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Kilkenny and Tipp Give Us A Traditional All Ireland Hurling Final

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Replying To PaudieSull1:  "Seriously??? What is really embarrassing though is the likes of Offaly men coming on here as 'cheerleaders' for KK, have they no self pride....any wonder they are now a Christy Ring county......"
Pot, kettle, black.

You're a Tipp cheerleader.

Also people in glasshouses. You've fallen a lot since Gerard McGratten fired over those splendid points v Cork in 1992. All counties rise and fall. Offaly will be back.

BliainanÁir (Laois) - Posts: 598 - 23/08/2019 19:48:25    2228859

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Replying To midlands:  "Get your facts right Faithfull. Maher didn't end Michael Rice's career (nor even his carrier). In fact Rice played in the league final the following spring (2013), but suffered a cruciate ligament injury in 2014 year which effectively ended his inter-county career, although he did go on to win an Intermediate All-Ireland with his club Carrickshock in 2117.

Then again, it's hard to take seriously someone who selected Joey Holden on their team of the year, ahead of such players as Liam Ryan, Cathal Barrett, Paul Murphy and Richie English, among others."
My facts are plenty right, Rice spent 3 days in hospital after the incident and months in rehab afterwards. Never got the full use back on his hand that completely hindered his inter county career. By the time he did the cruciate he was barely able to make an impact for the club team never mind the county.

I stand by my decision with Holden. As someone who went to most of the Leinster games rather than watching the odd game from the arm chair Holden had his best year for Kilkenny to date and he has an all star. Murphy who you mention as a better alternative had a shocking Leinster campaign and was completely cleaned out against Galway before been sent off. You should maybe go to a few games next year and see what these lads do when the camera isn't watching.

Faithfull (Offaly) - Posts: 573 - 23/08/2019 20:04:23    2228863

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Replying To Killarney.87:  "I'll be honest with you, i'm trying to recall the Laois sending off. From what I remember of it Maher did make a meal of it.

As for Michael Rice's injury nobody wants to see a player's career effectively end after a challenge like that (he tried hard to get back). No right minded Tipp fan or player would take any pleasure from it. Michael Rice was a great player for Kilkenny and seems like a top bloke too. Padraic Maher was wound up because Tipp were being thrashed, TJ and other Kilkenny players were hanging out of him and cynically fouling him. He shouldn't have reacted to it, I don't condone his wild challenge on Rice, I assume he didn't mean to injure him, and I am not defending him either.

Going back to the point about Tipp adopting a tactic of getting opposition players sent off/ booked is insulting to Liam Sheedy and the whole panel (players and management).

All I am seeing here all week is reasons to discredit Tipp's All Ireland win. Limerick were the first team to win under this new structure and were rightfully lauded for it. We won 7 out of 8 games, this was a hard won title."
I think there is absolutely no way Liam Sheedy sends his teams out with a deliberate tactic to get players sent off. He just doesn't come across as that type of manager, I just can't picture a scenario where he's instructing players to try get lads sent off. Other managers, it wouldn't be that big a leap to imagine it, but not him. That's not to say Tipp players (and players on most if not all teams) don't partake in playacting of their own accord, but I seriously doubt it's coming from the top.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1082 - 23/08/2019 20:19:46    2228868

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Replying To BliainanÁir:  "So stop you whining pussy cats, Cause we don't give a f**k, It's the Premier boys in blue & gold, That get the McCarthy Cup!"

There'll always be an asterix beside 2019 and ye know it.
Like 1989 (John Denton, Tony Keady affair reported by Tipp men and Antrim in the final). That was another one won by taking out opposition men through cute ho*orism!

I was delighted for ye in 2010, 2001, 1991, 2016 when ye WON your all-irelands."
You've got to be joking. You don't think Tipp legitimately won this All-Ireland? We played 8 games in this championship, beating Cork, Clare, Waterford, Limerick, Wexford and Kilkenny along the way (as well as a Laois team who'd accounted for Dublin), it might be the hardest won AI we've ever had.

And whatever your view on the sending off is, we'd drawn level at the time it happened, after a very poor first 20 mins, and were beginning to really hurl. And of course the sending off was going to have some effect, but it happened just before half time, which would have given Kilkenny time to regroup during the break. If we''d ended up winning the game by one or two points, you could point more effectively to the sending off as a factor, Richie Hogan would have been good for a few more in the 2nd half (although that said, we hit our best in the Wexford game after going down to 14 men). But we ended up winning by 14 points, and never looked in trouble in the 2nd half. Richie Hogan staying on the field might have reduced the winning margin a bit, but it would not have changed the final outcome. We were just the better team on the day, and deserved to win regardless. We've been on the other side of these results, every All Ireland is hard won.

Marlon_JD (Tipperary) - Posts: 1733 - 23/08/2019 20:35:15    2228872

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Replying To ballydalane:  "They're as entitled to support Kilkenny as you are to support Tipp."
I don't think PaudiSull supports Tipp based on previous posts.

Killarney.87 (Tipperary) - Posts: 2507 - 23/08/2019 20:36:17    2228873

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Replying To ballydalane:  "I think there is absolutely no way Liam Sheedy sends his teams out with a deliberate tactic to get players sent off. He just doesn't come across as that type of manager, I just can't picture a scenario where he's instructing players to try get lads sent off. Other managers, it wouldn't be that big a leap to imagine it, but not him. That's not to say Tipp players (and players on most if not all teams) don't partake in playacting of their own accord, but I seriously doubt it's coming from the top."
Thanks Ballydalane good to see some common sense shining through in this thread.

Killarney.87 (Tipperary) - Posts: 2507 - 23/08/2019 20:37:53    2228874

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Replying To Faithfull:  "My facts are plenty right, Rice spent 3 days in hospital after the incident and months in rehab afterwards. Never got the full use back on his hand that completely hindered his inter county career. By the time he did the cruciate he was barely able to make an impact for the club team never mind the county.

I stand by my decision with Holden. As someone who went to most of the Leinster games rather than watching the odd game from the arm chair Holden had his best year for Kilkenny to date and he has an all star. Murphy who you mention as a better alternative had a shocking Leinster campaign and was completely cleaned out against Galway before been sent off. You should maybe go to a few games next year and see what these lads do when the camera isn't watching."
The cameras were watching the Kilkenny v Galway game you refer to because it was live on RTE. Joey Holden isn't near an all star.Neither is Paul Murphy.I wouldn't have Eoin Murphy getting the goalkeeper all star this year either.He's the best goalkeeper in the country but he had a poor enough Summer.He might have done better for Niall O'Meara's goal which was the real game changer last Sunday.

endgame (Roscommon) - Posts: 1148 - 23/08/2019 20:39:07    2228875

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Replying To ballydalane:  "I think there is absolutely no way Liam Sheedy sends his teams out with a deliberate tactic to get players sent off. He just doesn't come across as that type of manager, I just can't picture a scenario where he's instructing players to try get lads sent off. Other managers, it wouldn't be that big a leap to imagine it, but not him. That's not to say Tipp players (and players on most if not all teams) don't partake in playacting of their own accord, but I seriously doubt it's coming from the top."
Fair comment (as usual) Ballydalane. It's a bit strange that most of the anti-Tipp vitriol is coming from Offaly and Laois. Then again, maybe not. Apart from a few ex-players, most of the narrative coming from Kilkenny is balanced and fair.

midlands (Westmeath) - Posts: 89 - 23/08/2019 20:46:18    2228878

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This is so sweet. It's now Friday after all Ireland and still moaning. Get them sour grapes into lads, its getting sweeter by the day.

therealtmo (Tipperary) - Posts: 1270 - 23/08/2019 20:55:16    2228881

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Replying To Faithfull:  "My facts are plenty right, Rice spent 3 days in hospital after the incident and months in rehab afterwards. Never got the full use back on his hand that completely hindered his inter county career. By the time he did the cruciate he was barely able to make an impact for the club team never mind the county.

I stand by my decision with Holden. As someone who went to most of the Leinster games rather than watching the odd game from the arm chair Holden had his best year for Kilkenny to date and he has an all star. Murphy who you mention as a better alternative had a shocking Leinster campaign and was completely cleaned out against Galway before been sent off. You should maybe go to a few games next year and see what these lads do when the camera isn't watching."
Thanks for the advice, Faithfull, but if you must know I was at ten championship games in total this year and would have attended more but for illness. By the way, Holden can thank Shefflin for his all-star because he kept plugging him at every opportunity. It was even claimed he contained Joe Canning in the 2015 final, ignoring the fact that he had plenty of back-up from his fellow defenders, including Paul Murphy. When he was on his own 12 months later his direct opponent took him for nine points from play in the final.

midlands (Westmeath) - Posts: 89 - 23/08/2019 20:57:08    2228882

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Replying To Marlon_JD:  "
Replying To BliainanÁir:  "So stop you whining pussy cats, Cause we don't give a f**k, It's the Premier boys in blue & gold, That get the McCarthy Cup!"

There'll always be an asterix beside 2019 and ye know it.
Like 1989 (John Denton, Tony Keady affair reported by Tipp men and Antrim in the final). That was another one won by taking out opposition men through cute ho*orism!

I was delighted for ye in 2010, 2001, 1991, 2016 when ye WON your all-irelands."
You've got to be joking. You don't think Tipp legitimately won this All-Ireland? We played 8 games in this championship, beating Cork, Clare, Waterford, Limerick, Wexford and Kilkenny along the way (as well as a Laois team who'd accounted for Dublin), it might be the hardest won AI we've ever had.

And whatever your view on the sending off is, we'd drawn level at the time it happened, after a very poor first 20 mins, and were beginning to really hurl. And of course the sending off was going to have some effect, but it happened just before half time, which would have given Kilkenny time to regroup during the break. If we''d ended up winning the game by one or two points, you could point more effectively to the sending off as a factor, Richie Hogan would have been good for a few more in the 2nd half (although that said, we hit our best in the Wexford game after going down to 14 men). But we ended up winning by 14 points, and never looked in trouble in the 2nd half. Richie Hogan staying on the field might have reduced the winning margin a bit, but it would not have changed the final outcome. We were just the better team on the day, and deserved to win regardless. We've been on the other side of these results, every All Ireland is hard won."
Hey Marlon, I hope you enjoyed the game and the celebrations since then. The suggestion of a handy route to the final is very insulting to Laois and Wexford. Both teams were unbeaten before Tipp beat them and for very good reason.

Laois were excellent this year and really put it up to Tipp in the quarter final. That's the best Laois team in the last 30 years. Wexford came through Leinster unbeaten and are improving each year. I think there is an all Ireland in the current Wexford team if the players keep at it.

Killarney.87 (Tipperary) - Posts: 2507 - 23/08/2019 21:12:44    2228884

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Any chance of getting some actual chat about when the ball was in play in the all Ireland?
Either that or close the thread

tiobraid (Tipperary) - Posts: 2724 - 23/08/2019 21:20:11    2228888

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Replying To tiobraid:  "Any chance of getting some actual chat about when the ball was in play in the all Ireland?
Either that or close the thread"
The stage is yours!

Ban (Westmeath) - Posts: 1015 - 23/08/2019 22:00:33    2228900

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Replying To tiobraid:  "Any chance of getting some actual chat about when the ball was in play in the all Ireland?
Either that or close the thread"
Agreed.

I think Tipp and Sheedy deserve immense credit for two turnarounds.

1-from their position in 2018
2-from the Munster Final

It takes a lot to persevere and inspire belief when you have a bad year or a bad defeat. Tipp beat three fine Leinster teams in Laois, Wexford and Kilkenny. They won 7 out 8 championship games. Last year's champions won 6 drew 1 and lost 1.

Two years into the new format Managers next year might be thinking of the value of a strong, match experienced squad which will hopefully set us up for a good NHL. I honestly can't wait to see our lads in competitive fare again.

Well done Limerick, Wexford on the NHL and Provincial titles but sincere congratulations to Tipp - deserved all Ireland champions 2019.

Roll on 2020!

slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6189 - 23/08/2019 22:10:00    2228905

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Replying To Marlon_JD:  "
Replying To BliainanÁir:  "So stop you whining pussy cats, Cause we don't give a f**k, It's the Premier boys in blue & gold, That get the McCarthy Cup!"

There'll always be an asterix beside 2019 and ye know it.
Like 1989 (John Denton, Tony Keady affair reported by Tipp men and Antrim in the final). That was another one won by taking out opposition men through cute ho*orism!

I was delighted for ye in 2010, 2001, 1991, 2016 when ye WON your all-irelands."
You've got to be joking. You don't think Tipp legitimately won this All-Ireland? We played 8 games in this championship, beating Cork, Clare, Waterford, Limerick, Wexford and Kilkenny along the way (as well as a Laois team who'd accounted for Dublin), it might be the hardest won AI we've ever had.

And whatever your view on the sending off is, we'd drawn level at the time it happened, after a very poor first 20 mins, and were beginning to really hurl. And of course the sending off was going to have some effect, but it happened just before half time, which would have given Kilkenny time to regroup during the break. If we''d ended up winning the game by one or two points, you could point more effectively to the sending off as a factor, Richie Hogan would have been good for a few more in the 2nd half (although that said, we hit our best in the Wexford game after going down to 14 men). But we ended up winning by 14 points, and never looked in trouble in the 2nd half. Richie Hogan staying on the field might have reduced the winning margin a bit, but it would not have changed the final outcome. We were just the better team on the day, and deserved to win regardless. We've been on the other side of these results, every All Ireland is hard won."
Of course Tipp deserve the win, they were the best team in the Championship and best team on the day. A lot of Tipp posters continue to try convince everyone that Tipp would have won anyway, that they had weathered the KK storm and that Richie Hogan is not worth 14 points, which is a strange way of looking at the effect of a sending off. But no one knows, i could claim that by the 30th minute KK had weathered the Tipp storm since from then to half time it was Tipp 3 points - KK 2 points, and with KK a point down at half time, their usual strong start to the second half should set them up for a win, but its all imaterial now. Kk did not handle the situation well and Tipp made hay and thrived on the space they were making and were deserving winners

Heftydickonem (Kilkenny) - Posts: 143 - 23/08/2019 22:54:38    2228919

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Replying To midlands:  "Thanks for the advice, Faithfull, but if you must know I was at ten championship games in total this year and would have attended more but for illness. By the way, Holden can thank Shefflin for his all-star because he kept plugging him at every opportunity. It was even claimed he contained Joe Canning in the 2015 final, ignoring the fact that he had plenty of back-up from his fellow defenders, including Paul Murphy. When he was on his own 12 months later his direct opponent took him for nine points from play in the final."
I saw Holden and Kilkenny a few times live this year myself and I cant say I was overly impressed by him. Lawlor looked much improved as the year went on but maybe not yet an all star. Paul Murphy not as good as a few years ago. Walsh was solid but not spectacular. I think they really missed Buckley.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 790 - 23/08/2019 23:23:46    2228926

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Replying To ballydalane:  "Did you think Bill Cooper's shoulder charge to the head of Richie Hogan in the QF should have been a red card offence?"
Yes,it was reckless and dangerous.Read my post again,I said all red card offences.

over35hurler (Cork) - Posts: 27 - 24/08/2019 15:30:53    2229013

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Replying To ballydalane:  "Did you think Bill Cooper's shoulder charge to the head of Richie Hogan in the QF should have been a red card offence?"
Yes,it was reckless and dangerous.Read my post again,I said all red card offences.

over35hurler (Cork) - Posts: 27 - 24/08/2019 15:40:45    2229014

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Replying To over35hurler:  "Yes,it was reckless and dangerous.Read my post again,I said all red card offences."
Fair response.

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1082 - 24/08/2019 21:35:14    2229046

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Replying To over35hurler:  "Yes,it was reckless and dangerous.Read my post again,I said all red card offences."
Just curious about language and the rules. Is there a distinction made between reckless play and dangerous play?
Seems to me reckless play is not always punished with a red card or even a yellow card.

baire (Galway) - Posts: 766 - 25/08/2019 00:56:20    2229089

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