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White Elephant GAA Projects

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Replying To pkboher: "Well excuse the Gaa for trying to make PuC a comfortable and safe stadium to watch a game. If it was up to people like you Jimbo you'd wait til someone gets seriously injured or worse to do anything about the stadium. It's unsafe and needs revamp. FACT" It's hardly a revamp It's a completely new stadium jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 16/10/2016 00:15:33 1926561 Link
Replying To rebelfan: "How cheap do you think it is to rebuild a stadium, if your going to build it at all make sure it up there for a while rather than building it on the cheap and replacing it again 10 years later" I don't think he wants a poor quality building that won't last 40 years, I think he is merely suggesting a more basic Stadium with less frills would suffice. GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 16/10/2016 01:50:28 1926568 Link
These stadiums would actually make some sense if the GAA got more games that people would want to go to. Getting the league played a little later with better weather and if there were more championship matches to go to things would be a whole lot better. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4205 - 16/10/2016 10:36:46 1926581 Link
I don't get this attitude that every stadium needs to be full "all the time". With the exception of Premier League stadiums most grounds around the world are mostly only half full. Just watch the Rugby Championship. It has the best teams in world there and grounds are mostly only half full. Watch the Spanish league and grounds rarely ever sell out. What's wrong with having a capacity to support a big game which Cork will get so this white elephant crap is just stupid pkboher (Cork) - Posts:9 - 15/10/2016 10:57:21 Rugby championship involves sides where the two nearest are a 3.5 hour flight away and every other flight is at least 8 hours and more often not about 12 hours. so capacities will rarely be full as there is virtually no away support. Though you make a good point apart from some soccer leagues a lot of competitions rarely have full houses all games While I am broadly in favour of upgrading Provincial Grounds, adding better roof coverage, more seating, better toilet facilities and area's for tea/refreshments, I am not in favour of spending £70/€70 million on a corporate events centre. These facilities could be upgraded for a fraction of that type of money. However with regards Games Development, youngsters often to aspire to play in front of a sold out Stadium playing for their County. I often see Croke Park mentioned as hardly ever being filled, but for every young Gael growing up, Croker really is the theatre of dreams, the place they all want to end up playing in. GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts:2762 - 15/10/2016 11:29:47 I don't think people are looking for corporate events centres and which places are that? Some corporate facilities are needed as they can bring is substantial income for games These stadiums would actually make some sense if the GAA got more games that people would want to go to. Getting the league played a little later with better weather and if there were more championship matches to go to things would be a whole lot better. Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts:1073 - 16/10/2016 10:36:46Changing championship to include the league/round robin format would be better than moving the league and having championship in same format. ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 16/10/2016 18:57:55 1926688 Link
Part of the answer lies in creating Gaelic "hubs". In other words developing not just a stadium- but the surronding area. Having say a handball alley, a community hall and a museum are all ideas. So I would say to any GAA club with a large stadium- try and develope the area around the stadium. Give the Gaelic grounds in Limerick to a local GAA club. Put in a hand ball alley also. If all these fail, well hold some concerts. Don't let Thomond park grab all the best gigs! galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2517 - 16/10/2016 19:52:27 1926704 Link
Replying To GaryMc82: "I don't think he wants a poor quality building that won't last 40 years, I think he is merely suggesting a more basic Stadium with less frills would suffice." Given the recent evidence of large revamp / rebuild projects falling on hard times and proving to be a massive drain 100% - I think €70,000,000 on yet another large stadium in Munster is daft €40 million of that is coming from tax payer/GAA and I'm sorry but there are far more important things going on that need addressing, we already have a large stadium in Limerick which is struggling, A stadium to cost an awful lot less than €70 Million ! Having another large stadium pretty much on the Gaelic grounds door step is beyond daft and a huge waste of valuable resources PUC could have had a great revamp for half the current level of funding To suggest I somehow don't care about human life, or people getting injured is something I find pretty daft, and if that's all that a number of posters can come back with I'd have to laugh at your input TBH jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 17/10/2016 09:20:39 1926794 Link
Replying To Whammo86: "These stadiums would actually make some sense if the GAA got more games that people would want to go to. Getting the league played a little later with better weather and if there were more championship matches to go to things would be a whole lot better." That is 100% spot on The issue is that crowds aren't coming to make such projects economically viable Just look at the examples that currently exist because of the above at present They make sense if they are self funding and can attract volume Not if the GAA have to step in and bail out CB's - because again that's more money being dragged away which should be being made to grow participation and to reinforce what is already in place At a time when this is happening http://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/munster-gaa-hit-in-the-pocket-as-senior-finals-hit-by-40-per-cent-attendance-slump-34875168.html Perhaps another large stadium is not required in Munster and an investment of €70,000,000 may not be a great idea at present, attendances are falling not increasing I remember a number of Cork fans bemoaning the lack of a coordinated structure to bring through new players in Cork, seeing that as one of the main reasons for their slump of late, is this sort of money being spent on a stadium going to make them improve? or like in Limerick will it prove to be a massive drain and a "burden" on finances that have to go to the upkeep of a large stadium thus making valuable funding unavailable on other far more important things, like clubs, like development. A far cheaper and smaller project in Mayo proved way beyond what their finances were able to handle, and the GAA had to bail them out of that situation, saving them 5 Million over the course of the loan jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 17/10/2016 09:36:20 1926801 Link
Replying To GaryMc82: "I don't think he wants a poor quality building that won't last 40 years, I think he is merely suggesting a more basic Stadium with less frills would suffice." I don't agree a no frills stadium is the way to go. We all see the benefits croke park brings for hospitality, match day experience, conferences etc. Crowds turn up to matches just for the experience. I think the GAA need to focus on getting top quality stadia in other locations to replicate that 'feel good' factor and they should get that in cork and Belfast soon. I can see the logic in the approach as long as planning means the stadia generate good revenue too via more games and commercial activity. The real problem comes in a few years when Tipp, Kerry, Limerick etc come looking for cash to maintain their large stadiums for which there is no need. Move all the finals & big games to cork (it happens in Ulster & Leinster, Clones & CP). Each province should have a marque stadium. Most other counties should have decent smaller stadiums to host league games and first round championship games. There is also a good few 'middle' venues around too which are not big money, but can hold decent crowds (Breffni, Portlaoise etc.) Connaught is a bit more complicated. They'd want a green field site somewhere to the north of Galway with good access to the city. himachechy (Donegal) - Posts: 293 - 17/10/2016 10:53:15 1926846 Link
The only hope that the Gaelic Grounds had was that it might be picked as a Rugby World Cup Venue. They would have had to invest in a new Mackey Stand then. Now that they couldn't even make the list of possible GAA venues, there seems to be no hope for this White elephant. Now that Pairc Ui Chaoimh is nearly done Limerick is behind Thurles and Cork so I can never see them getting a big match again. Time to put a for sale sign up and sell the Ennis Road white elephant and build a compact 20,000 seater stadium outside the city. record (Limerick) - Posts: 129 - 21/11/2016 09:47:13 1935684 Link
-RECORD Now that Pairc Ui Chaoimh is nearly done Limerick is behind Thurles and Cork so I can never see them getting a big match again. Time to If we beat clare in munster semi and got tipp or cork in final the munster final would be in limerick -like last years janesboro (Limerick) - Posts: 1502 - 21/11/2016 10:09:29 1935690 Link
Replying To jimbodub: "Do you see €40,000,000 tax payer/GAA investment as justifiable considering the struggles of many clubs around the country at present? Would this money not be better spent on grass root GAA people, such a colossal amount of funding could make a great impact. I just can't see the justification and I'd strongly question the granting of such a vast figure on a project that very few GAA people will benefit from, especially considering the benefits that are without doubt being squandered on yet another CB vanity project" I'd agree to a point but the issue I'd have is that we don't have enough people in clubs with the right skills to make any use of the money. The clubs could do with the money but what would you propose? Part time coach maybe going around to schools or something? Or maybe a few clubs get together and hire a full time coach for their primary schools? I think we need more suggestions rather than saying give them money. The HSE has had loads of money thrown at it but they seem to waste most of it. unless you have the right people then it's dead money. tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 21/11/2016 10:16:14 1935695 Link
Replying To himachechy: "I don't agree a no frills stadium is the way to go. We all see the benefits croke park brings for hospitality, match day experience, conferences etc. Crowds turn up to matches just for the experience. I think the GAA need to focus on getting top quality stadia in other locations to replicate that 'feel good' factor and they should get that in cork and Belfast soon. I can see the logic in the approach as long as planning means the stadia generate good revenue too via more games and commercial activity. The real problem comes in a few years when Tipp, Kerry, Limerick etc come looking for cash to maintain their large stadiums for which there is no need. Move all the finals & big games to cork (it happens in Ulster & Leinster, Clones & CP). Each province should have a marque stadium. Most other counties should have decent smaller stadiums to host league games and first round championship games. There is also a good few 'middle' venues around too which are not big money, but can hold decent crowds (Breffni, Portlaoise etc.) Connaught is a bit more complicated. They'd want a green field site somewhere to the north of Galway with good access to the city." Put it perfectly in fairness. Develop one major stadium per province. Croke Park will always hold a Leinster final. So why not have the same in the other provinces? The trouble with Munster is you won't have 6 counties agreeing on it. Yet there's no issue in Ulster. tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 4119 - 21/11/2016 10:22:19 1935698 Link
Replying To record: "The only hope that the Gaelic Grounds had was that it might be picked as a Rugby World Cup Venue. They would have had to invest in a new Mackey Stand then. Now that they couldn't even make the list of possible GAA venues, there seems to be no hope for this White elephant. Now that Pairc Ui Chaoimh is nearly done Limerick is behind Thurles and Cork so I can never see them getting a big match again. Time to put a for sale sign up and sell the Ennis Road white elephant and build a compact 20,000 seater stadium outside the city." Ya I think that will be the only option for Limerick in the next 10-20 years, when the economics make selling Ennis Road viable they should flog it - in fairness building a new 25K all seater stadium with top class facilities off the new ring road would make it accessible to most of the county, who use the stadium the most, and for League and early round Munster and All ireland games. 73forever (Limerick) - Posts: 89 - 21/11/2016 13:30:51 1935746 Link
:) Ah well... jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 14/12/2018 18:32:01 2154307 Link
Replying To galwayford: "Part of the answer lies in creating Gaelic "hubs". In other words developing not just a stadium- but the surronding area. Having say a handball alley, a community hall and a museum are all ideas. So I would say to any GAA club with a large stadium- try and develope the area around the stadium. Give the Gaelic grounds in Limerick to a local GAA club. Put in a hand ball alley also. If all these fail, well hold some concerts. Don't let Thomond park grab all the best gigs!" 'A hand ball alley' in the Gaelic Grounds.. or giving a 50,000 capacity stadium to a Club. And that can compete with what Thomond Park offers?! Maybe bingo of a Wednesday night under lights..a 40,000 near capacity sell out.. bloodyban (Limerick) - Posts: 1710 - 15/12/2018 08:52:39 2154336 Link
Replying To 73forever: "Ya I think that will be the only option for Limerick in the next 10-20 years, when the economics make selling Ennis Road viable they should flog it - in fairness building a new 25K all seater stadium with top class facilities off the new ring road would make it accessible to most of the county, who use the stadium the most, and for League and early round Munster and All ireland games." Limerick have home and away arrangements with Cork and Tipperary so plenty of potential for Munster finals. bloodyban (Limerick) - Posts: 1710 - 15/12/2018 14:28:21 2154354 Link
Replying To jimbodub: ":) Ah well..." i come across a fair few cork people in my job,and they knew that this location was a terrible choice,but yet they ploughed on!! perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 17/12/2018 08:53:38 2154457 Link
Limerick GAA should consider giving the Gaelic grounds to 2 or 3 clubs in the city. galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2517 - 19/12/2018 10:49:19 2154696 Link
I will hold my piece on this as I remember the same arguements been used about Croke Park development etc. White elephant, costs too much etc. witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1604 - 19/12/2018 17:40:32 2154754 Link
The Aviva needed 191 million euros from the Irish tax payer. galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2517 - 19/12/2018 19:54:06 2154772 Link