I think there's a big gap between the optimism of Cavan posters and the general feeling of Cavan supporters who go to all the games both senior and U21. Most people I meet at games are happy that we have built a defence that is solid because we had one of the worst in the country until last year. Midfield has been patchy but at last we have Gearoid McKiernan back from injury so some better prospects there. As for the forwards a lot of this is alien to Cavan football and it's hard to watch. We have come a long way in 12 months or so but we have a hell of a longer way to go to get up to top level. The best we can hope for is that we get a nucleus of a senior team from all these U-21 teams. As several posters pointed out it takes years to reach that and I think we're looking at 3 more years or so to make it that far. At that stage our game will have changed like Donegal's did in 2012 because you can't spend all day defending in numbers. We won a lot of tight games in the last year at both levels but we did it by reverting to our more traditional football which is hard and direct - a bit like Meath when they're going well. That's what I saw even last Wednesday night when we stopped playing "parlour" football and attacked Donegal straight down the middle. If we're going to win anything at senior level we'll be mixing our game an awful lot more than at present.

RoyalBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 198 - 11/04/2014 11:14:24    1573710

Well said Royal Blue. We are like An Post!!!!!!
We're not there yet but we're getting there :)

cavan97 (Cavan) - Posts: 369 - 11/04/2014 11:21:33    1573720

RoyalBlue,

Exactly. I for one think the current approach is simply a means to an end, to get us used to winning, and it is working so far. Considering where we were for the last 10 years, it was awful, Cavan football was at its lowest ever ebb, but that is changing at last, because as someone said already Cavan are traditionally among the greats of Gaelic football, and thats where we want to get back to. I can't see us persisting with this system for much longer. It does take its toll on players physically. And you are quite correct, when we revert back to what we know best, we do tend to bury teams i.e. the last 5 minutes against Donegal the other evening. We don't run up big scores, but we kill of a game in minutes.

The very fact this is causing such a debate shows others are taking notice.

Ned_Stormcrow (Cavan) - Posts: 1071 - 11/04/2014 12:02:37    1573738

DD10
County: Cavan
in reply to Galway and Down examples of u21 not translating...... show me 4 in a row provincial in either case?

mayo won four Connacht u21 in a row 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009 including the All Ireland in 2006. Ok you can say Mayo are one of the top teams in the country but we have not managed to cross the finish line (yet).

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11232 - 11/04/2014 12:11:15    1573742

Wow.

It's amazing how some ignorant, uninformed comments from Joe Brolly has created a narrative for Cavan football at all levels being completely negative and defensive in style. This is not the case no matter how much anecdotal evidence is provided by the likes of shaggylegend and others who have, like Brolly, rarely seen us in action, if at all.

Make up your own minds or say nothing at all.

THE FUTURE IS BLUE.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 11/04/2014 12:22:45    1573747

yew_tree

if Cavan get to where Mayo are currently I'd be delighted !!

Mayo are contenders at AI level
Mayo are serial provincial winners

In Cavans case as I said above I think provincial winners - yes, AI winners - no

also Mayo were adding to a decent senior team with those U21s.......whereas Cavan from the 2010 U21s forward were adding to nothing (a borderline div3/div4 set up)

DD10 (Cavan) - Posts: 130 - 11/04/2014 12:24:15    1573749

have my doubts on cavan for 2014. ulster is so tough this year, armagh, tyrone, monaghan, donegal, derry, down and cavan all knocking on the door.. need somting special this year and a rub of the green. as a pster said already, the defensive game we play is very hard on the body, can it be sustained year in year out?

sammaguire1 (Cavan) - Posts: 279 - 11/04/2014 12:45:02    1573762

I think people are being harsh on our forwards ok they haven't set the world alight but dillion has three goals in four games and take into consideration the conditions in the Tyrone and monaghan matches also all the teams we played have senior teams that will all be in division One next year so we are doing something right up cavan ;-)

sidelineview (Cavan) - Posts: 109 - 11/04/2014 12:53:48    1573766

Since the start of 2013 I have seen Cavan play Monaghan in the league, Meath in the league, Armagh,Monaghan and Fermanagh twice in the ulster championship and the qualifier in breffni. I was also present at both under 21 games between Cavan and Monaghan. So I can pass my judgement on what I have seen, Cavan operate with two forwards in Dunne and Keating with everyone else dropping back in the game against Armagh last year Cavan started the game with 9 backs on the field. With Mackey and McDermott dropping back, so by simple maths that means 2 forwards in Dunne and Keating. This theme was similar in the games against Fermanagh and Monaghan in the championship.

shaggylegend (Monaghan) - Posts: 1928 - 11/04/2014 12:59:26    1573771

Since the start of 2013 I have seen Cavan play Monaghan in the league, Meath in the league, Armagh,Monaghan and Fermanagh twice in the ulster championship and the qualifier in breffni. I was also present at both under 21 games between Cavan and Monaghan. So I can pass my judgement on what I have seen, Cavan operate with two forwards in Dunne and Keating with everyone else dropping back in the game against Armagh last year Cavan started the game with 9 backs on the field. With Mackey and McDermott dropping back, so by simple maths that means 2 forwards in Dunne and Keating. This theme was similar in the games against Fermanagh and Monaghan in the championship.

shaggylegend (Monaghan) - Posts: 1928 - 11/04/2014 13:07:26    1573775

DD10 - I see your point, Cavan probably need to get into Division 1 asap and win and Ulster title or two, then ye can think about higher honors. I wish ye well, great supporters and like ourselves Cavan is a football mad county with a great history.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11232 - 11/04/2014 13:45:47    1573796

Cavans u-21 teams have all played to the same gamplan, and akin to Donegal in 2012 they have developed a strong system within a team that wouldn't have great individuals. The other thing is that this kind of defensive game is more suited to the late winter/ear;y spring months. On top of that, u-21 is not taken as seriously in any county as minor football is for example. I believe that you see your counties real worth with the talent coming through at minor level where the games come down to pure football.

geoff (Tyrone) - Posts: 377 - 11/04/2014 14:38:22    1573819

Shaggylegend : You seem to take an awfuil lot of interest in Cavan. Have you nothing good to say about us? You continually berate us at every opportunity. Do you not think it is a modest achievement to win 4 Ulster title in a row? How about wininning 7 out of 7 in the Lge?
You talk about when we played Monagahn in the League and Championship last year. Were you at the games because if you were you were at a different game to me and most people.
Cavan beat Moanaghan comprehensively in the Lge in Breffni Park. We were far better than ye on the night!
In the championship we played very well and were much the better team in the first 20 mins. OK Monaghan got the goal and played with a lot more confidence from then on. But remember we could and should have equalised had Marty Duffy done his job in the last few minutes. Fair enough the same Mr.Duffy missed a blatant penalty for Monagahan in 1st half.
And fair play to Monaghan who went on and hammered Donegal in the final. And I and most Cavan people cheered ye on and also aginst Tyrone in Croker for your great football.
So find it in your heart (if you have one)to say something decent about your neighbours!!!!!

Brownred (Cavan) - Posts: 229 - 11/04/2014 14:47:10    1573824

Cavan have quite a distance to go to be competing with the top teams in Ulster. They need to expand on their style of play and actually try to play football. The muck they threw up in the first half of the All Ireland Quarters against Kerry last year was the worst football I've ever witnessed. Maybe they have improved and their continued U21 success wouldn lead you to believe that they can be contenders for Ulster title in next few years. But they do need to change their playing style to achieve this.

pdempsey (Mayo) - Posts: 1313 - 11/04/2014 15:19:09    1573835

Brownred the missed penalty in that game was crucial. Had that been given and scored then allied to Monaghan's goal Cavan would have been behind by a significant margin. Cavan's system is Donegal mark 2 without Donegal's forwards. Things are moving very well for Cavan and the future does look bright. However the system as it is played is too inflexible and once ye go behind ye could be in serious bother. It has worked very well so far this year. However Cavan have played two Division One teams namely Kerry and Tyrone in the last nine months and both of them have destroyed ye.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 11/04/2014 15:27:13    1573837

Calm down lads. I'm as big a Cavan man as the next but this is getting annoying.

Only time will tell whether we will win Ulster or not. My own opinion is that we need to mature physically and get a more potent forward line. It is also an awful pity Johnston did what he did.

ArminTamzarian (Cavan) - Posts: 66 - 11/04/2014 15:43:34    1573844

No doubt you were at the McKenna Cup final 'Greengrass'?

GallantJohnJoe (Cavan) - Posts: 329 - 11/04/2014 15:45:05    1573845

getting boring now.....

Goeff...this Cavan U21 team also won Minor Ulster
greengrass....."hammering" ??? ..... you should know the exact definition of this is 4 pts a hammering in Louth terms?

DD10 (Cavan) - Posts: 130 - 11/04/2014 15:50:24    1573854

Greengrass
County: Louth
Posts: 3020

1573837
Brownred the missed penalty in that game was crucial. Had that been given and scored then allied to Monaghan's goal Cavan would have been behind by a significant margin. Cavan's system is Donegal mark 2 without Donegal's forwards. Things are moving very well for Cavan and the future does look bright. However the system as it is played is too inflexible and once ye go behind ye could be in serious bother. It has worked very well so far this year. However Cavan have played two Division One teams namely Kerry and Tyrone in the last nine months and both of them have destroyed ye.

We beat Derry and Tyrone did not destroy us.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 11/04/2014 15:59:27    1573869

This is a young team with good U21's to come in and compete for places. I'm in a happy place. 7 out of 7 in the league and an Ulster U21. It's not sexy football I agree but we have been on the wrong end of close scorelines for so long that its a nice feeling to turn the screw. Could it be prettier? Absolutely. But we are a work in progress and will continue to develop and once the experience and trust is there we will attack more.

Also, when we do (please god) win that All Ireland then we will put the hands in the pockets and buy ye all a pint because we are the most daaaaaycent people in the country!

Reformation (Cavan) - Posts: 356 - 11/04/2014 16:42:26    1573894