yew_tree
County: Mayo
Posts: 5176

1514808
Master I would only except one stadium in Connacht to be nominated. That most likely would go to Pearce Stadium in Salthill (unless their lack of floodlights comes against them). Galway would be judged to have better all round facilities for fans travelling over with plenty of hotels etc and the city has a fairly strong Rugby connection. Mayo wouldn't be a strong Rugby stronghold. I couldn't see them bypassing Galway city and in fairness it would be hard to argue with it.

The Irish Tourism mafia out in Westport will make sure this gig gets as close to them as possible. Aided and abetted my Messrs Kenny and Ring, I'd see every chance of McHale Park being included. Have to admire Westport... they take full advantage of every chance to sell their town. They had the place packed out for that Sea 2 Summit thing. Imagine being able to fill every hotel room in you're town, in November... in Ireland.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 18/11/2013 17:35:23    1514889

If it goes ahead fair enough but I don't think the GAA public need to be brow beaten again about public monies been put into stadia like we were in the run up to the vote to open Croke park. Hopefully not put more debt on the country just so Mr Brown can show some rugby unions that he can do what they could do.

Bain (Donegal) - Posts: 470 - 18/11/2013 18:13:43    1514911

roundball

i coulad imagine the price them hotels would cost too in westport,have to say most expensive place I have been to in ireland south or north,also the poor ducks be extinct haha thats the main option in every restaurant when i was there.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 18/11/2013 18:48:38    1514927

Lot of us dreaming about our local venue playing host to the All Blacks no doubt!

IF...IF we succeed in a bit of this nature the venues would largely depend on 4 factors:

1) Standard, not capacity but standards, facilities, seating etc, the traditional Irish terrace won't cut it.

2) Location, Anything off the motorway has a decent chance. E.g Cork, Galway etc. Alot will come down to ease of access.

3) Price of rebuilds: Many stada would need a complete of at least 3/4 rebuild, most places have old mouldy terraces, no floodlights etc. Places like Breffini Park/Clones/Thurles would probably be ruled out due to the cost of the rebuilds.

4)Capacity, unlike soccer Rugby seems to be content with smaller venues so capacity isnt the biggest issue anything over 18K would cut it i'd say.

crossfieldball (Galway) - Posts: 650 - 18/11/2013 19:10:03    1514940

hill16no1man
County: Dublin
Posts: 6530

1514927
roundball

i coulad imagine the price them hotels would cost too in westport,have to say most expensive place I have been to in ireland south or north,also the poor ducks be extinct haha thats the main option in every restaurant when i was there.

I've family out there so never had to stay in a hotel thankfully, can imagine you'd pay for it alright. It doesn't feel quite as geared towards fleecing tourists as Killarney and some other places mind you. You'd wanna get in with the locals! They'd point ye right for better value.

And thinking about it... as Sports Minister, Michael Ring will not rest until Castlebar is on the shortlist as a venue.

roundball (Tipperary) - Posts: 2514 - 18/11/2013 19:20:51    1514942

It certainly could be a runner and its a great opportunity for the GAA to get some stadia built at a minimum cost! I'd assume the tax payer would be willing to foot any re-development costs. What exactly are we looking at here? 10-12 Stadiums! Assuming they are all city based you could have 2-3 in Dublin (if Dublin GAA ever proceeded with building a 20-30,000 new home away from Parnell or the RDS, perhaps both!. 2 in Belfast with Casement and Ravenhill. 1 in Cork in the Pairc, 1 in Limerick in Thomand, 1 in Galway in Salthill, 1 in Kilkenny with Nolan. The other obvious candidates are Castlebar and Semple with Castlebar more likely as air access is easier. These towns could potentially host 50,000 capacity stadiums but would not have the services and infrastructure required. All that is without the need to build a new stadium. Impressive and manageable bid in my view and a great opportunity for the GAA!

seany16 (Dublin) - Posts: 1658 - 18/11/2013 19:29:51    1514947

18/11/2013 16:23:18
jpcampion
I apologise for forgetting Castlebar on my list of venues. Probably a good spot as Knock airport in easy reach. I do believe that the rugdy crowd would use an opportunity like a RWC to redevelop grounds and that Ravenhill and Galway would be top of the list. This would leave no room for Casement or Pearse Park. Anyway can anyone really see Casement being released for Rugby? Limerick should have 1 venue and thomond is that. Smaller towns can be used quite easily as long as they are accessible. Portlaoise and Navan are less than 1 hour from dublin city centre and ideal for the likes of Georgia, Tonga, Namibia, Kenya. Those games that will probably only get 20-30,000 crowd anyway. With the right push could even get these smaller nations to base themselves in the provincial towns and bring a boost to the local economies.
Countries will want decent facilities to base themselves ie Carton House etc
Great point about Castlebar wrt Knock airport, would be very good
Ravenhill already in motions of being developed. Will be finished soon enough


18/11/2013 16:57:40
football first
You've hit the nail on the head, hurlingdub. Why should the GAA hand the IRFU such a fabulous marketing opportunity? It was bad enough letting the egg chasers into Croke Park, but destroying the surface in Thurles would be even worse. why all the name calling? 1/2 rugby games if Thurles was even chosen(I don't think it should or would be) wouldn't destroy the surface.

18/11/2013 17:06:39
hill16no1man
limerick is big enough for two stadums,thomond only holds 25 thousand gaelci grounds has a capacity of 50 thousand.
there train and good bus networks available in limerick city and an airport 20 mins away in shannon.
its has loads of hotels close to gaelic grounds especially and it is a rugby city so i cannot see why you make out it would not be able to have two stadiums used.it would be the best city to have two stadiums used logically as its the biggest rugby city in the country so you will have far higher chance of people attending meaningless games between the likes of tonga and samoa and fiji and the likes Limerick isn't really big enough for 2 stadiums only prob Cork, Dublin and Belfast are.
Thomond does only hold 26000 to the Gaelic Grounds 50000 but Thomond is a much better stadium and
Why you saying games between islanders would be meaningless how can you say that?? Tonga beat France at last world cup. The others ever improving.

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 19:30:47    1514949

18/11/2013 17:27:39
Jack_Goff
I wouldn't really call limerick a rugby city now hill not that it really matters.
The GAA should demand massive compensation for this as well as having existing grounds developed. It would be massive promotion to Rugby here and the GAA is in competition with other sports.
If I was the GAA I would demand the government remove the hiked rates on Croke Park, payed the players an increased grant and developed some stadia such as Navan, Drogheda and Kildare for use in this as some of the smaller stadiums.
I'd imagine the IRFU would have to assist the government in all of that.
Otherwise get stuffed. The GAA are not a governemnt/IRFU cash cow.
How is Limerick not a rugby city? Ever been to the city???
Massive compensation... You would get rent and a large down payment. what would GAA be getting compensated for? All money in for the GAA would be extra income

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 19:33:10    1514953

18/11/2013 19:10:03 crossfieldball
Lot of us dreaming about our local venue playing host to the All Blacks no doubt!
IF...IF we succeed in a bit of this nature the venues would largely depend on 4 factors:
1) Standard, not capacity but standards, facilities, seating etc, the traditional Irish terrace won't cut it.
2) Location, Anything off the motorway has a decent chance. E.g Cork, Galway etc Alot will come down to ease of access.
3) Price of rebuilds: Many stada would need a complete of at least 3/4 rebuild, most places have old mouldy terraces, no floodlights etc. Places like Breffini Park/Clones/Thurles would probably be ruled out due to the cost of the rebuilds.
4)Capacity, unlike soccer Rugby seems to be content with smaller venues so capacity isnt the biggest issue anything over 18K would cut it i'd say.
On 1. Yes more facilities would be needed ie and better facilities in stadiums.
Doing this would have long term benefits to GAA as the stadiums would improve and improvements would have increase the life of stadiums.
Everywhere connected by motorway and most have good train links which would help with movement of people. in the main French/English/Scottish/Welsh would only come over for their games on 1/2 day trips its the rest that you'd have to in the main carer for long term visits
Capacity would have to be higher than 18k if you look at the next 2 world cups in England/Japan where average stadiums are quite a bit above 18k

ormondbannerman (Clare) - Posts: 13473 - 18/11/2013 19:39:33    1514957

Hope the bid is successful and that the GAA don't hold the Government/IRFU to ransom. I don't think they will cause if they have common sense, they know they will gain big time too from revenues renting the stadiums etc. They have been living in the past long enough & many GAA followers are rugby followers too.

For e.g. if Munster get to the semi final in the Heineken cup and get a home draw, under the rules they can't use their home ground, but instead of going a few hundred meters to the Gaelic Grounds which they would fill out a time in the year when its empty, they have to head to Dublin. Limerick GAA loose out on rent from a stadium totally underused (and that Limerick GAA clubs have pay to support every year) & Limerick economy also looses out. It would be win win but under current rules that can't happen. Ludicrous.

county man (Limerick) - Posts: 1102 - 18/11/2013 20:08:12    1514970

As long as this doesn't cost the GAA a penny and they receive a huge amount of money to develop the stadia and then a huge excess that can be used for promoting the GAA I am all for it.

uibhfhaili1986 (Offaly) - Posts: 1296 - 18/11/2013 20:33:30    1514993

If the World Cup is held in Ireland then Killarney has to be used, stadium holds 45,000 it's near Kerry airport there is loads of hotels and bars and it's gorgeous .

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 14092 - 18/11/2013 20:39:26    1514997

What about Pairc Esleir?

OgraAnDun (Down) - Posts: 406 - 18/11/2013 21:07:27    1515017

Obviously it'd be great if it were to happen but logistically it's a long way off being possible.

New Zealand in 2011 used a dozen venues in eleven different locations, England in 2015 will be using thirteen in eleven different cities.

It's all well and good being able to name grounds over here that would be able to match the capacity requirements (going on New Zealand's is probably a bit misleading as there'd arguably be a greater demand for tickets due to the proximity of the European nations) but there's a lot more to it than just how many people can fit in.

The town would need to be able to accommodate for 20,000 plus fans, would need to be close to an airport or on a train line and you'd imagine there'd need to be plenty to do in the place too to keep the tourists happy.

There's three venues in Dublin, two in Limerick and two in Belfast straight off that would be able to host matches. Not sure that seven venues in only three cities would be a runner though so you're probably looking at using only one Limerick stadium.

Outside of that, Pairc Ui Chaoimh, Celtic Park, Pearse Stadium and Nolan Park would be as good as you can get really in terms of providing a good capacity ground with good transport links in a city environment. That gives us ten grounds in seven cities.

MacHale Park and Fitzgerald Stadium would be good options too, Killarney's within two hours of two airports and on the train line from Dublin, and Castlebar is no distance from Knock, on a train line and although it probably doesn't have enough hotel rooms for 20,000 it's close enough to Westport and Sligo to cover it. A dozen grounds in nine locations, which on paper would probably be enough to get by.

Even at that though I'd imagine a lot of work would need to be done to bring some of those stadiums up to some sort of international standard. Would it be worth it for the GAA to spend money on grounds that can already cope with the crowd demands for championship football / hurling? I'd love to see the All Blacks playing in Newbridge and I'm sure the Meath lads would say the same regarding Navan, both big towns, close to Dublin and good transport links. Can't imagine there being that level of investment in either ground though. You've the opposite problem with Thurles and Wexford, good grounds already but fall down on the other requirements.

Aside from the grounds issue. Where exactly are the teams going to base themselves? The other Six Nations teams may well stay at home and only travel over for matches, but there's fifteen other teams that need a base to operate out of. Ireland will be in Carton House, lets say the All Blacks are in Johnstown House, the Aussies are down in Fota Island where do the rest of them go? Breaffy House, Portmarnock and the Ramada in Belfast would be good enough but how many other hotels are there with the necessary facilites after those few? A couple of the colleges might have what is needed to host a team, UL, WIT, Jordanstown, DCU and UCD, but considering the tournament usually starts around the same time as freshers week would they be able to go through with it?

It's doable, but it'd be a lot more realistic if we were to share venues with Scotland or Wales which has been done before. Stadiums might be big enough, and those that aren't can be improved, but can anything be done regarding towns and sport facilities? Probably not if it's only to do with a once off tournament.

if_in_doubt (Kildare) - Posts: 3685 - 18/11/2013 21:10:48    1515021

If it would mean money coming in and RTE gets all the live games back I would defo be in favour

Villatown (Leitrim) - Posts: 902 - 18/11/2013 21:14:32    1515027

Great Idea. Would really benefit the country with foreign revenue & would also benefit the upgrading of some GAA grounds with state & sponsor investment.

My 12 venues would be:

Croke Park, Aviva & RDS (Dublin) 78,000, 50,000 and 15,000 seated capacities + accommodation infrastructure + international airport & rail link & car ferry link. Major hospitals x 5.

Casement & Ravenhill (Belfast) 35,000 & 18,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport & rail & car ferry link. Major hospitals x 2.

Pairc Úí Chaoimh (Cork) - 45,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport & rail link & car ferry link. Major hospitals x 2.

Fitzgerald Stadium (Killarney) - 45,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Kerry) & rail link. major hospital x 1 (Kerry General Tralee)

Thomond Park (Limerick)- 27,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Shannon) & rail link.

Salthill (Galway) - 30,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Knock) & rail link. Major hospital x 1.

McHale Park (Castlebar) - 30,000 capacity + nearby (Westport / Galway / Sligo) accommodation infrastructure + international airport (Knock) & rail link. Major hospital x 1.

Nowlan Park (Kilkenny) - 25,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + rail link & 1.5 hours to Dublin / Cork airports & ferryports (dublin, Rosslare, Cork). Major hospital x 1.

Breffni Park (Cavan) - 25,000 capacity + accommodation infrastructure + 1.25 hours to Dublin or Belfast airports / ferryports. Major hospital x 1.

That's 10 stadiums with a combined capacity of over 400,000 with a good geographical spread & good access via air, rail, road or ferry networks and all have hospital & A&E healthcare facilities. I'm sure hotel's, guesthouses, bars, restaurants, golf clubs, parks, tour operators, shop keepers etc., etc. all over the island would welcome this boost.

Also the GAA would get a huge financial windfall from making their grounds available & I'm sure local GAA clubs would cash in also in providing training facilities & training grounds etc.

Ideal if it could be held in April / May or October which would be slightly off season for most hospitality providers and thus give them a major boost. Also most major GAA grounds are relatively free of big games during these months.

Imagine the view from the terraces in Killarney being broadcast world wide??? The GAA or Ireland couldn't buy that publicity. I hope it becomes a reality.

dingle2 (Kerry) - Posts: 278 - 18/11/2013 21:14:50    1515028

ormondbannerman
County: Clare
Posts: 6262


Think you are dreaming wrt planning permission to the Aviva. There isnt any more room on the site in Lansdowne road for any expansion especially on the North, West and South boundaries of the site where the stadium already is at the edge and at the east side of the ground there is the back pitches etc for use of Lansdowne and Wanderers rfc and they need them so there will be no expansion in the lifetime of the stadium



The IRFU are currently in the process of buying up the houses at the back of the small end of the Aviva with the view of redevloping it in the future to make it bigger.

OgraAnDun (Down) - Posts: 406 - 18/11/2013 21:17:58    1515034

Jack_Goff
County: Meath
Posts: 593

1514880
I wouldn't really call limerick a rugby city now hill not that it really matters.
The GAA should demand massive compensation for this as well as having existing grounds developed. It would be massive promotion to Rugby here and the GAA is in competition with other sports.
If I was the GAA I would demand the government remove the hiked rates on Croke Park, payed the players an increased grant and developed some stadia such as Navan, Drogheda and Kildare for use in this as some of the smaller stadiums.
I'd imagine the IRFU would have to assist the government in all of that.
Otherwise get stuffed. The GAA are not a governemnt/IRFU cash cow.

it is a rugby city,you only have to spend a weekend there at the least to know.
i agree gaa should use this to demand better for themselves as they hold all the aces in this bid.
problem I have is everybody talks about how much money these things put into the economy thats all well and good but who pays to host it in the first place?the tax payer and does the tax payer get any of this money that goes back into governments pockets ?
No so its not really great for anybody other then buisnesses and the government at the end of the day if we are honest.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 18/11/2013 21:18:41    1515037

roundball in fairness i thaught killarney was not that bad at all,I went for league game this year and went for weekend and cost of food was alot less then westport,hotels cheaper too

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 18/11/2013 21:19:47    1515038

crossfieldball

sure the last world cup in new zealand they had grass banks behind the goals like navan currently has so I cannot see terraces being any sort of problem regarding it

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 18/11/2013 21:20:54    1515039