One thing I notice a lot of Kilkenny defenders do (& get away with) is, when behind an opponent who is trying to raise the sliothar, they reach over/across the opponent's head or shoulder & pull/flick down one-handed on where the ball is. Not necessarily "dirty" but to me that's a chop.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 24/02/2015 14:49:42    1696341

Keeper, it's only a chop if he doesn't hit the sliotar. If he hits the hurl or the player its a free.

Torcaill (Australia) - Posts: 204 - 24/02/2015 15:28:12    1696368

Heftydickonem - talking about other counties' supporters being "one-eyed" is a bit rich, coming from a Kilkenny supporter. No one absolutely dare mention a dirty stroke by a Kilkenny player without igniting whataboutery on a massive scale. I've read about it for years on Kilkenny Cats and on the short-lived Stripey Men.

Personally speaking, I seen no profit in talking about indiscretions by a player from another county. We would do well to concentrate on out own. But, compared to other counties, Kilkenny appear very think-skinned when they're being criticized. I can't speak for others, but if Cork were winning matches like Kilkenny I would only smile an any criticism. Titles is what counts.

Midleton (Cork) - Posts: 643 - 24/02/2015 15:37:10    1696373

Regardless of which incident he was referring to, what he said was wrong and implied that unless a player is injured then there shouldn't be a red card. Could he have questioned the technicality of the incident yes but he would have been wrong there also. What he was saying about the first one was yes there may have been a wild swing or a slap across the arm like Henry did a couple of years back they don't really count as nobody was hurt. By implication he was agreeing with the second one - here is the question, had the Kilkenny lad just missed the Dublin player should he have got a red card?

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1805 - 24/02/2015 15:41:21    1696374

Is that the actual rule???

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 24/02/2015 15:59:03    1696377

5.2 To strike or to attempt to strike an opponent with a hurley, with minimal force.
5.4 To behave in any way which is dangerous to an opponent.
5.10 To attempt to strike an opponent with a hurley, with force.

All red cards

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1805 - 24/02/2015 16:23:52    1696391

By the way I don't think this is just Kilkenny's attitudes to the rules - its quite a lot of peoples including a few Sunday game analysts

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1805 - 24/02/2015 16:25:59    1696392

Midleton, the premise of your argument now appears to be that Kilkenny people, when faced with repeated nonsense about Kilkenny being dirty etc. have a habit of highlighting similar incidents involving players from other counties to show that other counties players do these things too and that Kilkenny people should not do this because their team is successful.

Can you see how illogical and against human nature that is? Concerning smiling on any criticism, we've been doing it almost constantly since 2000 but the repeated bullshit gets tiring after a while, and if Kilkenny people drawing attention to incidents involving Cork or any other players to show that the things Kilkenny are accused of are not confined to Kilkenny hurling gets in the way of the bullshit, well that's an awful pity.

Just look two posts above yours, to another ridiculous post attributing something players from all counties do, to Kilkenny players solely, Just last night I read on the RTE comments section, that "only Kilkenny players thrown hurls" something that has been debunked with examples over and over again.

Speaking personally I read this forum on a daily basis and many others, and frequently read crap about Kilkenny that I couldn't be bothered responding to. Today I said I would for a change, does that make me thin-skinned or am I simply engaging in what the forum is intended for, discussion/debate?

Again, since you have repeatedly ignored this point, no one is trying to claim that Kilkenny players aren't physical or haven't on occasion had players legitimately sent off, the point being made in a thread entitled 'Kilkenny's attitude to hurling rules' is that Kilkenny are no different to any other county out there and their disciplinary record is better than most.

By the way, I've yet to see such an admission concerning Cork hurling from you.

Heftydickonem (Kilkenny) - Posts: 175 - 24/02/2015 16:33:58    1696395

zinny
County: Wexford
Posts: 218

1696374
Regardless of which incident he was referring to, what he said was wrong and implied that unless a player is injured then there shouldn't be a red card. Could he have questioned the technicality of the incident yes but he would have been wrong there also. What he was saying about the first one was yes there may have been a wild swing or a slap across the arm like Henry did a couple of years back they don't really count as nobody was hurt. By implication he was agreeing with the second one - here is the question, had the Kilkenny lad just missed the Dublin player should he have got a red card?

James McGrath waited to see how injured the Galway player was before issuing Bubbles with a card last Sunday.

Joe_Bloggs (Tipperary) - Posts: 186 - 24/02/2015 16:34:37    1696396

Here's a list of "agressive fouls" from the rule book.
The rules are available to read or download at:

[url=]https://www.gaa.ie/content/documents/publications/coaching_and_games/rules/Playing_Rules_of_Hurling_100110233127.pdf

5.1 To strike or to attempt to strike an opponent with head, arm, elbow, hand or knee.

5.2 To strike or to attempt to strike an opponent with a hurley, with minimal force.

5.3 To strike an opponent with a hurley, either with force or causing injury.

5.4 To attempt to strike an opponent with a hurley, with force.

5.5 To kick or attempt to kick an opponent, with minimal force.

5.6 To kick an opponent, either with force or causing injury.

5.7 To attempt to kick an opponent, with force

5.8 To stamp on an opponent.

5.9 To behave in any way which is dangerous to an opponent.

5.10 To inflict injury recklessly on an opponent by means other than these stated above

5.11 To spit at an opponent

5.12 To contribute to a melee

5.13 To strike, attempt to strike, to interfere with, or to use threatening or abuse language or conduct to a Match Official

5.14 To assault an opposing Team Official.


5.15 To commit any of the Fouls listed in Rule 5.1 to 5.11 inclusive against a team-mate.

5.16 To commit any of the fouls listed in Rule 5.1 to Rule 5.11 inclusive on an opponent, on the field, prior to the start of the game or at halftime

5.17 To pull down an opponent.

5.18 To trip an opponent with hand(s), foot, or hurley.

5.19 To threaten or to use abusive or provocative language or gestures to an opponent.

5.20 To engage in any form of rough play.

5.21 To make 'a pull' with the hurley from behind and around the body of an opponent that is not consistent with an attempt to play the ball.

5.22 To use the hurley in a careless manner

5.23 To throw a hurley in a manner which constitutes a danger to another player(s).

5.24 To pull or take hold of a faceguard or any other part of an opponent's helmet.

5.25 To attempt to achieve an advantage by feigning a foul or injury

5.26 To threaten or to use abusive or provocative language or gestures to a team-mate.

5.27 To hold an opponent with the hand(s)

5.28 (a) To charge an opponent in the back or to the front. (b) To charge an opponent unless:- (i) he is in possession of the ball, or (ii) he is playing the ball, or


5.29 (a) To push an opponent with the hand(s) or hurley. (b) To hold an opponent's hurley or pull it from his hands.

5.30 (a) To charge (in a manner otherwise permissible on an opponent) the goalkeeper in his small rectangle. (b) For a player in possession of the ball to charge an opponent.

5.31 To use the hurley to obstruct an opponent

5.32 To strike an opponent's hurley unless both players are in the act of playing the ball.

Midleton (Cork) - Posts: 643 - 24/02/2015 16:36:59    1696397

Hurling people talking about rules!!! . When were the rules ever applied in hurling ? Isn't the game supposed to be "let flow"?

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 24/02/2015 17:47:28    1696434

Middleton: Thanks for making list available. Great work
Would be wonderful if copies could be distributed after mass in every church in Kilkenny on Sunday.
Let it flow!

PatOLogical (Limerick) - Posts: 1360 - 24/02/2015 18:05:01    1696441

Excellent post Midleton. In fairness to the ref, he was entitled to issue the red card for the first one as it was a wild swing which the ref thought was an attempted strike with minimal force under rule 5.2. Eddie Brennan made the point that there would be more sending offs if the rules were applied, but possibly players need to be more careful. There seems to be a consensus in hurling that no one should be sent off unless someone is dead, but if that is that case, 70% of the rules need to be changed or discarded.

On a separate point, there is no doubt Kilkenny's appeal will be successful, and it should not be, as there was no mistaken identity or mis-application of the rules by the referee. Ready again for silly season where the CCCC & CHC make their decisions with little regard for the referee.

galwaydublin (Galway) - Posts: 226 - 24/02/2015 18:10:33    1696445

Do ye still bow to the catholic church

johnwhite12 (Kilkenny) - Posts: 306 - 24/02/2015 18:23:48    1696451

Heftydickonem - "By the way, I've yet to see such an admission concerning Cork hurling from you."

What admission are you looking for? Le me try a few admissions and see if it satisfies you.

Cork hurlers have been known to pull dirty strokes. (No Cork supporter approves of those.)

Cork hurlers have been known to foul to prevent scores. (Some Cork supporters approve of those. My own view is that such a foul is an admission that the player in question - or another player - hasn't been doing his job. Such fouling is unfair and not in the spirit of the game.)

I have never ever said that only Kilkenny players foul. Such a view would be nonsense; what can I say to someone who seems to think that this is my view? Along with many Cork supporters, I admire Kilkenny's aggression and will-to-win, their work-rate for the entire 70 minutes plus, their desire to win ever match and every competition.

Billy Morgan, in his autobiography, said that he admired the Kerry application and confidence, although he might hate them when he played against them. It was their way of doing things that he and Cork aspired to. I think that the same might be said of how Cork people feel about Kilkenny.

Midleton (Cork) - Posts: 643 - 24/02/2015 18:50:02    1696467

Well Midleton, after all that it seems that we are more or less on the same page. I'd freely admit the same things about Kilkenny as you have about Cork. I just object to the perception that many have that Kilkenny are any worse offenders than other teams

Heftydickonem (Kilkenny) - Posts: 175 - 24/02/2015 19:04:56    1696478

Heftydickonem
County: Kilkenny
Posts: 28

1696275 Bennybunny, no where in that sentence do I say that Horgan is a dirty player, and you know it. I referred to the offence itself, was it not a dirty stroke?. Anyway we heard all about how Horgan is not a dirty player, not in his nature etc. when he had his red card for striking Paudie O'Brien opponent's head with the hurl rescinded in 2013

Sorry about that Hefty! It was half tongue in cheek anyway..

You have held your counsel well here....fair play...look it, you know the Irish and begrudgery...there is nobody giving out about the Kilkenny footballers! You are probably safe there for a while! You know if they stop giving out about your hurling team then you won't like that either..

Incidentally, I was vehemently opposed to Cork appealing the Horgan incident (my posts on this forum at the time will back it up) against Paudie O'Brien..that was a deserved red..it was unintentional, possibly accidental, nobody got injured etc. etc. ..all that was besides the point as the ref merely implemented the rules and this is his job...club and county teams are entitled to lodge an appeal which is fair, however, sometimes it might be appropriate to accept a punishment and come out and support referees rather than always appeal..Andrew Shore has a right to appeal..everytime the Cork Co. Board has been before the CCCCCCC, I cringe...the same goes with many of the other appeals that I read and hear about..

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 24/02/2015 20:56:23    1696527

Pinkie it is true what blackspot said about Dunne

johnwhite12 (Kilkenny) - Posts: 306 - 24/02/2015 21:07:21    1696538

johnwhite12

You're another one buying into media hype. Comerford wasn't even hit. A Wexford player bore the brunt of that pull. Dunne was never dirty. Literally none of his Red cards were just. It was all over limerick being dramatic.

Doylerwex (Wexford) - Posts: 2689 - 25/02/2015 09:20:25    1696604

I am going to matches long enough to judge myself.

johnwhite12 (Kilkenny) - Posts: 306 - 25/02/2015 10:08:14    1696626