cork and Kerry have practically "byes" into the All Ireland quarterfinals. I mean this years final is in Killarney. Imagine if by a miracle Tipp were to get there!

galwayford (Galway) - Posts: 2519 - 14/10/2014 16:05:42    1663599

Thank you OR. I agree. The inability of teams, from any province, to perform on any given day has very little to do with who they met previously, how tired they are or how competitive the province is. If anything the extra back door games give teams the chance to develop cohesiveness and resolve and is a distinct advantage.

I think this is the reason why Kerry have a better chance of winning the All Ireland when they are knocked out of the Munster Championship early. (as the stats prove since the back door came in).

thykingdomcome1 (Kerry) - Posts: 78 - 14/10/2014 16:42:16    1663627

Galwayford
Tipp are playing us in the Munster semifinal in thurles in 2015 so if like you say by some miracle tipp get to the final they won't have to play the final in Killarney .

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 14/10/2014 17:12:02    1663641

SamOnErrigal
County: Donegal
Posts: 659

1663360
Treaty Exile
Can't let u away with all this nonsense you are talking about Ulster football
First of all you say the Ulster championship was a bye for the likes of Kerry and DUBLIN so I persume yo u are talking about the 70's/80's. Do you realise the situation that existed in the Six counties around that time::::how difficult it was for GAA people to keep running clubs and the hostile stance the Goverment there took against Gaelic games and culture
Do you not realise it was one of the most Dangerous places on Earth to live in::: yes The Six Counties , Arnagh, TYRONE, DERRY Down Fermanagh and Antrim.
At any time of day or night you could be lifted Nd might not see freedom again for years lots and lots of young men spent their 20's in prison so any of them that were good at football lost out as did their counties. Antrim won the All Ireland back in the late sixties or early seventies but that team never went nowhere as from what I can remember one or two of them were shot dead and some more were interend. That was at U21 level.
So you can see why Ulster teams would be cannon fodder. For a lot of young men to stay alive was no one, not to have good Gaelic football teams
I would argue that since partition Ulster had not a chance t for Cavan / MONAGHAN. To be fair Cavan produced good teams, GREAT TEAMS and won All Irelands in the 20's/30's40's/50's The six counties and Donegal had no chance of winning an All Ireland You can see how long it took some of them to win an Ulster Title Now saying that Leinster would be the only provience that Kerry would have win less titles is well out of touch. Do you think Kerry would have won all those titles if they were in Ulster from 1921 to around 1990 How would they have handled the period from 1969up on to say again 1990??
I would put Donegal's failure down to :: first ,, badly organised,, emigration lack of work , being so isolated with partition not helping. You only have to go back to the 50's and we stil had hiring fairs in Donegal where young boys and girls 15,16,17 years of age were hired out to big farmers for Six months with the parents getting around 15 pounds for the six month in my case we had not the price of a football or football boots and with a lot of us coming from big families maybe 10/12/14 or even 16 in the family what choice had we ::: The Boat. So having a good gaelic team was not the big issue then , survival was.
I often wonder how Kerry done it as they also suffered from immigration also but that's where they had a big advantage over Six county teams :: freedom to express themselves, to Train and never being harassed because they wanted to play Gaelic games So I do hope people understands how difficult life was in Ulster for some counties and hoe IMO Gaelic games , especially at county level took a long time to take off but they have done and with NINE All Irelands since 1991 I would be happy enough and also them being shared by Five different counties

I read this last night Sam. Can I first say that was a bit on the young side when the troubles were in flow during the 70's and 80's. I am no political animal, and the events did not take place on my doorstep so I cannot pretend I have any great knowledge of the events! I meant no offence at all, and I of course accept what I am sure is a very valid point. I apologise completely for any annoyance or offence I may have caused! I also meant no disrespect to Ulster, which is a proud bastion of Gaelic football (and long may that continue).

Treaty_Exile (Limerick) - Posts: 386 - 14/10/2014 17:34:06    1663652

Treaty,im glad somebody enlightened you about the troubles up the North.So easy to escape any knowledge of it down South.Maybe for your next lesson you can research WW2.Another insignificant row that no doubt uve managed to avoid coming across.Knowledge is power.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 14/10/2014 18:15:36    1663670

cuederocket
County: Dublin
Posts: 1263

1663670
Treaty,im glad somebody enlightened you about the troubles up the North.So easy to escape any knowledge of it down South.Maybe for your next lesson you can research WW2.Another insignificant row that no doubt uve managed to avoid coming across.Knowledge is power.

Jeez, that's pretty obnoxious. The troubles were not something that directly affected me, I was a bit on the young side at the time. It wouldn't have effected me as much as it would have effected a young lad growing up in Derry, and I think that's okay to say. When considering Ulster's weakness over the years, I had not factored it in what a huge effect the troubles must have had on the GAA community in the North, when I should have, and I apologised for not doing so. I'm not pretending it was insignificant, it wasn't. F*** sake.

Treaty_Exile (Limerick) - Posts: 386 - 14/10/2014 18:59:15    1663692

Kerry work harder, thats it, that is the only reason that kerry are better! There is nothing in the water down here and we dont have a genetic advantage! For every other county they are just not putting in enough effort! I am not talking just about how the senior team trains, im talking about from grass roots across the board up! It helps that football is religion in kerry but if other counties want to start tasting success they need to stop looking for excuaes of kerry having an advantage in one way or another and start looking at themselves!

All the rubbish that is talked about kerry having an advantage of being in munster is just disrespectful! It can be argued that cork are the fifth team after this years provincial winners! If we lose we still have to go through the back door and we have always proved our worth there! Stop looking for excuses, take a look in the mirror instead!

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 14/10/2014 18:59:43    1663693

OK Treaty,maybe it was a low blow.Everyone else seems to be griping,so i said id join the club(:

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 14/10/2014 19:15:06    1663700

I was hoping there was something in the water as ye will all be drinking less of it now the meter is running.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 14/10/2014 19:16:16    1663701

Not as simple as working harder ak ky.Probably the most skillfull,natural footballers.Tradition and self belief.With a little sprinkling of "good luck" by playing in Munster.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 14/10/2014 19:20:29    1663703

As ky,you play in a 6 county province,with 5 being hurling counties..Ulster has 9 counties,with 8 predominantly football counties.We play in a 12 county province(twice the amount as yereselves),with 10 predominantly football counties.Can you see any disparity with the numbers?Any at all?

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 14/10/2014 19:29:55    1663708

I find all this talk of Kerry having poor opposition in Munster intriguing when you consider that Galway with a huge hurling area and many many top class clubs have only won the All Ireland with the small ball on 4 occasions, despite having a clear run in the West for about 120 years. So much for all this talk of Kerrys' unfair advantage in Munster

Oldtourman (Limerick) - Posts: 4321 - 14/10/2014 19:35:54    1663711

Galway were never kingpins oldtour.And their in Leinster now,so no easy path to semi anymore.Kerry have always bein top dogs.The Real Madrid of football.On top of their undoubted brilliance over many decades,they have a relatively easy path into Croke Park every year,in comparison to Ulster and Leinster counties.It must be addressed.

cuederocket (Dublin) - Posts: 5084 - 14/10/2014 19:43:43    1663717

Offside_Rule
County: Antrim
Posts: 1709

1663401
Sam - I think if there was another Treaty to be signed tomorrow a few of the posters on here would be first in line to get their names down like their forefathers did.

On the topic - do Kerry have an unfair advantage? I just look at the stats for AI wins and it fits exactly how I would expect, that is, the easier a Province is to win I would expect more AI wins (success breeds success, familiarity with getting to the big stage on a yearly basis etc..) with the largest Urban area ranking high up the table. It is no surprise then that the league table of AI wins goes as follows:

Easiest province to win - Munster (Kerry)
Largest Urban Area (Dublin)
Second Easiest Province to Win - Connacht (Galway)

Its not all down to being superior as some of our learned friends on here would try and convince us.

You've got me there. How scientific. You cant argue with that kind of logic. I was going to propose:
Furthest west - Kerry
Largest Viking settlement - Dublin
2nd furthest west - Galway
But clearly your system explanation is flawless. Have you used this to explain results in other sports?

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 14/10/2014 20:27:19    1663734

All this Kerry versus Ulster stuff so I thought I would give a few stats. Here are the full results for all League and championship games between Kerry and Ulster (you know the nine counties)

KY Chp ---- Lge ---- Tot
P 46 ---- 68 ---- 84
W 28 ---- 26 ---- 54
D 4 ---- 1 ---- 5
L 14 ---- 11 ---- 25

That's a fairly good return for Kerry.

It's very interesting to see all this Kerry hatred that started the moment the final whistle was blown in Limerick. There was no interest before that when everyone thought Dublin or Donegal were going to win it. I don't mind this bile at all because it shows we must be winning something.

ky_dub (Kerry) - Posts: 16 - 14/10/2014 20:27:48    1663735

Ulsterman
County: Antrim
Posts: 7057

There is NO doubt that Kerry and Cork have a handy draw every season in Munster as seen again this year and they wouldn't have half the titles they did if they played in Ulster.

If Kerry played football in Ulster, the Gooch would have played as a back, Declan O sullivan would be have retired crocked at 24, Maurice Fitz would never have made the team as he would have been branded a "fancy pants" and gaelic football would be a much darker place. Heaven forbid

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 14/10/2014 20:32:50    1663738

Kerry have an unfair advantage. London do not. Mayo do but they haven't used it as well as Kerry. Leinster counties don't.

tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 14/10/2014 20:33:26    1663739

I took no offence Treaty Exile and the thing is I quite understand how younger people like you might not understand how serious the troubles was. That's fair enough and as it's almost 20 years since we got peace all the younger people would know is what they read about the place
Now I am open to be corrected but if my memory serves me right, the Six Counties was classed back in the 70's/80's as one of the most dangerous places in the world to live in
Now just around 3 years ago we had riots here in London and I rember being in Kilburn on afternoon and the Pubs, shops Cafes and Betting shops were closing at around 2 o clock in the day as they were expecting trouble there were police everywhere and the fear on the streets with people rushing to get home and indoors and I though of what the people in the six counties went through , events like that and worse happening every day Bombs , shootings killings army and gunmen on the street and that went on for years.
So I could not see in conditions like that how having a good well prepared county team be a big priority. As I well know Ulster teams including Donegal were very poor. And they were up on to the nineties.
It's not many years ago that the chairman of Bellaghy GAA club was kidnapped and murdered by loyalists as he locked up. In today's Ireland it's hard to believe what went on then but I remember being home on holidays on different occasions in the 70's and used to watch the news on Ulster TV. The whole programe would be all about violence, shootings , killings bombings, terrible it was but hopefully all that's in the past and never again
To me now Ulster teams are on a level playing field especially the six county teams , it's up to ourselves to produce good teams , teams that can challenge the likes of Kerry , DublinCork and Mayo and other strong counties and I would not worry too much what advantage Cork/Kerry have
Over the years I saw Donegal getting beat a lot , I did not worry too much about the teams that beat us , what I thought was::: Why can We ( Donegal) not be like them, as good as them ?? I think that's the way J McG looked at things when he became manager.

SamOnErrigal (Donegal) - Posts: 1427 - 14/10/2014 20:41:06    1663745

galwayford
County: Galway
Posts: 54

1663599


cork and Kerry have practically "byes" into the All Ireland quarterfinals. I mean this years final is in Killarney. Imagine if by a miracle Tipp were to get there!

I dont mean to be pedantic but that should read Cork OR Kerry.Also a bye suggests a 100% chance where in fact either has a 50% chance (give or take) which is not quite a bye strictly speaking.

Corrxxx (Kerry) - Posts: 584 - 14/10/2014 20:45:45    1663746

Just flicking through the thread again and it's gas , we are being blamed for being from Munster, and now we are being blamed for troubles in the north. It's gone a bit nuts to be honest. But I suppose that's the price we pay for being world champions for the 37th time. An Riocht Abu.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 14/10/2014 21:05:37    1663752