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Replying To moc.dna: "Your last point there Damothedub is one of the best made on this forum in a long time. Unfortunately at club, development level, county, county board & council level the environment is parochial, political, toxic & off putting yo children, sponsors, coaches, administrators & so on. Create the right environment & attitude & application of fairness to all & you will succeed at anything. I would guess from your last point that you could be a very able coach or administrator with open progressive ideas. I acknowledge the point you made about Castleknock & salute their achievements regardless of their population or socio economic background." Very hard for small rural clubs to get people involved who have that outlook and approach to things. In relation to everything that is done in a club.
There is a big problem of a lack of knowledge in a lot of clubs about best practice in terms of coaching, club structures, developing facilities etc
manfromdelmonte (UK) - Posts: 541 - 29/06/2016 09:07:13
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If poverty prevents success then how have Brazil churned out time and again the best players and teams for decades which all came from very poor areas.
take sherriff yc from sherriff street here dominating junior soccer.
ballymun kickhams in Dublin has are won of the most consistently at the top in each age group. You have excuses left and right and centre for population but once you select a panel in any sport from no matter how many you have to choose from its from there what you do with them as a group that determines success.
Dublin success lately is down to belief. They hadn't got that belief under pillar and it was visible that beating Tyrone changed everything in 2010 all ireland quarter final. The other big change was in attitude to the league. It clearly led to improved standards. Last but not least was the current actual ability being above other groups. Stephen cluxton had been out on the pitch practising free kicks since at least 2005 a whole hour before any other member of the panel turned up for training. That's called dedication. Bernard brogan to get to where he had worked extremely hard on his game by himself, kicking ball after ball in his own time. No money coaches or population just hard work.
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 29/06/2016 11:05:10
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Brazil which is the largest national economy in S America? The 8th largest economy at Market Exchange Rates? 9th largest in the world in Purchasing Power Parity? Poor old Brazil.... ;-)
Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 29/06/2016 11:42:26
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Replying To hill16no1man: "If poverty prevents success then how have Brazil churned out time and again the best players and teams for decades which all came from very poor areas.
take sherriff yc from sherriff street here dominating junior soccer.
ballymun kickhams in Dublin has are won of the most consistently at the top in each age group. You have excuses left and right and centre for population but once you select a panel in any sport from no matter how many you have to choose from its from there what you do with them as a group that determines success.
Dublin success lately is down to belief. They hadn't got that belief under pillar and it was visible that beating Tyrone changed everything in 2010 all ireland quarter final. The other big change was in attitude to the league. It clearly led to improved standards. Last but not least was the current actual ability being above other groups. Stephen cluxton had been out on the pitch practising free kicks since at least 2005 a whole hour before any other member of the panel turned up for training. That's called dedication. Bernard brogan to get to where he had worked extremely hard on his game by himself, kicking ball after ball in his own time. No money coaches or population just hard work." You can trot out all the anecdotal evidence you want.
It doesn't change the fact that research has told us that Population, Money and Tradition are the 3 big factors in sporting success.
Combine them all and you've a heady mix.
Dublin's success story is not going to end any time soon.
You know what though fair fcks to you.
You got your house in order and there is a huge amount of hard work going in so you deserve all the success you are getting.
But to say that money and population aren't also huge factors in that success is bonkers.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4241 - 29/06/2016 11:51:12
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There is obviously a lot of good,honest work going on by hard working,loyal volunteers.But i do believe the wealth of the area must play an important role in the rise of the club.It is a very wealthy area.I live across the Liffey in Lucan but am a member of Westmanstown gym and play golf sometimes in Luttrelstown and Castleknock.It is a well-to-do area.No doubt about it and i'd imagine the fundraising and club accounts are in rude health.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 12:00:48
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Replying To Whammo86: "You can trot out all the anecdotal evidence you want.
It doesn't change the fact that research has told us that Population, Money and Tradition are the 3 big factors in sporting success.
Combine them all and you've a heady mix.
Dublin's success story is not going to end any time soon.
You know what though fair fcks to you.
You got your house in order and there is a huge amount of hard work going in so you deserve all the success you are getting.
But to say that money and population aren't also huge factors in that success is bonkers." Of course they are.There are always exceptions to every rule but these factors are huge.No doubt about it.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 12:02:09
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Replying To cuederocket: "There is obviously a lot of good,honest work going on by hard working,loyal volunteers.But i do believe the wealth of the area must play an important role in the rise of the club.It is a very wealthy area.I live across the Liffey in Lucan but am a member of Westmanstown gym and play golf sometimes in Luttrelstown and Castleknock.It is a well-to-do area.No doubt about it and i'd imagine the fundraising and club accounts are in rude health." Cue they have a huge base of players from Laurel Lodge , Luttrelstown , Coolmine and Clonsilla these houses are not Georgian Village (1 million a pop ) but your bog standard working/middle class areas , best way to put it the name maybe Castleknock but those that live anywhere a stone throw from Myos probably play for Bridgets , but there a lot of professional people on there committees , they receive good sponsorship from Kavanaghs and the castleknock hotel , but they raise like everyone else from club lottos bag packing and strictly etc
Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/06/2016 13:17:27
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Replying To Damothedub: "Cue they have a huge base of players from Laurel Lodge , Luttrelstown , Coolmine and Clonsilla these houses are not Georgian Village (1 million a pop ) but your bog standard working/middle class areas , best way to put it the name maybe Castleknock but those that live anywhere a stone throw from Myos probably play for Bridgets , but there a lot of professional people on there committees , they receive good sponsorship from Kavanaghs and the castleknock hotel , but they raise like everyone else from club lottos bag packing and strictly etc" Yes i'm sure they do Damo.As i said there must be lits of hard work going on by the volunteers.Ciaran Kilkenny's massive talent must help sell the dream to local young lads also.I'd say your a Peregrinne's man Damo if im reading between the lines.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 13:29:23
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Replying To cuederocket: "Do you live in Dublin buachail?" I used to yes, why can you tell !!! ...got out of dodge last year !!
AnBuachaillGlas (Fermanagh) - Posts: 287 - 29/06/2016 13:33:12
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Replying To AnBuachaillGlas: "I used to yes, why can you tell !!! ...got out of dodge last year !!" Just the way you were able to name the likes of Porterstown as being near Castleknock.A lot of Dubs wouldn't even know that.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 13:35:51
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Lads
Castleknock wouldn't be one of the wealthier clubs in the area. Money definitely is not a factor in the clubs recent success, we are trying to get a clubhouse off the ground and this has put pressure across the board. Regarding success on the field , there is only one way to achieve that and that's to teach the kids how to play football properly , there's no short cuts there. I coach the team that won the Feile last weekend and money / socio background have had very little part to play in their achievement. If anything they have been at a disadvantage to other clubs with the clubhouse being built , a lot of focus has been on that. At the moment we could only dream of some of the facilities we were lucky to play in over the weekend in Kerry. Hundreds of hours on the training ground and hundreds of thousands of ball touches since they were five are the main reason the lads won the Feile , not money and background.
Paul
Paulh (Dublin) - Posts: 1 - 29/06/2016 14:07:12
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Replying To Offside_Rule: "Brazil which is the largest national economy in S America? The 8th largest economy at Market Exchange Rates? 9th largest in the world in Purchasing Power Parity? Poor old Brazil.... ;-)" Most of their footballers lived on the streets so don't come over the biggun you know full well the likes of ronaldo, ronaldhino , robinho and so on came from slums and had horrible life before making it as footballers.
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 29/06/2016 14:12:21
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Replying To Paulh: "Lads
Castleknock wouldn't be one of the wealthier clubs in the area. Money definitely is not a factor in the clubs recent success, we are trying to get a clubhouse off the ground and this has put pressure across the board. Regarding success on the field , there is only one way to achieve that and that's to teach the kids how to play football properly , there's no short cuts there. I coach the team that won the Feile last weekend and money / socio background have had very little part to play in their achievement. If anything they have been at a disadvantage to other clubs with the clubhouse being built , a lot of focus has been on that. At the moment we could only dream of some of the facilities we were lucky to play in over the weekend in Kerry. Hundreds of hours on the training ground and hundreds of thousands of ball touches since they were five are the main reason the lads won the Feile , not money and background.
Paul" Congrats Paul on your great win.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 14:12:22
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Replying To cuederocket: "There is obviously a lot of good,honest work going on by hard working,loyal volunteers.But i do believe the wealth of the area must play an important role in the rise of the club.It is a very wealthy area.I live across the Liffey in Lucan but am a member of Westmanstown gym and play golf sometimes in Luttrelstown and Castleknock.It is a well-to-do area.No doubt about it and i'd imagine the fundraising and club accounts are in rude health." But they already have two hugely popular clubs in the same area as then in brigids and plunketts. Both have well established facilities and some big names to the forefront especially plunketts having Bernard brogan the most recognizable gaa player in the country as the best piece free maekting tool you could have to entice kids to join the club. So for castleknock to rise this quick and actually win an all ireland from a establish themselves as a division one team in senior and knock the affore mentioned plunketts with host of inter county players from around Ireland out of the Dublin championship. You have to take your hat off to them. A lot of hard work needed to achieve this.
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 29/06/2016 14:17:46
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Well done paulh on a brilliant achievment.
on the point about facilities I am alwats amazed by the facilities when I go down the country you have some clubs in rural areas with stands and terraces and scoreboards in the middle of nowhere.
maybe if they decided to put that money into developing players instead they might be better off. If anything Dublin is the last county where clubs have gotten their own facilities and pitches. I played in more corporation pitches growing up than clubs playing football and hurling all over Dublin.indeed the likes of raheny still play in st Anne's park a public corporation park, yet produce players like Bryan Fenton on the Dublin team.
hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 29/06/2016 14:24:22
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Replying To cuederocket: "Yes i'm sure they do Damo.As i said there must be lits of hard work going on by the volunteers.Ciaran Kilkenny's massive talent must help sell the dream to local young lads also.I'd say your a Peregrinne's man Damo if im reading between the lines." maybe I am , maybe not , definitely not Bridget's ha ha
Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/06/2016 14:36:45
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Replying To hill16no1man: "But they already have two hugely popular clubs in the same area as then in brigids and plunketts. Both have well established facilities and some big names to the forefront especially plunketts having Bernard brogan the most recognizable gaa player in the country as the best piece free maekting tool you could have to entice kids to join the club. So for castleknock to rise this quick and actually win an all ireland from a establish themselves as a division one team in senior and knock the affore mentioned plunketts with host of inter county players from around Ireland out of the Dublin championship. You have to take your hat off to them. A lot of hard work needed to achieve this." And i have already said that hard work is obviously being done.I've said it twice,hill.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 14:40:25
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Replying To Paulh: "Lads
Castleknock wouldn't be one of the wealthier clubs in the area. Money definitely is not a factor in the clubs recent success, we are trying to get a clubhouse off the ground and this has put pressure across the board. Regarding success on the field , there is only one way to achieve that and that's to teach the kids how to play football properly , there's no short cuts there. I coach the team that won the Feile last weekend and money / socio background have had very little part to play in their achievement. If anything they have been at a disadvantage to other clubs with the clubhouse being built , a lot of focus has been on that. At the moment we could only dream of some of the facilities we were lucky to play in over the weekend in Kerry. Hundreds of hours on the training ground and hundreds of thousands of ball touches since they were five are the main reason the lads won the Feile , not money and background.
Paul" Total an unreserved congrats from a local neighbour , sterling effort by all , Id know your previous secretary very well and quite a few parents currently coaching as well as your twitter man , well done , as said already those who know the Dublin scene well enough know the effort and sweat put into your success and what youd be up against in the Dublin area.Enjoy your success me and my lot will always strive to knock youse off your throne.
Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 29/06/2016 14:42:42
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A rich Country with some of their players coming from poor backgrounds. A lot of countries have players from poor backgrounds playing for them but don't have the success that a rich country like Brazil has. So money is a huge factor. Brazil also has a huge population so population and wealth a big factor in their success. Not the fact that they have players from poor backgrounds.
Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 29/06/2016 14:44:48
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Replying To hill16no1man: "Well done paulh on a brilliant achievment.
on the point about facilities I am alwats amazed by the facilities when I go down the country you have some clubs in rural areas with stands and terraces and scoreboards in the middle of nowhere.
maybe if they decided to put that money into developing players instead they might be better off. If anything Dublin is the last county where clubs have gotten their own facilities and pitches. I played in more corporation pitches growing up than clubs playing football and hurling all over Dublin.indeed the likes of raheny still play in st Anne's park a public corporation park, yet produce players like Bryan Fenton on the Dublin team." That's what i mean about GAA being a part of a country county's dna.Every town,village and parish is immersed in GAA.The local GAA field is the pride of the parish and a local hub of activity.You say your often amazed to see fields with little stands down the country.I must say i'm not.I spent all my summer holidays in Tipp and Cork to a lesser extent and always played on good pitches with massive nets behind the goals.I used practise for hours hurling and loved the way these nets would stop the sliotar.I never had that in Dublin growing up.Sounds a small thing but i loved it.
It was never like this in Dublin.I grew up playing in Glenaulin Park in Palmerstown on Corporation pitches and one prefab as a changing room.Lots of away fields we changed in our cars.The country counties will always have that advantage over us.Their whole county is immersed in GAA.It is changing in Dublin but it is not the same.
cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 29/06/2016 14:51:40
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