So I have one question. If kerry win the CRC will they play in leinster preliminary round in 2016? And potentially get past that into a leinster quater final?

WildPundit (Tipperary) - Posts: 1709 - 12/05/2015 21:15:50    1722996

Good question. If Galway & Antrim are there then why not Kerry?

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 12/05/2015 21:31:18    1723005

keeper7
County: Longford
Posts: 2361

1723005 Good question. If Galway & Antrim are there then why not Kerry?

Why would Kerry enter the Leinster rather than the Munster - surely Antrim and Galway are entering Leinster because they have no competition in their own Provinces - I cannot understand why Kerry do not get to play in the Munster Championship as things stand especially given that they seem eager to play at a higher level.

Is there a cross over in colleges in Munster i.e. do Kerry lads go to school and have the opportunity to play in teams containing guys from other Munster counties? I think this is a key element in the development of players and something Antrim is missing in football as the vast majority of lads go to schools that are almost exclusively Antrim. The exception probably being lads from the Toome area (Cargin) who would go to South Derry Schools - perhaps no coincidence that Cargin have been one of the leading two teams in the county for at least the best part of 30 years.

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 13/05/2015 08:22:55    1723023

If Kerry are in the qualifier group, there should be a provisional draw for them in a Munster quarter-final should they finish in the top 2. They could still play the quarter-final despite not making the top 2 but be excluded from the qualifiers.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7847 - 13/05/2015 09:15:25    1723033

legendzxix - do you know how the eligibility of the outside players is going to be affected for the league next year? Just from looking at the link and the Special Eligibility for Hurling it has the condition that the County is not playing in the Liam McCarthy or Div 1 of the National League. If there are players not eligible would this not have a big impact on next season for you? Or are there houses being purchased already or postal addresses being provided..... ;-)

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 13/05/2015 11:29:36    1723081

Imo put Kerry into Munster Championship if they win Christy Ring this year. Christy Ring/Rackard/Meagher finals should be scrapped - the Christy Ring semi-final winners should be put straight into the Qualifiers R1 rather than playing a final where only one team qualifies same goes for Rackard/Meagher.

mayo_hurler (Mayo) - Posts: 113 - 13/05/2015 11:55:59    1723098

There have been many false dawns for hurling over the years in counties like Kerry. The step up is huge so progress needs to be tempered with consolidation at regular intervals. You have to have the right underage system in place too ensuring a conveyor belt of talent coming through. If you go up to McCarthy Cup & straight back down the following year, momentum is lost & it can be a slippery slope back to mediocrity.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 13/05/2015 13:46:05    1723180

surely Antrim and Galway are entering Leinster because they have no competition in their own Provinces

Well Antrim haven't been getting it their own way since they lost perpetual home advantage with the demise of Casement. Is there any other county who get a direct path to the final and are able to compete in two provincial competitions?? Dublin footballers didn't have it as good!!

As for Kerry and their imports, certainly there's a fanfare with their NHL promotion success and no doubt Kelly in particular contributed to that, the midfielder, not the manager, but long term there's 4 born and reared Kerry hurlers getting no exposure to intercounty hurling because of them. Plus with Conor Gleeson, Brendan Cummins et all involved, I can see a few more Tipp lads gaining 'residence' in the Kingdom!!

bricktop (Down) - Posts: 2503 - 13/05/2015 17:01:46    1723302

We have the same craic here with lads playing county hurling here but still hurling with their home clubs in Limerick or Offaly. The argument for was that it might help raise the profile of hurling in the county. The argument against, you're not focused on developing homegrown players & it doesn't help the local club scene.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 13/05/2015 17:17:46    1723311

Hey - Bricklop.

Don't let the facts get in the way of a cheap dig. Go check the records.

If you spoke to any of the Antrim players over the years, Casement Park never felt like or was any real advantage in an Ulster Hurling final. I am all for travelling to other places to promote the game. Its a shame some of our southern brethren don't feel the same way.

Oh, who are the Down teams playing in the Antrim Leagues this week? :)

Glensboy (Antrim) - Posts: 288 - 13/05/2015 17:52:53    1723325

Kerry had no interest in the league after last year. The first few games were experimentation ahead of the championship. We picked up a win over Carlow and our league season changed.

Going by the ruling, players who've come on board this year cannot be involved next year. We are no longer considered a designated county due to our league status.

THIS IS KERRY'S AMBITION IN HURLING:
Kerry want to be in the Provincial Qualifier Group. It is the next step up from Christy Ring action. I'd describe round robin teams as tier 2 McCarthy. It's all Kerry are interested in at this time. With our record of not having won the Ring since '11, it is pointless looking beyond the next step.

When Kerry won the Ring in 2011, there was too much of a gap between Ring and provincial championship. The Ring had been weakened by Carlow and Westmeath being promoted with no team coming down. Many intermediate club championships have been weakened due to an expansion of the tier above. It's perfectly normal that that would happen. The qualifier group has been a good idea in terms of an appropriate level for a small number of teams ranked 11 to 14. It shouldn't have to remain this way forever though. Can it be improved upon? I think it can. I believe there is a valid argument for including the 3rd and 4th placed round robin teams and the Ring finalists in the qualifiers. That would be a more fulfilling reward for the best of the lower tier counties.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7847 - 13/05/2015 17:55:32    1723327

bricktop for me Down have not put up a consistent challenge to Antrim in a long time. It could be argued that when Down were stronger Antrim were stronger maybe as a result of more competition in Ulster or could have been as a result of getting to play more top end teams in Chapionship hurling or maybe none of the above. But Antrim did go in to Leinster to try and play more games against higher quality opposition. Not to say it is going swimmingly but certainly was the intention.That is the only point I am making here.

Naysayer (Antrim) - Posts: 2071 - 13/05/2015 21:59:06    1723423

Bricktop - I've said it on here before that I have no issue with playing all games in the Ulster Championship outside Casement. We need a strong Down and Derry but for decades we struggled to keep a reasonable standard in part due to he lack of competition provided within the Ulster Hurling scene. While we have our own problems the other counties lack of interest has hampered us too. I would gladly have other counties winning as it would mean the other counties are taking it serious and this can only benefit us too. But as my fellow county an said no need for cheap digs - especially when we could throw many back :-)

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 13/05/2015 22:01:46    1723425

First things first, why would I need to ask an Antrim hurler if they felt Casement Park was an advantage or not, I only have to ask Down hurlers, club and county if they felt playing in Casement was a disadvantage and to a man they'd agree.

Where did Portaferry beat Cushendall this year?

When is the last time a Down team, club or county has had a home fixture against an Antrim team in the Ulster championships?

Strangely Derry and Antrim clubs have a 'home/away' arrangement (Slaughneil/Cushendall) in place but not Down teams who always seem to have to travel away..

Not blaming Antrim per say, blaming the Ulster Council who are very Antrim centric when it comes to hurling and hurling development. Now those same individuals couldn't organise a p!ss up in a brewery as can be seen with the farce of the Ulster championship postponement the other year, and low and behold they fix it on a date when Down had a Kehoe Cup game the previous day.

TBH Down CB need to take as much flack for the poor treatment of Down hurlers as anyone else as they're happy for these farces to happen to their hurlers, but by God it wouldn't be happening to our footballers!

bricktop (Down) - Posts: 2503 - 14/05/2015 09:32:36    1723448

First things first, why would I need to ask an Antrim hurler if they felt Casement Park was an advantage or not, I only have to ask Down hurlers, club and county if they felt playing in Casement was a disadvantage and to a man they'd agree.

The apathy from your own County towards hurling over the years is a lot bigger a disadvantage to a man than where a game is played to be honest.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/05/2015 10:27:43    1723482

There's as much apathy to hurling in Ballycran as there is in Loughgeil, but yes on a CB level the apathy of lack of will on the CB's behalf to stand up for the hurlers in committee rooms is still a downside of the Down CB, but in fairness the actual treatment of the county hurlers has improved immensely and that has to be lauded.

bricktop (Down) - Posts: 2503 - 14/05/2015 11:09:44    1723522

Bricktop - I didn't mean 'actually' ask the Antrim players. You will find that the Antrim players were and are happy to travel for fixtures.

Where is the evidence for Ulster giving primacy to Antrim in terms of development? The Antrim Board to its credit has always worked well with Down, at senior level, and Derry, in terms of underage, to accommodate club participation in leagues.

I know that almost all of the work being done at club level in North Antrim in terms of juvenile hurling is down to volunteers and club fundraising. I don't have the £ investment figures for Ulster but I suspect if we had this and compared it to the likes of Dublin, it would tell a story. The Ulster and Central Councils should hang their heads in shame at the lack of commitment and 'real' measures to develop our national game. We have our issues in terms of location etc which should energise our national bodies to go over and above in terms of investment.

The elephant in the room is that 50% of our population do not play our games. While Tom Elliott's approach to the GAA is deeply disappointing and a direct insult to 50% of the electorate in FST. Much more needs to be done by everyone to break down the barriers.

Glensboy (Antrim) - Posts: 288 - 14/05/2015 12:09:00    1723563

There's as much apathy to hurling in Ballycran as there is in Loughgeil, but yes on a CB level the apathy of lack of will on the CB's behalf to stand up for the hurlers in committee rooms is still a downside of the Down CB, but in fairness the actual treatment of the county hurlers has improved immensely and that has to be lauded.

I don't doubt that there is the same enthusiasm in Ballycran as there is in Loughgiel or in the hurling clubs of Derry, Armagh, Tyrone etc - the grass roots. It is the CB level I am specifically referring to and over the decades as opposed to where we are at this moment in time. As you are well aware we have Down and Derry clubs playing in our leagues and I see this as Antrim working on two levels - firstly to try and improve the standard within our own County (as the more teams of a higher standard you have the better) but also to try and get the other Counties stronger, which again can only benefit us too. But until County boards across Ulster put more emphasis on Hurling or Ulster GAA/HQ get proper structures in place or provide/assist to allow the CBs to get these structures in place (a la Dublin) then I can see ourselves, youse and the rest of Ulster Hurling stuck in a rut at best and extinct at worst. As I said in a previous post, I am well enough aware of our own problems within the County and this isn't meant to be a finger pointing exercise to try and deflect where we are on to others, more a case of pointing out that others have to also get the finger out too.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/05/2015 13:04:12    1723605

Any of ye Ulster heads hear of the South Ulster Hurling Academy for Fermanagh, Monaghan & Cavan? Basically these counties don't field individual county teams at U14 or U16 anymore in favour of 1 or 2 academy teams at either level.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 14/05/2015 16:17:56    1723708

who do they play?

bricktop (Down) - Posts: 2503 - 15/05/2015 11:04:44    1723900