Ulster is still a really competitive province and I don't agree that Donegal are way ahead of the rest. There is an over reaction to Donegal beating Armagh convincingly but all the other games in Ulster this year were close enough. I know the Monaghan beat Fermanagh well in the end but it was close for most of the game. Armagh are much better than they showed against Donegal. Look at Antrim's victory over Laois as an example, even without 3 of their players who played hurling the night before. The gap between the top and bottom team in the other provinces is just ridiculous.

JimTheLegend (Donegal) - Posts: 247 - 26/06/2015 12:42:55    1743031

Donegal ability to win 3 Ulster Championships in 4 years just confirms what an outstanding team they are. They've had to win from the prem round as well which is rare. They will go very close to an All-Ireland this year and the rest of Ulster will continue to fight via the back door. Since 2000 Armagh, Tyrone and now Donegal are outstanding Ulster teams.

Byanthon (Tyrone) - Posts: 1780 - 26/06/2015 12:49:25    1743040

GaryMc82
County: Derry
Posts: 1937

1742780 Dubh_linn
County: Dublin
Posts: 302

1742695
There's a lot of rivalry and competitiveness in Ulster but Donegal are still ahead of the rest. They have a great chance of another Ulster title but Monaghan will not make it easy. Still more competitive I would think than Leinster and Munster but really only 2/3 teams that will win it for last few years.

Donegal and Monaghan are both getting better, rather than fading away as some had predicted or hoped.

So while the rest are actually all getting better too, they are naturally going to be some way behind the two strongest sides. Looking around all the other sides in Ulster, the overall standard has really Improved in every single county.

While I'd agree that the standard has come up alright I still think the gap to the top team in each province is wide enough and Donegal are what appears to be a country mile ahead when it comes to Championship football whatever about the league. This may only last another year or two with seven Ulster teams in the top two divisions of the league which will further benefit them down the road.

Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 26/06/2015 13:02:16    1743054

Its only the league but another example of ulster being competive


It shows a good mix of ulster teams have won it while more than half the winners from the other provinces have won it 50% or more of the time.

Munster
27 titles Kerry (19)

Leinster
23 titles Dublin (12)

Ulster
17 titles Derry (6)

Connacht
16 titles Mayo (11)


Cue the "its only the league comments" i know it is its just another slight indicator :)

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 26/06/2015 13:07:16    1743057

You would expect a trend in the All Ireland series if Ulster was as good as some make out. Since 2010 three Ulster sides have contested the semi finals being Down Tyrone and Donegal. The Down Kildare game was in many ways an anomaly and Mayo took Tyrone apart in their respective semi. Only Donegal have succeeded by going on to play in two finals and winning one.

In my opinion recent evidence suggests that Donegal are a healthy step above the rest in Ulster as they are the only team in recent years to take it outside Ulster and beat the best of the rest. All the others have failed. Records are there to be broken though.

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 26/06/2015 13:10:44    1743058

Fair point seany but i think competitiveness in ulster doesnt have to trend with the AI series. competitiveness surley just means against each other?

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 26/06/2015 13:18:19    1743065

Seanfinn
Donegal are every bit as outstanding as Dublin. No question
It's debateable Sean and that's why this year's championship is so intriguing. If the Dubs claim Sam that is 3 titles in 5 years, if Donegal win they have 2 titles in 4 years. In the past 40 years the only time Kerry were not one of the favourites for Sam was the late 80s/ early 90's and this is when Clare made their breakthrough. Ulster really benefits from having no county which consistently produce great teams, so most county's then get a chance of success and can be hopeful. Kerry, and recently Dublin, mean it is a different scenario in other provinces.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 26/06/2015 13:26:44    1743070

In the context of this thread your right Doire. Although I would maintain it represents a more true reflection of the standard on offer. Perhaps most teams are competitive inside Ulster until they play Donegal...

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 26/06/2015 13:59:48    1743097

seany16 hold that thought until tomorrow night. 20 quid on derry at 5/1 DOIRE ABU ha ha

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 26/06/2015 14:08:22    1743100

seany16
County: Dublin
Posts: 1580

1743097
In the context of this thread your right Doire. Although I would maintain it represents a more true reflection of the standard on offer. Perhaps most teams are competitive inside Ulster until they play Donegal...
-----
I think that's the nail on the head Seany. Most Leinster teams are competitive until they meet Dublin. There was an implication that Leinster was non-competitive because Dublin are always winning it but we see the same trend developing in other provinces. Meath v Kildare or Laois would be competitive as would Tyrone or Derry against Armagh etc. but one or two teams are way ahead in each province IMO. I still think that Monaghan are punching above their weight. Rightly or wrongly I would not put them up there with Dublin, Mayo, Donegal or Kerry at this point. They are good in Ulster though.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 26/06/2015 14:47:51    1743130

"Meath v Kildare or Laois would be competitive"

What did kildare put past laois? ;)

Didnt laios beat carlow by 17 then get tanked by kildare in the replay by 13 and now dublin will do the same to them. oh no

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 26/06/2015 14:52:55    1743133

Going by lenister last year the winning margins were all big bar one. Wexford beat longford by 2 points.

The other margins:
7,4,5,5,10,15,28,16,16. Grand total of 108 over 10 games. almost 11 points per game

Ulster:
Draw,8,1,6,2,3,draw,5,13,3. Grand total of 41 over 10 games. 4 points per game


Big difference there lads!!!

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 26/06/2015 15:00:19    1743138

Munster was 32 points over 6 games. 5.3 points per game

Connacht was 62 points over 6 games. 10 points per game.

DoireCityFC (Derry) - Posts: 1580 - 26/06/2015 15:03:51    1743139

@Doire. Best of luck. I genuinely think Derry have good enough players to trouble Donegal. Derry problem is stamina. Any time I've seen them recently they are dead on their feet after 50 mins. It a tall order to win games against the big sides in such cases. Donegal are more open this year and I feel Derry will need at least two green flags to win.

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 26/06/2015 15:22:09    1743151

Yeah it is getting less competitive. Just at a slower rate than Leinster.

We've only had one real upset in the provincial championships and that was Sligo beating the Rossies and when you take out London and NY the games can be decent out west but it all feels like a procession to a Mayo victory. Munster is a two horse race, we're slowly narrowing the gap but I stress
that word- sloooowly. Leinster is a cake walk with the odd interesting side show like Kildare v Laois or Meath v Westmeath to see who wins the honour of being hammered by the Dubs.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 26/06/2015 16:19:21    1743182

Roundball

and when you take out London and NY the games can be decent out west

New York certainly. London not though. London reached a final a few years ago. London have more clubs than Leitrim, Sligo and Roscommon to pick from and now they have more organic growth in that with guys like Philip Butler, Anthony Moyles, Greg Crowley, Liam Gavigan, Alfie McNulty, they have their own home grown players to pick from. Added to the fact that they are building their own stadium, things are looking up for them. Certainly they have no hope whatsoever of winning anything big but they are an average Division 4 side - the whipping boys of Mayo for sure but certainly not the whipping boys of Leitrim, Sligo, Roscommon. If you are taking London out of the Connacht championship to make it competitive, then take Leitrim and Sligo (and they are in the final) too.

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 26/06/2015 16:43:52    1743192

Surely more competitive? Cavan almost beat monaghan who seem to have donegals number. Didnt antrim just knock out laois. Derry wont roll over for donegal either. All but antrim now in div 1&2 of league. Give a reason for asking the question otherwise admit that this is a stupid thread.

sceptical (Cavan) - Posts: 544 - 26/06/2015 18:48:13    1743232

I knew before I opened this thread that it was going to be a dub that posted it.

Lads give it up. If donegal win on Saturday and make their fifth final in a row, it should be seen for what it is. An incredible achievement in Ireland's hardest province. Just because one side has managed to propel to excellent heights doesnt mean the rest are rubbish.


You don't turn around after Usain Bolt has blitzed the Olympic 100 metres and go "ah sure those other seven lads werent up to much"

Actually some of ye probably do, but that doesnt mean you're right

shaggykev (Donegal) - Posts: 204 - 26/06/2015 20:08:23    1743266

I knew before I opened this thread that it was going to be a dub that posted it.

Lads give it up. If donegal win on Saturday and make their fifth final in a row, it should be seen for what it is. An incredible achievement in Ireland's hardest province. Just because one side has managed to propel to excellent heights doesnt mean the rest are rubbish.


You don't turn around after Usain Bolt has blitzed the Olympic 100 metres and go "ah sure those other seven lads werent up to much"

Actually some of ye probably do, but that doesnt mean you're right

----
"'I knew it was a Dub", "incredible achievement", "Ireland's hardest province" comparisons to Usain Bolt. That's one of the most paranoid and dillusional posts I have seen on here. Take the original post at face value. It was a genuine question with some evidence, unlike a lot of posts on here.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 26/06/2015 20:30:09    1743275

A lot of good teams in Ulster,but only one is capable of winning Sam.

ziggy32001 (Meath) - Posts: 8354 - 26/06/2015 20:46:26    1743283