I'm looking for clarification on the black card. Or one rule. Is it a free or a black card to block the runner after he unloads the ball ?

red1980 (Donegal) - Posts: 106 - 26/08/2014 13:41:39    1642255

red1980 its a black Card

chriscart580 (Meath) - Posts: 376 - 26/08/2014 13:47:16    1642260

There is one thing no one can take from you Master and that's your bizarre ability to deduce anything from simple statements. What I said was quite simple and easy to understand it has nothing to do with lesser players deserving differential treatment. With reputation and ability to have big impacts on games comes responsibility. Keegan let his teammates down by doing something he undoubtably regrets and will learn a huge lesson from. Any player could have seen red under similar circumstances but my point is I would expect more of my established players whom my gameplan relies heavily upon.

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 26/08/2014 13:50:24    1642265

Should be a black card and a free if there is no advantage from the play.
If there is an advantage play will continue but the ref should go back and show a black card to the offending player.

GAAHattrick (Dublin) - Posts: 278 - 26/08/2014 13:56:57    1642272

Red1980

Category II Infractions - Cynical Behaviour
5.10 To deliberately pull down an opponent.
5.11 To deliberately trip an opponent with hand(s), arm,
leg or foot.
5.12 To deliberately body collide with an opponent after
he has played the ball away or for the purpose of
taking him out of the movement of play.
5.13 To remonstrate in an aggressive manner with a
Match Official..
PENALTY FOR THE ABOVE FOULS -
(i) Order the offender off by showing him a
Black Card.
(ii) Allow a replacement from within the
substitutions permitted in Rule 2.4, Rules
of Specification.
(iii) Free kick from where the foul occurred
except as provided under Exceptions of
Rule 2.2.

In most cases rule 5.12 is clear however, as with any rule that requires the ref to interpit the thought of the player there can be grey areas.

ExiledinDublin (Mayo) - Posts: 131 - 26/08/2014 13:58:00    1642273

@red1980 - black card. The wording of the 3rd category of cynical foul regarding 'deliberate body collide' doesn't spell out exactly what constitutes such an instance, hence my earlier comment. However, there is a video with Coldrick and McEneaney providing examples of such instances and what you mention would be a black card.

Ailteoir (Galway) - Posts: 861 - 26/08/2014 14:05:33    1642279

If everyone was being honest i dont see how any genuine gaa fans could think keegan should have got a red, the letter of the law, by the letter of the law in ireland until 2006 someone dressed as a witch for Halloween would be facing a year in prison, almost as ridiculous as his red card, and punishment almost as harsh as him missing for the all ireland final if it wasnt for it being a draw.

Mayofc (Mayo) - Posts: 95 - 26/08/2014 14:09:57    1642286

Master

You're speaking out of both sides of your mouth. Keegan kicked out. After the whistle had gone. In front of Coldrick. I accept it was with minimal force and no ill intent but the rules state it's a red card offence and at the moment and he has to walk. There's nothing in the rule book about common sense or if a foul is committed that is in keeping with 'spirit of game' . I am happy for Keegan that it was a draw so he won't potentially miss an AI Final. Below is your response to a poster earlier in the year about a similar action.

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 11775
31/03/2014 17:43:26

for someone to think he can get away with kicking another player is quite unbelieveable. The rules apply to him the same as everyone else.

A

Aido69 (Dublin) - Posts: 381 - 26/08/2014 14:17:21    1642290

"If everyone was being honest i dont see how any genuine gaa fans could think keegan should have got a red,"
Keegan petulantly kicked out. He made a mistake that could in another match he could have got away with. If he got away with it doesn't make it right. He is a great player and this is very unfortunate for him as he always gives everything, but IMO the ref let the match get away from him in the previous few minutes and frustration was creeping in on both sides as to what type of tackle was deemed a free or not. It ended up with the Red card. I can see how it happened but you cant condone it.

cavan97 (Cavan) - Posts: 369 - 26/08/2014 14:23:52    1642299

mayo_123
County: Mayo
Posts: 5

1641870
aidan o shea was fouled all day and didnt get many frees his way .Refs win and lose games awful to see the effort by both teams yesterday been shadowed by bad refering they really need to get theses refs singing of the same sheet black cards seemed to have been done away with by some refs they can go to hawk eye for scores surely the same could be done for big decisions in games when ref is not sure

Stats dont agree with you
Mayo scored 1.5 from placed balls while kerry scored 2 ??
Yer penalty was questionable for me as from what i saw it was shoulder to shoulder and vaughan made a meal of it

thought the ref had a great game and dont think mayo can complain about the free count

ritchie (Cork) - Posts: 346 - 26/08/2014 14:25:50    1642301

What's the problem here? The Mayo fella kicked out at his opponent right in front of the referee and the rules quite clearly say that this is a red care offence; he didn't give the referee an option. However given the nonsense over the black card and the way officials are not implementing it properly leaves people in doubt as to how rules are being interpreted. As someone else said does anyone really believe a Dublin player would have been sent off in similar circumstances? Not in a million years if games involving them this year are anything to go by.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9703 - 26/08/2014 14:34:29    1642308

seany, what you expect from your established players has nothing to do with getting a red card. Every player gets the same treatment, established or not. That is how it works, so frankly, what baring does the fact that he was established have on getting a red card?


Aido, keegan didn't kick anyone, cluxton kicked a guy who was walking away from him. The only thing the two incidents have in common is that both got red cards.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 26/08/2014 14:47:20    1642317

ritchie
County: Cork
Yer penalty was questionable for me as from what i saw it was shoulder to shoulder and vaughan made a meal of it

That is pure bull and well you know it. Donie was through on goal, why would he go down? He was pushed, watch it again. I really do wonder at people sometimes.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11232 - 26/08/2014 14:53:43    1642320

Master

From the GAA's website

Immediate Ordering Off Infractions (Red Cards)

Kicking or attempting to kick with minimal force or with force or causing injury.

Keegan was sent off for exactly the same reason.

UM
your talking thru your hoop.

A.

Aido69 (Dublin) - Posts: 381 - 26/08/2014 15:01:57    1642332

It's about expectations master. It's something that holds through in all walks of life. You expect your established players to set an example in the same way you expect leaders in organisations to set an example. Managers give players responsibility under the assumption that they can handle it. A red card for Keegan and a petulant 18 year old out of minor means the same thing in terms of punishment but I doubt many will argue that Keegan should of known better. And if I was from Mayo I would expect better as if Mayo are to finally land the big one I'd imagine he will be central to it.

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 26/08/2014 15:21:45    1642347

TheMaster
County: Mayo
Posts: 11776

1642317 seany, what you expect from your established players has nothing to do with getting a red card. Every player gets the same treatment, established or not. That is how it works, so frankly, what baring does the fact that he was established have on getting a red card?


Aido, keegan didn't kick anyone, cluxton kicked a guy who was walking away from him. The only thing the two incidents have in common is that both got red cards.


your both funny and predictable , who on here and I mean WHO is supprised at your stance , No-ONE , your in danger of becoming a caricature similar to Ulsterman which is a pity for you can talk sense when not wearing your county glasses .
In the words of Forest stupid is as stupid does , Ref should never have had a decision to make .

Damothedub (Dublin) - Posts: 5193 - 26/08/2014 15:31:38    1642360

An Ulsterman does it and people would be calling for his head. He kicked out - 100% right decision by the ref. He did however cow out of a black card later in the game.

Brolly (Monaghan) - Posts: 4472 - 26/08/2014 15:33:52    1642364

Consistency, Consistency, Consistency. That is the problem folks. The question that should be asked is, why did the ref not apply the rules in the incident where Mayo could (should?) have had a penalty in the first half? Ok people will say he played the advantage and the shot was put wide but then where does the advantage start or stop? Had the keeper not pulled back the arm of O'Connor (think thats who it was) then he wouldn't have been falling and he probably would have put the ball inside the post instead of outside it. But even if he did play the advantage then if there was no advantage, which there clearly wasn't, then why was it not pulled back, pnealty given and the black card issued?

Thing is, Mayo have no right to complain over the fact that Keegan got a red card as he put himself in the position of giving the referee the decision to issue the red. What Mayo do have a right to complain about though is that there were other examples of rule breaks which were Black Card (and maybe even red card) offences yet no action was taken.

Referees can't decide that they are going to apply the rules to the letter one moment and not the next yet this has been happening in many games this year. That is why at the start of the year and the debate about the black card I said that they need to sort out ruling by the rules which are in place already before they start introducing new ones and that consistency in the application was the biggest problem not necessarily the rules.

Offside_Rule (Antrim) - Posts: 4058 - 26/08/2014 15:35:52    1642366

But that is the gaa website aido, not my words. Therefore no, Im not talking out the two sides of my mouth like you said, because those are not my words. I see a big difference between what keegan done and what cluxton done, frankly because there is one. What keegan done was something similar to what McCauley did in the laois match - he got a yellow for that by the way.

People so keen to get the card upheld because of the cluxton incident are pretty sad. A repeat performance from cluxton on sunday might have a whole lot talking out both sides of their mouths I would think.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 26/08/2014 15:43:02    1642373

seany, expectations of particular players over others don't have a bearing on how a game is officiated. All players are supposed to be given the same treatment, therefore, and again I state, being a senior player doesn't mean you get different treatment from the ref compared to a guy on his debut. The point is wrong.

TheMaster (Mayo) - Posts: 16187 - 26/08/2014 15:45:06    1642375