Won't last more than two years in it's current form. Will have to be changed or scrapped.

RebelCork (Cork) - Posts: 789 - 02/01/2014 21:47:28    1527074

Before a ball is thrown in we already have the controversy of the year waiting to happen.I do agree that something has to be done about cynical fouling but I don't think the current version of the black card is the way forward,in typically Irish fashion we are overdoing it here imo.This will be the biggest change to the way our games are played than even the introduction of the "blanket defence".
My fear is that the pysicality will be taken out of the game which is one of the things we love about the game.
While the idea is to open up play so that we get spectacles like the dublin/kerry shootout semi last year,I think the weaker teams who do not posses the same potency upfront will pack their defences instead to give themselves a realistic chance of winning because thats all that matters once you enter the field,winning!
The biggest fear I have above all others is how the referees implement the new rule,consistency has been a problem here for a long time and this just adds to the problem,as the rule states "it's the referees interpretation" I don't want to bash refs because thats not my adgenda but I'm just saying!
I think a yellow for the offence and ten mins in the sin bin would be a better/more appropriate punishment,effecively a tug on the jersey is carrying the same punisment as a punch or kick which are leagues apart in seriousness imo.

I hope I'm completely wrong and it works well but I have my reservations!!

DL (Donegal) - Posts: 210 - 04/01/2014 09:15:12    1527565

There will definitely be teething problems with this, there will be controversy too especially is players are sent to the line in big games. But in the long run, if the law is administered properly, those fouls listed should in the main be eradicated. I don't see how the game could lose any physicality, players can be as physical as the law allows.

Whats been addressed is the equivalent of the professional foul in other sports. It will still exist, but players will now know the risks.

For whats it worth i actually don't think the law goes far enough as nothing has been done to cater for end of match fouls such as the one famously highlighted seen last year that prevent scoring chances. These actions should incur suspensions but although i can see this introduced, it will be some time yet!

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 04/01/2014 16:18:20    1527647

Tomsmith here

Did youse all notice the charm offensive by the pro-Black card brigade on Sunday evening and all day Monday.
It sure was a hard sell by them of a rule that will not work in small clubs playing in Div 3 and 4 in its current manner

tomsmith (Cavan) - Posts: 3861 - 07/01/2014 15:18:25    1528581

Tom do these small clubs and Division 3 and 4 teams have many players who deliberately pull and drag opponents to the ground, verbally abuse referees and verbally abuse opposing players? And do these lads, by doing these things, contribute in a positive or negative way to the club and the GAA as a whole? The purpose of the black card is to prevent all these things taking place, if it ends up costing a team a win or two it wont be long before these lads are made correct their ways by fellow gaels within these small clubs. There will always be yellow cards in games because it is a fast and physical sport and sometimes players will mistime challenges or push the boundaries too often through nothing more than eagerness. However I would say that after a short while the black card will be nearly as rare as the straight red.

Soma (UK) - Posts: 2630 - 07/01/2014 16:12:31    1528614

I firmly believe this will be one of the biggest own goals to ever hit the GAA. There will be so many incidents of "why was this a black and that wasn't?" that controversy will permanently dominate the game for the foreseeable future. Already there have been many talking points from last weekend's games and disagreement over cards so what happens when National League points and Championship games are up for grabs? If people deny that refs will be under pressure not to give black cards to the big sides in the big games they are deluded.

Ulsterman (Antrim) - Posts: 9706 - 07/01/2014 18:31:48    1528683

Tomsmith here

Ulsterman if the charm offensive continues as it has in the Mc Kenna cup and the O Byrne cup this new rule may win you over.
But wait until the League starts and managers start loosing player I hope that the PR people are available to defend it.
But don't say youse have not been told, by lots of people on Hoganstand and in particular by Tomsmith

tomsmith (Cavan) - Posts: 3861 - 17/01/2014 14:17:42    1533040

Tomsmith

The attached report says it all
Black card blunder in Killarney
23 January 2014


Black cardGaelic football's new black card rule caused controversy in a schools games yesterday.

Dingle's Barra O Suilleabhain was issued with both a yellow and a black card during his side's extra-time defeat of Colaiste Chriost Ri in the Corn Ui Mhuiri quarter-final at Killarney yesterday.

Under the new rule, that equates to a red card but referee Kevin Walsh allowed the Kerry school to replace the midfielder.

Chriost Ri selector Ephie Fitzgerald - a former Cork minor football manager - explained to the Irish Daily Star: "Their midfielder got yellow-carded in the first half, maybe after 20 minutes.

"Then after ten or 12 minutes of the second half, he got a black card. We pointed it out to the linesman, but the referee was having none of it.

"I said to him at the time and I said it to him after the game. The referee's attitude to me was 'I'll send you to the stand if you don't go away'.

"And I wasn't being in any way aggressive, I was just asking the question, which I was disappointed

tomsmith (Cavan) - Posts: 3861 - 23/01/2014 14:15:08    1535646

07/01/2014 15:18:25 tomsmith
Did youse all notice the charm offensive by the pro-Black card brigade on Sunday evening and all day Monday.
It sure was a hard sell by them of a rule that will not work in small clubs playing in Div 3 and 4 in its current manner you dont have to type tomsmith here at top of every post we all know who is posting by looking to the left of our computer screens etc
This rule will work in smaller clubs and bigger clubs. Teams will have to improve how they play if they are consistently getting black cards
07/01/2014 16:12:31 Soma
Tom do these small clubs and Division 3 and 4 teams have many players who deliberately pull and drag opponents to the ground, verbally abuse referees and verbally abuse opposing players? And do these lads, by doing these things, contribute in a positive or negative way to the club and the GAA as a whole? The purpose of the black card is to prevent all these things taking place, if it ends up costing a team a win or two it wont be long before these lads are made correct their ways by fellow gaels within these small clubs. There will always be yellow cards in games because it is a fast and physical sport and sometimes players will mistime challenges or push the boundaries too often through nothing more than eagerness. However I would say that after a short while the black card will be nearly as rare as the straight red. good post.
07/01/2014 18:31:48
Ulsterman
I firmly believe this will be one of the biggest own goals to ever hit the GAA. There will be so many incidents of "why was this a black and that wasn't?" that controversy will permanently dominate the game for the foreseeable future. Already there have been many talking points from last weekend's games and disagreement over cards so what happens when National League points and Championship games are up for grabs? If people deny that refs will be under pressure not to give black cards to the big sides in the big games they are deluded.rubbish. what would you do to try halt cynicism then?

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 23/01/2014 15:16:48    1535709

first major talking point of new black card rule
http://www.hoganstand.com/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=208160

kerryluck (Kerry) - Posts: 2517 - 24/01/2014 12:06:53    1536079

No problem with black card with the game in Kerry. It seems to be a genuine referee error which if proves to be the point the board in charge will remix the game which is right thing to do. The black card was brought in to help clean up our game and for me seems to be doing that. Any games I have watched are more open and good to watch. It was always going to have a few teething problems at the start which this seems to be one. But great thing is others learn from mistakes and they don't happen again which is going to be the thing with this rule. It doesn't need detractors looking for reason to be rid it should be given all the time it needs to see if it has the desired affect on our games and if not then looked at. A winter competition and league will not be sufficient for that. Teams will get used to it and stop fouling eventually and then we have a cleaner more watchable game

urhavinalaugh (Carlow) - Posts: 73 - 24/01/2014 14:37:01    1536167

All sounds very embarrassing for the referee. One of the basics a ref should know following the introduction of the black card. That decision is up there with the ref who allowed the Meath goal against Louth.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7888 - 24/01/2014 14:50:01    1536172

legendzxix
County: Kerry
Posts: 2804

1536172
All sounds very embarrassing for the referee. One of the basics a ref should know following the introduction of the black card. That decision is up there with the ref who allowed the Meath goal against Louth.


Out of all the referees, this one, in particular should know about the black card and what should happen with them. The referee was Kevin Walsh. He is a National Referee Tutor and tutors the referees at in-service courses. He is also Chairman of the referees sub-committee on Munster Council. The mind boggles at how he got this one wrong.

donkeyford (Limerick) - Posts: 119 - 25/01/2014 16:03:36    1536473

Tomsmith here

In relation to the Black, Yellow, or red cards I make the following points
No 1 A particular Rule has not to be the centre of controversy to be effective
No 2 How many controversial instances has arisen so far
No 3 The poor referee that did the alleged blunder in that schools game is to be pitied.

But then again all these high powered Referees went with the flow when this rule was being installed , was one of them man enough to stand up and tell the GAA This is a shambles in its present form)
Why not well I can tell you that these fellows would have Refereed there last big game if the would have gone against the GAA HQ.
Indeed I Tomsmith must pride myself as one of the few that has raised this shambles of a rule .
It would be more difficult to count the Black Card fellows that are selling this rule/or PR people as they exist in many circles.

tomsmith (Cavan) - Posts: 3861 - 25/01/2014 18:46:18    1536555

Have we had a few, Tom?

joncarter (Galway) - Posts: 2692 - 25/01/2014 19:29:04    1536578

Chroist Ri won't get a replay because if they do the GAA will have to give a replay every time there's a mess up (and trust me there will be a lot of mistakes this year at least).

RebelCork (Cork) - Posts: 789 - 25/01/2014 20:58:56    1536610

Lads we gota give it a chance, let's review it in October when the championship is over and the dust is settled.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 25/01/2014 21:10:45    1536614

The Munster Post-Primary CCC have ruled tonight that a replay is to take place in the Corn Ui Mhuirí quarter-final between Pobalscoil Chorca Dhuibhne and Coláiste Chríost Rí after a black card controversy in the drawn game.
PS Chorca Dhuibhne won last week's game by 0-12 to 1-6 after extra-time at Dr Crokes GAA grounds in Killarney but controversy emerged after a black card error in normal time of the match.
Coláiste Chríost Rí were ahead by 1-5 to 0-5 when referee Kevin Walsh did not send off Corca Dhuibhne player Barra Ó Súilleabháin after the player was shown a black card in the aftermath of being given a yellow card in the opening-half.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7888 - 30/01/2014 20:35:14    1539011

Will this become common practice when they make mistakes (there will be more)?. Lets see will the GAA finally learn the meaning of the word consistent.

RebelCork (Cork) - Posts: 789 - 30/01/2014 21:00:54    1539027

Failing to send off a player is fairly embarrassing. If referees don't understand that basic rule, they shouldn't be refereeing in the first place.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7888 - 30/01/2014 21:05:19    1539029