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You can see why a neutral would favour the underdog, Westmeath, yesterday, and I suppose the ref is only human - when you have an underdog playing that Tyrone shower, time to dust off the 2 rule books approach to refereeing whereby you give one team soft frees and you let the other team be fouled all over the place. Westmeath could have had 4 men off on black cards. On GAAGO, Michael Murphy was openly incredulous about one of the frees he gave Westmeath - "never a free", he repeated several times, in disbelief.
Westmeath played great, and no issues with them - good well drilled team, and I'd run at a defence too if I knew that every little contact would get me a free.
Look at the black card and penalty Kerry got v Cork, when the Kerry forward was to the left of the goal and had men between him and the goalie when he was pulled down; and then look at Tyrone yesterday - clean through on the goalie, straight in front of the goal, taken down, and no black card and no penalty - and try to tell me we don't have a refereeing problem.
Hopefully the GAA will leave the parish-pump referees behind in the remaining games. That lad yesterday was as bad as I've ever seen.
points50swiththeargyllsonthewrongfeet (Tyrone) - Posts: 243 - 19/06/2023 13:21:18
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Saw something online - apparently it was the correct call as it was deemed 'a high tackle rather than a deliberate pull down , which is absolutely crazy! Absolutely no need for it to be so complicated
TobeaRossie (Roscommon) - Posts: 139 - 19/06/2023 13:55:33
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Replying To points50swiththeargyllsonthewrongfeet: "You can see why a neutral would favour the underdog, Westmeath, yesterday, and I suppose the ref is only human - when you have an underdog playing that Tyrone shower, time to dust off the 2 rule books approach to refereeing whereby you give one team soft frees and you let the other team be fouled all over the place. Westmeath could have had 4 men off on black cards. On GAAGO, Michael Murphy was openly incredulous about one of the frees he gave Westmeath - "never a free", he repeated several times, in disbelief.
Westmeath played great, and no issues with them - good well drilled team, and I'd run at a defence too if I knew that every little contact would get me a free.
Look at the black card and penalty Kerry got v Cork, when the Kerry forward was to the left of the goal and had men between him and the goalie when he was pulled down; and then look at Tyrone yesterday - clean through on the goalie, straight in front of the goal, taken down, and no black card and no penalty - and try to tell me we don't have a refereeing problem.
Hopefully the GAA will leave the parish-pump referees behind in the remaining games. That lad yesterday was as bad as I've ever seen." Where will they get these new part-time, amateur, high standard, athletic referees, with full time jobs, that consistently apply the rules even if they're not clearly defined?
GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7381 - 19/06/2023 14:04:13
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You can contact your local club, they always need more referees. Ive done it myself at underage and it is incredibly difficult. One rarely noted issue being other players blocking the referees view of an incident, the ref doesnt get 10 different camera angles, zoom shots and and slow motion replays like the RTE and HS pundits .
bad.monkey (USA) - Posts: 4627 - 19/06/2023 14:18:29
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Replying To bad.monkey: "You can contact your local club, they always need more referees. Ive done it myself at underage and it is incredibly difficult. One rarely noted issue being other players blocking the referees view of an incident, the ref doesnt get 10 different camera angles, zoom shots and and slow motion replays like the RTE and HS pundits ." I wouldn't put the blame on referees - The constantly changing rulebook and amount of grea areas are ridiculous and does them no favors whatsoever.
Kildare fella got booked for time wasting in our game yesterday when they were running down the clock with the black cards, never seen it in a GAA game before but credit where its due was great to see.
TobeaRossie (Roscommon) - Posts: 139 - 19/06/2023 14:21:18
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The most glaring error took place in Dublin match when Lee Gannon point, straight between the posts, was waved wide.
No one protested, and it was obviously inconsequential but if that had been determining score or non score is there a right of appeal? Don't know why none of the outfield officials intervened.
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2609 - 19/06/2023 14:31:35
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Replying To BarneyGrant: "The most glaring error took place in Dublin match when Lee Gannon point, straight between the posts, was waved wide.
No one protested, and it was obviously inconsequential but if that had been determining score or non score is there a right of appeal? Don't know why none of the outfield officials intervened." You obviously didn't see the Mayo player getting pounded on top of the head by the Cork player. I would love to ask the referee what he gave the yellow for.
cluichethar (Mayo) - Posts: 454 - 19/06/2023 15:18:19
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Replying To TobeaRossie: "I wouldn't put the blame on referees - The constantly changing rulebook and amount of grea areas are ridiculous and does them no favors whatsoever.
Kildare fella got booked for time wasting in our game yesterday when they were running down the clock with the black cards, never seen it in a GAA game before but credit where its due was great to see." That was very well dealt with. If his mate hadn't lay down beside him he might have got away with it but the 2 of them went down together! To be fair to ref, he was same for both teams, David Murray went down holding his head in 2nd half and ref told Carroll to kick it out and play on
D.Hyde (Roscommon) - Posts: 150 - 19/06/2023 16:17:00
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Replying To cluichethar: "You obviously didn't see the Mayo player getting pounded on top of the head by the Cork player. I would love to ask the referee what he gave the yellow for." I didn't see that match obviously. The most glaring error i personally witnessed was in Cavan. Caught the end of the Galway/Armagh match and I'd say Armagh would have been rightly annoyed over the referee's liberal interpretation of "at least 4 minutes."
Would have also to have felt for Shane Walsh who I'm sure could have done without McQuillan and the linesman virtually standing on top of him for a minute before he went to take the kick!
BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 2609 - 19/06/2023 17:16:32
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Replying To BarneyGrant: "I didn't see that match obviously. The most glaring error i personally witnessed was in Cavan. Caught the end of the Galway/Armagh match and I'd say Armagh would have been rightly annoyed over the referee's liberal interpretation of "at least 4 minutes."
Would have also to have felt for Shane Walsh who I'm sure could have done without McQuillan and the linesman virtually standing on top of him for a minute before he went to take the kick!" I think Joe was looking for his autograph.
Eddie the Exile (Monaghan) - Posts: 1065 - 19/06/2023 17:22:53
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Replying To points50swiththeargyllsonthewrongfeet: "You can see why a neutral would favour the underdog, Westmeath, yesterday, and I suppose the ref is only human - when you have an underdog playing that Tyrone shower, time to dust off the 2 rule books approach to refereeing whereby you give one team soft frees and you let the other team be fouled all over the place. Westmeath could have had 4 men off on black cards. On GAAGO, Michael Murphy was openly incredulous about one of the frees he gave Westmeath - "never a free", he repeated several times, in disbelief.
Westmeath played great, and no issues with them - good well drilled team, and I'd run at a defence too if I knew that every little contact would get me a free.
Look at the black card and penalty Kerry got v Cork, when the Kerry forward was to the left of the goal and had men between him and the goalie when he was pulled down; and then look at Tyrone yesterday - clean through on the goalie, straight in front of the goal, taken down, and no black card and no penalty - and try to tell me we don't have a refereeing problem.
Hopefully the GAA will leave the parish-pump referees behind in the remaining games. That lad yesterday was as bad as I've ever seen." If you're going to come on here and have a cheap shot at refs, at least direct your anger in the right direction.
The rule book is the problem in the main, not the refs.
The call for the Westmeath tackle on the Tyrone guy that was through on goal was 100% correct. It's only a penalty if it's a black card offence inside the 20m line.
Unfortunately though it did deny a clear goal chance, it was a "high tackle", and the ref correctly gave a yellow card.
As plenty more posters have told you, go out and take up a whistle - see how you get on.
Donaldtrump (Galway) - Posts: 252 - 19/06/2023 18:55:09
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Replying To points50swiththeargyllsonthewrongfeet: "You can see why a neutral would favour the underdog, Westmeath, yesterday, and I suppose the ref is only human - when you have an underdog playing that Tyrone shower, time to dust off the 2 rule books approach to refereeing whereby you give one team soft frees and you let the other team be fouled all over the place. Westmeath could have had 4 men off on black cards. On GAAGO, Michael Murphy was openly incredulous about one of the frees he gave Westmeath - "never a free", he repeated several times, in disbelief.
Westmeath played great, and no issues with them - good well drilled team, and I'd run at a defence too if I knew that every little contact would get me a free.
Look at the black card and penalty Kerry got v Cork, when the Kerry forward was to the left of the goal and had men between him and the goalie when he was pulled down; and then look at Tyrone yesterday - clean through on the goalie, straight in front of the goal, taken down, and no black card and no penalty - and try to tell me we don't have a refereeing problem.
Hopefully the GAA will leave the parish-pump referees behind in the remaining games. That lad yesterday was as bad as I've ever seen." Both referees were right; simple as that.
Aibrean (Kerry) - Posts: 264 - 19/06/2023 19:16:54
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The black card rule needs some tidying up for sure.
A 'high tackle' is considered rough play and is always a caution (or red if a bad one) even if it's clearly cynical.
So if you as a player/coach want to make the most of the rule book discrepancies to get away with cynical play follow this advice if a player is about to pull the trigger bearing down on goal :
1. Take him out but do it high and not bad enough to get a red. It happened last weekend but I can't remember which game.
2. Shove him if you can, and to the ground if you want. You'll be 'noted' for your cynical action!
3. If you are facing him as he's coming at you get your two arms around him but make sure he doesn't go to ground. If he does then you're getting black. Just hold him up.
Refs don't write the rules, we only implement and interpret what needs to be interpreted.
Blame someone else if the rule is wrong or doesn't make sense.
There's a potential situation in the rulebook where a team that receives a black card in the last 10 mins of normal time cannot start extra time with 15 but a team that gets a red card in the same period can.
Imagine a bust up in the last minute of normal time and one player gets a black and an opponent gets red. Game goes to extra time and the red carded team start with 15 and the black carded team have to play 10 minutes with 14.
I can't wait till that happens in a big game and listen to the fall out
Sindar (Roscommon) - Posts: 348 - 24/06/2023 12:50:59
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Replying To Sindar: "The black card rule needs some tidying up for sure.
A 'high tackle' is considered rough play and is always a caution (or red if a bad one) even if it's clearly cynical.
So if you as a player/coach want to make the most of the rule book discrepancies to get away with cynical play follow this advice if a player is about to pull the trigger bearing down on goal :
1. Take him out but do it high and not bad enough to get a red. It happened last weekend but I can't remember which game.
2. Shove him if you can, and to the ground if you want. You'll be 'noted' for your cynical action!
3. If you are facing him as he's coming at you get your two arms around him but make sure he doesn't go to ground. If he does then you're getting black. Just hold him up.
Refs don't write the rules, we only implement and interpret what needs to be interpreted.
Blame someone else if the rule is wrong or doesn't make sense.
There's a potential situation in the rulebook where a team that receives a black card in the last 10 mins of normal time cannot start extra time with 15 but a team that gets a red card in the same period can.
Imagine a bust up in the last minute of normal time and one player gets a black and an opponent gets red. Game goes to extra time and the red carded team start with 15 and the black carded team have to play 10 minutes with 14.
I can't wait till that happens in a big game and listen to the fall out" get rid of the rule about starting extra time with 15 then. its a stupid rule anyway.
it shouldnt be classed as a new game as its the continuation of the same game.
KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3517 - 24/06/2023 15:20:37
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Replying To Sindar: "The black card rule needs some tidying up for sure.
A 'high tackle' is considered rough play and is always a caution (or red if a bad one) even if it's clearly cynical.
So if you as a player/coach want to make the most of the rule book discrepancies to get away with cynical play follow this advice if a player is about to pull the trigger bearing down on goal :
1. Take him out but do it high and not bad enough to get a red. It happened last weekend but I can't remember which game.
2. Shove him if you can, and to the ground if you want. You'll be 'noted' for your cynical action!
3. If you are facing him as he's coming at you get your two arms around him but make sure he doesn't go to ground. If he does then you're getting black. Just hold him up.
Refs don't write the rules, we only implement and interpret what needs to be interpreted.
Blame someone else if the rule is wrong or doesn't make sense.
There's a potential situation in the rulebook where a team that receives a black card in the last 10 mins of normal time cannot start extra time with 15 but a team that gets a red card in the same period can.
Imagine a bust up in the last minute of normal time and one player gets a black and an opponent gets red. Game goes to extra time and the red carded team start with 15 and the black carded team have to play 10 minutes with 14.
I can't wait till that happens in a big game and listen to the fall out" It has happened. Ulster Final this year. Brendan Rogers got a black card a couple of minutes from the end of normal time. Derry had to play most of the first period of extra time with 14 men. A straight red would have meant Derry start extra time with 15.
kingpuck71 (Derry) - Posts: 690 - 24/06/2023 17:23:12
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Every GAA match ever is now a whinge by the losing manager about the referee.
Maybe Glen Ryan needs to become a referee...he might do a better job.
ExiledInWex (Dublin) - Posts: 1141 - 26/06/2023 09:57:13
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Replying To KillingFields: "get rid of the rule about starting extra time with 15 then. its a stupid rule anyway.
it shouldnt be classed as a new game as its the continuation of the same game." 'New Game' is a myth bandied about. Yellows and blacks and reds, in the sense that player sent off cannot play, all carry over to ET.
Sindar (Roscommon) - Posts: 348 - 26/06/2023 11:38:21
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Replying To kingpuck71: "It has happened. Ulster Final this year. Brendan Rogers got a black card a couple of minutes from the end of normal time. Derry had to play most of the first period of extra time with 14 men. A straight red would have meant Derry start extra time with 15." Not the same situation I'm talking about. If Armagh had seen a red at the same time they would have been allowed to start ET with 15 players while Derry would have been down to 14 until the 10 minutes elapsed.
Derry, or any other team, would have been wondering wtf and there would be a big hullabaloo for a few days. But that is the rule!
Sindar (Roscommon) - Posts: 348 - 26/06/2023 11:42:04
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Yellows don't carry into extra time. Blacks do. Reds don't in the sense team back to 15 but red card recipient can't play
Claretandblue (Westmeath) - Posts: 1512 - 26/06/2023 18:01:25
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Replying To ExiledInWex: "Every GAA match ever is now a whinge by the losing manager about the referee.
Maybe Glen Ryan needs to become a referee...he might do a better job." It's a tough job being a referee. It doesn't help when a manager comes out and immediately puts a ref at the center of the post match comments.
There were a few very bad episodes with referees being physically assaulted last year. Those comments from Glen won't help that at all.
It's probably fair to say that nearly every time a team is beaten by a point you could point to the ref and say he cost us. That's the nature of the game with a very thin line between a tackle and a foul; between over carrying and a score between a free for a rugby tackle at the end of the game and the full time whistle. It's all part of the luck on the day.
I'd prefer if Glen looked at the difference being the missed goal chance; the ball hits the crossbar Kildare lose; the ball goes in Kildare win.
brianb (Kildare) - Posts: 292 - 26/06/2023 21:12:21
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