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Replying To royaldunne: " Replying To Whammo86: "[quote=royaldunne: "[quote=MesAmis: "The membership have questioned the decision and the membership by voting in congress decided to allow the GAA to sell the rights to whoever they choose.
People still don't seem to get it that there was a democratic decision made by congress who are made up of delegates from all across the country and are representing the rank and file GAA membership and congress delegates decided to allow the rights to be sold to whoever the GAA wanted.
Democracy has spoken in this instance and people need to accept it and stop whinging and accept the decision.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts:974 - 11/09/2016 17:12:02 1912783
Just because a decision was made once doesn't mean it has to stay like that forever. What type of logic is that?
By that logic we would never have elections after we had the first one because the decision was made!
As I've already said I've no real problem with some games going behind a pay wall but only if the deal is a good one. This Sky deal was nowhere near good enough to justify lowering the numbers of people able to watch a game by so much.
I do have a problem with some people labelling anyone who questions the Sky deal as a whinger who feels self entitled. That's just rubbish as there are a lot of genuine reasons to not be happy with this TV deal as it hasn't really been a very good deal for the GAA." Your point really doesn't hold water. Sky paid more than tv3. It was a higher bid, cause its a subscription service makes no difference, the gaa are entitled to accept the highest offer, which was sky, how would anyone feel if their club wasn't getting the new dressing rooms, cause gaa cant afford it, but maybe the extra few quid from sky would have built it? Its plain economics, the rights go to the highest bidder, if you unhappy with that then write to tv3 and demand they offer more than sky this time, I would be furious if the gaa gave these rights to a lower bidder, in business like in life you should never sell yourself short."
Suppose you own and are renting out a house. It makes sense to rent it to a family even though a group of students may be prepared to pay marginally more. It's a perfectly rational decision to. There's a cost benefit analysis being done. We get less rent but it should also mean less hassle.
With the tv rights you have to think, ok they're paying more but is it worth the reduced exposure of our games."]I also think that over exposure is huge problem, attendees are down all over the place, why would I go when I can watch it for free on TV? Balance is something that needs to be found, and i believe pay subscriptions help in this regard."]I find it hard to trust that the GAA's main concern in this is too maximise attendances. Maybe I'm very cynical but that line reeked of spin doctoring to me.
Look anyway that's a bit off topic. As I say I'm not against pay tv as a matter of principle.
I think it is a very tough decision though. After reading the articles with the links I posted I would be more against the deal than for it.
Describing people as whingers or entitled for complaining is just not fair.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4235 - 11/09/2016 19:31:32
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Replying To Whammo86: " Replying To royaldunne: "[quote=Whammo86: "[quote=royaldunne: "[quote=MesAmis: "The membership have questioned the decision and the membership by voting in congress decided to allow the GAA to sell the rights to whoever they choose.
People still don't seem to get it that there was a democratic decision made by congress who are made up of delegates from all across the country and are representing the rank and file GAA membership and congress delegates decided to allow the rights to be sold to whoever the GAA wanted.
Democracy has spoken in this instance and people need to accept it and stop whinging and accept the decision.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts:974 - 11/09/2016 17:12:02 1912783
Just because a decision was made once doesn't mean it has to stay like that forever. What type of logic is that?
By that logic we would never have elections after we had the first one because the decision was made!
As I've already said I've no real problem with some games going behind a pay wall but only if the deal is a good one. This Sky deal was nowhere near good enough to justify lowering the numbers of people able to watch a game by so much.
I do have a problem with some people labelling anyone who questions the Sky deal as a whinger who feels self entitled. That's just rubbish as there are a lot of genuine reasons to not be happy with this TV deal as it hasn't really been a very good deal for the GAA." Your point really doesn't hold water. Sky paid more than tv3. It was a higher bid, cause its a subscription service makes no difference, the gaa are entitled to accept the highest offer, which was sky, how would anyone feel if their club wasn't getting the new dressing rooms, cause gaa cant afford it, but maybe the extra few quid from sky would have built it? Its plain economics, the rights go to the highest bidder, if you unhappy with that then write to tv3 and demand they offer more than sky this time, I would be furious if the gaa gave these rights to a lower bidder, in business like in life you should never sell yourself short."
Suppose you own and are renting out a house. It makes sense to rent it to a family even though a group of students may be prepared to pay marginally more. It's a perfectly rational decision to. There's a cost benefit analysis being done. We get less rent but it should also mean less hassle.
With the tv rights you have to think, ok they're paying more but is it worth the reduced exposure of our games."]I also think that over exposure is huge problem, attendees are down all over the place, why would I go when I can watch it for free on TV? Balance is something that needs to be found, and i believe pay subscriptions help in this regard."]I find it hard to trust that the GAA's main concern in this is too maximise attendances. Maybe I'm very cynical but that line reeked of spin doctoring to me.
Look anyway that's a bit off topic. As I say I'm not against pay tv as a matter of principle.
I think it is a very tough decision though. After reading the articles with the links I posted I would be more against the deal than for it.
Describing people as whingers or entitled for complaining is just not fair."]Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground, while the entitlement brigade do nothing but get everything for nothing. Its not how I was raised and how my children are raised. And while slightly off topic, it really gets on my wick.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 11/09/2016 19:48:27
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royaldunne (Meath)
Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground...
But if you're seeing young families working themselves into the ground just to make ends meet, is that not a good argument against adding extra costs to their household, when possible?
Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1823 - 11/09/2016 20:18:05
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Replying To Marlon_JD: "royaldunne (Meath)
Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground...
But if you're seeing young families working themselves into the ground just to make ends meet, is that not a good argument against adding extra costs to their household, when possible?" They would have sky tv as a norm, so it's already factored into their expenses . They will sit in on a Sunday / Saturday watching it, while the entitlement brigade are down the pub, drinking the tax money paid for by the hard working young couples.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 11/09/2016 20:25:27
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Replying To Marlon_JD: "royaldunne (Meath)
Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground...
But if you're seeing young families working themselves into the ground just to make ends meet, is that not a good argument against adding extra costs to their household, when possible?" Vast majority would have sky , so it wouldn't make a difference, already factored into their expenses
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 11/09/2016 20:46:33
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Replying To MesAmis: "The membership have questioned the decision and the membership by voting in congress decided to allow the GAA to sell the rights to whoever they choose.
People still don't seem to get it that there was a democratic decision made by congress who are made up of delegates from all across the country and are representing the rank and file GAA membership and congress delegates decided to allow the rights to be sold to whoever the GAA wanted.
Democracy has spoken in this instance and people need to accept it and stop whinging and accept the decision.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts:974 - 11/09/2016 17:12:02 1912783
Just because a decision was made once doesn't mean it has to stay like that forever. What type of logic is that?
By that logic we would never have elections after we had the first one because the decision was made!
As I've already said I've no real problem with some games going behind a pay wall but only if the deal is a good one. This Sky deal was nowhere near good enough to justify lowering the numbers of people able to watch a game by so much.
I do have a problem with some people labelling anyone who questions the Sky deal as a whinger who feels self entitled. That's just rubbish as there are a lot of genuine reasons to not be happy with this TV deal as it hasn't really been a very good deal for the GAA." An awful lot of people complaining about this are whingers though.
People complaining keep saying it isn't what the membership want and yet the membership (through congress) validated the decision to allow the rights to be sold.
There has been a ridiculous attitude of exaggeration form people arguing against the deal, there are rational arguments against but a lot people arguing against it are making bullshit points about it being unfair to charge to watch games on TV, despite all sports doing it and all sports having a volunteer element.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts: 1296 - 11/09/2016 21:01:53
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Replying To royaldunne: " Replying To Marlon_JD: "royaldunne (Meath)
Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground...
But if you're seeing young families working themselves into the ground just to make ends meet, is that not a good argument against adding extra costs to their household, when possible?" They would have sky tv as a norm, so it's already factored into their expenses . They will sit in on a Sunday / Saturday watching it, while the entitlement brigade are down the pub, drinking the tax money paid for by the hard working young couples."
Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1823 - 11/09/2016 21:06:08
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Replying To royaldunne: " Replying To Marlon_JD: "royaldunne (Meath)
Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground...
But if you're seeing young families working themselves into the ground just to make ends meet, is that not a good argument against adding extra costs to their household, when possible?" They would have sky tv as a norm, so it's already factored into their expenses . They will sit in on a Sunday / Saturday watching it, while the entitlement brigade are down the pub, drinking the tax money paid for by the hard working young couples."
I also saw another person saying that most people could afford sky for the 3/4 months of the championship. Unfortunately that's not how it works. You are tied into a minimum 12 month contract so at the very least it's going to cost you 500 euro a year to watch the championship games on the tv.
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 11/09/2016 21:17:17
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Replying To uibhfhaili1986: " Replying To MesAmis: "The membership have questioned the decision and the membership by voting in congress decided to allow the GAA to sell the rights to whoever they choose.
People still don't seem to get it that there was a democratic decision made by congress who are made up of delegates from all across the country and are representing the rank and file GAA membership and congress delegates decided to allow the rights to be sold to whoever the GAA wanted.
Democracy has spoken in this instance and people need to accept it and stop whinging and accept the decision.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts:974 - 11/09/2016 17:12:02 1912783
Just because a decision was made once doesn't mean it has to stay like that forever. What type of logic is that?
By that logic we would never have elections after we had the first one because the decision was made!
As I've already said I've no real problem with some games going behind a pay wall but only if the deal is a good one. This Sky deal was nowhere near good enough to justify lowering the numbers of people able to watch a game by so much.
I do have a problem with some people labelling anyone who questions the Sky deal as a whinger who feels self entitled. That's just rubbish as there are a lot of genuine reasons to not be happy with this TV deal as it hasn't really been a very good deal for the GAA." An awful lot of people complaining about this are whingers though. People complaining keep saying it isn't what the membership want and yet the membership (through congress) validated the decision to allow the rights to be sold. There has been a ridiculous attitude of exaggeration form people arguing against the deal, there are rational arguments against but a lot people arguing against it are making bullshit points about it being unfair to charge to watch games on TV, despite all sports doing it and all sports having a volunteer element."
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 11/09/2016 21:43:25
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Replying To Marlon_JD: " Replying To royaldunne: "[quote=Marlon_JD: "royaldunne (Meath)
Look not all are whingers. But there is a entitlement brigade in modern Ireland, now maybe it was always there just not as visible, it just annoys me to hell, and they seem to shout the loudest, protest the most, but nearly to the man or woman give the least to society /community / whatever. It stinks I see young couples working every hour god sends to just keep their heads above ground...
But if you're seeing young families working themselves into the ground just to make ends meet, is that not a good argument against adding extra costs to their household, when possible?" They would have sky tv as a norm, so it's already factored into their expenses . They will sit in on a Sunday / Saturday watching it, while the entitlement brigade are down the pub, drinking the tax money paid for by the hard working young couples."
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 11/09/2016 21:44:44
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Replying To gotmilk: "An awful lot of people complaining about this are whingers though.
People complaining keep saying it isn't what the membership want and yet the membership (through congress) validated the decision to allow the rights to be sold.
There has been a ridiculous attitude of exaggeration form people arguing against the deal, there are rational arguments against but a lot people arguing against it are making bullshit points about it being unfair to charge to watch games on TV, despite all sports doing it and all sports having a volunteer element." But most other sports are professional. People involved in the sport end up getting their hands on this cash, this is not the case with the sky deal in the gaa."]I don't really see why the players being amateur really makes a difference.
The GAA makes money from inter-county players through advertising and other revenue streams without players getting a penny.
The real issue is that the deal excludes people from watching our games live.
There's even European legislation on this issue where countries can protect important sporting events so that they must be shown on terrestrial tv. In Ireland there are soccer, rugby and GAA games included under that legislation. To me that shows that it is an important issue.
It's disappointing that the GAA aren't protecting their membership. O'Fearghaill's attitude based on his remarks earlier this week is a disgrace also.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4235 - 11/09/2016 22:42:12
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Replying To uibhfhaili1986: " Replying To MesAmis: "The membership have questioned the decision and the membership by voting in congress decided to allow the GAA to sell the rights to whoever they choose.
People still don't seem to get it that there was a democratic decision made by congress who are made up of delegates from all across the country and are representing the rank and file GAA membership and congress delegates decided to allow the rights to be sold to whoever the GAA wanted.
Democracy has spoken in this instance and people need to accept it and stop whinging and accept the decision.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts:974 - 11/09/2016 17:12:02 1912783
Just because a decision was made once doesn't mean it has to stay like that forever. What type of logic is that?
By that logic we would never have elections after we had the first one because the decision was made!
As I've already said I've no real problem with some games going behind a pay wall but only if the deal is a good one. This Sky deal was nowhere near good enough to justify lowering the numbers of people able to watch a game by so much.
I do have a problem with some people labelling anyone who questions the Sky deal as a whinger who feels self entitled. That's just rubbish as there are a lot of genuine reasons to not be happy with this TV deal as it hasn't really been a very good deal for the GAA." An awful lot of people complaining about this are whingers though. People complaining keep saying it isn't what the membership want and yet the membership (through congress) validated the decision to allow the rights to be sold. There has been a ridiculous attitude of exaggeration form people arguing against the deal, there are rational arguments against but a lot people arguing against it are making bullshit points about it being unfair to charge to watch games on TV, despite all sports doing it and all sports having a volunteer element."
Within any democracy dissent and debate are essential to keep the representatives honest.
I don't see why people, including the president, want to stifle the debate on what is a genuinely important issue.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4235 - 11/09/2016 22:46:27
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Replying To gotmilk: "An awful lot of people complaining about this are whingers though.
People complaining keep saying it isn't what the membership want and yet the membership (through congress) validated the decision to allow the rights to be sold.
There has been a ridiculous attitude of exaggeration form people arguing against the deal, there are rational arguments against but a lot people arguing against it are making bullshit points about it being unfair to charge to watch games on TV, despite all sports doing it and all sports having a volunteer element." But most other sports are professional. People involved in the sport end up getting their hands on this cash, this is not the case with the sky deal in the gaa."]The GAA's revenue is recycled amongst the organisation so clubs and there members are benefiting from this.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts: 1296 - 12/09/2016 00:28:12
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Look it's pointless debating with royaldunne as if some one doesn't agree with his view on this he is implying that they don't work, have a sense of entitlement, are whingers & it's all about not wanting to pay for anything. Absolutely disgusting & I got one am far from all those things. He fails to acknowledge the article of Dr Paul Rouse & his points as he knows he has lost the argument. Anybody that has to start telling is when he started work, for how much in a public forum us trying very hard to justify himself for some reason.
moc.dna (Galway) - Posts: 1212 - 12/09/2016 01:17:15
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The article by Paul Rouse is not relevant to the GAA. Why? Because cricket and rugby has gone exclusively SKY, so there is no alternative, and clearly, in all countries and sports PAY TV gets lower ratings.
Did the GAA ever say it was going exclusively to SKY. Never
Was the SKY deal voted and accepted? Yes.
Are the GAA using SKY for the money or increase International coverage? No they are not. It is used to pressure RTE, a leverage if you will.
I agree with this strategy and also to ensure that the GAA gets it fair share of the monies going around.
SKY get only 13 exclusive games if I remember and I think 8 or 9 are Qualifiers, usually Saturday afternoon or night games. So well quarantined if you want by the GAA. Hence I support their strategy.
If they ever went exclusively SKY that is a different story but no one anywhere is proposing this.
witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1604 - 12/09/2016 09:41:40
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Replying To uibhfhaili1986: "But most other sports are professional. People involved in the sport end up getting their hands on this cash, this is not the case with the sky deal in the gaa." The GAA's revenue is recycled amongst the organisation so clubs and there members are benefiting from this."]But clubs aren't seeing this money. Fundraising by clubs is greater than it was 20 years ago, the cash isn't filtering down to grassroots level.
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 12/09/2016 15:23:09
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Replying To witnof: "The article by Paul Rouse is not relevant to the GAA. Why? Because cricket and rugby has gone exclusively SKY, so there is no alternative, and clearly, in all countries and sports PAY TV gets lower ratings.
Did the GAA ever say it was going exclusively to SKY. Never
Was the SKY deal voted and accepted? Yes.
Are the GAA using SKY for the money or increase International coverage? No they are not. It is used to pressure RTE, a leverage if you will.
I agree with this strategy and also to ensure that the GAA gets it fair share of the monies going around.
SKY get only 13 exclusive games if I remember and I think 8 or 9 are Qualifiers, usually Saturday afternoon or night games. So well quarantined if you want by the GAA. Hence I support their strategy.
If they ever went exclusively SKY that is a different story but no one anywhere is proposing this." Was the sky deal voted on? From what I remember it was brought on with no vote at congress.
gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 12/09/2016 15:24:32
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It was brought on with no vote, that is correct but this year's congress voted on whether all matches that are shown should be free to air. 85% voted against the motion that everything must be free to air. 85%!!!
witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1604 - 12/09/2016 16:42:26
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Replying To gotmilk: "The GAA's revenue is recycled amongst the organisation so clubs and there members are benefiting from this." But clubs aren't seeing this money. Fundraising by clubs is greater than it was 20 years ago, the cash isn't filtering down to grassroots level."]Cost are much greater than they used to be.
There is never going to be enough money generated at central level to pay for everything and fundraising is always going to exist.
uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts: 1296 - 12/09/2016 19:07:27
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Replying To gotmilk: "The GAA's revenue is recycled amongst the organisation so clubs and there members are benefiting from this." But clubs aren't seeing this money. Fundraising by clubs is greater than it was 20 years ago, the cash isn't filtering down to grassroots level."]the clubs are seeing the money...maybe u are ignoring how much it costs for clubs now with physios gear and medical stuff..the gaa cant afford to look after every single club..they do the best they can...clubs have always had to fundraise
alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 12/09/2016 19:25:04
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