Muck I'm genuinely worried for our game that was an embarrassment of a final , rugby league at it's best hand pass after hand pass complete rubbish. When you hear jack o Shea giving out after Kerry won then you know we've a problem.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9926 - 21/09/2014 21:07:38    1654881

PoolSturgeon
County: Galway
Posts: 94

1654816
Ye would want to have heard Jack O'Shea on radio 1 a short while ago. He said the way the game was played today is not the game he wants to see and he said there should be a rule introduced to outlaw short kick outs..that a kick out has to travel a certain distance or else it's penalised (on the basis that the short kick out eliminates high fielding, one of the best skills in the game). When one of the best players of all time is finding gaelic football hard to watch sometimes, you know the game is in trouble. It's a game that lost me a long time ago
..would only watch it on the telly nowadays, and only when it comes to All Ire semi final stage. As for the argument that the full house today proves gaelic football is in a healthy state, it doesnt hold water in my opinion.When a county reaches an All Ireland final, every event junky in that county wants to be there...but the event junkies wont be there for the first round championship game and they probably wont look at a game again until their county reaches the final again. And for sure, games like today will do nothing to encourage them to become more regular supporters of the game

Jack O'Se said Ciaran Kilkenny was only a junior footballer last year so I wouldn't read too much into anything he says. Jack himself dropped into a more defensive position in the second half of the 1982 all ireland final which contributed to Kerry losing that match

Did he blame Kerry for some of short kickouts in the game.Games like today won't encourage people to watch Gaelic Football but games like the semi finals will.I noticed you disappeared when those matches were on

uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts: 1296 - 21/09/2014 21:25:23    1654899

In all honestly the game was torture to watch, there was as many handpasses during the game as there was people in Croke Park, it will be remembered as the worse final ever, in time it will be shunned like the final of '83 between Dublin and Galway where 3 or 4 red cards were shown. Is the future of our game bleak? No, Kerry showed at the start of the game that if you pump the ball quickly into the fullforward line then you bypass the blanket defense by going over it, Kerry got their 1st goal and should have scored more in 1st half with that tactic. In the semi Dublin carried the ball to the Donegal 45m line before kicking for a score and it gave time for Donegal to get men back behind the ball. Both teams today just chocked the life out of the game. Quick, long, direct ball will beat any defensive setup. Dublin, Cork, Mayo, Donegal, Kerry have all shown that if you play attacking football then the game is miles better and beats any defensive system, it's when some teams do this and immediately run back to midfield to run the defensive setup that this horrible plays happen, ie Donegal. Think and play positively and all will be well or some rubbish like that

riverboys (Mayo) - Posts: 1389 - 21/09/2014 21:28:14    1654905

Time to start showing respect for ulster! Mickey harte and tyrone drove this game into the professional levels it ia it today! Personally I enjoyed the game, not just because kerry won but because every score meant something! To get a acore to day it took hard graft and smarts to create the space! A free for all shoot out just looks childish!

We saw a well fought profeasional game today, both teams were in serious condition! Think it should be applauded!

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 21/09/2014 21:29:42    1654908

All,
A few points
Delighted with number 37 - winning the All Ireland is what it is all about. It's not all about playing beautiful football all of the time.

However, that game today was pretty poor in fairness. Yes, I loved it, yes, I was enthralled but that's because I was so emotionally involved. If I was sitting at home I'd have been disappointed with the way the sport has gone.

What happened -

The 2 teams were set up as mirror images of each other. Basically by sticking 12 players in defense you end up with 25 players in 1 half rather than 13. Doubling the players reduces the 'green field' space to a half, yes. But really it reduces the functional space to a third or so and it massively reduces the time to think.

It's not difficult to perfect. It's not a 'system'. It's simply a defensive counterattacking strategy. It works throughout numerous sports. It's very effective and will drastically curtail scoring but it's shockingly boring.

We heard all week and for the last 10 years about commitment, belief, unity, systems, honesty, mental toughness, etc etc. None of which are skills of Gaelic football by the way and each could be easily accredited to a good sales & marketing team or a bunch of political activists. Presume now that both teams have the same level of each of these qualities and the same tactics. What then? The best team of footballers will win. Donegal were bigger and Kerry were more aggressive so all square there. Donegal hit the post for a goal and Kerry hit the post for three points. All square there. 1 goalkeeping error for a goal and 3 disciplinary errors resulting in frees being moved forward 10 metres and into within scoring distances. All square again. What won it was the slightly more positive ethos from Kerry which in my opinion was down to the footballers themselves being more naturally attacking minded or gifted.

What will happen next - hopefully teams will develop a plan to counteract the counterattacking tactics. Doubt it though. It's all about space.

Football has gone down this route and IMO the only way to be certain of changing is to move to 13 men.

Up the Kingdom. Hard luck Donegal.

thykingdomcome1 (Kerry) - Posts: 78 - 21/09/2014 21:34:06    1654913

lads calm down
tactics systems itas all mind games
seriously if dublin had of taken their goal chances against donegal like they did against monghan
mcguinnes could have used all the tactics in the world and wouldnt have mattered
just like today kerry couldnt have planned for durcan kicking the ball terribly into donaghys hands
so you can play all your systems and tactics but it all comes down to what happens between the lines on the day

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 21/09/2014 21:35:49    1654915

so was this puke football????

cuchulainn35 (Armagh) - Posts: 1676 - 21/09/2014 21:58:25    1654937

You can talk about systems and formations all you like but the bottom line is you have to be able to kick pass the ball. Donegal didn't do that. The only time any of their players kicked the ball was to solo or take a shot at goal. Unbelievable shite football this hand passing game.

dirtybag (Cavan) - Posts: 242 - 22/09/2014 08:29:16    1654945

M Murphy was clobbered very early on and as a result was carrying an injury for most of the game which made a difference to his contributions from open play. Of course, it may have been accidental. Although D Walsh's clothes-line foul in the 3rd minute was the stand-out foul in the game and surprisingly no card was produced. Donaghy can't run anymore but is still value for money due to having sticky hands and an eye for a half chance. He was the difference for Kerry.

essmac (Tyrone) - Posts: 1141 - 22/09/2014 08:30:17    1654947

Can we please consign the detestable term "puke football" to the dustbin once and for all. There is no such thing, there is only football, a game that can be played more than just one way and thats the beauty of it.

brendtheredhand (Tyrone) - Posts: 10897 - 22/09/2014 08:58:12    1654963

The best way to improve the game is by changing rules to get the game we want. Football rules are very different know than they were 30 years ago.
What are the best skills in the game?
1. Kick passing
2. Long range points
3. High fielding

What are the worst things in Gaelic football

1. Cynical play
2. Over use of the handpass
3. Blanket defences

Numerous rule changes had been tried to improve the game but they rarely get a chance to work.
This would be my rule changes.

1. Limit the use of the handpass - no more than 4 consecutively - (counted by forth official who radios ref)
2. All kickouts past the 45m line and a mark for a clean catch
3. Draw a radius on the pitch 35m out from the goal and all scores outside that get 2 points
4. 4 points for a goal
5. Use a 10min sin bin instead of the black card, three sinbins per match results in forfeit of match and refs to actually implement rules
6. Bring ball forward 50m for any delaying to restarts and sinbin player
7. Red card for 3 man into any row
8. Free kick for man in possession when tackled by 3 players or more

tirawleybaron (Mayo) - Posts: 1134 - 22/09/2014 09:32:55    1654978

I've attended a good number of finals and have seen worse than yesterday. 1980, 1983 and Kerry's mauling of Mayo and Cork in 2006 and 2007 spring to mind. Yesterday's game was a defensive tactical battle, and wasn't pretty. The ref allowed a lot of cynicism early on (e.g the targeting of Michael Murphy off the ball) and that set the tone. Players are quick to judge what a ref allows, and generally react accordingly. So, no, football isn't in serious trouble. Two great semi-finals were followed by a not-so-great final...we'll see better games, but we'll also see worse ones.

football first (None) - Posts: 1259 - 22/09/2014 10:18:09    1655037

I have seen loads of worse finals so just put that to one side. I enjoyed the game because it was a real 70 minute affair, both sides were guilty of unforced errors, mostly Donegal.
If every attack yields a poloroid moment then that would get old fast too. The individual thing won in the end as the "system" failed. KD made the interception that can happen in any game, if the Donegal kickouts were any good they would have easily won.

suckvalleypaddy (Galway) - Posts: 1674 - 22/09/2014 10:28:40    1655061

People should really get a grip here. It wasn't a quality final but then sometimes they never are. Teams have always been defensive as log as I can remember wing forwards have always been dropping back, corner forwards as well depending on how the game was going. If blanket defenses only came in recently then cast back to the 1980 AI final and a scoreline of 1.9 - 1.6. 1990 11 points to 9. Looking back over the years where teams are evenly matched the games have had fewer scores, some people would say thats because the teams cancelled each other out, which is really another way of saying defenses were on top.
All the skills were there yesterday in both the minor and senior games. You cannot change the rules to make the game more interesting or have more scores, you change the rules to eliminate unfair play, dangerous play or where the current rules just don't make sense - its up to the teams that go on the field to play the game and as long as they play within the rules of fair play let them off.

zinny (Wexford) - Posts: 1805 - 22/09/2014 10:29:25    1655062

Congrats to Kerry on a well deserved win yesterday. As to the topic, I think there were about 3 decent entertaining football games this year. Yesterday's game was hard to watch due to the number of silly mistakes, which often tends to happen in finals. Yesterday's effort wouldn't encourage anyone to go watch a match never mind take up the sport. As I've said before the overall quality of football throughout the country is poor. At IC level at the moment, I would say that there are 26-27 counties which are not remotely close to levels required to compete, and I'd include Meath in that number.

moylagh (Meath) - Posts: 484 - 22/09/2014 10:52:49    1655082

Gaelic football is absolutely fine.

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13650 - 22/09/2014 11:02:01    1655098

If we are to judge gaelic football on most all ireland finals, then yes it looks terrible. But audit the game over the course of the champoinship and you will see some great games.

Is a game good if it is very one sided with sublime skill played by the winning team, or if it is close and tense, error ridden and relatively low scoring? that is the core issue in my book.

Donegalman (None) - Posts: 3830 - 22/09/2014 11:19:06    1655118

you never see any high fielding from kickouts now on TV anyway as they are too busy showing endless replays of mundane shots at goal that they always miss the kickouts.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 22/09/2014 11:20:25    1655122

To keep any sport going there have to be players that kids want to copy - somebody that after they watch they will go out in the garden and pretend to be them. We know JoD and Michael Murphy are both this type of player, but the system completely takes them out of the game. Was there a single player or piece of individual brilliance yesterday that a kid playing at school today will try to copy? Other than a handful of decent points kicked I don't think so. Instead they are more likely to be trying to copy the outrageous piece of skill Di Maria had for Manchester United yesterday. That is why woeful matches like we had yesterday are so bad for the future of the game.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 22/09/2014 11:49:20    1655154

for goodness we don't need any more rule changes we just need to existing rules implemented.
there are rules which the refs are not implementing. I had to laugh at an Uachtarán CLG Liam O'Neill last night on TSG when asked what his abiding memory of the year was and he said the black card and how it was working and improving the game... leading to better games with more scores.. what a joke. perhaps he should remind the referees that the black card is still in existence.

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 22/09/2014 12:03:32    1655178