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There was a time only the semi-finals and finals were shown live. People who were not attending the other games listened to the commentary on the radio. Radio coverage is still available.
legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7856 - 06/08/2019 16:57:11
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Replying To OGarmaile: "RTÉ simulcasted 4 national leagues games live this year. I think 2 of them were football." I stand corrected OGormaile. It's doesn't get away from the fact that RTE's coverage in general of football has for years been very poor and particularly so this year . Their coverage of this year's football championship has been atrocious . It's all very well for their pundits to cry foul in relation to the Donegal v Mayo game but RTE by choice completely ignored the football provincial championships until the finals . The only game they showed was Donegal v Tyrone .
Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6031 - 06/08/2019 17:03:25
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Replying To Liamwalkinstown: "Completely disagree
See, this attitude which I note is in the majority here, it completely misses the point of the actual GAA itself.
Ye are viewing the GAA as being the same as soccer, rugby etc; ie just another sport.
The GAA and coverage of same however is NOT just another sport, it is so so much more than that, and to many many people means so much more than that. It is an Irish institution, no less than the 6 o clock news and the late late show.
The attitude that "sure so what if the old lads in the nursing homes can't see it, sure didn't they grow up not seeing it" or the ol "Sligo are never on tele anyways" completely insult everything many GAA people would have believed all their lives.
That attitude is a classic example of "i am alright John"
Those same "old lads" deserve to be able to watch their county, or for that matter, any county play a big game like a Super 8 clash. For many, GAA would have been an integral part of their lives growing up and into adulthood and beyond.
To simply wipe away their needs with a "what of it" is incredibly insulting and just bloody wrong
I am in the minority on this one, I get that, but it gals me to see so many GAA fans, who I have no doubt all have the capacity to either go to the match, or to the pub to watch the match, just deride older GAA people's entitlements to enjoy the sport this nation was bloody founded on.
And if you decry that and you throw your eyes to heaven at that, then you fail to grasp the importance and cultural significance the GAA has and has always had to this country since its inception, and to the older generations in particular
Perhaps the GAA is just another football team/Hurling team to you, but its so much more to so many, and many of those same people are in their dotage and deserve to be looked after.
But sure look, so long as ye got to see the games, eh lads.........." 100% agree. Great post.
IMO we are gradually losing the appeal of GAA to younger people and it's slowly becoming just another sport. When in my view it is indeed an institution which if run properly can still be the glue in rural society for an age.
However I fear that in it's current direction, the GAA is in risk of losing its heart.
DLlegends (Donegal) - Posts: 503 - 06/08/2019 17:19:22
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Complete straw man argument Wayne imo.
Disagreeing with the Sky deal doesn't equate to believing everyone has a right to watch every single game on TV.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13710 - 06/08/2019 17:28:16
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The crazy thing about this recent RTE propaganda is RTE would never be showing these sky games anyway. They bought the alternative package which was previously shown by TV3. If TV3, TG4 or RTE won't outbid Sky then tough. None of these stations broadcast in the North or Great Britain either so it wasn't exactly ideal anyway.
Personally I think RTE are a disgrace. They'd rather over pay their staff millions but don't want to pay up for the second GAA package which costs about 13M over 3 years I think. It would pay for itself with TV adverts and sponsorship. They could sub lease some of the matches out to TG4 as well.
Besides all this there are enough matches on TV already and we don't need then all on free TV (which isn't even free).
Jack_Goff (Meath) - Posts: 2920 - 06/08/2019 17:29:42
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Mickey might have a different opinion if he was already paying the Irish Government for a TV licence.
Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 1911 - 06/08/2019 17:53:35
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Replying To waynoI: ""Why should anybody have the God-given right to see all games on television? That was never the case back in the day and we all survived. Just because it's a luxury that's available nowadays and some people can pay for it, other people may choose not, and we'll all have the luxury of seeing highlights afterwards if we didn't go to the game."
________________________________
I don't think I've read something so spot on RE: televised games in all my life.
People might not like hearing it, but its true. Good man Mickey.
All this mumbo jumbo about the elderly who cant make it to the game, or people who cant afford it, or those in care homes etc, while its unfortunate and not nice that those people cant see their county play on tele, What about 30 or 40 years ago when there was one game a week if you were lucky?. How did the elderly, people who couldn't get to the game itself, or those in care homes manage to see their county back then ? They didn't.
And whats more, it only seems to be an issue talked about for the big games. What about followers of Sligo football for example ? Wicklow, Antrim football. The ulster and Connaught hurling teams ? None of their games were broadcast live to the elderly or those who couldnt afford to go to in Sligo, Wicklow, antrim etc. Nobody cared about them. Nobody was having a go at RTE/SKY etc for not showing Any Wicklow football games to the elderly in Bray or Greystones, those in Wicklow care homes that may want to watch their county.
The fact of the matter is this, There is more GAA games shown live/exclusively live now than ever before. Its impossible to please everyone. Its unfortunate but if for whatever reason you cant go the game and its not shown on tele, then that's just how it is. Some of us support other teams in other sports, we cant go to all their games, we cant watch them all on the box either, you don't hear other fans giving it socks about their organisations being a disgrace.
Its impossible to show every single inter county game on tele, and every single club game on tele. Impossible. But of course you have the cry-a**ing GAA people who moan and whinge and want everything for free, as if the whole organisation runs on monopoly money. Have a day off.
I drive a VW golf, and id love to buy a brand spanking new one in January, but I cant afford it. So I wont get one. Do I expect VW to just bend over and hand me one FOC cause I want one ? no. So why should we expect to be able to watch games for free on the telebox ? Where does this type of pathetic, entitlement come from ?" Maybe its talked about for big games because they are big games?
I don't agree that games should be all there for free. I agree that all games that big (Super 8, provincial finals, SF, Final) should be free to air and on sky. People can watch whichever they want. I use NOW TV and prefer the sky coverage to RTE. RTE would have taken that deal all day long but Sky didn't want that....
Gator (Monaghan) - Posts: 238 - 06/08/2019 17:53:57
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I think it's probably just a bad deal to be honest and the GAA a being taken for a ride.
Markets are not determined by the best bidder.
The GAA's marginal gains from the deal aren't actually that huge.
It's simple where RTE where Sky paid higher than tv3.
The rate doesn't suddenly spike because of one rich player because they only have to pay more than the competition.
It also sounds like these deals are being renewed without them going back out to the market.
The GAA also changed the contract length to 5 years from 3 years out of the blue.
I think RTE haven't been getting a great deal for years but it's just not the case that Sky are paying significantly more.
http://historyhub.ie/sports-rights-commercialization-revisited-sky-and-the-gaa
This is an interesting paper on the deal.
I just think we're likely getting fooked.
Sky are only getting 10% of the number of viewers in to watch them that TV3 could for similar matches.
What's the real cost of that loss of promotion?
I think the sense of trust in the association also was impacted when they announced the deal. They'd steadfastly rejected it as even a possibility as late as 1 year before the deal was agreed.
The whole thing reeked.
I do think RTEs complaints are a lot of hot air though, there are better reasons than bed bound Paddy Joe to have the games on terrestrial television.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4226 - 06/08/2019 18:18:17
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I have Sky sports myself so can watch all the games. The main reason I have Sky Sports is that my son watches the soccer and basketball. However I do feel sympathy for GAA fans who want to watch games who dont have sky sports. No way would you pay for it just to watch a few gaelic matches in the summer. The analysis is great on sky but cant say I am comfortable with them having exclusive rights. Next time the TV rights come up for renewal, is there anything stopping Sky outbidding RTE and TV3 for all packages?
The other potential problem is that players are surely going to want a cut of the money at some point in the future. I wouldnt blame them either. Maybe I am overreacting but it feels like the inevitable outcome. By the way, does Sky Sports show any other sport where the participants are ametuers? I cant think of any.
Green_Gold (Donegal) - Posts: 1874 - 06/08/2019 18:24:40
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It's less of a concern for me but I do really hate the overall sports right industry and media platforms in general in how their are fragmenting the market for tv.
Adding new players to the market has been about increasing competition and lower costs, it's been an industry wide tactic to extract most value out of an industry that doesn't have much room for natural expansion.
There is value add in that more live sport and good quality programming is being produced by my good are they really squeezing people.
In the past if you wanted to see a TV3 show instead of RTE you change the channel.
If you want to see an Amazon Prime show but you've already gotten Netflix and Sky do you fork out for more.
It's also the demographic that this strategy targets.
Lower socioeconomic classes watch more tv. They have access to fewer other leisure activities like going to dinner or seeing plays etc. It's specifically squeezing the poorer class and also rural areas.
The GAA are in bed with these guys.
Look also at the ads on Sky, decent amount for vice activities like gambling and drinking. Pub licensing is an ever growing an significant cut of the profit of the industry.
I drink and gamble, I don't have a huge problem with vice industries personally but they do make all their profits from addicts.
If it wasn't for addicts by and large drinks companies couldn't survive at their current costs of production.
It's not really in keeping with the GAA's healthy lives message.
Ah yeah we'll get rid of drink advertising directly but we will still have exposure to it through this middle man, who'll keep most of the profits anyway.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4226 - 06/08/2019 18:31:02
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Also where does the extra money come from?
Sky are making a profit, how are they making that profit.
Particularly consider that paid tv significantly decrease the potential market share.
They make the money off you and I. Gaels.
So yes maybe Central Council makes more money, does the association as a whole make more money.
Not necessarily because the people who are paying for this are Gaels and they will have less income to spend generally and they will this have less capacity for giving in their own community and local team.
When you scratch in any little way at the surface and benefit the one number in central councils bottom line the whole deal holds up pretty badly to scrutiny.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4226 - 06/08/2019 18:37:01
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A few important points IMO:
1. Yes, RTE may have a vested interest in arguing against Sky getting exclusive rights to some games, but let's not forget that previously, TV3 and TG4 were showing the games that RTE didn't broadcast. These are terrestrial channels that are available to most people (unfortunately not everyone at present).
2. The GAA wheeled out the diaspora as the reason for the Sky deal. Yes, we got GAAGO but I am quite frankly sceptical that this was the real reason for the deal. Firstly, the GAA/RTE charges between €10 and €20 to watch an NFL or championship match, or €140 for a season pass, not exactly cheap. Secondly, in my experience the GAA top brass are not above milking the international GAA units, whether it be for an all-expenses paid junket or for various membership and affiliation fees that we get little return on.
3. The upper echelons of the GAA seem to be about making money and little else these days. The GAA has always pledged itself to be a communitarian organization and IMO selling exclusive rights to a pay per view broadcaster flies in the face of this.
4. Yes, there was a time (until the early 1990s) when only the latter stages of the All-Ireland series in hurling and football were shown. However, a hell of a lot of things have changed in Irish society since then and few people advocate for us to return to those traditions. Nobody thinks that every person should have a right to see everything, but IMO we should be doing our utmost to ensure as many people as possible can see our games. Remember that there are still parts of our island where Gaelic games play second fiddle to other major sports.
5. Finally, I would respectfully suggest that people are codding themselves if they think Sky are satisfied with just a few exclusive fixtures per year. I remember a time when paying your monthly Sky subscription would get you all the Premier League games. Then, a few years later, came pay per view fixtures. Then, the FA started splitting the rights to ensure that their games were distributed to several different channels, trousering the extra cash. Now, one needs subscriptions to several satellite tv channels if you want to see everything.
If you dance with the devil, he plays the tune.
Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 06/08/2019 18:43:13
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Replying To legendzxix: "There was a time only the semi-finals and finals were shown live. People who were not attending the other games listened to the commentary on the radio. Radio coverage is still available." There was a time when people didn't have electricity in their houses too.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13710 - 06/08/2019 18:54:56
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The main question I'd have against the Sky deal is to question whether or not the GAA is getting a good deal.
They're getting slightly more money from Sky and they're having the games hidden away behind a pay wall meaning that a lot less people end up watching them.
I think it's short term thinking, more money today versus exposure for the games is the debate.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13710 - 06/08/2019 19:00:41
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Replying To Gator: "Maybe its talked about for big games because they are big games?
I don't agree that games should be all there for free. I agree that all games that big (Super 8, provincial finals, SF, Final) should be free to air and on sky. People can watch whichever they want. I use NOW TV and prefer the sky coverage to RTE. RTE would have taken that deal all day long but Sky didn't want that...." Its ridiculous the only Country in the world that charges for a TV license and you can't watch the national game.
murphy32 (USA) - Posts: 15 - 06/08/2019 19:09:42
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Replying To Gleebo: "A few important points IMO:
1. Yes, RTE may have a vested interest in arguing against Sky getting exclusive rights to some games, but let's not forget that previously, TV3 and TG4 were showing the games that RTE didn't broadcast. These are terrestrial channels that are available to most people (unfortunately not everyone at present).
2. The GAA wheeled out the diaspora as the reason for the Sky deal. Yes, we got GAAGO but I am quite frankly sceptical that this was the real reason for the deal. Firstly, the GAA/RTE charges between €10 and €20 to watch an NFL or championship match, or €140 for a season pass, not exactly cheap. Secondly, in my experience the GAA top brass are not above milking the international GAA units, whether it be for an all-expenses paid junket or for various membership and affiliation fees that we get little return on.
3. The upper echelons of the GAA seem to be about making money and little else these days. The GAA has always pledged itself to be a communitarian organization and IMO selling exclusive rights to a pay per view broadcaster flies in the face of this.
4. Yes, there was a time (until the early 1990s) when only the latter stages of the All-Ireland series in hurling and football were shown. However, a hell of a lot of things have changed in Irish society since then and few people advocate for us to return to those traditions. Nobody thinks that every person should have a right to see everything, but IMO we should be doing our utmost to ensure as many people as possible can see our games. Remember that there are still parts of our island where Gaelic games play second fiddle to other major sports.
5. Finally, I would respectfully suggest that people are codding themselves if they think Sky are satisfied with just a few exclusive fixtures per year. I remember a time when paying your monthly Sky subscription would get you all the Premier League games. Then, a few years later, came pay per view fixtures. Then, the FA started splitting the rights to ensure that their games were distributed to several different channels, trousering the extra cash. Now, one needs subscriptions to several satellite tv channels if you want to see everything.
If you dance with the devil, he plays the tune." Brilliant post Gleebo, summed it up better than I could manage.
JoeSoap (Donegal) - Posts: 1432 - 06/08/2019 19:45:01
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Basically what Whammo said....
A pillar of sense man.
MesAmis (Dublin) - Posts: 13710 - 06/08/2019 19:47:11
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Replying To murphy32: "Its ridiculous the only Country in the world that charges for a TV license and you can't watch the national game." The UK has a license fee.
Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4226 - 06/08/2019 19:53:34
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Replying To Tom1916: "On another note I see that RTE are banning viewers from the 6 counties from their competitions on The Sunday Game etc." About time. Don't pay the license fee why be able to enter. We not allowed to enter the ones on ITV BBC's so don't see the problem
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 06/08/2019 20:06:40
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"Why should anybody have the God-given right to see all games on television? Who coined that phrase and put it out there as if that's the issue we're arguing about, when we say we are being deprived of watching our games on Saor view / free to air.The more this contentious issue is being debated the more uglier and insensitive it gets. This issue cannot be back dated 30 or 40 years and throw in the argument of, "when there was one game a week if you were lucky", that was then this is now, there was no sky PPV then but there is now and that's only part of the argument, the gaa in its entirety supposingly "prides" itself on being proactive in every parish,community,club,school,village, and nursing homes, those lucky enough to be looked after in those nursing homes find their families paying anything between 1100 and 1350 euros a week albeit subsidised, along with that they have to surrender their pension book, then there are those at home who cannot afford to the luxury of a nursing home, fact, On behalf of those unfortunate people let me say they are most certainly entitled to look at any gaelic game of their choice on free to air / soar view and not PPV, it's a National entitlement. I compare this PPV charges to the water charges, some protested and paid their charge others refused to pay and protested, the rest is history and water is still our free entitlement, so too a cairde gael is our national games.
When the back door was signed off in 2000 I walked away from it (literally) in protest with no regrets, the super 8's brought with it more back doors in the guise of the round robin, dead rubbers and a thin wedge to separate the elite from the also rans, .Mickey Harte favours the super 8's and I respect that, but I just wonder if Mickey was from a weak county would he still be pushing for its retention, sky included.
People are conveniently missing the point here, no one that I'm aware of has an issue with either sky or eir, or do I, the contentious issue is only with the three or four people who signed off the deal without putting it to the clubs to vote on, should that have happened then what ever the outcome I would have agreed with the vote reluctantly or otherwise, even though the gaa is an amateur sport on the field of play, but off the field it's professional.
Sky and eir are multinational companies worth billons possibly, akin to that is our RTE, a corner shop heavily in debt.
Personally I am lucky that I can afford PPV but on principal I won't connect.
I can always say I never left the gaa, - - - - rather it left me.
supersub15 (Carlow) - Posts: 2907 - 06/08/2019 20:41:04
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