Themaster

He's the best of a bad lot in the Mayo forward unit... I'll give you that

But really... that's not saying much

If he ends up half the player as those you mentioned above he'd be worth this sort of adoration

As it stands - he's bloody miles off it...

He wouldn't keep any of the players you mentioned out of the Dublin team.

Simple as that really.. C'OC has potential but as it stands...

NOPE. You can only base it on the facts... he's gone missing when needed the most.

Mentally frail perhaps.. it's certainly not out of the norm for a Mayo player

You've built quite the tradition around such...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 12/02/2015 16:33:14    1692988

Again, no mention of outscoring the 3 of them, at 21 years old, with 1 arm - when it mattered most... You don't have to keep repeating the rest of it.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/02/2015 16:45:04    1692994

Good player. For me though, hes just down the list of the best forwards in Ireland. Id take Murphy, Cian 0'Neil , Jamie Clarke , Brogan , James O D ahead of him any-day. Brogan , Murphy et al have produced it on the biggest stage of all so until he does that , then id have him behind them . Age is on his side though. Similar to Paddy McBrearty though, we take them for granted and yet they are still so young.

TheRightStuff (Donegal) - Posts: 1688 - 12/02/2015 16:54:23    1692998

TheRishgStuff, but similarly, doesn't this 'on the biggest stage' stuff take for granted the team you play in, your opponents, (the fact that your shoulder was held on by a thread) in the same way people take age for granted? O'Connor has played in 2 finals, 1) he was 20 and playing against the most complete blanket defence ever, 2) he was 21 and carrying a serious injury which had gone again in the weeks previous. Surely he is due a bit of slack there? He tore Kerry a new one in the semi final - no other forward managed that all year. He done the same to donegal the year before.

Again I point out, Im making no claims about him being as good as A,B or C, Im simply displaying how full of holes many of these criticisms are.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/02/2015 17:08:32    1693010

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 12626

1692994
Again, no mention of outscoring the 3 of them, at 21 years old, with 1 arm - when it mattered most... You don't have to keep repeating the rest of it.
_________

Mattered the most?

What medal did he win for that again?

Best one armed player award was it...? ;)

Really goes to show the desperation in the Mayo camp doesn't it...

Having to jeopardize the health of a young man with a serious injury, because they have no one else to take frees...

I tell you what.. he's a brave young lad. Thankfully Horan has left... he never held his players in much regard.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 12/02/2015 17:11:32    1693015

Good man Jimbo. Very reasoned argument as usual.

pdempsey (Mayo) - Posts: 1313 - 12/02/2015 17:12:02    1693016

pdempsey
County: Mayo
Posts: 890

1693016
Good man Jimbo. Very reasoned argument as usual.

________

Yeah...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 12/02/2015 17:18:55    1693022

Jaysus,lads this is turning into a bit of a bitchfest.
And its only February. (Maybe that's the reason )
Hardly deserves this much time.

Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 12/02/2015 17:25:34    1693029

Again speaks voulmes about the current Myao setup

A bloody one armed player has to do all the scoring...

Talk about depending on one player

Just hope that shoulder doesn't pop gain Mayo lads.. once you do it a couple of times

It's prone to pop again.. but sure you'll probably play him again anyway... fit or not...

Seems you have very little options... no wonder he doesn't win a lot of his own ball

He's only looking after himself as best he can.. someone has too I guess

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 12/02/2015 17:26:35    1693032

If his team had lost in the quarter final to donegal they would have been out, that goes for the semi final too, although I have a feeling you are aware of that. So that is when it matters most to your team. If you cant deliver in a knockout game and your team lose, that is when it mattered. Quite simple actually. So when it mattered most against donegal for example, he rattled off 3-4 with one arm, around the time of his 21st birthday. Now, Connolly, brogan and Flynn, first off 6 good arms - no injuries there, all grown men in their late 20s, supposedly among the elite forwards in the game, and undoubtedly 3 of the best Dublin have produced, probably ever. How did they do when it mattered most against donegal? I mean if the magees cant mark O'Connor and varley, Id be worried for their safety against those 3. Can you refresh my memory, how did it go? Double hat-tricks was it? It is strange you cant seem to bring yourself to discuss it. Surely the exploits of these Dublin heroes, and dare I say marquee forwards, can offer an example to O'Connor as to how it should be done?

As I recall there was a marquee alright, and they were jumping through hoops...

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/02/2015 17:39:20    1693039

Surely the exploits of these Dublin heroes, and dare I say marquee forwards, can offer an example to O'Connor as to how it should be done?


Yep.. just get him to watch a replay of the 2013 All Ireland Final.

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 12/02/2015 17:45:26    1693045

Dubh_linn, as the saying goes, if you want to dish it out, be prepared to take it back. Some people get a bit upset when that happens Im afraid...

link

Nearly was a hat trick that day actually...

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 12/02/2015 17:54:14    1693049

jimbodub
County: Dublin
Posts: 13291

1693032
Again speaks voulmes about the current Myao setup

A bloody one armed player has to do all the scoring...

Talk about depending on one player

Just hope that shoulder doesn't pop gain Mayo lads.. once you do it a couple of times

It's prone to pop again.. but sure you'll probably play him again anyway... fit or not...

Seems you have very little options... no wonder he doesn't win a lot of his own ball

He's only looking after himself as best he can.. someone has too I guess



That's about as bitter a post I've seen from you jimbo. Not like you at all. Those Mayo lads FINALLY starting to get to you?

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 12/02/2015 18:01:53    1693054

Really roundball...

I think you're seeing it in a light that wasn't my intention whatsoever

These things can happen

No trouble.

I was simply adding to the point of being overly dependent on one player...

Thus further adding to the point of starting an obviously injured player

Perhaps I should have phrased it better.

Apologies for any confusion caused roundball...

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 12/02/2015 18:11:34    1693059

Every thread turns into a bitch fest :D

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8592 - 12/02/2015 18:23:37    1693061

Master- yeah thats fair enough. At the end of the day, I suppose it doesnt matter who is better, once they do it for their own county. I think hes a class act. Your point re the All-Ireland final is valid too. Id dont believe though overall that players need to win one to be regarded as the greatest. Dec Browne and Paul Barden were as good as anything I have ever saw in the flesh so that argument is futile. Its like Paddy McBrearty has already received some slight criticism in Donegal. Ridiculous IMO given his age. Players normally dont peak until 25-29.

TheRightStuff (Donegal) - Posts: 1688 - 12/02/2015 18:36:54    1693063

enright showed himself to not being up to the right standard..what else did o connor though afterwards?..why couldnt he do anything from play 2 years in a row against the dubs?...if he is as good as people say then how come mayo are regarded as having no top forward?...hes a decent player largely because of his hard work good free taking and good finishing..far from exceptional and not anywhere close to the likes of o donoghue connolly or brogan when hes in form..colm o neil is another example of a much better footballer as he is such a threat from play which o connor simply is not

fabio8 (USA) - Posts: 2182 - 12/02/2015 19:07:16    1693078

Don't think he's near O'Donoghue's level

IamADragon (Cavan) - Posts: 305 - 14/02/2015 15:53:16    1693487

fabio8
County: USA
Posts: 1369

1693078
enright showed himself to not being up to the right standard..what else did o connor though afterwards?..why couldnt he do anything from play 2 years in a row against the dubs?...if he is as good as people say then how come mayo are regarded as having no top forward?...hes a decent player largely because of his hard work good free taking and good finishing..far from exceptional and not anywhere close to the likes of o donoghue connolly or brogan when hes in form..colm o neil is another example of a much better footballer as he is such a threat from play which o connor simply is not

Eamon Fitzmaurice seemed to think he was a threat from play when he hauled Shane Enright off him in Limerick last year...

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 14/02/2015 16:06:49    1693492

roundball
County: Tipperary
Posts: 2208

1693492
fabio8
County: USA
Posts: 1369

1693078
enright showed himself to not being up to the right standard..what else did o connor though afterwards?..why couldnt he do anything from play 2 years in a row against the dubs?...if he is as good as people say then how come mayo are regarded as having no top forward?...hes a decent player largely because of his hard work good free taking and good finishing..far from exceptional and not anywhere close to the likes of o donoghue connolly or brogan when hes in form..colm o neil is another example of a much better footballer as he is such a threat from play which o connor simply is not

Eamon Fitzmaurice seemed to think he was a threat from play when he hauled Shane Enright off him in Limerick last year...

Enright should really have been selecting bath salts at that stage; swapping him for Marc Ó Sé probably won Kerry the match in the end. This stuff about O'Connor not being good enough for the Dublin team is a lot of hot air, really. The criticism of his contribution from play may have been valid three years ago, but he contributed plenty from open play last year, both for Mayo and for Ballintubber. He's also strong in the air, which he never seems to get any credit for. The only major deficiency he has IMO is a lack of searing pace, but even at that, he has no problems winning the ball most of the time.

As for the over-reliance thesis, you could probably make a similar claim about the Dubs and Diarmuid Connolly, though they have a stronger forward line overall than Mayo.

Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 16/02/2015 10:44:16    1693939