Soma, did Justin McMahin really spend 70 minutes "sledging" Michael Murphy? I watched the game back during the week and I seen McMahon following Murphy everywhere doing a great man marking job. I also seen him make his way up the pitch to score. Did he mouth off to Murphy during the game? No doubt. Did he do it for 70 minutes like you claim? No he didn't. Is there clear evidence to say he said anything to Murphy any worse than the rubbish talked between to men marking each other in games up and down the country? Ofcourse there isn't, but why let that get in the way of the Tyrone whitch hunt. He must have done it because Ricey used to do it. Because Tyrone are players are coached how to sledge. Because they sent someone on a 6 hour drive to Kerry to find out where each player works and what car they drive. (If anyone sledged me about my car I would be bent over laughing!) Honestly, some of the rubbish been thrown out here to blacken Tyrone with nothing to back it up is sickening.
I am absolutely against any of this personal stuff been used by anyone to upset a player. It is disgusting behaviour and I know people in Tyrone are as appalled by it as everyone else. It needs to be stopped and stopped now. I wouldn't be so naive as to say no player from Tyrone has ever done it. If it is properly investigated and proved any player at this should receive a lengthy ban and offer a full apology to their victim before they play again. A very serious allegation has been made about what happened in the minor game. If the allegations are true it is truly disgusting and there should be consequences. On the other hand the Tyrone lad has denied it, and if he didn't say it then the abuse he is taking now is unacceptable. There are contradictory reports on what happened, and with such a serious allegation I think it deserves further investigation before another free for all to assume the worst about Tyrone. I would like to see the 2 county boards cooperate to get to the bottom of this in the coming days as it is too serious a matter to leave as it is. If Tyrone are proven guilty of any of this they deserve punishment. Equally if not then I look forward to reading the apologies. Finally I hope the same microscopic level of scrutiny Tyrone come under every time they take the field is applied to every other team this year, although I'll not be holding my breath.

johnboy7 (Tyrone) - Posts: 79 - 24/05/2015 11:12:27    1727555

Seanboy I said McMahon spent most of the 70 minutes sledging Murphy, not all 70 minutes. Most reasonable people who watched the game agree with that. I notice you never answered my question about why Tyrone players seem to continually go against the instructions of management and sledge. Cavanagh said there was lots of it Sunday from both sides, yet Tyrone say management actively discourage it. Are we to believe that McMahons sledging on Sunday, along with many other players, was something they decided to do despite being told not to by Harte? Tyrone players down the years done anything ever asked of them by Harte, yet we are to believe he actively discourages them from sledging and they ignore it - its incredibly hard to believe.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 24/05/2015 12:36:07    1727569

What has this disgusting behavour achieved for tyrone? A defeat. Maybe if lads concentrated on playing football a bit more it would be more in there interest. Is there a back door in this ulster minor champ? Hopefully not. No smoke without fire. It must have happened.

overdabar (Westmeath) - Posts: 230 - 24/05/2015 12:49:19    1727572

This is simple indefensibly, I know fans like to back up their players when things get tough but this is a step to far. Tyrone fans should be demanding an adequate response from their county board including an apology for any hurt caused. I was at the 21 final and couldn't believe the sledging the Tyrone players where engaged in, two players in particular engaged in continuous in your face sledging regardless of where the ball was on the field. A couple of weeks later and the Tyrone minor team, then senior team are involved in the same behavior. It's time Tyrone fans stopped looking for ways to defend their teams actions and start looking for ways to amend them.

Louth Gael (Louth) - Posts: 1227 - 24/05/2015 12:58:38    1727573

seanie_boy
County: Tyrone
Posts: 3195

1727476
MuckrossHead
County: Donegal
Posts: 3479

1727472
Seanie,

Who is the Donegal official who denies it ever happened?

It's easy to key in the words "Donegal official", much harder to actually name that official as he might deny it.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I don"t know Muckross.As I said it was from Tyrones "Teamtalk" website that I read this story.Im sure its still there if ye want to take a look.Surely they must have been talking to somebody from within the Donegal set up to put out a story like that? Like I said though,not my story,just relaying it here to demonstrate that its still not clear what has happened.

Seanie

Why would the Tyrone website no name the Donegal official concerned, it would add credence to the story if they did & the official in question could then either affirm or deny, I also find it hard to believe that any Donegal official would say something like that to a Tyrone website.

Until I see a name, I'm afraid I am of the opinion that this is nothing more than an attempt to muddy the waters from the website concerned.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 24/05/2015 13:32:15    1727579

arock
County: Dublin
Posts: 2571

1727494
MuckrossHead

Tyrone have done exactly what Dublin did after "bitegate" & closed ranks which they are perfectly entitled to do. But if Donegal where not prepared to even give the Dublin lad a chance to clear his some would say that was despicable no?

I don't disagree with you at all on this point arock. The traditional practise of omerta within the GAA needs to be swept away when it comes to incidents like biting & despicable sledging. The problem in both cases is that it is one player's word against another which is why I think these things need to be sorted out in house.

In fact there are similarities between the two incidents - two allegations that were/are impossble to prove - but also impossible to defend against, I suggest that is grossly unfair. Tyrone have to defend their man especially if its one word against another.

Again I agree 100%. Where things need to change is at management level where an example is made of players who do this sort of thing. By all means defend your player against outsiders who are often not whiter than white themselves, but be tough behind closed doors

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 24/05/2015 13:39:32    1727580

Muckross,I don't know why an official is not named.But it certainly does Muddy the waters,for me anyway.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 24/05/2015 14:20:12    1727598

Soma,I'd be fairly confident that Tyrone management would discourage this nasty,extremely personal type of slagging.The regular type verbals that go on everywhere and in every game is a different matter.That would be mostly left up to the player himself on the field.Sure nobody would expect a player to stay on a pitch for 70 mins with some boy talking into his ear and not to say something back.Right Soma? Or do you want to hold Tyrone lads to a different standard than everybody else cos thats what it sounds like from ye on this topic.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 24/05/2015 14:24:32    1727600

Soma , I agree McMahon did a lot of mouthing to Murphy and iMurphy had a bit to say himself. I have not seen any reports that anything beyond the usual mouthing you would hear anywhere was said between these two. Is this sledging? If so it has been going on for as long as I have been watching football. I assumed sledging is the horrible personal stuff we are hearing about. Maybe our understanding of what sledging is, is different. Are you advocating that any type of verbal jostling between players is sledging and should be punished by the referee? Please define for me, because going by that there will be a dozen black cards every game.
The anti Tyrone nonsense continues I see. They must be guilty because "there is no smoke without fire" . Is that all it takes to prove innocence or guilt when it comes to Tyrone now? I am not aware of any statement from Donegal County Board on this allegation yet, just a number of individuals like devanney and bonner. I am not defending or ignoring this incident at all. If proven to be true the individuals involved should be severely dealt with. I'm sure all Tyrone people would agree. But an allegation as serious as this deserves a proper joint investigation involving both counties and the individuals involved. I would imagine they should be able to get to the bottom of it. What is happening at the minute where people are happy to assume guilt without knowing all the facts yet is grossly unfair.

johnboy7 (Tyrone) - Posts: 79 - 24/05/2015 14:24:45    1727601

In one extract, Cassidy revealed how they watched an American footballer with a big reputation for 'trash talking' on YouTube and decided to try to adopt a similar approach to introduce a 'nasty' side to their game.

Captain Michael Murphy and defender Karl Lacey approached McGuinness with a view to taking this approach prior to the Cavan game, according to Cassidy. He admitted that Tyrone free-taker Peter Harte came in for particular verbal treatment in that Ulster semi- final.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What ye think of that Soma?Or any of yez for that matter?Don't remember yez getting outraged when Cassidy revealed these tactics in the book.A pre meditated plan by top players and their manager to deliberately "sledge" Petey Harte.Was there outrage followed by thread after thread of Donegal bashing?Not that I recall.Only thing I've ever heard about Donegal was the complaint about their "system" of play which in reality was just something for begrudgers to complain about.Also,as pointed out by another Tyrone poster,our own Cathal Mc Carron is taking dogs abuse out on the pitch in nearly ever game,can yez just imagine whats being said to him,and he just has to put up with it and try to play his game.Nobody rushing to defend Cathal like yez are all doing here for big Saint Mick! As I said after the game ,Murphy was very tight lipped when asked about the verbals taking place,thats because he is as good as anybody for it and was probably saying all sorts back to Justy Mc Mahon.The opportunity to attack Tyrone is all that some of yez want regardless of any facts or perspective on what else is going on during a Tyrone game.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 24/05/2015 14:42:36    1727615

Seanie,
I am on record here as having no issue with McMahons marking of Murphy, neither do I have any problem with players taking a rise out of each other. Donegal are no angels when it comes to the black arts.

But this thread s not about that. It is about what was said to the minor player about the death of his father from cancer & here my patience runs out with you.

You have attempted to muddy the waters with what the Tyrone website alleges some anonymous Donegal official said. As far as I am concerned this official doesn't exist & until I see a name I will continue in that belief & I'd say the vast majority of posters on HS would agree with me.

It was a vile thin to do & while I don' expect Tyrone to hang him out to dry in public, I do expect them to sort it out.

A statement from Mickey Harte wouldn't go miss either as opposed to wittering on, telling people to vote no in the referendum.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 24/05/2015 15:50:20    1727664

MuckrossHead
County: Donegal
Posts: 3483

1727664
Seanie,
I am on record here as having no issue with McMahons marking of Murphy, neither do I have any problem with players taking a rise out of each other. Donegal are no angels when it comes to the black arts.

But this thread s not about that. It is about what was said to the minor player about the death of his father from cancer & here my patience runs out with you.

You have attempted to muddy the waters with what the Tyrone website alleges some anonymous Donegal official said. As far as I am concerned this official doesn't exist & until I see a name I will continue in that belief & I'd say the vast majority of posters on HS would agree with me.

It was a vile thin to do & while I don' expect Tyrone to hang him out to dry in public, I do expect them to sort it out.

A statement from Mickey Harte wouldn't go miss either as opposed to wittering on, telling people to vote no in the referendum.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Hang on a second Muckross,I am not trying to muddy the waters I am simply relaying the story from that website which I am entirely entitled to do.I am also on record as saying that if the alegations are true then they are vile and reprehensible and the player should be sanctioned for it.
My problem is when these stories come out against Tyrone there are simply too many on here and in the national media relishing the chance to put the boot into our entire county set up and our people in general.
To say such things is completely wrong.I can't be any more succinct about it than that.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 24/05/2015 16:09:58    1727674

Fair enough Seanie, I won't argue with you about the unfairness of some of the coverage.

I do have to say though that Tyrone don't do themselves any favours by coming out with stuff like the website "story".

Every county has a problem but Tyrone are in the spotlight with the U21s minors & seniors getting it in the neck. The best thing to do is for the Tyrone leadership, & I do mean Mickey Harte here, to come out & say that they will no longer stand over excessive gamesmanship.

Constantly deflecting & denying that anything happened won't help.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 24/05/2015 17:16:41    1727713

I just hate this word 'sledging'. Full stop!!

Wicklowman (Wicklow) - Posts: 1139 - 24/05/2015 17:22:07    1727719

Folks stick to the subject here as there were no complaints from players on either side involved in the Senior game last Sunday - yes Cavanagh did pass comment when journalists went looking for a response but was not making a fuss about the match and mainly spoke generally about sledgings existence throughout the game - as such not much point in folk on here going all hysterical about what they wanted to take from watching the game last Sunday.

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 24/05/2015 19:13:57    1727804

Johnboy & Seanie-Boy - Sean Cavanagh himself said there was lots of sledging from both sides last Sunday, so my definition is no different to his. Also, that extract from Cassidys book should be remembered when people claim the only problem with Donegals approach to the game is that they are challenging the 'traditional' counties! Again I ask, if Tyrone management actively discourage sledging why do so many players, by Sean Cavanaghs admission as well as numerous other past players, indulge in it? I am fairly confident that if Mickey Harte said any player seen sledging gets dropped from the panel that would be the end of it in Tyrone, though many other counties would continue with it. It's a problem that can only be solved by management, passing it to referees to resolve is a copy out.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 24/05/2015 19:44:58    1727824

How boring has all this got. Is the season over yet.

redhanddefender (Tyrone) - Posts: 913 - 24/05/2015 19:53:15    1727833

Soma again I ask define sledging . Is it run of the mill mouthing off or this personal stuff? You accused McMahon of sledging but you know no more than I do if he crossed the line with the personal abuse which I would call sledging, nor has anyone from either camp accused him of it. I do agree with you though that the lead to cut this out should come from managements and the players themselves. The GPA should also be having a word with their members. Anyhow, I'm sure now that I have seen 2 striking incidents involving hurleys today that the negativity spotlight will switch to Clare and Limerick in the interests of objectivity, and they will be pilloried on the TV, papers and internet for the next week.

johnboy7 (Tyrone) - Posts: 79 - 24/05/2015 20:37:30    1727859

Soma cop on,I'm not in the room to hear Mickey Harte speak to the players. I've not doubt these conversations are taking place now about how this nasty personal type of slagging is not on. I'm sure of that. I don't think on the other hand that he is telling the lads to keep their mouths shut for 70 mins if another fella is mouthing to them. Who would? If Ye give it out be prepared to take some back too.

seanie_boy (Tyrone) - Posts: 4235 - 24/05/2015 21:29:03    1727889

Donegal have said they've produced evidence of the alleged sledging incident to the Tyrone County board.

Other than actual recordings of the alleged tautns you'd wonder what proof they could have?

link

Will be interesting to see where this goes.

CroiGorm (Dublin) - Posts: 1547 - 05/06/2015 10:29:12    1732664