Master - what is a proper footballing county?

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts:2812 - 13/04/2016 12:07:17


A phrase I despise ,
There are words like established , traditional , power counties etc that are fit for purpose , Ive been to Kilkenny and heard it numerous times were not a proper Hurling county and that was one of the more polite sayings .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 13/04/2016 12:23:45    1845093

Title of the thread should actually be "I miss a competitive game in Leinster involving Dublin". It's not that long ago (2011) when Kildare ran Dublin to a point in a Leinster final and that was a dodgy free for a foul on BB, Meath were beaten by 4 in 2012. Since then the collapse of a credible opposition to Dublin within Leinster is mind boggling, both have taken 16 point whoppings since then from the Dubs (everyone else has as well). Counties that light up the early part of the last decade (Westmeath and Laois) are now in Div 4/3. Westmeath in particular have gone into reverse in a most alarming fashion, div 1 to 4 in successive seasons is probably a record, and they somehow managed a 1st win over Meath last year. God be with the days when Offaly always put up a good game against any opposition. The team from the Tommy Lyons managed era just vanished without a trace and there's not been a whimper since. Completely off the radar at this stage.
In short, there will be good/competitive games in Leinster this year, just none involving Dublin. Whatever chances in the near future of having one will depend on how Kildare develop.
As for Meath, could we be doing better, undoubtedly, but there's a level of apathy and inertia in the county with regard to football/hurling development that is most worrying. Successive CB's have to take a large slice of blame, but they're elected by the clubs so we've nobody to blame but ourselves. Best of luck to all in the summer, Ulster aside it'll probably be a snooze fest until August!

moylagh (Meath) - Posts: 484 - 13/04/2016 12:30:05    1845098

No doubt Meath will come again but Dublin will never be average again like they occasionally were for periods over the last 30 years and I think that is the key point. No matter how you look at it, for every footballer meath or indeed my own county, Kildare can produce, Dublin can produce 8 or 9. And for every footballer than Longford can produce, Meath or Kildare can produce 8 or 9. It's a flawed system we all know that

11jm11 (Kildare) - Posts:106 - 13/04/2016 12:21:16 184

Whats the solution.....discouraging GAA with the youth of Dublin?? Stop lads playing our games?????

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 13/04/2016 12:36:26    1845101

moylagh (Meath) - Posts:375 - 13/04/2016 12:30:05


Cant argue with anything there , Muhammad Ali was in most peoples eyes the greatest , definitely his own , he got to fight some fantastic opposition some times more than once , he fought fighters/boxers , he fought beasts , we can evaluate how good he was because we saw him tested by equals and come out the other side, this may well be one of the best teams Dublin have ever produced it may never get the credit it deserves which would be partially down to the quality of opposition in Leinster .
So while it may not be any day soon I hope for a resurgence in the level of football in Leinster .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 13/04/2016 12:42:22    1845103

No doubt Meath will come again but Dublin will never be average again like they occasionally were for periods over the last 30 years and I think that is the key point. No matter how you look at it, for every footballer meath or indeed my own county, Kildare can produce, Dublin can produce 8 or 9. And for every footballer than Longford can produce, Meath or Kildare can produce 8 or 9. It's a flawed system we all know that

11jm11 (Kildare) - Posts:106 - 13/04/2016 12:21:16 184

Whats the solution.....discouraging GAA with the youth of Dublin?? Stop lads playing our games?????

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts:6554 - 13/04/2016 12:36:26 1845

More money needs to go to weaker counties than is currently. this might allow the bigger counties in Leinster compete with Dublin but i think the days of Longford or Offaly challenging are over

11jm11 (Kildare) - Posts: 366 - 13/04/2016 12:44:16    1845107

Whats the solution.....discouraging GAA with the youth of Dublin?? Stop lads playing our games

don't think anyone is saying that, I feel this is the big issue facing the gaa at the moment the gaa needs a strong Dublin in both codes. but it also needs some semblance of competition the growing apathy is worrying imo more and more youngfellows from weaker counties are opting out of the intercounty scene, the football is worse than hurling even as regards competition and the gap is getting wider. this is a fact there is unfortunately no answer to this but saying other counties should get there own house in order misses the point its not about just Dublin its about the very future of the game no one wants to see two teams battiling out for the all Ireland everyyear which is the way it looks like going

coopersleftfoot (Kerry) - Posts: 91 - 13/04/2016 12:52:02    1845113

More money needs to go to weaker counties than is currently. this might allow the bigger counties in Leinster compete with Dublin but i think the days of Longford or Offaly challenging are over

11jm11 (Kildare) - Posts:107 - 13/04/2016 12:44:16

If a perceived fairer distribution of funds is what it takes for a better Leinster championship is what's called for then let it be so.
But as I've said to one other poster already go onto the Meath website and read what Meath posters are saying is their problem , how much money would it take to turn Wicklow into a force in either code and would you really recommend giving their county board funds. In some counties unfortunately the inmates are running the asylum.
Big problems require big solutions , yes funding should be looked at but only as part of a bigger plan. Development of the games from grass route levels , better coaches , GPOs in schools , buy in from clubs and penalties where plan is not followed , club vested interests rarely serve the county .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 13/04/2016 12:58:59    1845116

Sadly we aren't producing the caliber of player anymore. Giles in the half forward line and Gerathy, Ollie Murphy, and Tommy Dowd inside. Don't think we'll ever see the like of this again.

What some people might find surprising is that Giles won a county championship in 2010, was probably the best player in the championship that year. I seen Gerathy in an intermediate county final 2 years ago and there were 2 men marking him and him over 40 years of age. If either of them guys were 20 year olds playing at that level they'd be on the county panel for sure.

begining (UK) - Posts: 300 - 13/04/2016 13:02:47    1845120

Meath still have a big enough population to thrive without having to draft the "blow in's" indeed Meath in the past have benefited from the re-location of families back in the land reformation. I think Tommy Dowd and John McDermott of the top of my head are from Mayo stock.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11237 - 13/04/2016 13:06:58    1845123

If a perceived fairer distribution of funds is what it takes for a better Leinster championship is what's called for then let it be so.

Its not just leinster counties that need this the gaa need to take charge of this centrally in my opinion certain county boards are very progressive and are reaping the rewards, Dublin, Kerry Roscommon , tipp and tyrone are counties that spring to mind in the other column I would have cork,meath and antrim and probably a lot more ! its not just about money although it does help, coaches are the key every self respecting Dublin senior club has a full time coach, other counties need help in this regard I think the gaa really needs to fund coaches that work over several counties centrally and keep the county boards out of it (easier said than done) it shoudnt just come down to participation levels it should be down to potential eg the money put into Dublin hurling has been an unrivalled success meath football and antrim hurling should be given the same input of money and time to develop it wont happen tho why?

coopersleftfoot (Kerry) - Posts: 91 - 13/04/2016 13:12:47    1845127

O Rourkes are Leitrim men originally are they not?

11jm11 (Kildare) - Posts: 366 - 13/04/2016 13:19:05    1845131

Richieq get away from that trap. It's alright to split someone with a punch to the jaw but not to lie down easily if someone hits you.

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 13/04/2016 13:37:49    1845141

11Jm11: Indeed they are, Lyons's too I think although I'm not sure. Terry Ferguson's old man (Snitchy Fergusson) was from Dublin, won an AI alongside K. Heffernan. Kevin Foley's connections with Limerick, Liam Hayes has connections in Carlow. Same with most county teams, you'll find plenty of players with outside connections.

moylagh (Meath) - Posts: 484 - 13/04/2016 13:39:50    1845143

General air of apathy within the county, CB an manager seem content we survived in division two. Big risk we could fall further in next few years, don't think money is answer, we have to sort out our problems from within. Compared with a lot of counties we have a big population but little in way of ambition at present. Whatever we are doing is not working, but we still persist with this broken formula.

seadog54 (Meath) - Posts: 2151 - 13/04/2016 13:41:01    1845145

If a perceived fairer distribution of funds is what it takes for a better Leinster championship is what's called for then let it be so.

Its not just leinster counties that need this the gaa need to take charge of this centrally in my opinion certain county boards are very progressive and are reaping the rewards, Dublin, Kerry Roscommon , tipp and tyrone are counties that spring to mind in the other column I would have cork,meath and antrim and probably a lot more ! its not just about money although it does help, coaches are the key every self respecting Dublin senior club has a full time coach, other counties need help in this regard I think the gaa really needs to fund coaches that work over several counties centrally and keep the county boards out of it (easier said than done) it shoudnt just come down to participation levels it should be down to potential eg the money put into Dublin hurling has been an unrivalled success meath football and antrim hurling should be given the same input of money and time to develop it wont happen tho why?

coopersleftfoot (Kerry) - Posts:72 - 13/04/2016 13:12:47 1845127


I agree with your post right up until the last line , was speaking to someone who has left background staff in Antrim trust me money without a plan there and a change of personnel at CB level is just pi77ing down a hole , I agree with what Brolly has said that Belfast is neglected , it should have serious funds/attention from HQ I honestly feel a strong Antrim would spread amongst other counties participation etc Im for serious funding in Belfast just not in giving a blank cheque to the muppets up there.

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 13/04/2016 13:41:49    1845146

Sure Bernard Flynn is from Louth!!! (or is it Cavan?)
Sean Doherty was a Wicklow man
and as for Kildare......where do i even begin!!!

Liamwalkinstown (Dublin) - Posts: 8166 - 13/04/2016 13:42:31    1845147

oh I agree that's my point should be central council the county board up there is a joke they had a 100 years at it with limited success, that was the crux of my argument useless county boards should be bypassed, impossible I know to implement

coopersleftfoot (Kerry) - Posts: 91 - 13/04/2016 14:03:56    1845167

I think counties like Meath, good teams come in cycles - remember Meath were rank bad in the 70's and early 80's also. Yes good coaching can do a lot but you need the natural talent also, Meath have nobody nowadays to touch a Bernard Flynn, Tommy Dowd, Graham Geraghty and that's just the forward line. Maybe counties like Mayo, Tyrone and Roscommon are in the right cycle at the moment but it's very difficult to maintain that over a sustained period with limited enough resources. Remember Kepak pumped a lot of money into Meath at that time also.
Now don't get me wrong county board ineptitude hasn't helped either, Dublin are not playing on a level playing field to everyone else, anyone that questions that statement needs to take their head out of the sands.

AthboyCelt (Meath) - Posts: 147 - 13/04/2016 14:21:47    1845185

I think counties like Meath, good teams come in cycles - remember Meath were rank bad in the 70's and early 80's also. Yes good coaching can do a lot but you need the natural talent also, Meath have nobody nowadays to touch a Bernard Flynn, Tommy Dowd, Graham Geraghty and that's just the forward line. Maybe counties like Mayo, Tyrone and Roscommon are in the right cycle at the moment but it's very difficult to maintain that over a sustained period with limited enough resources. Remember Kepak pumped a lot of money into Meath at that time also.
Now don't get me wrong county board ineptitude hasn't helped either, Dublin are not playing on a level playing field to everyone else, anyone that questions that statement needs to take their head out of the sands.

AthboyCelt (Meath) - Posts:20 - 13/04/2016 14:21:47

Athyboy would you agree or disagree that Dublin equally are in a cycle , a large amount of lads coming off of two minor teams , joining a bunch of seriously talented older heads , our minor hurlers backed by the very same players made a charge but once they moved on success came to a halt .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 13/04/2016 14:38:27    1845195

What can you say about them? I used to hate them with a passion...

Giles like an altar boy with his perfectly parted hair yet the baby faced assasin could fling a point over from any angle and put a pass through the eye of a needle.

Stafford the shy boy who looked like he had just fallen off a stack of hay yet was the most lethal dead ball expert in the game.

O'Rourke with his Kevin Sheedy'esque cultured left foot. His ever present knee strap always suggesting that he was brittle in the hope that Barr and Heery wouldn't bash him but they did anyway.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iBl-vRWV8QU

Coyle a master of the dark arts. The original 'have a word in the opponent's ear' merchant. Rarely to be seen starting a shemozzle but always in the thick of things once it kicked off

Lyons with the bald head masking a portly man of iron. A man with the audacity to put Barrsy off a match winning penalty.

Foley that goal, the oversized jersey, the mad head on him.

That tank Tommy Dowd. A neck as wide as the river liffey but an unstoppable force.

Boylan with his witch's brew and nicey nicey interviews to the media but putting Dublin players' faces on a dart board in the dressing room. And to think that you could pee into his front garden from Dublin.

There was so much to hate yet admire also. It made Jack Sheedy's last minute winner against them in 93 one of my most memorable moments in Croker.

I have to say for all those reason to hate them, I miss the Royal.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 13/04/2016 14:42:41    1845197