National Forum

Are Mayo Bottlers??

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Replying To alano12:  "sadly yes id have to agree that they are bottlers..more than good enough to win an all ireland and have constantly made silly mistakes and errors and shown a lack of composure when it mattered most

in a lot of sports you have to fail before you succeed look at the dubs who constantly failed like cluxton brogans etc up to 2011...sadly mayo have hard to suffer quite a lot but next year will possibly be their year"
If Tyrone don't win it there is nobody I'd like to see win it more than Mayo, but I just can't see it happening for this group anymore, Kerry will be back to winning All Ireland's very soon and I hope to see ourselves starting to challenge as well in the next few years,Dublin will stay strong so I think Mayo have missed their chance with this group of players, they will still be a top 4 or 5 team no doubt.
Bottlers is not a nice term, Mayo are just very unlucky for whatever reason.

El_Torro (Tyrone) - Posts: 155 - 04/10/2016 20:49:59    1922604

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Replying To Breffni39:  "Exactly, most counties would kill to be in their position but no all this "to win just once" and curse b/s makes them a special case for sympathy. Drives me mad."
The whole Mayo losing thing, It's starting to get a bit awkward now and they've tried multiple methods, managers, tactics.

The problem with the current Mayo team across 2016 is obvious

An average of 16pts a game isn't good enough, and they have an average offensive option from the bench when their main stays forwards get gassed.

Starting Moran so much is case and point

They need additional forward options and as it stands, I see Kerry beating them if they were to meet in a semi final in 2017

Kerry can match them defensively enough to break even but have more natural forwards who have the edge over Mayo all day long.

Mayo won't win anything with a 16pt average

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 04/10/2016 21:16:16    1922613

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Replying To El_Torro:  "If Tyrone don't win it there is nobody I'd like to see win it more than Mayo, but I just can't see it happening for this group anymore, Kerry will be back to winning All Ireland's very soon and I hope to see ourselves starting to challenge as well in the next few years,Dublin will stay strong so I think Mayo have missed their chance with this group of players, they will still be a top 4 or 5 team no doubt.
Bottlers is not a nice term, Mayo are just very unlucky for whatever reason."
Bottlers is not a nice term,
The day we start being nice to each other on HS is the day I stop posting . The patronising Dubs and others on the Mayo forum, however well intentioned, really gets me. We may have been unlucky but we were beaten by a better team.

liner (Mayo) - Posts: 756 - 04/10/2016 23:10:37    1922662

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Replying To jimbodub:  "The whole Mayo losing thing, It's starting to get a bit awkward now and they've tried multiple methods, managers, tactics.

The problem with the current Mayo team across 2016 is obvious

An average of 16pts a game isn't good enough, and they have an average offensive option from the bench when their main stays forwards get gassed.

Starting Moran so much is case and point

They need additional forward options and as it stands, I see Kerry beating them if they were to meet in a semi final in 2017

Kerry can match them defensively enough to break even but have more natural forwards who have the edge over Mayo all day long.

Mayo won't win anything with a 16pt average"
Hit the nail on the head Jimbo.

Regardless of the goal keeping calamities at the weekend the attacking strategy isn't refined enough and there's a key forward or 2 missing. What Mayo would give for a go to forward like Colm McFadden for Donegal in 2012. It's all a bit sporadic. Will the half backs get up and contribute enough etc while marking one of the best half forward lines of all time.

Dublin won a great all-ireland this year. Tiring a little, a few big names gone, a few big names not performing to their usual standards and they ground it out. Kinda like Cody Kilkenny teams.

To the naked eye Dublin look the best conditioned outfit i've ever seen in gaa. Sometimes they remind me of the Aussie teams of 2005-6 in physicality and other counties like Irish gaa players of the era. Now Mayo are the closest to them in conditioning..

Laois76 (Laois) - Posts: 1270 - 04/10/2016 23:51:37    1922674

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Replying To ballydalane:  "Yeah but Tipp never had the litany of self-inflicted calamities that Mayo had, plus Tipp already had an All-Ireland win against Kilkenny under their belt from 2010."
Maybe not exactly like with like but their are similarities and the "bottlers" thing was thrown around a lot about Tipp. They were about 7 up with time just up in '09, everybody thought they were certs in '11, the Lar debacle in '12, Nowlan Park '13, night winning another tight one in '14 and not to mention various league matches. The Kilkenny team knew how to win tight games, the same as Dublin, Tipp werent "bottlers", same as Mayo are not "bottlers".

Joe_Bloggs (Tipperary) - Posts: 186 - 05/10/2016 09:33:20    1922707

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Replying To Joe_Bloggs:  "The terms "bottlers" really annoys me.
This reminds me of the Tipp v Kilkenny thing. Tipp were being labelled "bottlers" and in the same breath, people were saying that the Kilkenny were the greatest hurling team of all time - which they were. In any other era, Tipp would have won 3 / 4 more All Irelands, its very fine margins.
Instead of saying Mayo are "bottlers", why not applaud this great Dublin team and their ability to grind out results."
Looking at the posts here it kinda seems different people have different ideas of what bottle means. For me it is a person/ team's ability to perform to your best when the pressure is highest. Bottlers are people/ teams whose performance drops off when the pressure comes on or the more attention is put on them (for example if a team is winning and if the opposition get a bit closer they lose their nerve and their performance level drops off). A team who wins easy (as Tipp did this year) for me does not get to show their bottle in nearly the same way a team who come through a hard close game does.

bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1356 - 05/10/2016 09:43:35    1922710

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Replying To bdbuddah:  "Looking at the posts here it kinda seems different people have different ideas of what bottle means. For me it is a person/ team's ability to perform to your best when the pressure is highest. Bottlers are people/ teams whose performance drops off when the pressure comes on or the more attention is put on them (for example if a team is winning and if the opposition get a bit closer they lose their nerve and their performance level drops off). A team who wins easy (as Tipp did this year) for me does not get to show their bottle in nearly the same way a team who come through a hard close game does."
Hold on tho -


After the manner in which Dublin won in tight circumstances, you would have to say they showed great bottle.


HOWEVER -

When Mayo put the pressure on, they certainly did not perform at their best. That doesn't make them bottles.



Mayo showed up for both finals, and very nearly pulled off what would have been one of the biggest final upsets in recent years. There is no way you can call the bottlers.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5016 - 05/10/2016 11:21:16    1922751

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Replying To cavanman47:  "Hold on tho -


After the manner in which Dublin won in tight circumstances, you would have to say they showed great bottle.


HOWEVER -

When Mayo put the pressure on, they certainly did not perform at their best. That doesn't make them bottles.



Mayo showed up for both finals, and very nearly pulled off what would have been one of the biggest final upsets in recent years. There is no way you can call the bottlers."
Spot on..

They have had this issue in the past,but they gave Dublin their closest game this year and did that twice..

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 05/10/2016 11:35:16    1922757

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From last January it was pretty obvious that only Dublin could win Sam 2016. And still Mayo (and only Mayo) denied all prediction's. After their battles in the last 3 years it is just rediculous to call them "bottlers". For heaven''s sake give Dublin credit.

michael (Cork) - Posts: 381 - 05/10/2016 11:59:22    1922775

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Replying To cavanman47:  "Hold on tho -


After the manner in which Dublin won in tight circumstances, you would have to say they showed great bottle.


HOWEVER -

When Mayo put the pressure on, they certainly did not perform at their best. That doesn't make them bottles.



Mayo showed up for both finals, and very nearly pulled off what would have been one of the biggest final upsets in recent years. There is no way you can call the bottlers."
My post was not having a go at Mayo, more saying bringing the recent Tipp Kilkenny All Ireland final (a game which was not close enough for nerve to play any big part) into a discussion about bottle as not being relevant.

bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1356 - 05/10/2016 21:11:01    1923025

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Replying To bdbuddah:  "My post was not having a go at Mayo, more saying bringing the recent Tipp Kilkenny All Ireland final (a game which was not close enough for nerve to play any big part) into a discussion about bottle as not being relevant."
Yes not a relevant comparison.Tipp are a superpower of hurling who have a great record in All-Ireland Finals and will always fancy themselves in an All-Ireland Final.Sadly,from a West of Ireland point of view, the relevant comparison is between Mayo footballers and Galway hurlers.Both have a terrible record in All-Ireland Finals.Mayo have lost 8 Finals since the late 80s and Galway hurlers have lost 6 Finals in the same period and neither have won a final during that time.

endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 2170 - 05/10/2016 21:39:23    1923038

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Bottlers? No, well only the illegal drink but that was well over 50 years ago, not happening nowadays, Mayo used to be a big place for bakers and bakeries. Hope that clears things up

riverboys (Mayo) - Posts: 1389 - 05/10/2016 22:52:15    1923073

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Replying To bdbuddah:  "My post was not having a go at Mayo, more saying bringing the recent Tipp Kilkenny All Ireland final (a game which was not close enough for nerve to play any big part) into a discussion about bottle as not being relevant."
So Tipp are still "bottlers", because they won easy in 2010 & 2016 and lost all the other tight games is what your trying to say?

Tipp were a hurling superpower 50 years ago. In terms of Mayo & Tipp over the last 10 years, they are similar because they have been dining at the top table consistently but struggling to get over the line (I know Tipp have got over the line but my point was that more often than not they havnt and I have heard from many labeling them "bottlers"). What happening 50 years ago doesnt even come into it.

Joe_Bloggs (Tipperary) - Posts: 186 - 06/10/2016 09:04:45    1923107

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Replying To Joe_Bloggs:  "So Tipp are still "bottlers", because they won easy in 2010 & 2016 and lost all the other tight games is what your trying to say?

Tipp were a hurling superpower 50 years ago. In terms of Mayo & Tipp over the last 10 years, they are similar because they have been dining at the top table consistently but struggling to get over the line (I know Tipp have got over the line but my point was that more often than not they havnt and I have heard from many labeling them "bottlers"). What happening 50 years ago doesnt even come into it."
Tipp have won 27 senior All-Ireland hurling titles,19 National League titles and around 40 Munster senior hurling titles.Tiop are a hurling superpower along with Cork and Kilkenny.Mayo have missed a lot of opportunities.Don't think they'll keep getting those opportunities because life and sport doesn't work like that.I don't think this current Mayo team will win Sam.

endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 2170 - 06/10/2016 19:49:32    1923473

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Wouldnt go so far as to call mayo bottlers but theyve definitely had enough chances to win the thing at this stage. Dont really have much sympathy left.

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 06/10/2016 20:10:28    1923479

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Replying To Joe_Bloggs:  "So Tipp are still "bottlers", because they won easy in 2010 & 2016 and lost all the other tight games is what your trying to say?

Tipp were a hurling superpower 50 years ago. In terms of Mayo & Tipp over the last 10 years, they are similar because they have been dining at the top table consistently but struggling to get over the line (I know Tipp have got over the line but my point was that more often than not they havnt and I have heard from many labeling them "bottlers"). What happening 50 years ago doesnt even come into it."
When did I say Tipp (or Mayo) were bottlers?, more I find it kind of irrelevant bringing the fact that Tipp beat Kilkenny in this year's hurling final into the debate, I mean this was a very one sided game where Tipp won easy, Kilkenny were not close enough to test Tipps nerve.

bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1356 - 06/10/2016 22:51:12    1923550

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