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Would be great to see a 'rest of Ulster' and 'rest of Connaught' team compete. I wonder what level they would be at? What to do with Longford and Louth though?!
liam500 (Wicklow) - Posts: 175 - 14/11/2023 19:27:13
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I posted in the Leitrim thread. Dreadful idea, basically. An anti-hurling idea.
Tacaí Liatroma (Leitrim) - Posts: 1047 - 15/11/2023 09:44:23
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Replying To Tacaí Liatroma: "I posted in the Leitrim thread. Dreadful idea, basically. An anti-hurling idea."
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2590 - 15/11/2023 10:57:20
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Replying To liam500: "Would be great to see a 'rest of Ulster' and 'rest of Connaught' team compete. I wonder what level they would be at? What to do with Longford and Louth though?!" It doesn't make any sense to have a Team Ulster. Antrim have ruled it out and the logistics of where to train and who would be picked are too great. I would rather see the the number of tiers reduced to 4. 11 in Liam and 8 in the Joe McDonagh, Christy Ring, Lory Meagher.
Meath beat Derry by two points and lost to London. They beat Mayo by 2 who were relegated. Derry and Kildare would join them in the Joe McDonagh and it would be very competitive.
Rolo2010 (Donegal) - Posts: 739 - 15/11/2023 14:25:29
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Replying To Rolo2010: "It doesn't make any sense to have a Team Ulster. Antrim have ruled it out and the logistics of where to train and who would be picked are too great. I would rather see the the number of tiers reduced to 4. 11 in Liam and 8 in the Joe McDonagh, Christy Ring, Lory Meagher.
Meath beat Derry by two points and lost to London. They beat Mayo by 2 who were relegated. Derry and Kildare would join them in the Joe McDonagh and it would be very competitive." You've forgot the nicky rackard cup
Timmy86 (Sligo) - Posts: 270 - 15/11/2023 17:35:49
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Hard to believe this proposal was ever brought forward. Very insulting to the counties involved. Really bad form.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1361 - 16/11/2023 08:16:50
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This is purely a money saving exercise & the promised money will not find its way into the promotion of hurling in these counties. If we need more money just hold another concert or American Football match surely!!!
LemonySnickett (Louth) - Posts: 88 - 17/11/2023 11:50:54
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Replying To LemonySnickett: "This is purely a money saving exercise & the promised money will not find its way into the promotion of hurling in these counties. If we need more money just hold another concert or American Football match surely!!!" By all accounts driven by certain people within the counties involved which makes it even more scandalous.
TerribleFootwork (Wexford) - Posts: 1760 - 17/11/2023 12:15:34
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https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/cccc-chief-hurling-not-sustainable-in-five-counties-if-their-base-doesnt-grow/a1536291490.html
Some interesting points in this article. Especially the one about the average number of adult hurlers in the 5 counties and how few don't play intercounty, to the point that there is no real club activity at all during the intercounty season. Also the fact that there are 10 less hurling clubs in those counties than 20 years ago. There needs to be a push made by those counties boards, hopefully helped by the GAA at Central level, to try get more hurling done in schools where there are no clubs, especially in populous areas maybe where there are larger numbers of kids. As regards the valid point Derek Kent makes about there being a lack of volunteers from a hurling background maybe if coaches and the local county board paid for GPOs/coaches to train volunteer coaches in those areas it would be a start.
This of course needs the Boards, 4 of which reacted very angrily to the initial proposal, to put resources where their mouths were now. And needs the GAA to support their efforts from central funds.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12114 - 30/11/2023 09:43:53
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Replying To Viking66: "https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/cccc-chief-hurling-not-sustainable-in-five-counties-if-their-base-doesnt-grow/a1536291490.html
Some interesting points in this article. Especially the one about the average number of adult hurlers in the 5 counties and how few don't play intercounty, to the point that there is no real club activity at all during the intercounty season. Also the fact that there are 10 less hurling clubs in those counties than 20 years ago. There needs to be a push made by those counties boards, hopefully helped by the GAA at Central level, to try get more hurling done in schools where there are no clubs, especially in populous areas maybe where there are larger numbers of kids. As regards the valid point Derek Kent makes about there being a lack of volunteers from a hurling background maybe if coaches and the local county board paid for GPOs/coaches to train volunteer coaches in those areas it would be a start.
This of course needs the Boards, 4 of which reacted very angrily to the initial proposal, to put resources where their mouths were now. And needs the GAA to support their efforts from central funds." Maybe it's time to admit , 139 years after the foundation of the GAA that Hurling is a micro minirity sport in at least 16 Counties and will remain so.
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1451 - 30/11/2023 10:58:31
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Replying To Viking66: "https://m.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/hurling/cccc-chief-hurling-not-sustainable-in-five-counties-if-their-base-doesnt-grow/a1536291490.html
Some interesting points in this article. Especially the one about the average number of adult hurlers in the 5 counties and how few don't play intercounty, to the point that there is no real club activity at all during the intercounty season. Also the fact that there are 10 less hurling clubs in those counties than 20 years ago. There needs to be a push made by those counties boards, hopefully helped by the GAA at Central level, to try get more hurling done in schools where there are no clubs, especially in populous areas maybe where there are larger numbers of kids. As regards the valid point Derek Kent makes about there being a lack of volunteers from a hurling background maybe if coaches and the local county board paid for GPOs/coaches to train volunteer coaches in those areas it would be a start.
This of course needs the Boards, 4 of which reacted very angrily to the initial proposal, to put resources where their mouths were now. And needs the GAA to support their efforts from central funds." Have been reading Kent's comments and looking at Cavan as an example.
The Cavan GAA website seems to list only one adult hurling competition for the year - its Senior Hurling Championship.
It had three teams, who were supposed to play each other in a group, with the top two going through to the final. However, one team was involved in the first two games, and lost both of them. This meant that the other two sides already had two points each, and would go through no matter what the outcome of a group game between them. So, seems they didn't bother with that group game, and instead proceeded straight to the final.
So, just three matches played in the entire championship (July 16th, July 24th, and August 6th), with each of the three clubs getting only two games each.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see any sign on the website of any other club hurling match being played this year at all.
So maybe Kent has a point?
Cavan's inter-county hurlers had five League matches between February and early April, and a further five in the Lory Meagher Cup between middle of April and middle of May. However, seems that other hurlers in Cavan, not on the county panel, only had two competitive matches all year.
How to address this? Strengthening hurling in the three clubs currently playing it would only go so far, because there'd still only be three clubs. Surely what's really needed are efforts to get other clubs to start hurling as well.
But then when would these clubs actually play matches, if it's so difficult to run club matches between February and May on account of the county team digging so deeply into the playing pool?
Couldn't take the tack we do in Wexford (for example), where there's a League that clubs play without their inter-county players, on account of how the clubs already playing hurling would hardly be able to field teams in it if they're supplying seven, eight or nine players each to the county squad.
And unfair on the non-county players in those clubs if there's a "Development League" run just for emerging clubs unaffected by the county squad, because then players in those clubs would get maybe four or five games more than the players in the clubs who've been keeping the hurling flag flying all along.
Makes me wonder again what's really best for trying to develop hurling in a place like that?
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2257 - 30/11/2023 11:39:35
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Replying To Seanfanbocht: "Maybe it's time to admit , 139 years after the foundation of the GAA that Hurling is a micro minirity sport in at least 16 Counties and will remain so." It's the "and will remain so" part that grates.
I'd love to see hurling on a stronger footing in all those counties. But sad fact is that despite all the calls for extra resources etc. from Croke Park, it'll never happen unless there's a genuine and concerted desire and effort within those counties to make it happen.
For as long as that desire is not there, you could throw all the resources in the world at hurling in those counties, but it'd be like trying to build a swimming pool by pouring water straight into a sandpit.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2257 - 30/11/2023 11:44:01
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Replying To Seanfanbocht: "Maybe it's time to admit , 139 years after the foundation of the GAA that Hurling is a micro minirity sport in at least 16 Counties and will remain so." Maybe those counties should form their own GFA then?
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12114 - 30/11/2023 12:33:12
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Replying To Pikeman96: "Have been reading Kent's comments and looking at Cavan as an example.
The Cavan GAA website seems to list only one adult hurling competition for the year - its Senior Hurling Championship.
It had three teams, who were supposed to play each other in a group, with the top two going through to the final. However, one team was involved in the first two games, and lost both of them. This meant that the other two sides already had two points each, and would go through no matter what the outcome of a group game between them. So, seems they didn't bother with that group game, and instead proceeded straight to the final.
So, just three matches played in the entire championship (July 16th, July 24th, and August 6th), with each of the three clubs getting only two games each.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see any sign on the website of any other club hurling match being played this year at all.
So maybe Kent has a point?
Cavan's inter-county hurlers had five League matches between February and early April, and a further five in the Lory Meagher Cup between middle of April and middle of May. However, seems that other hurlers in Cavan, not on the county panel, only had two competitive matches all year.
How to address this? Strengthening hurling in the three clubs currently playing it would only go so far, because there'd still only be three clubs. Surely what's really needed are efforts to get other clubs to start hurling as well.
But then when would these clubs actually play matches, if it's so difficult to run club matches between February and May on account of the county team digging so deeply into the playing pool?
Couldn't take the tack we do in Wexford (for example), where there's a League that clubs play without their inter-county players, on account of how the clubs already playing hurling would hardly be able to field teams in it if they're supplying seven, eight or nine players each to the county squad.
And unfair on the non-county players in those clubs if there's a "Development League" run just for emerging clubs unaffected by the county squad, because then players in those clubs would get maybe four or five games more than the players in the clubs who've been keeping the hurling flag flying all along.
Makes me wonder again what's really best for trying to develop hurling in a place like that?" Tbh that piece has me thinking all morning Pikeman
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12114 - 30/11/2023 12:34:56
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Replying To Viking66: "Tbh that piece has me thinking all morning Pikeman" Yeah, it has me thinking too. To be honest, had never previously really considered the club scene in such counties, and how poor it must be.
By the way, didn't mention it in earlier post, but maybe it goes without saying - any answer of "play club hurling from June onwards" wouldn't be a runner either, because realistically, football will still be a 90-something per cent focus of any club taking up hurling.
And as a further aside - just to let others here know that Derek Kent's mother passed away yesterday. By all means, come on here and make your point if you happen to disagree with him, but in the circumstances, please be sure to play the ball and not the man.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2257 - 30/11/2023 13:57:56
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Replying To Pikeman96: "Yeah, it has me thinking too. To be honest, had never previously really considered the club scene in such counties, and how poor it must be.
By the way, didn't mention it in earlier post, but maybe it goes without saying - any answer of "play club hurling from June onwards" wouldn't be a runner either, because realistically, football will still be a 90-something per cent focus of any club taking up hurling.
And as a further aside - just to let others here know that Derek Kent's mother passed away yesterday. By all means, come on here and make your point if you happen to disagree with him, but in the circumstances, please be sure to play the ball and not the man." He's a good man. Im biased of course. Bridget was great craic and a nice woman. Mad. At least she went peacefully. RIP.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12114 - 30/11/2023 14:38:46
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Replying To Pikeman96: "Have been reading Kent's comments and looking at Cavan as an example.
The Cavan GAA website seems to list only one adult hurling competition for the year - its Senior Hurling Championship.
It had three teams, who were supposed to play each other in a group, with the top two going through to the final. However, one team was involved in the first two games, and lost both of them. This meant that the other two sides already had two points each, and would go through no matter what the outcome of a group game between them. So, seems they didn't bother with that group game, and instead proceeded straight to the final.
So, just three matches played in the entire championship (July 16th, July 24th, and August 6th), with each of the three clubs getting only two games each.
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't see any sign on the website of any other club hurling match being played this year at all.
So maybe Kent has a point?
Cavan's inter-county hurlers had five League matches between February and early April, and a further five in the Lory Meagher Cup between middle of April and middle of May. However, seems that other hurlers in Cavan, not on the county panel, only had two competitive matches all year.
How to address this? Strengthening hurling in the three clubs currently playing it would only go so far, because there'd still only be three clubs. Surely what's really needed are efforts to get other clubs to start hurling as well.
But then when would these clubs actually play matches, if it's so difficult to run club matches between February and May on account of the county team digging so deeply into the playing pool?
Couldn't take the tack we do in Wexford (for example), where there's a League that clubs play without their inter-county players, on account of how the clubs already playing hurling would hardly be able to field teams in it if they're supplying seven, eight or nine players each to the county squad.
And unfair on the non-county players in those clubs if there's a "Development League" run just for emerging clubs unaffected by the county squad, because then players in those clubs would get maybe four or five games more than the players in the clubs who've been keeping the hurling flag flying all along.
Makes me wonder again what's really best for trying to develop hurling in a place like that?" On the flip side of that. . .
Cavan have 3 teams. So circa 70 hurlers if we're lucky.
30 or so of those make the county panel.
Take half their intercounty games away and what does that do to hurling in the county??
cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5021 - 30/11/2023 15:12:22
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Is it a bad idea? Leitrim spent more than €150,000 on senior hurling county team last year? That's surely an incredible waste of money. Merit to the proposal. Those opposing it in these counties should do something practical to increase participation
Claretandblue (Westmeath) - Posts: 1506 - 30/11/2023 16:14:37
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Replying To Claretandblue: "Is it a bad idea? Leitrim spent more than €150,000 on senior hurling county team last year? That's surely an incredible waste of money. Merit to the proposal. Those opposing it in these counties should do something practical to increase participation" Why is it an incredible waste of money?
Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 2482 - 30/11/2023 17:32:50
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Replying To Claretandblue: "Is it a bad idea? Leitrim spent more than €150,000 on senior hurling county team last year? That's surely an incredible waste of money. Merit to the proposal. Those opposing it in these counties should do something practical to increase participation" How much money did they waste on their senior football team?
Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 1917 - 30/11/2023 17:59:46
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