National Forum

2019 Division 1 League Final.

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Replying To GreenandRed:  "It would be great to have a Ciaran Mc calibre of forward but I don't think we need one unless all the forwards are also contributing. We need 6 forwards to be able to kick points, goals at the right time, not to pass it off when opportunities are there in the last 10 minutes. Since 2011 we have been too reliant on Cillian's frees which I think has put an 'I can get a free here' mentality in some heads rather than taking a chance themselves. Past few years we've also become too reliant on Andy to do something up front. Similar to how we were with Ciaran, who was unreal mostly, but I think it upset the balance of the team. Last Sunday was only a League Final, preseason you could say. But I thought we went for it more than usual and for me part of that was because we didn't have the comfort blanket of a good freetaker. Better to be trying from play, missing some as we did, and improving for the championship."
Ciaran McDonald overrated, was slagged for years by Mayo people and all over the country then retires and becomes this all time great which he never was. Had moments of brilliance no doubt but that's it.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9520 - 06/04/2019 13:53:33    2177899

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Replying To alano12:  "yes a truly special forward on the level of ciaran mcdonald etc"
As special as Ciaran was I can recall him missing a 14m free, dead straight in front of the goal in the AI final of 1997. He was young at the time but If Mayo had been defending champions that year, would he have felt the same pressure?

Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 1931 - 06/04/2019 14:01:30    2177900

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Replying To Pericles:  "As special as Ciaran was I can recall him missing a 14m free, dead straight in front of the goal in the AI final of 1997. He was young at the time but If Mayo had been defending champions that year, would he have felt the same pressure?"
He missed loads and kicked ball after ball away Andy Moran a way bigger Mayo legend who does it always on the biggest of occasions and still doing it.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9520 - 06/04/2019 14:27:08    2177901

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I don't think we will see Tommy Walsh starting for Kerry again. Whatever about Sean O Shea being slow Tommy can hardly run at all - the experiment was always doomed to fail. I think Sean will play very well in the championship; BTW, at one stage in the first half for a Kerry kickout Keegan had both his arms about Sean - a normal enough activity for Keegan. Sean will know better how to 'manage' the situation should it recur.
Kerry could easily have won so I don't understand either the bullishness of Mayo or the pessimism of Kerry. As Joe Brolly said, albeit in 2018, it's over for this Mayo squad. Kerry have a far more healthy age profile.
And, Paddy Power - a good judge in these matters - has Kerry at 4s and Mayo at 8s for the All Ireland.

Aibrean (Kerry) - Posts: 21 - 06/04/2019 15:59:17    2177908

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Replying To clondalkindub:  "Ciaran McDonald overrated, was slagged for years by Mayo people and all over the country then retires and becomes this all time great which he never was. Had moments of brilliance no doubt but that's it."
Not overrated I'd say, but didn't do it every game. But no forward of his era had his skill I'll argue. First semi final against Fermanagh in 2004 was one of the best games I saw him play. Did his usual good job in attacking sense but was also doing a good defensive shift in an era when forwards didn't track back as much as now.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 5000 - 06/04/2019 15:59:19    2177909

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Except for Maurice Fitzgerald!

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 5000 - 06/04/2019 16:05:49    2177910

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Replying To clondalkindub:  "He missed loads and kicked ball after ball away Andy Moran a way bigger Mayo legend who does it always on the biggest of occasions and still doing it."
in fairness to mcdonald he probably lacked the team around him compared to the current team especially at the back/midfield

alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 06/04/2019 17:50:58    2177919

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Mayo won't win an all ireland until they stop conceding goals. 2 conceded the last day and should have been 3.

Mayo have plated 7 final matches since 2004
conceding 13 goals and have not kept a clean sheet in any of the 7 matches

contrast to Dublin who played 7 final matches since 2013 conceding 5 goals.

if i was the Mayo management i'd get the videos of the Dublin team out and see if i could learn something from the system they are employing

centerfield (Mayo) - Posts: 233 - 06/04/2019 20:13:34    2177926

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Replying To Aibrean:  "I don't think we will see Tommy Walsh starting for Kerry again. Whatever about Sean O Shea being slow Tommy can hardly run at all - the experiment was always doomed to fail. I think Sean will play very well in the championship; BTW, at one stage in the first half for a Kerry kickout Keegan had both his arms about Sean - a normal enough activity for Keegan. Sean will know better how to 'manage' the situation should it recur.
Kerry could easily have won so I don't understand either the bullishness of Mayo or the pessimism of Kerry. As Joe Brolly said, albeit in 2018, it's over for this Mayo squad. Kerry have a far more healthy age profile.
And, Paddy Power - a good judge in these matters - has Kerry at 4s and Mayo at 8s for the All Ireland."
Good and all as they are as judges did the same Paddy Powers not have Kerry odds on to win the League final? Odd how you you focus on Leroy as any back worth their salt on both sides was doing much the same. Not sure what's normal for young Tom O Sullivan but we know now that Kev Mc was wearing a good quality jersey. Maybe Kev will "manage" the situation better when they meet again. Do you think Toms manager took him to one side after and told him we don't do things that way down in Kerry. He did in his ####. I have great respect for Kerry but they will do what they have to do to win same as any other team and make no apologies either. Sure when all else fails blame Lee Keegan.

Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 957 - 06/04/2019 20:27:13    2177930

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Replying To GreenandRed:  "Except for Maurice Fitzgerald!"
Mattie Forde of Wexford was as good a forward as you will see. Unbelievable skill. Would have easily made it with Dublin or Kerry. Mattie could score from any distance any angle. Magic!

Blockandhook (Wexford) - Posts: 112 - 06/04/2019 20:36:35    2177931

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Replying To Blockandhook:  "Mattie Forde of Wexford was as good a forward as you will see. Unbelievable skill. Would have easily made it with Dublin or Kerry. Mattie could score from any distance any angle. Magic!"
Forde was one of the best I have seen, he was the best forward in the game for a while IMO. Would have walked on to any team ever at his peak.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1127 - 06/04/2019 22:23:48    2177936

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Replying To Blockandhook:  "Mattie Forde of Wexford was as good a forward as you will see. Unbelievable skill. Would have easily made it with Dublin or Kerry. Mattie could score from any distance any angle. Magic!"
incredible player

alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 07/04/2019 11:30:36    2177953

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Replying To Blockandhook:  "Mattie Forde of Wexford was as good a forward as you will see. Unbelievable skill. Would have easily made it with Dublin or Kerry. Mattie could score from any distance any angle. Magic!"
Absolutely. He was unmarkable at his best. He put up massive tallies regularly and kicked incredible scores as if they were routine.
I remember being at the Galway-Kerry quarter final in 2008, which was a double-header with Wexford-Armagh. Mattie put on a show that day, as did Michael Meehan in the following game.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 415 - 07/04/2019 20:00:44    2177983

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Too much is being made of the league win by Mayo, James Horan saying they should have won by 10 or 12 points won't help the cause much when the championship comes round either, I think if the league was worth winning Dublin would have won it, suits them now getting revved up for the 5 in a row, who can stop them?

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 534 - 07/04/2019 23:56:41    2178000

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Replying To Aibrean:  "I don't think we will see Tommy Walsh starting for Kerry again. Whatever about Sean O Shea being slow Tommy can hardly run at all - the experiment was always doomed to fail. I think Sean will play very well in the championship; BTW, at one stage in the first half for a Kerry kickout Keegan had both his arms about Sean - a normal enough activity for Keegan. Sean will know better how to 'manage' the situation should it recur.
Kerry could easily have won so I don't understand either the bullishness of Mayo or the pessimism of Kerry. As Joe Brolly said, albeit in 2018, it's over for this Mayo squad. Kerry have a far more healthy age profile.
And, Paddy Power - a good judge in these matters - has Kerry at 4s and Mayo at 8s for the All Ireland."
The only reason Kerry are 4/1 is they are almost guaranteed to be in the super 8s. Were they to traverse Ulster on Connaught they would be 8 or 10s

theblackcard (Mayo) - Posts: 41 - 08/04/2019 08:27:58    2178004

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Replying To Llaw_Gyffes:  "I don't think Mayo people are getting carried away. Yes we were surprised to beat Kerry, as were the bookies. Yes we're delighted to win a national title and both players and supporters celebrated because it made such a change from losing finals. Yes we are a little more upbeat about this years championship because after last summer we felt we had an ageing team with very little new talent coming through. We still have an ageing team but maybe there is more talent coming through than we thought. Do we think that because we won the League we are going to win the All Ireland? Not at all. We will be second favourites to win Connacht and getting to the super eights would be an improvement on last year. As for Kerry, everyone knows that they are a work in progress and that they will be, at the very least, in a semi final this Summer. Before the League we knew that Dublin were well well ahead of a chasing pack that includes Galway, Tyrone, Kerry, Mayo and Monaghan. After the League we know that Dublin are well ahead of the chasing pack that includes Galway, Tyrone, Kerry, Mayo, Monaghan and Donegal."
Yeah I wasn't suggesting it was Mayo people losing the run of themselves. Just people in general over-reacting to both Kerry and Mayo's performance.

Breffni39 (Cavan) - Posts: 11551 - 08/04/2019 10:15:46    2178017

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Replying To theblackcard:  "The only reason Kerry are 4/1 is they are almost guaranteed to be in the super 8s. Were they to traverse Ulster on Connaught they would be 8 or 10s"
Can be the only explanation, come the summer we'll see other counties odds shorten as they make the super 8's.

JDF (Galway) - Posts: 263 - 10/04/2019 10:14:28    2178329

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