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Unionism is a complicated animal, there's as much squabbling that goes on within its ranks as there is between themselves and nationalism.
There is a class difference for starters where I find that the working class man is more likely to be going to Orange Parades, waving the flag and protesting at Stormount. These guys have no interest in the GAA, they would be anti-GAA. The upper classes are more likely to be playing rugby, supporting an all Ireland rugby team and I think its here you might, if your lucky find somebody who takes a passing interest if their Ulster county is in a GAA final or semi. Willie Anderson, famous Irish Rugby player comes to mind who was a fan of Peter Canavan and went to the odd game as well.
Sadly the GAA is seen as a sectarian, discrimatory organisation by unionists, its seen as anti partition and anti everything that is British. So you will be hard pushed to find a unionist who has an interest in it.
You got to say as well when a county wins an all Ireland from the six, what an achievement that is...... there must be a disadvantage when a county is divided up by two communities, one with zero interest in GAA sport and who do not play it. If GAA appealed to all up here, there would be a lot more silverware heading north.
cacsmckilly (Tyrone) - Posts: 1294 - 09/06/2016 11:12:57
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Replying To KerryKillers: "That's brilliant, would've loved to have seen a picture of it :D" Kerrykillers it was in Annalong, County Down. Not too
far from Kilkeel County Down and Ballymartin where
the car in the Down colours was burnt out.
There are a few funny anecdotes from the area.Way
back in the 1950s I think Nationalists blew up the
road so that Orangeman couldnt walk.The Army/ police
etc then filled in the road so that the Orangeman could
walk.That happened in Longstone named after a long
stone in a field. A nationalist hamlet, the stone was
always painted Green White and Orange. Unionists
went and painted it Red White and Blue. The Longstone
Nationalists painted it back Green White and Orange
then it is was painted Red White and Blue by the
Unionists. And on and on. Eventually it was washed and
left with no colours at all for many years now.
When Longstone reached the final of the 2007 Down
Championship v Mayobridge which they lost after
after a replay they painted some kerbstones red
and white in celebration, the Unionists added some
blue to the kerbstones!!!!
South Down is a very Nationalist area predominantly.
In Castlewellan you will find a monument to the IRA
men from South Down who died in the recent troubles.
A few weeks ago a giant tricolour was unveiled outside
Castlewellan library for the Easter Rising celebrations
in the town . Unionists were seething.
REDANDBLACK30 (Down) - Posts: 1617 - 09/06/2016 11:32:32
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Replying To 32_4_1: "These sort of threads annoy me. How can some people in the south be so ignorant when it comes to the north? The reality is they aren't, and the threads are just a thinly veiled attempts to say "tell me about what goes one there, I wouldn't know as I live in a different country". How are any nationalists in the north going to be any wiser about what goes through a unionists head, as we can see from here. If I had never even been north of the border, I could probably make as educated guess with one click of google to say hardened loyalists wouldn't have anything to do with it, some moderate unionists wouldn't either, some wouldn't be pushed either way and some might take a passing interest, with the very odd one taking an active interest. What a useless thread. GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts:2387 - 08/06/2016 20:37:54 This point is actually quite interesting. My grandmother was a "southern unionist"/Church of Ireland goer from near Malahide. That general area (Kinsealy Portmarnock etc) would have quite a few heads who didn't go north after partition. She brought me to some churches and area's in Kildare that would have been the same. So I done quite a bit of research on it over the years. These days, apart from the church you go to, the majority of protestants would consider themselves Irish and would follow GAA in the exact same way as anyone else. I know a small minority who would still hold a great affinity to Britain and would be quite moderate but wouldn't really take much interest in GAA. They may watch it with a passing interest if there was nothing else on or would talk to someone about it if they knew that person was interested in the GAA of course. Then you'd have an even smaller minority like this lot: linkMy cousin is in young Fine Gael and is a complete eejit. Supports the UUP in the north. SDLP are too republican apparently. So have heard the ignorant nonsense he spouts along with his other "unionist mates". None of these have any affiliation to any sort of traditional unionism (or the north in general), yet have regaled me with stories of going to marches in the north to show how matured they are by "accepting the other side". And I'm not even joking. Reality is, there's a very nasty undercurrent to this lot, who yearn for the grandeur of the British Empire. From my experience , it's this type of southern partitionist who tends to head north for the marches, in their element surrounded by all the union flags. Kind of like the 6th generation Irish American on paddys day, who will outright lie to Irish people about having some sort of tedious link to Ireland. So you've a bit of that going on when they engage with northern unionists....made up connections 3 generations ago etc. So to sum up, from my experience and from stories I've heard, those who come from actual unionist backrounds generally just carry on the same as anyone else, with their unionist connection being diluted because they are 3/4 generations removed from partition, while a few hardened southern unionists (the type in the link above) and the plastic unionists are the one's who head north for marches and would have no time for GAA. As an aside, you'd be surprised how rife this attitude is in young Fine Gael."
Never heard of anyone in FG going up to the north and taking part in orange order parades. What a load of nonsense. And to insinuate that FG people are less into gaelic football???
Yeah, Gerry McEntee and Graham Geraghty have no interest in gaelic games.
Weirdo.
Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1318 - 09/06/2016 11:49:44
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This thread is an eye-opener, I must say. I'm always impressed by the hurdles that Northern Gaels overcome just to play Gaelic games.
Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 09/06/2016 13:04:02
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Replying To Crinigan: "What a bizarre rant. What have FG got to do with this thread?
Never heard of anyone in FG going up to the north and taking part in orange order parades. What a load of nonsense. And to insinuate that FG people are less into gaelic football???
Yeah, Gerry McEntee and Graham Geraghty have no interest in gaelic games.
Weirdo." I think you've misinterpreted most of my post. Fine Gael have nothing to do with it, other than that one person who happens to be involved with them too. The other plastic unionists would have been dotted around Leinster and would have nothing to do with Fg, and they all met up to go through the Dublin/Wicklow Orange Lodge that I linked. Other than these few eejits and the few actual southern unionists who make up the Dublin/Wicklow Orange Lodge, I don't know of anyone who goes north to marches as their numbers are so so few. I though Gary might have been referring to seeing these, as 99% of people in the south from a traditional unionist backgrounds have nothing to do with unionism, and are just Irish like anyone else. I also referred to some moderate unionists in the south too, but they would obviously be of an older generation and have nothing to do with unionism in the north, and just hold an affinity to Britain in general. Again, you wouldn't even know this unless you got talking to them and asked. Generally in the south, real unionism doesn't exist (outside the border counties which is slightly different again).
As for Fine Gael, I was referring to a very anti-nationalist attitude in general, hence why I said it was an aside. Many of their active followers are what I would generally refer to as southern unionists.
32_4_1 (Meath) - Posts: 4122 - 09/06/2016 13:10:53
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Replying To cacsmckilly: "Unionism is a complicated animal, there's as much squabbling that goes on within its ranks as there is between themselves and nationalism.
There is a class difference for starters where I find that the working class man is more likely to be going to Orange Parades, waving the flag and protesting at Stormount. These guys have no interest in the GAA, they would be anti-GAA. The upper classes are more likely to be playing rugby, supporting an all Ireland rugby team and I think its here you might, if your lucky find somebody who takes a passing interest if their Ulster county is in a GAA final or semi. Willie Anderson, famous Irish Rugby player comes to mind who was a fan of Peter Canavan and went to the odd game as well.
Sadly the GAA is seen as a sectarian, discrimatory organisation by unionists, its seen as anti partition and anti everything that is British. So you will be hard pushed to find a unionist who has an interest in it.
You got to say as well when a county wins an all Ireland from the six, what an achievement that is...... there must be a disadvantage when a county is divided up by two communities, one with zero interest in GAA sport and who do not play it. If GAA appealed to all up here, there would be a lot more silverware heading north." I don't think that Tyrone can claim to have that particular disadvantage. The county has a population of 170,000 and is 80% nationalist.
We also have 60 odd GAA clubs.
We can make lots of excuses for not winning more All Ireland's but unfortunately the sectarian divide up north is not one of them.
Wally (Tyrone) - Posts: 912 - 09/06/2016 13:41:11
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GaryMc, I'm not saying you're wrong because there's no way I could really prove that, but out of interest what are you basing that on? I've been over and back from Wexford my entire life, my family know pretty much A-Z of their neighbours (something that always seems unusual to me, growing up in an urban area where making eye contact with others isn't always the greatest of ideas) and I've never, ever heard of one instance of anyone going up north to join an OO parade.
Combined with the other counties you've referenced, are you saying there's a sizeable minority throughout the south east of Ireland? If you are, as I said above, what are you basing that on?
MedwayIrish (Wexford) - Posts:1077 - 08/06/2016 23:55:16
I have a strong family connections in the Carlow/Kilkenny area, and also outside Waterford and we spend a lot of time down there throughout the year.
I first heard of one local farmer in the South East, who most of the nearby local town probably don't realise is even protestant, never mind an Orangeman, is known to travel up North every single year for the marching season. He is said to travel with Orange Lodge group from the Wicklow/Wexford area, and has strong links to the East Cork Orange Order lodges. I didn't fully realise that Orange Order has lodges or bands in those regions, and was a bit shocked by this.
I think it is a very tiny minority in the South east, But It is an functioning entity all the same.
GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 09/06/2016 13:50:46
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I think you've misinterpreted most of my post. Fine Gael have nothing to do with it, other than that one person who happens to be involved with them too. The other plastic unionists would have been dotted around Leinster and would have nothing to do with Fg, and they all met up to go through the Dublin/Wicklow Orange Lodge that I linked. Other than these few eejits and the few actual southern unionists who make up the Dublin/Wicklow Orange Lodge, I don't know of anyone who goes north to marches as their numbers are so so few. I though Gary might have been referring to seeing these, as 99% of people in the south from a traditional unionist backgrounds have nothing to do with unionism, and are just Irish like anyone else.
As for Fine Gael, I was referring to a very anti-nationalist attitude in general, hence why I said it was an aside. Many of their active followers are what I would generally refer to as southern unionists.
32_4_1 (Meath) - Posts:4070 - 09/06/2016 13:10:53 1864
No my particular information was initially based around individuals in Carlow/Kilkenny, who I was later told travel as part of a wider Wicklow/Wexford group to Orange Order parades up North. Which would suggest he is of the deep Unionist persuasion, which is his rite in a free country.
I highlighted this, as there seemed to be a general opinion that Unionism only exists in Ulster, which is definitely where it has the large numbers.
GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 09/06/2016 14:01:08
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i find this one more interesting:
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/news-analysis/unionists-and-republicans-have-little-understanding-of-each-sides-cultural-touchstones-the-reflex-action-can-be-antipathy-34567927.html
s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 09/06/2016 15:55:43
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Replying To Offside_Rule: "Yeah know that filling station bumper. The funny thing about Ahoghill is that a number of people are surprised when you say you are going to a Football or Hurling match there and the reaction is not unlike the one you encountered. I suppose people associate Ahoghill as let's just say a good Protestant place and while you would probably struggle to knock on the door of a Catholic in the village the pitch is a few miles outside in the country where there are more Catholics living." yeah and that was the reason why I tried to tell him he was wasting his time offside but sure he knew best!
bumpernut (Antrim) - Posts: 1852 - 09/06/2016 16:53:25
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just to dispel a myth on here.....
I live in Limerick, a county with a large protestant minority in certain towns, Adare for example being chief amongst them. A mix of RC, COI, Presbyterian and Methodist. If u branch the Protestant groups together as one, its probably anything up to 30% of the population of Adare.
Now, to say that these people are of a unionist persuasion is ludicrous! The COI primary school play football, hurling and camogie, spell their names as gaeilge and are every bit as Irish as any of the rest of us!! There is no line, no divide. Southern Protestants, at least the many that I know, regard themselves as 100% Irish.
I do know one lad alright who would be of the unionist persuasion, but he is a catholic, of scottish heritage!!!
A lovely fella, but a bit nuts!!
Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 09/06/2016 18:21:47
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8pc of the population in Monaghan is Protestant, the biggest per-capita density of the 26 counties. I'd say this doesn't make a difference to most of the clubs and a lot of protestants play GAA in Monaghan but my own club has a serious amount of Unionists living in the area and the majority of them hate the GAA with a passion. They won't even step foot in our clubhouse if there's a charity fundraiser on or if they're invited to a birthday party or anything in it. It's a pity because it's a small area and we have a tiny pick as it is, could be some great footballers among them!
turkeyplucker (UK) - Posts: 137 - 09/06/2016 19:22:36
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Replying To turkeyplucker: "8pc of the population in Monaghan is Protestant, the biggest per-capita density of the 26 counties. I'd say this doesn't make a difference to most of the clubs and a lot of protestants play GAA in Monaghan but my own club has a serious amount of Unionists living in the area and the majority of them hate the GAA with a passion. They won't even step foot in our clubhouse if there's a charity fundraiser on or if they're invited to a birthday party or anything in it. It's a pity because it's a small area and we have a tiny pick as it is, could be some great footballers among them!" When Monaghan won their first Ulster title in 25 years in 2013, we were driving back from Clones near to a rural village called Drum which has a mostly Protestant population. There was a local farmer bringing cattle down the road so we were stopped waiting. He saw our county jerseys as he walked passed and the only comment he made was 'Yez did well today!'. Small point but it was interesting the 'us' and 'yous' mentality he had, even though the vast majority of Monaghan people that day were tuned in to the match.
RightFull (Monaghan) - Posts: 74 - 09/06/2016 22:28:02
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I believe partitionist mindsets within the GAA community have a more detrimental effect on our games than the unionist community both north and south could ever have.
Just one small example. After the recent Round 1 Qualifier draw I read a tweet on twitter from a Longford supporter that read, 'Down V Longford 2 days after Brexit vote. Will we need passports to go to Newry for the match?'. The official Longford GAA twitter page retweeted this. Poor taste.
The GAA has played a massive role in our country's national identity for over a century; particularly culturally and socially. I am proud of where I am from. I am proud to be a northern Gael. But, comments like this, regardless of how insignificant they might seem, can make us in the north feel alientated from Gael's in the south. They have no place in the GAA community.
For us Gael's in the 6 counties, 'Brexit' is a realistic threat to our national identity. And, without turning this thread into a political debate, it is also a threat to the GAA community. Therefore I feel it is a topic worthy of mature discussion.
MourneArmy (Down) - Posts: 1787 - 11/06/2016 08:06:28
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Replying To Liamwalkinstown: "When your counties are in big big games towards the end of the summer, now and in the past, what was the general reaction of your unionist friends/colleagues? Apathy? Empathy? Best of luck kinda thing, or pure f*ckoffary?!" Liamwalkinstown I have no problems in Derry as I avoid bigots and people who let political differences decide their personality.
Liamwalkinstown How do unionists in Dublin react when your county is playing? I'm guessing you don't know as these kind of questions and thoughts are only brought up mainly in the bigot 6
DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 15/06/2016 19:06:30
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"And, without turning this thread into a political debate, it is also a threat to the GAA community. Therefore I feel it is a topic worthy of mature discussion."
Its early where I am now and I haven't had a coffee yet so please explain.
I fail to see how part of the U.K 'leaving' Europe will affect the GAA community. Iceland voted not to join the EU but they seem to be doing okay.
DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 15/06/2016 19:25:28
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Replying To DoireCityFC: "Liamwalkinstown I have no problems in Derry as I avoid bigots and people who let political differences decide their personality.
Liamwalkinstown How do unionists in Dublin react when your county is playing? I'm guessing you don't know as these kind of questions and thoughts are only brought up mainly in the bigot 6" Is it that much of an unreasonable question DCFC? Would you prefer people to just make assumptions and not bother to ask those living in culturally divided areas?
MedwayIrish (Wexford) - Posts: 2324 - 15/06/2016 19:45:16
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Replying To MourneArmy: "I believe partitionist mindsets within the GAA community have a more detrimental effect on our games than the unionist community both north and south could ever have.
Just one small example. After the recent Round 1 Qualifier draw I read a tweet on twitter from a Longford supporter that read, 'Down V Longford 2 days after Brexit vote. Will we need passports to go to Newry for the match?'. The official Longford GAA twitter page retweeted this. Poor taste.
The GAA has played a massive role in our country's national identity for over a century; particularly culturally and socially. I am proud of where I am from. I am proud to be a northern Gael. But, comments like this, regardless of how insignificant they might seem, can make us in the north feel alientated from Gael's in the south. They have no place in the GAA community.
For us Gael's in the 6 counties, 'Brexit' is a realistic threat to our national identity. And, without turning this thread into a political debate, it is also a threat to the GAA community. Therefore I feel it is a topic worthy of mature discussion." It was a lame tweet, but I'm not sure if it was meant as a pro-partition comment. There's lots of scaremongering going on in the media about the 'Brexit' at the moment, and alot of talk about border controls being re-instated between North and South etc. I don't think the tweet was advocating for border controls, was it? I hope not.
And from what I've heard/read, if there are new border controls as result of Britain leaving the EU, it will be between Ireland as a whole, and Great Britain. So the Brexit might actually lead to the entire Island of Ireland being treated as one unit, and separate from Britain. Wouldn't irish nationalists/republicans be in favor of this?
Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1823 - 15/06/2016 20:15:59
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They could always just make the MASSIVE trek to one of these beautiful and historical places and find out and not have to ask. I don't need to ask a person in any part in Ireland what their county is like as I have visited all 31 and the Peoples Republic
DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 15/06/2016 20:18:18
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Replying To DoireCityFC: "They could always just make the MASSIVE trek to one of these beautiful and historical places and find out and not have to ask. I don't need to ask a person in any part in Ireland what their county is like as I have visited all 31 and the Peoples Republic" Again, I've some sympathy with what you're saying DCFC but I've been to Derry and Belfast. That doesn't mean I'd pretend to know what goes on in either better than a local would.
MedwayIrish (Wexford) - Posts: 2324 - 15/06/2016 20:33:41
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