ormond
I cannot see why its not able to host two stadiums?
has airport near by,has train station,has good bus routes,has loads of hotels in the area,has motorway direct to dublin and galway and cork.
well put it this way if you were hosting england v france would thomond park be better or gaelic grounds im sure local businesses would rather the game in gaelic grounds as it would allow doubl the amount of people to view the match and bring in more money.
as your on about it gaelic grounds is situated in nicer area,has more access to motorway and has hotels all along the ennis road and a shopping centre directly across the road nearly much better area for to host it then thomnd park.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 18/11/2013 21:27:36    1515040

ormo
How is Limerick not a rugby city? Ever been to the city???
Massive compensation... You would get rent and a large down payment. what would GAA be getting compensated for? All money in for the GAA would be extra income

I would call it GAA or soccer city before Rugby. More GAA clubs and more soccer than Rugby. Just because Rugby is more popular there than in vast majority of the country doesn't make it a Rugby city.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 18/11/2013 21:34:03    1515045

Great post dingle2 and I Agree with you 100%.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 18/11/2013 21:40:50    1515047

18/11/2013 20:33:30
uibhfhaili1986
As long as this doesn't cost the GAA a penny and they receive a huge amount of money to develop the stadia and then a huge excess that can be used for promoting the GAA I am all for it. GAA would pay some costs but would benefit exponentially from the whole thing.
.
18/11/2013 21:10:48 if_in_doubt
Obviously it'd be great if it were to happen but logistically it's a long way off being possible.
New Zealand in 2011 used a dozen venues in eleven different locations, England in 2015 will be using thirteen in eleven different cities.
It's all well and good being able to name grounds over here that would be able to match the capacity requirements (going on New Zealand's is probably a bit misleading as there'd arguably be a greater demand for tickets due to the proximity of the European nations) but there's a lot more to it than just how many people can fit in.
The town would need to be able to accommodate for 20,000 plus fans, would need to be close to an airport or on a train line and you'd imagine there'd need to be plenty to do in the place too to keep the tourists happy.
There's three venues in Dublin, two in Limerick and two in Belfast straight off that would be able to host matches. Not sure that seven venues in only three cities would be a runner though so you're probably looking at using only one Limerick stadium.
Outside of that, Pairc Ui Chaoimh, Celtic Park, Pearse Stadium and Nolan Park would be as good as you can get really in terms of providing a good capacity ground with good transport links in a city environment. That gives us ten grounds in seven cities.
MacHale Park and Fitzgerald Stadium would be good options too, Killarney's within two hours of two airports and on the train line from Dublin, and Castlebar is no distance from Knock, on a train line and although it probably doesn't have enough hotel rooms for 20,000 it's close enough to Westport and Sligo to cover it. A dozen grounds in nine locations, which on paper would probably be enough to get by.
Even at that though I'd imagine a lot of work would need to be done to bring some of those stadiums up to some sort of international standard. Would it be worth it for the GAA to spend money on grounds that can already cope with the crowd demands for championship football / hurling? I'd love to see the All Blacks playing in Newbridge and I'm sure the Meath lads would say the same regarding Navan, both big towns, close to Dublin and good transport links. Can't imagine there being that level of investment in either ground though. You've the opposite problem with Thurles and Wexford, good grounds already but fall down on the other requirements.
Aside from the grounds issue. Where exactly are the teams going to base themselves? The other Six Nations teams may well stay at home and only travel over for matches, but there's fifteen other teams that need a base to operate out of. Ireland will be in Carton House, lets say the All Blacks are in Johnstown House, the Aussies are down in Fota Island where do the rest of them go? Breaffy House, Portmarnock and the Ramada in Belfast would be good enough but how many other hotels are there with the necessary facilites after those few? A couple of the colleges might have what is needed to host a team, UL, WIT, Jordanstown, DCU and UCD, but considering the tournament usually starts around the same time as freshers week would they be able to go through with it?
It's doable, but it'd be a lot more realistic if we were to share venues with Scotland or Wales which has been done before. Stadiums might be big enough, and those that aren't can be improved, but can anything be done regarding towns and sport facilities? Probably not if it's only to do with a once off tournament.Excellent post. There is plenty of hotels with bases. They could use big hotels and if they had to use local rugby clubs(ie Adare Manor and go into Dooradoyle for training etc) then that is possible.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 21:41:58    1515049

18/11/2013 20:08:12
county man
Hope the bid is successful and that the GAA don't hold the Government/IRFU to ransom. I don't think they will cause if they have common sense, they know they will gain big time too from revenues renting the stadiums etc. They have been living in the past long enough & many GAA followers are rugby followers too.
For e.g. if Munster get to the semi final in the Heineken cup and get a home draw, under the rules they can't use their home ground, but instead of going a few hundred meters to the Gaelic Grounds which they would fill out a time in the year when its empty, they have to head to Dublin. Limerick GAA loose out on rent from a stadium totally underused (and that Limerick GAA clubs have pay to support every year) & Limerick economy also looses out. It would be win win but under current rules that can't happen. Ludicrous.
Yeah shame Limerick as a city loses(sic) out. Would be savage to have European semi's etc in Gaelic Grounds.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 21:43:02    1515050

18/11/2013 21:14:50
dingle2
Great Idea. Would really benefit the country with foreign revenue & would also benefit the upgrading of some GAA grounds with state & sponsor investment.
My 12 venues would be:
Croke Park, Aviva & RDS (Dublin) 78,000, 50,000 and 15,000 seated capacities + accommodation infrastructure + international airport & rail link & car ferry link. Major hospitals x 5.
Casement & Ravenhill (Belfast) 35,000 & 18,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport & rail & car ferry link. Major hospitals x 2.
Pairc Úí Chaoimh (Cork) - 45,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport & rail link & car ferry link. Major hospitals x 2.
Fitzgerald Stadium (Killarney) - 45,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Kerry) & rail link. major hospital x 1 (Kerry General Tralee)
Thomond Park (Limerick)- 27,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Shannon) & rail link.
Salthill (Galway) - 30,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Knock) & rail link. Major hospital x 1.
McHale Park (Castlebar) - 30,000 capacity + nearby (Westport / Galway / Sligo) accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Knock) & rail link. Major hospital x 1.
Nowlan Park (Kilkenny) - 25,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + rail link & 1.5 hours to Dublin / Cork airports & ferryports (dublin, Rosslare, Cork). Major hospital x 1.
Breffni Park (Cavan) - 25,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + 1.25 hours to Dublin or Belfast airports / ferryports. Major hospital x 1.
That's 10 stadiums with a combined capacity of over 400,000 with a good geographical spread & good access via air, rail, road or ferry networks and all have hospital & A&E healthcare facilities. I'm sure hotel's, guesthouses, bars, restaurants, golf clubs, parks, tour operators, shop keepers etc., etc. all over the island would welcome this boost.
Also the GAA would get a huge financial windfall from making their grounds available & I'm sure local GAA clubs would cash in also in providing training facilities & training grounds etc.
Ideal if it could be held in April / May or October which would be slightly off season for most hospitality providers and thus give them a major boost. Also most major GAA grounds are relatively free of big games during these months.
Imagine the view from the terraces in Killarney being broadcast world wide??? The GAA or Ireland couldn't buy that publicity. I hope it becomes a reality.
Good points.
If It hasn't been mentioned yet the only issue may be with several stadiums is lack of corporate seating etc and that would be needed in plenty of games mainly the big nations
When is Pairc Ui Chaoimh getting its do up?
Not sure local GAA clubs would really benefit from sides looking for training grounds as it would be rugby clubs or hotel area's that would be used.
Rugby world cup would never be in april/may it would be autumn time

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 21:47:25    1515054

ormondbannerman
County: Clare
Posts: 6265

Excellent post. There is plenty of hotels with bases. They could use big hotels and if they had to use local rugby clubs(ie Adare Manor and go into Dooradoyle for training etc) then that is possible.

There's plenty of hotels but how many of them have all the facilities needed? Off the top of my head I can only count six that would have a number of playing pitches coupled with gyms and swimming pools readily available on site.

Of course they could use GAA, football or rugby club facilities but the tournament is held during a time when the All Ireland is just finished and club championships are in full flow. Would many clubs have their facilities up to the required levels anyways and then be willing to let a rugby team tear it up for a few weeks before a county final for example? The football season starts in August so clubs probably wouldn't be too willing to let their pitches be used either.

Anyways, the rugby looked ridiculous on a pitch as big as the Croker one when Ireland played there, imagine how it would look in stadiums with terraces and grass banks around the sides.

if_in_doubt (Kildare) - Posts: 3685 - 18/11/2013 21:54:10    1515063

18/11/2013 21:17:58
OgraAnDun
The IRFU are currently in the process of buying up the houses at the back of the small end of the Aviva with the view of redevloping it in the future to make it bigger.

18/11/2013 21:27:36
hill16no1man
ormond, I cannot see why its not able to host two stadiums?
has airport near by,has train station,has good bus routes,has loads of hotels in the area,has motorway direct to dublin and galway and cork.
well put it this way if you were hosting england v france would thomond park be better or gaelic grounds im sure local businesses would rather the game in gaelic grounds as it would allow doubl the amount of people to view the match and bring in more money.
as your on about it gaelic grounds is situated in nicer area,has more access to motorway and has hotels all along the ennis road and a shopping centre directly across the road nearly much better area for to host it then thomnd park.
Nobody(virtually nobody as nobody having any issues is impossible) ever has any issues around thomond.
Limerick is too small. The stadiums are in too close an area. For both to be used Gardaí would have to make serious requests as to scheduling of games etc.
Yes Limerick has all those but it is still only big enough a city for one ground and that will be the rugby ground and the rugby ground that is one of the most famous in the world.
Gaelic grounds is on ennis road and Thomond has plenty of access to motorway. Thomond isn't exactly on Mars in relation to the ennis road. Its a few hundred metres down the shelbourne road or a walk through the housing estates in mayorstone, caherdavin. Thomond Parks location has never been an issue before so why would it now?

18/11/2013 21:34:03
Jack_Goff
I would call it GAA or soccer city before Rugby. More GAA clubs and more soccer than Rugby. Just because Rugby is more popular there than in vast majority of the country doesn't make it a Rugby city.Rugby is Limerick City's sport. Rugby dominates the city. Go to Moyross, St Marys Park, Castletroy or Dooradoyle and its rugby that's the sport. In virtually all the schools rugby is the main sport and if not its top billing with another sport. Messing to say anything other than that rugby is king

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 21:56:09    1515068

18/11/2013 21:54:10
if_in_doubt
There's plenty of hotels but how many of them have all the facilities needed? Off the top of my head I can only count six that would have a number of playing pitches coupled with gyms and swimming pools readily available on site.
Of course they could use GAA, football or rugby club facilities but the tournament is held during a time when the All Ireland is just finished and club championships are in full flow. Would many clubs have their facilities up to the required levels anyways and then be willing to let a rugby team tear it up for a few weeks before a county final for example? The football season starts in August so clubs probably wouldn't be too willing to let their pitches be used either.
Anyways, the rugby looked ridiculous on a pitch as big as the Croker one when Ireland played there, imagine how it would look in stadiums with terraces and grass banks around the sides.
There is plenty of hotels - Strand, Clarion, Savoy in the city and then there's hotels outside the city etc. sides could use UL, club grounds like Cookieland, Dooradoyle, Rosbrien etc so GAA clubs wouldn't be needed.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 22:00:22    1515078

18/11/2013 21:34:03
Jack_Goff
I would call it GAA or soccer city before Rugby. More GAA clubs and more soccer than Rugby. Just because Rugby is more popular there than in vast majority of the country doesn't make it a Rugby city.


Rugby is Limerick City's sport. Rugby dominates the city. Go to Moyross, St Marys Park, Castletroy or Dooradoyle and its rugby that's the sport. In virtually all the schools rugby is the main sport and if not its top billing with another sport. Messing to say anything other than that rugby is king.

I'm sorry Ormo but Limerick hurling is bigger than Limerick Rugby. And I'm talking about Hurling and Football together aka the GAA. More people in Limerick and the city play GAA than Rugby and more attend GAA matches every year than Rugby hence I conclude Limerick is most certainly not a Rugby city. Way more excitement around the hurlers this year than there was for Rugby and in particular Munster Rugby.

Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 18/11/2013 22:04:31    1515079

A few points it would be very unfair on the rest of the country for Belfast and Dublin to have 2 or 3 grounds. Croke park would really be only a valid option for the final and Semi finals. Would be ridiculous to have the earlier rounds there.
They should spread it out as much as possible. The South East more than any place in Ireland gets neglected. The likes of Carlow, Wexford, Waterford and Wicklow never get a fair deal. The fact that there isn't an appropriate ground in any of those counties just highlights this further. They should upgrade the facilities in at least one of these counties to cater for this.

Nick (Wexford) - Posts: 1100 - 19/11/2013 09:11:47    1515092

If the infrastructure were fine in Ireland it wouldn't matter where the game was. Most counties are no more that 2 or 3 hours away from Dublin. Most of the other stadiums would be no more than 2 or 3 hours from Cork, Galway, Limerick, Belfast etc.. Wouldn't be unreasonable for people to travel that fair to the games. If we got our train lines into order as they should be there wouldn't be a problem.

Nick (Wexford) - Posts: 1100 - 19/11/2013 09:17:12    1515095

They would have to take down the fence around Fitzgerald stadium and put in proper seating but other than that we'd be good to go, also it wouldn't interrupt our county championship one bit cos we could play the final in Austin stack park. The good thing about having the worldcup in Ireland is that all the grounds are no more than 4 or 5 hours drive from eachother.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 19/11/2013 09:22:35    1515097

Limerick isn't a rugby city. It's a myth the media use to draw attention to the place and is being taken as gospel by the rest of the country. Soccer is the main sport, and main topic of pub conversation, in the city and the county is GAA country. You only have to look at the attendances at AIL games in Limerick to see it isn't a rugby city. Don't be fooled by what you see in Thomond Park on a Heineken cup night. A huge amount of people at those matches only took an interest in rugby in the last 10-15 years. They will admit themselves they have no real affiliation to rugby and wouldn't even know what clubs the Munster players are from

mike03 (Limerick) - Posts: 2000 - 19/11/2013 09:25:21    1515099

Folks we live on a small enough Island, where it takes roughly 6 hours to drive from North coast to the South coast.

An International airport is not required when choosing a City or location to host matches. Smaller towns across the country host GAA matches of 20,000+ capacity every summer, and they manage fine. Special buses and Intercity travel can be set up for such an event, regardless of what services are currently available.

As for hotel facilities, we can pool the resources from surrounding area's to help accommodate people. Just because a big stadium is in a relatively small town ( Like Castlebar for example ), fans can stay in a host of satellite towns/villages surrounding it.

I am in favour of spreading group games around the country, places like Kilkenny, Killarney, Carlow, Armagh, Waterford City, Clonmel, Sligo, Letterkenny, Omagh etc have a lot to offer visiting tourists.
Then the bigger games can be played in the bigger City area's.

I'm not a big rugby fan to be honest, but I wouldn't be against the IRFU applying to host such a big event.

GaryMc82 (Derry) - Posts: 3017 - 19/11/2013 11:25:10    1515150

18/11/2013 22:04:31
Jack_Goff
I'm sorry Ormo but Limerick hurling is bigger than Limerick Rugby. And I'm talking about Hurling and Football together aka the GAA. More people in Limerick and the city play GAA than Rugby and more attend GAA matches every year than Rugby hence I conclude Limerick is most certainly not a Rugby city. Way more excitement around the hurlers this year than there was for Rugby and in particular Munster Rugby. I play rugby mainly in Limerick, Im in Limerick the whole time. If Limerick is not a "rugby city" nowhere is any kind of city like nowhere is a "GAA city".
Limerick is known worldwide for rugby and is a rugby city

19/11/2013 09:11:47 Nick
A few points it would be very unfair on the rest of the country for Belfast and Dublin to have 2 or 3 grounds. Croke park would really be only a valid option for the final and Semi finals. Would be ridiculous to have the earlier rounds there.
They should spread it out as much as possible. The South East more than any place in Ireland gets neglected. The likes of Carlow, Wexford, Waterford and Wicklow never get a fair deal. The fact that there isn't an appropriate ground in any of those counties just highlights this further. They should upgrade the facilities in at least one of these counties to cater for this. What would be ridiculous would be to only use Croke Park for the 3/4 games at the end.
Why would it be ridiculous to have earlier games than that on there? If involving the big countries it would sell out.
Why upgrade facilities in those counties when a stadium would rarely be used afterwards?


19/11/2013 09:25:21
mike03
Limerick isn't a rugby city. It's a myth the media use to draw attention to the place and is being taken as gospel by the rest of the country. Soccer is the main sport, and main topic of pub conversation, in the city and the county is GAA country. You only have to look at the attendances at AIL games in Limerick to see it isn't a rugby city. Don't be fooled by what you see in Thomond Park on a Heineken cup night. A huge amount of people at those matches only took an interest in rugby in the last 10-15 years. They will admit themselves they have no real affiliation to rugby and wouldn't even know what clubs the Munster players are from Not a myth. Ive played with club in the city and played enough against sides. Depends on the opposition but the top division 1 games get thousand+ at games depending on opposition.
Most Munster players are only affiliated in name with clubs now and most only play with those clubs if coming back from serious injury.
Most have built up real affiliations to rugby. Just like all sports do rugby has built and widened its support base

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 19/11/2013 11:53:05    1515170

19/11/2013 11:25:10 GaryMc82
Folks we live on a small enough Island, where it takes roughly 6 hours to drive from North coast to the South coast.
An International airport is not required when choosing a City or location to host matches. Smaller towns across the country host GAA matches of 20,000+ capacity every summer, and they manage fine. Special buses and Intercity travel can be set up for such an event, regardless of what services are currently available.
As for hotel facilities, we can pool the resources from surrounding area's to help accommodate people. Just because a big stadium is in a relatively small town ( Like Castlebar for example ), fans can stay in a host of satellite towns/villages surrounding it.
I am in favour of spreading group games around the country, places like Kilkenny, Killarney, Carlow, Armagh, Waterford City, Clonmel, Sligo, Letterkenny, Omagh etc have a lot to offer visiting tourists. Then the bigger games can be played in the bigger City area's.
I'm not a big rugby fan to be honest, but I wouldn't be against the IRFU applying to host such a big event.
Small towns host GAA games and do fine but they don't have to deal with 90+% of the attendances looking for hotel rooms before/after games which would be the case with a world cup.
Carlow? Armagh? Waterford? Clonmel? Letterkenny? Where are the stadiums and facilities in those areas? You got to be kidding me if you think those towns could be used for matches.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 19/11/2013 11:56:36    1515172

Here's a suggestion, maybe it will sound completely ridiculous but here goes.

The World Cup has 4 pools. How about each province hosting a pool, with the bulk of supporters staying in the one or two major cities in the province; Ulster would be mostly Belfast, Connacht mostly Galway, Munster Limerick and Cork and Leinster mostly Dublin.

Each province would use 3-4 stadiums for the pools. Ulster would be Casement, Ravenhill and Clones. Connacht would be Salthill, Sportsgrounds and Castlebar. Munster would be Páirc Uí Chaoimh, Thomond, Thurles and maybe Killarney. Leinster would be Aviva, Croke Park, RDS and maybe one place outside Dublin like Tullamore, Portlaoise or wherever.

I would split the quarter-finals between Dublin and Belfast with the semi-finals and final in Dublin.

Be honest, is that a completely ridiculous idea?

Another point; a lot of people mentioning large-scale redevelopment of the smaller stadia, these measures would not have to be permanent leaving large capacity stadiums rarely filled. Take the Olympic Village in London for example, a lot of the arena were temporary structures and have since been dismantled.

Hurling1Guru1 (Galway) - Posts: 244 - 19/11/2013 12:07:35    1515179

Surely Healy Park must be one of the venues.......

pcworld (Mayo) - Posts: 549 - 19/11/2013 12:36:30    1515194

19/11/2013 12:07:35
Hurling1Guru1
Here's a suggestion, maybe it will sound completely ridiculous but here goes.
The World Cup has 4 pools. How about each province hosting a pool, with the bulk of supporters staying in the one or two major cities in the province; Ulster would be mostly Belfast, Connacht mostly Galway, Munster Limerick and Cork and Leinster mostly Dublin.
Each province would use 3-4 stadiums for the pools. Ulster would be Casement, Ravenhill and Clones. Connacht would be Salthill, Sportsgrounds and Castlebar. Munster would be Páirc Uí Chaoimh, Thomond, Thurles and maybe Killarney. Leinster would be Aviva, Croke Park, RDS and maybe one place outside Dublin like Tullamore, Portlaoise or wherever.
I would split the quarter-finals between Dublin and Belfast with the semi-finals and final in Dublin.
Be honest, is that a completely ridiculous idea?
Another point; a lot of people mentioning large-scale redevelopment of the smaller stadia, these measures would not have to be permanent leaving large capacity stadiums rarely filled. Take the Olympic Village in London for example, a lot of the arena were temporary structures and have since been dismantled.
I dont think you need to put specific groups in each province. Ireland is small enough to travel around that you dont need to do that though it wouldnt be a bad idea
Dublin between Aviva and Croke Park would prob get all 8 games after the group stages between quarters, semis, 3rd/4th playoff and final.
Good points on redevelopment and using London as an example

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 19/11/2013 14:13:08    1515257