There is no doubting that the GAA centrally has a responsibility to ensure a decent level of funding for ALL counties, but this constant debating and rehashing of figures of games development grants is very one eyed by some posters. Dublin certainly get the lions share of grants in this respect but as these are monies allocated specifically to on going games development work within counties then its understandable that they do. Some people seem to be of the opinion that its a 'what we hope to do' grant, it isn't. It is solely for games promotion and development work currently being undertaken.
It's a bit ironic that some of the most vociferous posters on this topic come from counties such as Mayo and Kildare that have had huge financial support given to them from the GAA in recent times to help them cope with the debts run up by their county boards reckless spending. (approx. 5.22 million in Mayos case and over 1.5 million in Kildare). but because the money is not from the coaching budget it obviously doesn't count.
As I said before on this topic the most important thing the GAA could do now is to put in place a targeted and specific coaching program that can be adapted to every club/county no matter how big or small they are and when it is established then put coaches into each county to implement it. There is no point giving out funds without the proper structures in place or they would just end up being at worse wasted, or at the least poorly utilised.
It is often overlooked, (perhaps deliberately) , when talking about paid coaches in Dublin that the clubs pay 50% of the cost of the coach. If a club can't afford this they frequently join with a neighbouring club and share the coach who then covers firstly the schools and then the juvenile teams in the area. Its not as though a pot of money is just thrown open for everyone to grab from. If a club can't meet, and show how they will meet the cost involved then it just doesn't happen, and going forward the GAA would need to insist on similar criteria for future funding.

AHP (Dublin) - Posts: 323 - 04/02/2016 13:29:40    1822201

The Master
I couldn't agree more, people can't argue against something where they have no logical defense
I have posted this twice and not one Dublin poster has refuted me or even referenced me

"Explain to me exactly why Meath and Kildare should PROPORTIONALLY receive 24 cent and 20 cent for every Euro Dublin get. Do you not think that proportionally it should be euro for euro.
To break this down for you if Dublin get €1.46 million, Meath should get €182,400, not the €45,600 they got this year.
No one is saying that other counties should get 1.46 million, what we are saying is it should be distributed equally. You have no argument."

It is simple maths, the bag of a fag packet economics you're using jimbodub is to be frank plain wrong.
Proportional funding is what the GAA themselves espouse to adhere to yet Dublin despite their complete and utter dominance of commercial sponsorship (no problem with self generated revenue by the way) receive almost 75% more grant funding from Central council than their two local rivals. Its just wrong and what's worse is you have now the GAA saying a "review" will take place and nothing will change for 18 months to 3 years!
Bury it in another committee, standard GAA

highking12 (Meath) - Posts: 184 - 04/02/2016 13:58:51    1822216

The GAA DON'T want any debate on this, the Dublin media are largely indifferent because a successful Dublin team is good for business and there will be no change soon. Meanwhile the Leinster Championship will continue to decline to an even bigger farce and Gaelic Games will slowly die a death in places like Belfast and Derry.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9706 - 04/02/2016 13:59:20    1822217

AHP, the counties are entitled to a fair share of the monies. You or anyone else doesn't get to decide they don't get it until they spend it as you say, no more than anyone else gets to decide how Dublin spend it. It isn't dublin assigning pocket-money to the rest of us. This assumption that people from other counties are idiots is just ridiculous. Have you considered that maybe other counties need funds to get these processes in place in the first place - like Dublin did? Have you considered that Dublin probably wasted a fair bit themselves, but when the gaa kept funding them and so there is no debts, so it in turn gets consigned to history?

Also, all that posting, and still no reference to why any one person in Dublin gets 5 times more than any one person in meath or Kildare...

Im thinking of starting a pool - how many more posts will jimbo and co go through without mentioning the investment per capita point (i.e. the very root of the entire argument). Any guesses? Id say it is good for another page at least

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 04/02/2016 14:37:24    1822238

Ulsterman correct me if I'm wrong on this but I thought a lot of the club's up in ulster also got funding of different kinds from aunty lizzies government! I know all sporting organisations up there are entitled to apply for these grants now whether gaa clubs and Co boards apply for these or not is another matter, I wonder would you with your vast knowledge of all things Gaa north and south of the border be able to clarify for me if Gaa clubs north of the border take lizzie up on her kind offerings!

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts: 932 - 04/02/2016 14:39:18    1822241

Ulsterman have you come back from lunch yet?

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts: 932 - 04/02/2016 15:17:40    1822253

Dubjohn,

Please enlighten us with your knowledge of the grant system up here because im curious myself.

Clubs in Antrim and I presume other ulster counties certainly get no funding to provide coaching from central government.

There are, however, capital grants made available occasionally from Lizzie's coffers which I hardly need to add cannot be used for coaching.

bumpernut (Antrim) - Posts: 1852 - 04/02/2016 15:31:45    1822262

Bumpernut my good friend I cannot "enlighten" you with my knowledge of the grants system provided by lizzie and Co. hence the need to seek counsel from that fountain of knowledge aka Ulsterman and why "I thought" was in the second line of my post, If I knew how it worked (the grants system) I wouldn't be asking, would I?

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts: 932 - 04/02/2016 15:44:25    1822269

There are far bigger issues at play that some are also greatly ignoring

Very important issues that actually explains a lot of what is wrong with not only the GAA but what's actually wrong with this country

Thinking everything is simply about money and getting a few extra quid will have them competing with the best

A little bit extra, will cure all their ills - it wont. It simply wont.

We have seen many a County Board sink many millions into their structures and have ended up with nothing but debt

Struggling to keep up with Interest rates on their own loans

I am all for the redistribution of funds to weaker counties - but prove to the GAA that you deserve it.

Where are the strategic plans?

Should money just be handed over without any sort of business plan to prove how they will spend this money effectively...

No - it shouldn't.

"Just give us money...because you give Dublin money"

Silly stuff. Simple as that

It's obvious enough that many can't be trusted with extra revenue because they have already run themselves into the ground

You cant just demand money without a plan to implement it successfully - because that will just be more wasted money that could be better spent

Dublin came up with a strategic plan and currently run it superbly well, with great commitment and endeavour at grass root level and at CB level - it's increasing the playing population and our sports are now reaching more people - But it takes great work, but we have proven we can deliver.

Dublin GAA brings in more revenue compared to any other county - through various revenue generating ways

Why are we getting more per head.. because it's proven that we can deliver and that it's a wise investment perhaps?

Because we generate revenue greater than any other county that benefits everyone

That is why the GAA invests into Dublin GAA and it's working.

I know... pure madness right?

Why do you need such simple things explained to you?

Now.. have a look at your own structures, have a look at what you can offer, where does your CB currently stand and look at their own record of spending their own money.. do you deserve the investment?

If you can prove you do... then you deserve the money.

But again... there are far bigger problems at work here and that's where the real issues can be found

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 04/02/2016 16:04:37    1822283

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There is no doubting that the GAA centrally has a responsibility to ensure a decent level of funding for ALL counties, but this constant debating and rehashing of figures of games development grants is very one eyed by some posters. Dublin certainly get the lions share of grants in this respect but as these are monies allocated specifically to on going games development work within counties then its understandable that they do. Some people seem to be of the opinion that its a 'what we hope to do' grant, it isn't. It is solely for games promotion and development work currently being undertaken.
It's a bit ironic that some of the most vociferous posters on this topic come from counties such as Mayo and Kildare that have had huge financial support given to them from the GAA in recent times to help them cope with the debts run up by their county boards reckless spending. (approx. 5.22 million in Mayos case and over 1.5 million in Kildare). but because the money is not from the coaching budget it obviously doesn't count.
As I said before on this topic the most important thing the GAA could do now is to put in place a targeted and specific coaching program that can be adapted to every club/county no matter how big or small they are and when it is established then put coaches into each county to implement it. There is no point giving out funds without the proper structures in place or they would just end up being at worse wasted, or at the least poorly utilised.
It is often overlooked, (perhaps deliberately) , when talking about paid coaches in Dublin that the clubs pay 50% of the cost of the coach. If a club can't afford this they frequently join with a neighbouring club and share the coach who then covers firstly the schools and then the juvenile teams in the area. Its not as though a pot of money is just thrown open for everyone to grab from. If a club can't meet, and show how they will meet the cost involved then it just doesn't happen, and going forward the GAA would need to insist on similar criteria for future funding.


Very good.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 04/02/2016 16:10:52    1822287

Jimbo, frankly the ills of other counties are not your concern. Dublin are being awarded what others are entitled to, that is the long and the short of this debate. Other ills are not being discussed, nor are they relevant to the topic. You are just deflecting away from the per capita issue, which completely trumps your argument.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 04/02/2016 16:32:19    1822292

Ulsterman correct me if I'm wrong on this but I thought a lot of the club's up in ulster also got funding of different kinds from aunty lizzies government! I know all sporting organisations up there are entitled to apply for these grants now whether gaa clubs and Co boards apply for these or not is another matter, I wonder would you with your vast knowledge of all things Gaa north and south of the border be able to clarify for me if Gaa clubs north of the border take lizzie up on her kind offerings!

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts:364 - 04/02/2016 14:39:18

Dubjohn me oul china, I don't see any question marks in your initial post which usually is a good sign of a question being asked, however, you do use quite a few exclamation marks which usually is a good indicator that you somehow believe your statements are fact based!!

Im glad I cleared up your confusion though re Lizzie being an avid GAA fan

bumpernut (Antrim) - Posts: 1852 - 04/02/2016 16:46:54    1822299

TheMaster you are using the money as a smoke screen to ignore the work done in Dublin by Dublin people to build the games. Your inference is that the Dublin GAA are only there because of the money, and once people like you and others keep thinking this we will keep moving ahead.

Answer my question. How much do Dublin and its teams generate for the GAA and then take off the 1.4M€ and tell me the net result?? So do Dublin lose or gain???

witnof (Dublin) - Posts: 1604 - 04/02/2016 16:48:24    1822300

jimbodub

Speaking from a Meath perspective there is a strategic development plan in place in the county, but i know for a fact when a proposal was put forward for more capital grants for grassroots coaching but this was rejected out of hand by Central Council, with a pot is empty answer
Its a simple propsal, can we have money for coaches for pair with schools and clubs? No. Thats what happens when the development of your county doesn't feature on the economic radar of Central Council as Dublin's did in 2005
Dublin with their very innovative Blue Wave which was latched onto and ran whole heartedly by the GAA has worked exceptionally well because it was given such unprecedented funding.
Surely now when a county has the structures in place, has money of their own for a Marketing department and an overflowing list of sposorss on board such as AIG, Toyota, Bavaria, Aer Lingus, Ballygowan, Energise, Linwoods, Skins, O'Neills, DCU, Gibson Hotel, ROS Nutrition, Benetti, etc the need for this financial propping up is removed.

But still also you haven't addressed the simple fundamental question, do you believe your county deserves 75% more funding per capita than your nearest and dearest, even when they are literally crying out for more funding for a development plan that is there?
Your avoidance, coupled with simplistic, uninformed, patronising answers belays the truth of the matter, you only care what happens in your own backyard.

highking12 (Meath) - Posts: 184 - 04/02/2016 16:48:32    1822301

If said funds are going to go to toxic CB's that don't deserve them

I think that's a matter of concern to the GAA at large

Money shouldn't just be blindly handed out

As in Dublin's case it's quite obviously a sound investment given the current success story

The game has never been bigger in Dublin and this is largely built upon the actions of Dublin GAA

Formulating a plan, getting it funded, it takes a while and a lot of hard work, it proves to be successful and the GAA continues with it's sound investment

Why do we get more per heads of capita

Is it not obvious?

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 04/02/2016 16:54:34    1822305

The blind leading the blind sums up this thread.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 04/02/2016 16:55:46    1822306

Dubjohn. I believe various sporting organisations in the North can apply for funding and grants to local councils, the Stormont Culture Dept, Sports Council, UK Lottery and European Commission but there are certain criteria re: cross community that must be met and I don't know how many GAA counties or clubs have applied or been successful. HOWEVER clubs in the South also have Irish Sports Council, Irish Lotto and EU funding available so your argument is pretty redundant and irrelevant. The example of American football has been used where the bottom teams each year get the first pick of the College Draft students the following year so that an even keel and sense of fairness is established.
We are now witnessing the GAA being run as a professional organisation with the fruits and rich pickings going to the stronger, traditional counties and Dublin especially over the horizon and out of sight. I also get the impression that the GAA, most Dubs and the media are quite arrogantly and dismissively content with this 'natural order' as it suits their agenda. The truth is they couldn't really give a damn about the rest as the dark and light blue gravy train trundles along keeping the elite content. It is quite obvious that the other counties have now had enough of this apartheid system and are no longer willing to sit at the back of the bus as the goodies are handed out to the few 'white folk' up at the front. However as Sam Cooke sang in the 60's "Change is gonna come".

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9706 - 04/02/2016 17:21:37    1822315

Well jimbo, you would say that wouldn't you? Sports fans are a selfish lot and Dublin and their followers couldn't really give a monkey's what happens to others so long as they are successful. What is also pretty unpleasant is the sense of entitlement that is coming from many Dubs, as if it is their God given right to be at the top. I have seen it with Man Utd fans, Rangers/Linfield fans, England soccer/rugby/cricket fans. They believe they are top of nature's order and that's the way it just it. Well no it isn't.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9706 - 04/02/2016 17:33:09    1822318

If said funds are going to go to toxic CB's that don't deserve them

I think that's a matter of concern to the GAA at large

Money shouldn't just be blindly handed out

As in Dublin's case it's quite obviously a sound investment given the current success story

The game has never been bigger in Dublin and this is largely built upon the actions of Dublin GAA

Formulating a plan, getting it funded, it takes a while and a lot of hard work, it proves to be successful and the GAA continues with it's sound investment

Why do we get more per heads of capita

Is it not obvious?

Dublin's ability to turn an annual 2,5 million of outside money into a successful sports team is awe-inspring.

realman2 (Kildare) - Posts: 464 - 04/02/2016 17:36:10    1822320

Bumpernut me aul buddy "Correct me if I'm wrong" and "Clarify for me" those two phrases would suggest to me that I was looking for answers would they not? Also at no point did I think or even insinuate that aunty Elizabeth would be a fan, avid or otherwise of our great games, but then I'm sure you'd know more about her interests than I would! I sincerely hope I've cleared up any misunderstanding you might have had of my earlier post!

DUBJOHN (Dublin) - Posts: 932 - 04/02/2016 17:43:47    1822322