For a start check previous posts , Im one of The Goochs biggest fans and would have him in a jiffy in a blue shirt if it was possible. Was wondering what folks think, have other players stepped out of his shadow? Are they a more potent team now? I didn't think Kerry had a hope in hells chance of winning Sam without the Gooch but have noticed a bit more strut and confidence from the posters in green and gold. A lot of this of course comes on the back of the Cork game which as excellent Kerry were Cork were woeful, so a better system , a better unit , a better chance of winning Sam without the Ginger God thoughts ????

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/07/2014 16:21:32    1628032

Haha, Ginger God!!!

A double edged sword this. Yes, other players will step up to a degree but Gooch is so good that Kerry have to be diminished without him.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 29/07/2014 17:39:56    1628076

I wouldn't agree with that Damothedub. Over the years Gooch himself has had moments where's he had to play in shadows of Mike Frank, Dara O'Cinneide, Declan and Darren O'Sullivan, Galvin, Donaghy and James O'Donoghue.

Gooch has been a great player but there's been others there with him and I don't any of those I've named ever suffered from leaving it all up to Cooper.

Any new confidence in Kerry players, I would put down to Eamonn Fitzmaurice and his managerial reign.

Former_Poster (Meath) - Posts: 394 - 29/07/2014 17:42:09    1628079

As per usual when a team's star player is taken out of the equation you will often see other players stepping up to compensate.
It's likely Kerry will end up in final again as they will either play a team they have already beaten well or a team who generally loose to them once it gets to the business end of the championship.
Some of their posters though unlikely to comment as they prefer to talk about everyone else's chances and hope you don't notice.

SLLY (Dublin) - Posts: 463 - 29/07/2014 17:45:42    1628080

No x infinity

Is discussion of Gaelic football improved by banning the nebulous term 'system'!?!?

an tseabhac (Kerry) - Posts: 441 - 29/07/2014 18:08:47    1628094

Certainly holds water Damo, it'll probably pay off in the long run!

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8589 - 29/07/2014 18:24:53    1628104

No. He's irreplaceable. HOW COULD A team be better off without one of the greatest players of all time? He is not only a great score getter but his passing and his vision are second to none. I miss watching him this year and hope he makes a speedy recovery. But not before September ;-)

avonali (Dublin) - Posts: 1974 - 29/07/2014 20:12:05    1628174

One swallow does not make a summer. Nothing to see here. Move along to the unstoppable machine, the negative machine or the Westerners who might just finally reach the summit.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7840 - 29/07/2014 20:27:07    1628193

To answer the actual question I think the system works better without gooch at centre forward! When he was there, there was too much temptation to give the ball into gooch instead of kicking it straight into the full forward line! When you have james o donoghue in there you have to give quick ball. The results of doing this were his 10 points against cork, kick it into him and he will win it and do something with it! Also pace has become so important in the game now so think the loss of tomas, gooch and galvin is not as a bad a thing as first thought! The young playera that have come through are very impressive and there is a strong squad there now! When u talk about the strongest bench in the country I think kerry have it with the likes of darran o sullivan, david moran and peter crowley! It was dublins bench that won them the game last year when legs tired, they wont have that advantage this year! I fancy kerry to win sam, be it against dublin or donegal! Mayo have regresswd in my opinion, andy moran back starting is only a aign of how thwir young players arent up to it and the mayo forward line will struggle against whats a very tough kerry defence grantwd they beat cork and we dont have a collapse against galway!

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 29/07/2014 20:32:07    1628200

as_ky
County: Kerry
Posts: 233

1628200

Thank you for answering the actual question posed , on the same theme can you possibly see Star fitting into current system ?
Heaven knows my own county has been done to death along with Donegal and Mayo interesting that Kerry seem to be going along under the radar .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/07/2014 21:08:03    1628236

Damo
If you go on to the Kerry page you'll see I mentioned this very topic my self, I felt we were very over reliant on gooch but it's hard to blame the players for that, I mean when you win a ball and your under pressure and you hear the gooch calling for the ball your gona give it to him coz he rarely coughs up possession , but in fairness to the lads they have stepped up in his absence. Can we win Sam? Well we're in with a shout but it's hard to know, our midfield is still very suspect, but if you offered me a semifinal spot after we lost to cork in the league we'd have snapped your hand off but now we'd all like to go all the way and win it. But what I think is very important for us this year is to win the minor championship .

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 29/07/2014 21:25:29    1628250

Would be suprised if donaghy even gets any game time! Great serveant to the county and appreciate all he has done but has been far from his best for a long time! Big plus for kerry is that declan o'sullivan has refound his form after a poor season last year and sheehan is back fully fit again this year which is a great bonus! Fionn fitz is arguably the best back in the country and has progressed nicely! Paul geaney has comen on in leaps and bounds, never knew he had that potential and stephen o'brien has great pace and is a good ball carrier! The kerry tactics are set up to beat donegal, quick ball into the forwards where it is bouncing in to the forwards hand, when the ball is bouncing uo its easier to burst onto and harder for a defender to get a hand in, makes it alot more difficult for a swarm defence to work! Kerrys forwards are all small and quick, even if donegals backs get cloae they will struggle not to foul them! The system of course can work pretty well against other counties too! Kerrys main strenght this year is there defence, its probably the best in the country and everyone is comfortable on the ball as well, they will not give goals away cheaply!

Im realistic about things as well anything can happen on any given sunday, couple of injuries, a red card or a couple of bad decisions against you and you are out As their is not much to seperate the top teams. We have a team that can win the all ireland though and kerry people wont be happy with anything less!

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 29/07/2014 21:25:48    1628251

Nonsense! How could any team or system be better without the gooch! He could make the Kilkenny footballers a force to be reckoned with! The guys a genius!

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts: 932 - 30/07/2014 08:40:31    1628304

Kerry are weaker without him, by virtue of the fact his the best player in Ireland. However, I agree that last year it might have been a bit too comfortable for the likes of some of our players passing the ball onto him rather than make a decision themselves. I think for the younger forwards like O'Donoghue, Geaney and O'Brien a year of them having to stand up and take responsibility will do them wonders long term.

Its always been so in the Kingdom, one seemingly irreplaceable player leaves, and another rises to take his place. Maurice Fitz went and lo and behold a young ginger fella from Killlarney burst on the scene. If Kerry do make it to an All Ireland final, put your money on James O'Donoghue winning player of the year. This guy's going to be a superstar.

TheHermit (Kerry) - Posts: 6354 - 30/07/2014 10:06:26    1628329

Certainly Kerry will not win the All-Ireland without the Gooch this year. He just brings that undisputed class under pressure that can not be replaced. Kerry should beat Galway but Mayo will be a harder hurdle and Dublin will be happy not to have to face the Gooch after his performance last year.

Byanthon (Tyrone) - Posts: 1780 - 30/07/2014 13:24:30    1628446

This is a minority opinion but I thought Fitzmaurice messed up with gooch at centre forward last year. I think you play you're biggest goal threats close to goal. Could you imagine the havoc that Gooch and James o D could have caused if both were inside.

I actually think its possible that Declan Osullivan is a better kick passer than gooch as well & would have been better suited to centre forward, especially since O'sullivan was terrible at full forward last year. People got a bit carried away with Gooch's performance vs dublin in my opinion last year.

realman2 (Kildare) - Posts: 464 - 30/07/2014 15:55:43    1628559

Kerry will win the All Ireland next year with Gooch back in the fold. Just think they're a wee bit short this year.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9132 - 30/07/2014 16:14:01    1628573

No doubt players have stepped up a notch without relying on the Gooch but no Kerry would be a more potent outfit with the Gooch.
A bad performing Gooch would always be a threat no matter who Kerry are playing against.

Kerry are not as good as we saw against Cork but hopefully will still find a way to win the all ireland

woops (Kerry) - Posts: 2073 - 30/07/2014 16:44:50    1628595

No.

Cooper is phenomenal.

End of thread.

Samsforthehills (Donegal) - Posts: 1070 - 31/07/2014 18:06:42    1629089

Kerry I'm afraid have been in transition when our '10 championship ended. Jack O'Connor was aware of that in '11 and '12. Fitz was well aware is was what he was taking over. What we've seen is both men have the team competitive. The players that remained were a help for that but as is well known many players had a lot of mileage on the clock. There were young lads then without the experience.

2011 seemed a bit too easy until the Dubs grabbed the game and drove on to win it. It was a well fought for win by the Dubs in the championship as a whole. If we had taken the spoils that day, it would have been this thing people claim to be a soft All-Ireland. Alas All-Irelands are hard won. The team that has prepared right, have everything in place and seize the moment deservedly win.

There is correctly no talk of Kerry. Our squad is unknown. Most have a pretty good gauge on where Mayo, the Dubs and Donegal are at. The same cannot be said of Kerry. Sure look, all any team can do is look ahead to the next game. We'll go to Croker as usual on Sunday and give it our best shot.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7840 - 31/07/2014 19:14:50    1629123