I see Oisin McConville has talked about the inbalance in the All Ireland Championship. This is from an All Ireland winner with club and county. Players understand the differences in terms of having to peak in May and playing against teams who are only having to peak in August. There is a broad discussion to be had about change whilst respecting the provincial councils. Who would have thought Croke Park would be opened up or Sky would become involved. Big decisions happen and as all 32 counties are becoming more influential with what is best for the GAA I just cannot see today's structure in place in 10 years. Some counties will not like it but common sense will prevail plus a way needs to be found to maximise the marketing potential of the dubs. The fun will start when it is a fair structure.

sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 999 - 14/10/2014 10:21:19    1663424

Soma
County: UK
Posts: 650

1663412
We had a large number of Ulster posters on here just a few weeks ago telling us that Jim McGuinness had used the provincial campaign to try out a number of different ideas, with the focus all year on having things right for Croke Park. These same posters, and not all were from Donegal, said that Jim had not showed his hand at all on their way to winning Ulster, and that was why they were well placed to win Sam. If Donegal have it so easy in Ulster these days that the manager can treat the games like pre-season friendlies, you would wonder why it was that they could not see the job out in Croke Park then? The best team win the All-Ireland, it was always the same.

Well some of these posters were obviously ignorant or wind up merchants or trolls even.

I would really like to see where and when JMG said this about the ulster championship, rather than a keyboard warrior on a forum.

The bottom line is that Mayo and Cork have the same run of games before the all ireland knock out stages, and they dont share the same success as kerry do. All right Cork is a dual county, but they have a sufficiently large population to be able to handle this. But they still dont excel.

I would worry about next year though for us. We have to come from a game in the middle of may v tyrone to start our preparation for the year. Everything will have to go right, that means injury and form.. It is a different proposition than playing either antrim or fermanagh in the first round. You cant argue that Donegal and tyrone will be off the bridle for an extra 2 months. Excellent preparation if the squad stays healthy. Not so good if there is attrition.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 14/10/2014 10:31:24    1663425

ZZZZZZZZZZ! Look, top 5 in Ireland are Kerry, Dublin, Donegal, Mayo and Cork. Kerry beat Donegal, Mayo and Cork to win their All-Ireland so blaming geography for Kerry's success is nonsense. It's fine saying that Ulster is competitive but as a province it's in transition as there are no exceptional teams in Ulster barring Donegal, that's why it's competitive ~PHS

Pope_has_spoken (Dublin) - Posts: 138 - 14/10/2014 10:49:28    1663431

Kerry clearly have an unfair advantage. The place is in the south west, facing the balmy Atlantic and is bathed by the Gulf Stream, all of which makes natives of the Kingdom shrewder and healthier, obviously. Blessed with the best soil in the country, the Yerrah Lads grow up secure in the knowledge that the club facilities will be excellent and there will always be a place for them at home, jobwise. And when the time comes to settle down, they are automatically given five head of cattle for every All Ireland medal... and... first call on the latest crop of comely and biddable colleens from God's own county.

I had ye fooled up until all that malarkey about the Kerry colleens. They are a lot of things but biddable isn't one of them, hah?!!!

plike (Kerry) - Posts: 569 - 14/10/2014 10:51:34    1663432

I've been on several GAA fan forums over the years and the same trend keeps emerging on them. Fans of less successful counties zone in on some perceived advantage enjoyed by a county or counties who have enjoyed a period of success, and then whinge and moan about how the GAA should introduce this rule or that rule in order to curtail said advantage, and "give everyone else a chance". It's a very GAA thing, almost uniquely. And more than a bit sad.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 14/10/2014 11:00:37    1663438

Makes perfect sense to me pdempsey. If you have two strong teams in a weak Province then it will nearly always be one of these teams who got in to the semi-final each year (pre 2001). If you know you only have to play 3 competitive games to win an All-Ireland of course it helps keeping players coming forward year after year in the conveyor belt. Plus you are used to playing on the big stage and on the big occassion which is a definite advantage over players from Counties who are only there every blue moon. Sure look at Kilkenny - people say its down to them only playing one code and yes this does play a part but so does the fact that they have been successful and the juggernaut got rolling. To say otherwise is folly.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/10/2014 11:13:13    1663444

Offsiderule, what a pathetic and whinging post, the most negative posters on here appear to be from Antrim, lack of success and failure has made ye bitter and of course the bitterness re: signing of the treaty is at the background of this, ye are more to be pitied I suppose, We are Kerry and i'm very proud of that, our history and our tradition sustains us and by the way my grandfather fought in the first world war with the Munster fusiliers and I am so proud of him and he was a proud Irishman and a proud Kerryman so away with your pathetic sleveen remarks about the treaty, wallow in your negativity if you wish but at the end of the day, WE ARE KERRY, now live with it.

mlcollins (Kerry) - Posts: 440 - 14/10/2014 11:34:24    1663450

Oh the irony of someone called M Collins giving out to someone about the North on their stance on the treaty. I stopped reading at that point.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/10/2014 11:45:56    1663456

ballydalane
County: Kilkenny
Posts: 261

1663438
I've been on several GAA fan forums over the years and the same trend keeps emerging on them. Fans of less successful counties zone in on some perceived advantage enjoyed by a county or counties who have enjoyed a period of success, and then whinge and moan about how the GAA should introduce this rule or that rule in order to curtail said advantage, and "give everyone else a chance". It's a very GAA thing, almost uniquely. And more than a bit sad.

It's not some "perceived advantage" that they have, in Kerry's case is pretty obvious and you would have to be fairly ignorant to fail to acknowledge it. They practically have a bye into the quarter final stage as there's no real competition in Munster. Whereas Ulster teams have a much more difficult route. That is an advantage, obviously they are going to have more of a chance to win it, as they will be in that stage every year, whereas Ulster teams would not get there as often. How is it fair to have two teams end up at a the same stage of a competition with one of those having played quite a few more games than the other? It's like having the 100 metres and 200 metres at the same time, Kerry obviously only having to run the shorter distance! Not their fault of course but it is an advantage. What is really sad and a "very GAA thing" is being accused of "whinging and moaning" if you try an criticise something in the GAA.

Colmcille01 (Donegal) - Posts: 3 - 14/10/2014 11:49:32    1663457

I knew you would, therefore it proves my theory, bitter, so bitter, ciarrai abu, 37 and counting, did you read that.

mlcollins (Kerry) - Posts: 440 - 14/10/2014 11:55:25    1663461

Oh and just to clarify Ml. Collins is not my name, he is my username and my HERO, so therefore no irony, ciarrai abu.

mlcollins (Kerry) - Posts: 440 - 14/10/2014 11:59:09    1663464

Ml. Collins is not my name, he is my username and my HERO, so therefore no irony, ciarrai abu.

Ha - even more ironic then. Now where's that pen to I sign my name.....

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/10/2014 12:10:15    1663465

Of course it's an advantage, any team that has an inherently easier run to the All Ireland series has an advantage over a team that doesn't. Many counties have enjoyed it, it's prevalent at times in Leinster, and perennially in Connacht and Munster. Ulster is by far the hardest route.

Now by saying that it kind of breaks down if you try to say it makes winning an All Ireland easier. Mayo enjoy the same ease as Kerry to the All Ireland series yet cannot win All Ireland's so although it is a factor is by no means a definitive one. Since the demise of Meath the same held through for Dublin until recently.

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 14/10/2014 12:40:12    1663480

That bitterness is so sad, god help you, it's such a privilege to come from a county which has been so successful and that has given us such great pride, no bitterness, just joy now where did I leave my pen.

mlcollins (Kerry) - Posts: 440 - 14/10/2014 13:18:36    1663505

All Dublin games staying in Croke Park next year. This does not surprise me but it is the one reason change will come to even up the championship which will have Dublin playing big teams throughout the summer. Kerry may have the most All Irelands however Dublin will always be the county which generates the income and is the most important county in the GAA.

sam1884 (UK) - Posts: 999 - 14/10/2014 13:20:32    1663507

Good man Michael Collins - I am a lot happier now knowing your feeling of privilege. There is no bitterness from this quarter, just amusement at the stance of a lot of so called Irishmen on all matters relating to the North. In fact, I am glad that I am from this part of Ireland, unsuccessful and all as we might be on the Football or Hurling field. See, there are more things in life that I would deem important or worthy of my feeling of privilege, especially if the feeling of privilege is on others achievements and not something I have actually achieved myself. Privilege by association if you wish. Anyway, I have no doubt that if Antrim were in the Munster Championship we too would have a good few AI titles by this stage of our history.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/10/2014 14:24:24    1663544

Yeah, this comes up every year. You add the extra quarter final round in in 2001 and all of a sudden Kerry's win rate increases. 5 of the last 14 since the back door was introduced. Prior to that we only won 1 in every 3.5. Maybe, the more games you include means the more Kerry win! I don't know. That's just speculation. The same type of speculation about what would kerry have won if they were in Ulster.

One thing for certain is that in 2014:-

Derry were beaten by Longford! Who in turn were hammered by tipperary! Tipp also beat Laois who absolutely trounced Fermanagh! Down got destroyed by Kildare (Who beat Clare by 1 point only) and Cavan were absolutely mauled by Roscommon! Limerick beat Antrim and were then beaten by Sligo. Please don't tell me that this is all because these teams were tired after 1 or 2 difficult games in Ulster. What about Tipp, Limerick, Clare, Laois, Roscommorn and Kildare all of whom were beaten in what you must presume were difficult games in their own counties.

Yes, Tyrone were knocked out by Armagh in the qualifiers but hey, when you have 9 counties you have more of a chance of meeting a fellow provincial team at some stage.

thykingdomcome1 (Kerry) - Posts: 78 - 14/10/2014 15:18:51    1663572

The vote is in lads.By a large majority,the GAA men/woman of Ireland believe Kerry have an unfair advantage by being in Munster.There are none so blind as those who choose not to see.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 14/10/2014 15:49:51    1663585

Limerick beat Antrim and were then beaten by Sligo. Please don't tell me that this is all because these teams were tired after 1 or 2 difficult games in Ulster.

Can only speak for Antrim and in our case we had lost 5 of the starting 15 for the Limerick match from the previous games in Ulster - the quarter final against Fermanagh and the semi against Donegal due to guys heading off to the states etc. Nothing to do with tiredness.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/10/2014 15:51:30    1663587

Colmcille01
County: Donegal
Posts: 3


It's not some "perceived advantage" that they have, in Kerry's case is pretty obvious and you would have to be fairly ignorant to fail to acknowledge it. They practically have a bye into the quarter final stage as there's no real competition in Munster. Whereas Ulster teams have a much more difficult route. That is an advantage, obviously they are going to have more of a chance to win it, as they will be in that stage every year, whereas Ulster teams would not get there as often. How is it fair to have two teams end up at a the same stage of a competition with one of those having played quite a few more games than the other? It's like having the 100 metres and 200 metres at the same time, Kerry obviously only having to run the shorter distance! Not their fault of course but it is an advantage. What is really sad and a "very GAA thing" is being accused of "whinging and moaning" if you try an criticise something in the GAA.

Have you raised a proposal to your club for the Donegal County Board to table a motion at the next Congress to scrap the provincial system, if it's so inherently disadvantageous?

I agree, the provincial system is lobsided. What gets on my nerves is people using it as an excuse for this county winning All-Irelands and that county not winning All-Irelands, yet no one ever (as far as I can see) tables a motion to scrap the provincial system. In fact, I daresay if a motion to scrap the provincials ever did make it to Congress, which province do you think would be most opposed? I have a feeling I know.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 14/10/2014 15:59:30    1663593