Cody was only speaking his mind. Is there much wrong in that? My opinion is I don't think so, but then I'm an admirer of Cody and Kilkenny so I get that this influences my thinking.

Its been a fairly common complaint over the last few years that GAA managers say allot about nothing in their interviews. Maybe we don't really know what we want.

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 02/10/2014 17:00:59    1659483

SLLY
County: Dublin
Posts: 111

1659394 ballydalane
County: Kilkenny
Posts: 233

1659216
OK lads, what punishment should Cody get if he doesn't say sorry?

Put him in charge of the footballers for 3 years. We'd see how good/happy he is after that.

That punishment would be filed under "cruel and unusual".

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 02/10/2014 18:12:31    1659501

If you read the transcript of the "offending" section of the interview, Cody never even refers to Barry Kelly by name. He doesn't even mention the word "referee".

Q: Was Saturday's game better?

BC: "It is simple for me to say that now because we won. The last game was an outstanding game, there is no doubt about that, but I would say for either team to concede as much as was conceded the last day would not be what either team would be hoping to do. Obviously, you would love to score as much but the strange thing was that both teams scored the same and it was as if they had scored and missed more than we had and I didn't think so. Also, at the end of the day, at the end of the day, they were handed an opportunity with the last puck of the game the last day in the wrong to win the game. You are nodding your head now, so you agree. They were handed an opportunity by a complete wrong decision. We didn't speak about it the last day but it was criminal what was done the last day. And people can say that I am whingeing and moaning all they like but I am telling the truth here."

Q: Did you think it was a free the other way?

BC: "If he had said 'play on' I would have said fair enough. I could say maybe it might have been a free for us. If the ball broke and they put it over the bar fair enough but you don't hand a team a free puck and say, 'lads, there you go'. It was like that."

Q: Would you consider he has previous with Kilkenny after Jackie Tyrell free in 2012 final and Henry Shefflin's red card last year?

BC: "Of course he has. Of course he has. Now you have your story! Keep it simple lads now right!"

Apart from the use of the word "criminal", which even though he was clearly using it figuratively rather than in any literal sense of the word, the rest of what he said is scarcely different to what a million managers/coaches in a million different sports say every week about what they perceive to be bad refereeing decisions. He's entitled to think it wasn't a free, he's entitled to think it was a wrong decision and he's entitled to say it. And yes, you're entitled to disagree with him. Last time I checked we weren't living in North Korea.

In the interest of defusing the situation he should retract his use of the word "criminal" while still standing by the overall point he was making.

The issue of Kelly's "previous with Kilkenny" was brought up by the journo (who probably couldn't believe his luck). What could Cody say, "no, he doesn't"?

Culchie's post on the previous page is an outstanding summation of the event. A manager letting off steam, who probably let off more steam than he should. Won't be the first and certainly won't be the last.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 02/10/2014 18:22:10    1659505

Culchie's post on the previous page is an outstanding summation of the event. A manager letting off steam, who probably let off more steam than he should. Won't be the first and certainly won't be the last.

I think there's allot of steam around

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1415 - 02/10/2014 19:47:57    1659523

Q: Was Saturday's game better?

BC: ........ Also, at the end of the day, at the end of the day, they were handed an opportunity with the last puck of the game the last day in the wrong to win the game. You are nodding your head now, so you agree. They were handed an opportunity by a complete wrong decision. We didn't speak about it the last day but it was criminal what was done the last day. And people can say that I am whingeing and moaning all they like but I am telling the truth here."

I did not post this transcript. It was somebody else.I thought that he may have been taken out of context at first.

bennybunny (Cork) - Posts: 3917 - 02/10/2014 20:13:36    1659535

I took the transcript from John Fogarty's article in the Irish Examiner.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 02/10/2014 20:46:54    1659552

This is really blown out of all proportion here. The man was asked a question and he answered honestly. People can hark back to 2009 all they want, the truth is there have been a lot of contentious decisions since then in Kilkenny games with no explanation. I'm a proud Kilkenny man with good friends in Tipperary and I've no problem admitting we got a lucky break in '09, Tipp got the breaks this year but didn't take advantage.

Fester (Carlow) - Posts: 15 - 02/10/2014 21:24:14    1659574

Brian Cody has been vilified by many on this thread. He spoke his mind and fair play to him for that! Too many others in the GAA backstab by what they don't say when interviewed.
He called the decision 'criminal' not the man. A very big difference.
Should referees be protected to the extent that managers cannot comment on specific decisions and general performances? What would that say about us as an association? Are referees a protected species?

I have spoken to Kilkenny people and their difficulty with Barry Kelly does not emanate from one performance alone. It goes back quite a few years. Ask them!

Brian Cody did the decent thing and spoke plainly. He said what many Kilkenny people wanted to say. He was straight in his response - like he is in his preparation of his team and in his interviews before and after matches.

I feel that too many are now jealous of Kilkenny's success. Any perceived weakness or mistake either on the field or off it is a cause for some to detract from the achievements of Kilkenny and of their manager. It becomes an opportunity to cast mostly ill informed comment through forums like this and shows little understanding of what the game of hurling is all about.
I say well done Brian.

carlowman (Carlow) - Posts: 1821 - 02/10/2014 22:03:00    1659599

For all of Cody's whingeing, Barry Kelly had an excellent game the first day, a mile better than the lack of refereeing in the replay.

icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2553 - 03/10/2014 08:26:07    1659603

Its always great refereeing if Kilkenny don't win and when they win the refs let them away with murder, change the record please!.

Time other counties got their finger out and stop blaming Kilkenny for been successful!.

Take a look back on the the 2012 final and replay and tell me which team was playing the rough house hurling?.

kildarecat22 (Kildare) - Posts: 257 - 03/10/2014 11:24:47    1659654

carlowman
County: Carlow
Posts: 1176

1659599 Brian Cody has been vilified by many on this thread. He spoke his mind and fair play to him for that! Too many others in the GAA backstab by what they don't say when interviewed.
He called the decision 'criminal' not the man. A very big difference.
Should referees be protected to the extent that managers cannot comment on specific decisions and general performances? What would that say about us as an association? Are referees a protected species?

I have spoken to Kilkenny people and their difficulty with Barry Kelly does not emanate from one performance alone. It goes back quite a few years. Ask them!

Brian Cody did the decent thing and spoke plainly. He said what many Kilkenny people wanted to say. He was straight in his response - like he is in his preparation of his team and in his interviews before and after matches.

I feel that too many are now jealous of Kilkenny's success. Any perceived weakness or mistake either on the field or off it is a cause for some to detract from the achievements of Kilkenny and of their manager. It becomes an opportunity to cast mostly ill informed comment through forums like this and shows little understanding of what the game of hurling is all about.
I say well done Brian.


So having read your piece those that disagree are jealous or ill informed ,yet Codys comments beyond analysis , this is a free forum for everyone and anyone to give there tuppence halpennys worth , a forum of debate .
A national newspaper or microphone is a different beast especially when the individual does not get the chance to reply , a point of which Cody would be well aware ,
Ive said in previous posts that Id walk over hot coals to have Coady as Dublin manager and that they are the greatest team our sport has ever seen , I think the man is a legend the likes of which we will never see again , but what he said was wrong , he abused his position , for this simple reason NO COACH should ever say anything that may have a bearing on future games , influencing refs intentionally or unintentionally is wrong .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 03/10/2014 11:35:57    1659663

icehonesty
County: Wexford
Posts: 1689

1659603 For all of Cody's whingeing, Barry Kelly had an excellent game the first day, a mile better than the lack of refereeing in the replay.

Yes, an excellent game. Apart from Larkin getting rugby tackled twice with no free, getting 2 penalty decisions wrong, not sending Stapleton off for twisting Richie Power's faceguared 90 degrees across his head (he saw it too) and giving Tipp a dodgy free with the last puck of the game.

Much as you might disagree, a ref aggravating Kilkenny, while it no doubt gives great enjoyment and satisfaction to a large swathe of people around the country, does not necessarily constitute "an excellent game".

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 03/10/2014 11:45:23    1659671

Will you come off it, Icehonesty! I have just watched that entire first game for the first time just now (I was out of the country and so couldn't watch it live). Kilkenny suffered many poor calls in that game, and that last one in particular could have been very costly. However, I still don't think it's a manager's place (whether it be Brian Cody, Davy Fitzgerald or whoever else)to comment on a referee's performance. I was surprised to find Cody up to it - very untypical of him especially when you consider his run-in with Marty Morrissey and the "I make a habit of saying absolutely nothing about referees"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JWgp-vSs7zI

But I suppose in one way I understand him. He also says in that interview "the only time the scoreboard matters is when the very very final whistle blows". Kelly had given many big decisions against Kilkenny in the past that were never commented on. Referees are bound to make mistakes but decisions coming up to the final whistle in tight games are absolutely crucial.A team has to be prepared to ride bad decisions during the course of a game, whether or not these balance out at the end (if for example a team concede a controversial goal, as happened in 2009, and end up losing my 5 points in my opinion they then have nothing to complain about).

Well, luckily, that poor decision did not affect "the final final whistle" but I assume nonetheless the final final whistle has sounded for Cody himself as Kilkenny manager and that was why he felt compelled to break his code of silence. Just a pity he didn't wait a few more months before making these comments.

MiAmigaVERONICA (Clare) - Posts: 302 - 03/10/2014 11:51:26    1659674

So judging by the comments here, it's ok to call a man a disgrace but it's not ok to call a referee's DECISION criminal. That's right his decision, not the person.

Back to the double standards again. So from what i'm reading, if Cody came out and said Kelly was a disgrace all would be ok because criminal decision was too harsh a description.

In all fairness, in a Country where words are said in a completely different meaning all day everyday, we are some moaners of a Nation.

I don't condone picking on refs or anyone for that matter but you can bet your bottom dollar that the media have been asking Cody about Kelly every interview for the last couple of years before games he has reffed and he has done well to say nothing until now.

If Cody gets punished for his words then in future refs should have to come out and explain their decisions in games. At least then if they come out and put their hands up and say yes I made an error here but I only had a second to decide, at least we can say fair play and get over it. The other side of the coin is they show where they thought the free was.

Faithfull (Offaly) - Posts: 573 - 03/10/2014 11:59:40    1659676

MiAmigaVERONICA

"I make a habit of saying absolutely nothing about referees"

I pointed out that quote with the link on page to and got no response, it seems those in support of Cody prefer to bury their heads in the sand when it comes to that quote.

Cody was bitter in victory this year, that's how he'll be remembered unless he clears this up very quickly, not necessarily an apology because none of us know the the exact circumstances or tone of the interview but if past interviews and recent quotes about Barry Kelly are anything to go by then he looks like a sour winner to me for now anyway.

Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 03/10/2014 12:07:39    1659683

carlowman

He called the decision 'criminal' not the man. A very big difference.

Ha ye but hold on a second, Barry Kelly made the 'criminal' decision so isn't the criminal then? I mean if I commit a crime by say breaking someone's nose with a box I can't tell a judge, 'listen I'm not the criminal, the decision I made to throw the punch was the real criminal', I mean what sort of twisted logic is that?

Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 03/10/2014 12:30:14    1659696

Lads there are no bad people, only people who do bad things.;-)

Westfester (Limerick) - Posts: 944 - 03/10/2014 13:10:11    1659718

Htaem
County: Meath
Posts: 5796

1659696 carlowman

He called the decision 'criminal' not the man. A very big difference.

Ha ye but hold on a second, Barry Kelly made the 'criminal' decision so isn't the criminal then? I mean if I commit a crime by say breaking someone's nose with a box I can't tell a judge, 'listen I'm not the criminal, the decision I made to throw the punch was the real criminal', I mean what sort of twisted logic is that?

Ever hear the expression, "figure of speech"? I'm sure most people would have used the expression "criminal defending", for example, when speaking of a particularly inept defensive performance. I don't think they literally mean that the hapless defender(s) in question are actual criminals.

Serious amount of mock-offence going on here.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 03/10/2014 13:14:46    1659725

Ballydalane

Listen I'm not particularly pc and so I'm not overly concerned about the word criminal, I know Cody didn't mean it literally I just think what he had to say was in very poor taste after winning the AI. Also what do you make of his comment about never saying anything about referees?

Htaem (Meath) - Posts: 8657 - 03/10/2014 14:34:41    1659781

Htaem
County: Meath
Posts: 5797

1659781 Ballydalane

Listen I'm not particularly pc and so I'm not overly concerned about the word criminal, I know Cody didn't mean it literally I just think what he had to say was in very poor taste after winning the AI. Also what do you make of his comment about never saying anything about referees?

Well yeah, I'd agree that his comments last Sunday or whenever contradict that quote he gave from 5 years ago, no doubt about that. But in general I don't think he had, up to last week, made comments about specific referees. Refereeing, yes, quite often, but not individual refs. That's why last week's comments have created such a stir, because they were relating to a particular ref.

As for the use of the word "criminal", as a high profile manager he probably needs to be more careful about the vocabulary and terminology he uses than the average fan on the street.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1246 - 03/10/2014 16:38:31    1659841