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IMHO the GAA is streets ahead of rugby in terms of juvenile participation in Dublin. Within a short distance of where I live there are two senior rugby clubs, and could be considered by some as a rugby heartland area. The local GAA clubs are in the primary schools with GDOs, offer games for boys and girls, and literally can't get their hands on enough pitches to meet demand. The rugby will attract some of the same kids but not to the same numbers. You will see more children in GAA gear rather than rugby on the streets.
The Irish rugby team is backboned by private school players and a few lads from the southern hemisphere. The odd junior club player breaks through- maybe Furlong is the poster boy now, but the reality is the 'boggers' don't really matter, except the odd player from outside the usual pool is occasionally thrown up - Sean O'Brien and Alan Quinlan come to mind. Furthermore rugby IMHO is going sorta the same way as American football, outside of schools the main deal is the pro game, big clubs do not have the same numbers of adult male teams as say 25 Years ago. The level of physical conditioning is huge and the difference between a pro player and a club guy is huge, to the extent it is actually physically dangerous if they get on the same pitch.
Equally I know of people who had sons at underage in senior rugby clubs in Dublin and at secondary level for various reasons decided not to follow the rugby school route, but over time took their kids out of the clubs as they would occasionally be playing against boys involved at the school Level, again the physical mismatch was seen as too risky given the level of training some of these elite rugby schools put in. Throw in the mounting evidence of player brain damage and it is taking some of the lustre off the game. The GAA is now increasingly the middle class participation game in Dublin.
This is not to deny the hugely successful work the IRFU has done since the game went pro which is to their credit and hopefully will see them progress in the RWC. However, the traditional senior clubs are not prospering to the extent you would have considered- provincial academies are hoovering up the cream from the schools game and developing top class professional players. The clubs do not benefit from this, does anyone know who the current AIL champions are? Professional games are well supported and are an enjoyable after work social activity. However, I wonder how many of the spectators actually understand what is even going on on the pitch, the rules are incredibly technical and infringement s occur in scrums, rucks , mauls and are virtually inscrutable unless, you are ref following play or watching on TV. Note the complaints each year for some patrons of hordes of people congregating in the bars rather than watching the game on the pitch- I can attest to having been bored at some international games over the years with endless forward play.
Anyway, IMHO all sports have a huge drop off rate, but rugby has increasingly structural issues relating to the growing physicality of the game, but the 'front of house'pro game is prospering which masks other issues. The GAA are very clever, in particular the non competitive Go Games keeps multitudes involved. It is eating the lunch of other sports, particularly in Dublin where it matters for the overall health of the organisation. However the GAA cannot be complacent- elite Gaelic football is a poor spectacle, but it does not have the health concerns of rugby and is solidly anchored in their communities.
Bainisteoir (National) - Posts: 540 - 14/10/2023 16:36:31
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Replying To BarneyGrant: "GAA pitches are ours. They are not municipal and this is not Paris. The only reason any aspect of Irish culture survived was because those who ensured that it would survive were exclusivists. "Narrow nationalists" even.
And they will disappear unless we get some of that attitude back." I think to call GAA stadium "ours" then it would have to be funded 100% by GAA and not the tax payer like Croke Park and PuC
DuhallowRed (Cork) - Posts: 269 - 14/10/2023 16:43:10
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Replying To BarneyGrant: "GAA pitches are ours. They are not municipal and this is not Paris. The only reason any aspect of Irish culture survived was because those who ensured that it would survive were exclusivists. "Narrow nationalists" even.
And they will disappear unless we get some of that attitude back." What a ridiculous, insolar and insecure view which really has nothing to do with how the GAA utilise their assets. As you're well aware, the revenue generated is reinvested in the organisation to the benefit of everyone. Very few have any issue with the GAA acting commercially on the basis that it allows the organisation maintain it's overall ethos. Times have moved on and lets be honest, it will move on without you.
Square_B (Leitrim) - Posts: 846 - 14/10/2023 16:43:35
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Replying To Ryanteam: "Casement Park not Windsor Park hosting Euro 2018. Both Irish teams assured qualification as they are hosting event!" Correction typo… Euro 2028 not 2018!!
Ryanteam (Cork) - Posts: 217 - 14/10/2023 17:01:37
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Replying To Bainisteoir: "IMHO the GAA is streets ahead of rugby in terms of juvenile participation in Dublin. Within a short distance of where I live there are two senior rugby clubs, and could be considered by some as a rugby heartland area. The local GAA clubs are in the primary schools with GDOs, offer games for boys and girls, and literally can't get their hands on enough pitches to meet demand. The rugby will attract some of the same kids but not to the same numbers. You will see more children in GAA gear rather than rugby on the streets.
The Irish rugby team is backboned by private school players and a few lads from the southern hemisphere. The odd junior club player breaks through- maybe Furlong is the poster boy now, but the reality is the 'boggers' don't really matter, except the odd player from outside the usual pool is occasionally thrown up - Sean O'Brien and Alan Quinlan come to mind. Furthermore rugby IMHO is going sorta the same way as American football, outside of schools the main deal is the pro game, big clubs do not have the same numbers of adult male teams as say 25 Years ago. The level of physical conditioning is huge and the difference between a pro player and a club guy is huge, to the extent it is actually physically dangerous if they get on the same pitch.
Equally I know of people who had sons at underage in senior rugby clubs in Dublin and at secondary level for various reasons decided not to follow the rugby school route, but over time took their kids out of the clubs as they would occasionally be playing against boys involved at the school Level, again the physical mismatch was seen as too risky given the level of training some of these elite rugby schools put in. Throw in the mounting evidence of player brain damage and it is taking some of the lustre off the game. The GAA is now increasingly the middle class participation game in Dublin.
This is not to deny the hugely successful work the IRFU has done since the game went pro which is to their credit and hopefully will see them progress in the RWC. However, the traditional senior clubs are not prospering to the extent you would have considered- provincial academies are hoovering up the cream from the schools game and developing top class professional players. The clubs do not benefit from this, does anyone know who the current AIL champions are? Professional games are well supported and are an enjoyable after work social activity. However, I wonder how many of the spectators actually understand what is even going on on the pitch, the rules are incredibly technical and infringement s occur in scrums, rucks , mauls and are virtually inscrutable unless, you are ref following play or watching on TV. Note the complaints each year for some patrons of hordes of people congregating in the bars rather than watching the game on the pitch- I can attest to having been bored at some international games over the years with endless forward play.
Anyway, IMHO all sports have a huge drop off rate, but rugby has increasingly structural issues relating to the growing physicality of the game, but the 'front of house'pro game is prospering which masks other issues. The GAA are very clever, in particular the non competitive Go Games keeps multitudes involved. It is eating the lunch of other sports, particularly in Dublin where it matters for the overall health of the organisation. However the GAA cannot be complacent- elite Gaelic football is a poor spectacle, but it does not have the health concerns of rugby and is solidly anchored in their communities." The GAA is ahead but rugby is increasing its footprint hugely.
Its not true at all about rugby tha the boggers dont matter. there will be more coming through from the schools be it fee paying or otherwise in other areas as the players simply train more, and get access to coaches players from clubs/sma;ler schools dont get enoughof.
Also use paragrapsh bainisteor!!! makes your posts far easier to rea!!!
There is lot more than Sean O Brien, Quinny who came from other areas.
Rugby isnt going just like american football. the game is different to 25 years ago with some clubs not fielding numbers of teams as they were but theres more clubs fielding and the whole attitude towards sport i different now compared to then.
the clubs do benefit from the players coming through the academies. these guys play plenty of AIL and are invovled in clubs extensively before they make it in the pro game.
Rugby has had non competitive games at under 12 and below for over 20 years. well ahead of the GAA in that regard.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3513 - 14/10/2023 17:29:41
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6/4 the All Blacks, Mmmm. Should one wet one's beak?
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2590 - 14/10/2023 19:34:57
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Replying To Ryanteam: "Casement Park not Windsor Park hosting Euro 2018. Both Irish teams assured qualification as they are hosting event!" Both Irish teams are not assured qualification, nor are the 3 British teams, for that matter.
Cockney_Cat (UK) - Posts: 2481 - 14/10/2023 19:38:55
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Replying To Cockney_Cat: "Both Irish teams are not assured qualification, nor are the 3 British teams, for that matter." We be spared that at least.
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2590 - 14/10/2023 20:57:17
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Replying To BarneyGrant: "6/4 the All Blacks, Mmmm. Should one wet one's beak?" I should be in business. Although to be honest I cashed out after third try so worked out at 4/7.
Pints on me :-)
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2590 - 14/10/2023 21:53:45
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They probably be big parade now. Finishing in top eight or not even winning a match qualifies.
Unless its Dublin football team of course. Shoved up into Smithfield on a Monday night with hardly a councillor even there. Probably all at home watching "football" on Sky. I'm glad I'm old sometimes.
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2590 - 14/10/2023 22:20:58
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Wouldnt worry too much they failed as usual.
jobber (Westmeath) - Posts: 1463 - 14/10/2023 22:37:54
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Replying To BarneyGrant: "They probably be big parade now. Finishing in top eight or not even winning a match qualifies.
Unless its Dublin football team of course. Shoved up into Smithfield on a Monday night with hardly a councillor even there. Probably all at home watching "football" on Sky. I'm glad I'm old sometimes." So pathetic. Anyone who supports Irish sport is so disappointed for this team. Get back under your rock.
Square_B (Leitrim) - Posts: 846 - 14/10/2023 23:16:51
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Andy Farrell will be happy anyway.
His first love and home town Wigan won the Rugby League Final.
Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1451 - 14/10/2023 23:21:54
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No
MeAlone (Galway) - Posts: 75 - 14/10/2023 23:29:32
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Replying To Cockney_Cat: "Both Irish teams are not assured qualification, nor are the 3 British teams, for that matter." Will be some event if Republic of Ireland play Northern Ireland in Casement. I remember they played in Windsor Park in World Cup 1994 qualifiers, and that was a tense occasion! Right now Republic of Ireland are weak, but we'll live in hope!
Ryanteam (Cork) - Posts: 217 - 15/10/2023 00:07:55
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And the heartbeat of the nation was stilled....
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2590 - 15/10/2023 02:13:13
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Replying To jobber: "Wouldnt worry too much they failed as usual." Maybe a bit harsh but at the same time hard to disagree.
They had an extra man for a quarter of the game too.
The fact both our tries came from kiwis doesn't help either.
Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1733 - 15/10/2023 08:08:13
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Replying To KillingFields: "The GAA is ahead but rugby is increasing its footprint hugely.
Its not true at all about rugby tha the boggers dont matter. there will be more coming through from the schools be it fee paying or otherwise in other areas as the players simply train more, and get access to coaches players from clubs/sma;ler schools dont get enoughof.
Also use paragrapsh bainisteor!!! makes your posts far easier to rea!!!
There is lot more than Sean O Brien, Quinny who came from other areas.
Rugby isnt going just like american football. the game is different to 25 years ago with some clubs not fielding numbers of teams as they were but theres more clubs fielding and the whole attitude towards sport i different now compared to then.
the clubs do benefit from the players coming through the academies. these guys play plenty of AIL and are invovled in clubs extensively before they make it in the pro game.
Rugby has had non competitive games at under 12 and below for over 20 years. well ahead of the GAA in that regard." Come on now KillingFields, there's no issue whatsoever with Bainisteoir's paragraphs there. They're talking accurate sense eloquently, from top to bottom there. Perhaps you can't handle the truth?
Pope_Benedict (Galway) - Posts: 3478 - 15/10/2023 10:27:06
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I think the horse has well bolted on this one. The split season is what we should worry about rather than rugby. We are the masters of our own downfall. We have taken our main competitions out of the window. No all ire final should be played before last week in august. Rugby, soccer, athletics, are all getting huge more coverage and not a word about Gaa . I personally enjoyed the rugby and while disappointed with nz result it has lifted the whole country. When you see what's going on in the rest of the world it pales inot insignificance. But we want to save football and hurling? The split season has to be revisited
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 15/10/2023 10:41:31
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Athletics? You're having a laugh?
Claretandblue (Westmeath) - Posts: 1506 - 15/10/2023 12:00:11
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