from All Ireland win who knows) but the league and early championship we were very poor. Gavin had a brilliant 2013 and a brilliant 2014 up until Donegal game , certainly from a fans point of view. Sh..t happens I think we underestimated Donegal and results up to the game gave us a false sense of where we were. Management have to take certain responsibilty for this.
After next year we can have the debate about Gavins merits. Not after 1 loss.
Im not slagging the posters county , its just when i see you name first i kinda can guess whats going to come next and dont tell me that post wasnt a veiled dig at the Dubs this year.

AthCliath (Dublin) - Posts: 4347 - 11/09/2014 13:18:19    1650933