arock
County: Dublin
Posts: 2400

1668657
I think maybe its time for duel code clubs to encourage kids from U16 to opt for one code. Its a waste of valuable time, hurling will suffer more but at the end of the day you'll get better skilled ones.

Why would you want that? Not everyone is good enough to be on a county panel. In that case they should be encouraged to play hurling & football for their CLUB. Diarmuid Connolly still lines out for his club's hurlers when he can. This is still the essence of the GAA as far as I'm concerned.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 31/10/2014 14:55:41    1668676

Big athletic guy who will be an asset to the hurlers no doubt. Will surely make a big difference and Cork will be a threat for sure next year and augers well for a cracking championship. Kerry will benefit also as loss of players to hurling and the return of some big names to their ranks will mean an easier run to MSF title.

Dubh_linn (Dublin) - Posts: 2312 - 31/10/2014 15:20:14    1668686

I have a feeling Walsh will prove the doomsayers wrong.He showed enough,albeit briefly,of quality play,to say he is capable of being a good hurler.With his undivided attention now to the small ball game he will get the maximum out of himself.As for Cadogan,i think he is equally poor at both both games,and really would be of no great loss to either panels.Ive yet to see him play well in either code.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 31/10/2014 15:35:37    1668691

Please spell correctly: Dual player..not duel
Good luck to Aidan Walsh. It must be tough lining out for Cork footballers when in genera; the game is poorly supported.
On his day, he is a fine hurler, awkward to mark, and can be very effective. He has controlled midfield on many occasions

Rockies (Cork) - Posts: 947 - 01/11/2014 18:03:00    1668876

arock
County: Dublin
Posts: 2400

1668657
I think maybe its time for duel code clubs to encourage kids from U16 to opt for one code. Its a waste of valuable time, hurling will suffer more but at the end of the day you'll get better skilled ones.

I can debunk your post in 5 words.

Cratloe
Loughmore/Castleiney
Slaughtneil
Ballyhaunis

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 01/11/2014 18:26:38    1668879

It seems to always happen that dual players choose football. I thought it couldnt get any worse this year when Podge Collins decided that a potential decent run in the qualifiers with the Clare footballers was preferable to a potential all Ireland title with the Clare hurlers, but aidan walsh has bucked the trend and id love to see some dubs like Ciaran Kilkenny follow suit.
The resistance needs everyone they can get if they are to overthrow the black and amber empire.
I think its a good move for him, and for Cork. They reached an all Ireland final last year, they were deservedly beaten by an excellent CLare team but who knows, he could prove to be the difference this year.

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 01/11/2014 18:31:37    1668881

Rounball, those clubs may be doing well at the moment but I guarantee you it wont last. As time goes by one code will begin to take over (its usually football).

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 01/11/2014 18:39:38    1668883

joncarter
County: Galway
Posts: 1374

1668883
Rounball, those clubs may be doing well at the moment but I guarantee you it wont last. As time goes by one code will begin to take over (its usually football).

Why not? Ballyhaunis have a long tradition in both. Loughmore have been up there with the best in both codes for 15 years. Cratloe have grown incredibly fast in both codes and they are close to the epicentre of Munster Rugby which is a serious competitor.

Think I might add Killenaule to the list. Beat Clonmel, the 2012 champions, in the south Tipp final today. I'd imagine Kieran Bergin and John O'Dwyer were playing. Possibly Pat Kerwick as well.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 01/11/2014 19:00:12    1668889

Theres a difference with Ballyhaunis, football is the undisputed king in Mayo.
Its different in counties where both codes are taken seriously.

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 01/11/2014 19:07:22    1668893

Hurling is taken very seriously in Ballyhaunis. It would be at least 50/50 hurling/football.

keeper7 (Longford) - Posts: 4088 - 01/11/2014 19:55:35    1668906

Im talking about Mayo as a whole.

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 01/11/2014 19:58:41    1668909

what im trying to say is that if you come back in ten years i reckon that places like cratloe will be majority football or hurling 9 my moneys on football wining out)
Dont forget that financial pressures, as well as work commitment from the players could force clubs to abandon the dual thing.
Doing it for a couple of seasons, fine, sustaining it, almost impossible, which is a shame because I have massive respect for those who try it.

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 01/11/2014 20:01:54    1668912

joncarter
County: Galway
Posts: 1383

1668912
what im trying to say is that if you come back in ten years i reckon that places like cratloe will be majority football or hurling 9 my moneys on football wining out)
Dont forget that financial pressures, as well as work commitment from the players could force clubs to abandon the dual thing.
Doing it for a couple of seasons, fine, sustaining it, almost impossible, which is a shame because I have massive respect for those who try i

I take your point on Mayo hurling. However look at Loughmore- traditionally more succesful in football (despite being in a hurling division), in the last 25 years they've won 6 county titles... split evenly between both codes. Mightn't seem like a huge haul of silverware but the point is they have been consistently competitive in both for over a quarter of a century. In a small rural are as well. I'm not in any way associated with them but they're a fantastic club in my view.

As for Cratloe. I think they're smart. They're a commuter town for Limerick so A) while it is traditionally a hurling area they have "blow-ins" from football country so rather isolate them they've just assimilated football in to the club B) Thomond Park is on their doorstep, when you're vying with a mammoth like Munster Rugby. and old, well established Limerick clubs like Shannon RFC for kids attention it helps to have a broad appeal so offering two codes must work for them.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 02/11/2014 13:42:34    1668993

Cratloe is unusual given the cross-over between the players on both sides. There is no reason why clubs cannot be successfully dual if they have a large number of players. A lot of the city sides in Cork are strong at both codes and do so with only minimial cross over of players (none are super successful I suppose).

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 03/11/2014 15:17:31    1669398

I disagree Bennybunny. I have very little interest in football, so I can't really comment. But from what I hear, wht you're saying is a widely held view by the football people. He was messed about, not left mature into a good midfielder (same is often daid about Goold) couldn't serve too masters etc. Could be true, I don't know.

But I'm pretty sure he is an intercounty hurler. He has pace, strength and will up his skill level hugely. I suspect he'll never be the kind of player JOC was, but the days of a player like that making an impact are long gone. People tend to think he's just a 'big athletic bruiser,' but like a lot of the recent KK hurlers, that's not all he is. Walsh strikes a ball better than most. His positioning is top class. He reads the game very well, and there are very few who are as dangerous as him when moving forward into space.

The arrival of Walsh may be a sign of how far our star has fallen, but for me, it's more of a sign that Cork are accepting the way the modern game is played.

Culchie (Cork) - Posts: 799 - 03/11/2014 15:21:25    1669401

zinny
County: Wexford
Posts: 154

1668553
While Cork hurling may gain from this I believe Hurling overall will lose out. What its doing is giving the impression that you cannot play top level hurling and football at the same time and overall I would say that will have a negative effect on Hurling not Football. Unfortunately its all coming from the Hurling people as well, the boys on the Sunday game and some high profile county managers are the biggest culprits. There are a huge amount of duel players playing the game at the club level from underage up to Senior, I think these Hurling purists should pull their horns in and get behind players who play both otherwise it will start to have a knock on effect at the club level as well.


To be fair Aidans decision had nothing to do with pureism.. He was mid field in both codes as well as club and divisional commitments.. He would admit himself he got burned out.. And you could see his performances slide as the year went on.. I think its a huge loss for the footballers but their management is for another days arguing..
In reflection to your point there is a big difference in being dual for a club rather than being dual county.. The day of dual stars are gone and they went with the introduction of the back door.. Its just too many games in quick succession .. If cork won the munster football we may never have been discussing this but as soon as the journey started for cork through the back door that was the end of the dual star.. So they are the simple facts.. its not about the pundits or anyone with an agenda its simply about the players them selves and what can realistically take.. There is no point mentioning the likes of cahalane and them they are bit players at best but with walsh his talent will always see him starting so he has done the intelligent thing and i wish him the best of luck .. I also wish cork would bite the bullet and get a new football manager but thats probably not going to happen

ritchie (Cork) - Posts: 346 - 03/11/2014 15:48:36    1669408

ritchie

What I was trying to say was that the hurling purists who say you cannot play elite hurling and football are wrong - the fact is nobody is being given the chance to do it anymore but thats not what they are saying, the implication coming from them is that playing football impacts your ability to play hurling. The GAA itself doesn't help, I remember days when Wexford had League games in Hurling and Football on the same day - last year it was championship the next day. Why don't people come out and say neither Hurling or Football managers in a county are willing to change their routines which would give duel players a chance to represent both codes - I cannot imagine that it would be that hard given the knowledge there is out there these days around training and training methods. Agree clubs are different but these guys spouting stuff on the TV will just give the anti other code people the ammunition they need to try and do the same at the club level and worse still at the underage level.

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1805 - 04/11/2014 14:12:18    1669623

ritchie
County: Cork
Posts: 187




To be fair Aidans decision had nothing to do with pureism.. He was mid field in both codes as well as club and divisional commitments.. He would admit himself he got burned out.. And you could see his performances slide as the year went on.. I think its a huge loss for the footballers but their management is for another days arguing..
In reflection to your point there is a big difference in being dual for a club rather than being dual county.. The day of dual stars are gone and they went with the introduction of the back door.. Its just too many games in quick succession .. If cork won the munster football we may never have been discussing this but as soon as the journey started for cork through the back door that was the end of the dual star.. So they are the simple facts.. its not about the pundits or anyone with an agenda its simply about the players them selves and what can realistically take.. There is no point mentioning the likes of cahalane and them they are bit players at best but with walsh his talent will always see him starting so he has done the intelligent thing and i wish him the best of luck .. I also wish cork would bite the bullet and get a new football manager but thats probably not going to happen

Good post. I would agree with everything except you said Cahailane was a bit part player. He should be a (no) bit-part player but alas, he was given quite a few parts to play.

You could also delete the highlighted word in your last sentence. His face is suited to hanging around the main corridors in PuC. He is staying until he decides otherwise.

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 05/11/2014 12:30:53    1669813

Much needed boost for the Cork footballers with cadogan opting for football.
Wise decision on his part too.

Dont think either JBM or Cuthbert will get too much sleepless nights over what Cahalane does!


But you know the fact the footballers know Walsh wont be there next year gives other players a good chance to stake a position down on the team which can only help moral.
it would have been much worse for them to lose Walsh to an injury midway through the year...now they can just plough on without him and just like in Kerry's case where the much less known players really stood up and got counted without Gooch which players in Cork will have to do without Walsh

woops (Kerry) - Posts: 2073 - 07/11/2014 16:59:26    1670524

The fact that Cadogan was even considering going hurling is surely a sign of how bad things are in the football side of the house, given where he was/is in the Cork hurling pecking order.

His only championship involvement with the hurlers last year was coming on in the 67th minute of the Clare game. The other 4 games he was left sitting on the bench. By comparison he played every minute of the Kerry, Mayo and Sligo games and came on at half-time in the Tipperary game.

Fair play to Cadogan - can't be easy heading into an intercounty season under a manager who left him exposed like Cuthbert did in the Kerry game.

besidetheditch (Dublin) - Posts: 81 - 07/11/2014 18:11:52    1670549