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2019 Division 1 League Final.

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Replying To Pericles:  "Mayo U21 team v Sligo in the Connacht final: Robert Hennelly; Eoghan O'Reilly, Kevin Keane, John Broderick; Donal Vaughan, Lee Keegan, Kevin McLoughlin; Tom Parsons Aidan O'Shea; Cathal Carolan, Frank Burke, Brian Gallagher; Michael Sweeney, Neill Douglas, Jason Doherty. Subs: Sean Prendergast for Broderick (26 mins ), Conor Jordan for Neill Douglas (53 mins ), Niall Prenty for Frank Burke (54 mins ), Jason Gibbons for Cathal Carolan.

A fair number made the step up under James Horan to senior from that side, which lost the semi-final to Down, who in turn were pipped by Cork in the final. Amazing how few of those Cork and Down players went on to make a name for themselves despite being talented, although I'm sure a few of the Cork lads were on the panel that won Sam the year after. Shows the difference having the senior structures right makes."
Meant to mention the year... 2009.

Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 1981 - 04/04/2019 16:37:01    2177722

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Replying To Aibrean:  "What do the Kerry experts think about the Tommy Walsh experiment now? Was it a waste of time?."
He had a good league and made the mark rule pay dividends for Kerry. He was worth trying against the Mayo fb line in the final based on that form, but he'll probably be a bench option come the summer, taking over from Donaghy as the Hail Mary ball winner if Kerry find themselves in a tight spot. PK obviously wants him about... is he now the Kerry player with oldest playing link to the senior squad (debut 2008, I think)?

Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 1981 - 04/04/2019 17:09:29    2177728

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Replying To maroondiesel:  "Why was Boyle awarded a free out when he caught the saved attempt from Clifford? Glad for Mayo but just curious"
one of these things that never got mentioned, don't know really

suckvalleypaddy (Galway) - Posts: 1224 - 04/04/2019 17:30:44    2177732

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Replying To GeniusGerry:  "Not a waste of time, he may have some part to play but I'm not convinced that he offers enough as a starter. A fully fit and in-form Paul Geaney is ahead of him IMO and a Clifford / Geaney inside line offers a very decent aerial threat without Walsh. I'd certainly have him on the panel though.

I wouldn't be stressing too much about who will be starting there anyway, our problems lie elsewhere."
I think he was criminally underused last week. The quality of ball going into him wasn't good enough in the first half then can only remember one long ball going in during the 2nd.

Don't get why he wasn't brought out to the middle like he did against Galway. That change was one of the main reasons why you won that day, bizare when you think about give the struggles last Sunday

He's going to be a decent option to spring from the bench during the summer but as you say he's got bigger worries.

On another note surprised at the Kerry lads in the media blowing up O'Shea, he's clearly a brilliant prospect but there's been too much talk about him. I think he's going to find it very difficult to have the impact during the summer he's had during the league.

I'm not as sure as others are that Kerry will win an All Ireland in the next few years, they've a lot of good younger players and lot of lads 28+. Nearly every team that wins the All Ireland has plenty of lads aged in an around the mid 20's. Mentioned it on here before but think we're approaching a great era for the game with 3 or 4 teams winning in the next 5 or 6 years.

JDF (Galway) - Posts: 313 - 04/04/2019 18:56:03    2177739

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Replying To Pericles:  "Mayo U21 team v Sligo in the Connacht final: Robert Hennelly; Eoghan O'Reilly, Kevin Keane, John Broderick; Donal Vaughan, Lee Keegan, Kevin McLoughlin; Tom Parsons Aidan O'Shea; Cathal Carolan, Frank Burke, Brian Gallagher; Michael Sweeney, Neill Douglas, Jason Doherty. Subs: Sean Prendergast for Broderick (26 mins ), Conor Jordan for Neill Douglas (53 mins ), Niall Prenty for Frank Burke (54 mins ), Jason Gibbons for Cathal Carolan.

A fair number made the step up under James Horan to senior from that side, which lost the semi-final to Down, who in turn were pipped by Cork in the final. Amazing how few of those Cork and Down players went on to make a name for themselves despite being talented, although I'm sure a few of the Cork lads were on the panel that won Sam the year after. Shows the difference having the senior structures right makes."
wow, very impressive u21 side...what is also very notable is the majority guys who made the step up to senior are backs/midfielders/goalkeeper showing a lack of top level forward talent which has always been the achilles heel of this current mayo team who have lacked a top forward outside of andy moran the year he won player of the year.

alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 04/04/2019 19:16:37    2177743

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Replying To JDF:  "I think he was criminally underused last week. The quality of ball going into him wasn't good enough in the first half then can only remember one long ball going in during the 2nd.

Don't get why he wasn't brought out to the middle like he did against Galway. That change was one of the main reasons why you won that day, bizare when you think about give the struggles last Sunday

He's going to be a decent option to spring from the bench during the summer but as you say he's got bigger worries.

On another note surprised at the Kerry lads in the media blowing up O'Shea, he's clearly a brilliant prospect but there's been too much talk about him. I think he's going to find it very difficult to have the impact during the summer he's had during the league.

I'm not as sure as others are that Kerry will win an All Ireland in the next few years, they've a lot of good younger players and lot of lads 28+. Nearly every team that wins the All Ireland has plenty of lads aged in an around the mid 20's. Mentioned it on here before but think we're approaching a great era for the game with 3 or 4 teams winning in the next 5 or 6 years."
It's easy to forget that Seán O'Shea would still be U21 under the old system, Clifford and Diarmuid O'Connor are still U20 this year!! You're right it's far too young to be blowing these guys up and asking them to deliver all Ireland's.

I'd be very surprised if Keane doesn't put a very good team together throughout the 2020's though. There are some very good footballers coming up behind what is already there and it will click eventually when they all have a few years under their belt. They may even be competitive this year but Sunday gave us a glimpse of how far ahead teams like Mayo are in terms of physicality and overall experience and cuteness.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1498 - 04/04/2019 21:30:39    2177752

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Replying To GeniusGerry:  "It's easy to forget that Seán O'Shea would still be U21 under the old system, Clifford and Diarmuid O'Connor are still U20 this year!! You're right it's far too young to be blowing these guys up and asking them to deliver all Ireland's.

I'd be very surprised if Keane doesn't put a very good team together throughout the 2020's though. There are some very good footballers coming up behind what is already there and it will click eventually when they all have a few years under their belt. They may even be competitive this year but Sunday gave us a glimpse of how far ahead teams like Mayo are in terms of physicality and overall experience and cuteness."
With all the minor titles Kerry have won in a row you'd imagine they'd be tripping over talent.

Trump2020 (Galway) - Posts: 446 - 04/04/2019 23:11:26    2177763

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Kerry will be fine , I wouldn't worry too much about them. If Clifford scored that chance at the end , which he should have , we would all be saying what great bottle they had to come back and win after a sloppy 2nd half. It might just be the kick they needed and I'd imagine training will be very competitive down in the kingdom over the next few weeks, we're all expecting them to walk Munster. They will be a hard team to beat once the super 8's come around.

dublin5 (Dublin) - Posts: 30 - 05/04/2019 09:14:13    2177779

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First time Ive seen Kerry with no attacking plan really, they were doing it the Mayo way which is off the cuff and see what happens. Bad ball going into Clifford and Walsh but they were being well marked too.

tommy132 (Mayo) - Posts: 326 - 05/04/2019 09:41:48    2177782

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Replying To JDF:  "I think he was criminally underused last week. The quality of ball going into him wasn't good enough in the first half then can only remember one long ball going in during the 2nd.

Don't get why he wasn't brought out to the middle like he did against Galway. That change was one of the main reasons why you won that day, bizare when you think about give the struggles last Sunday

He's going to be a decent option to spring from the bench during the summer but as you say he's got bigger worries.

On another note surprised at the Kerry lads in the media blowing up O'Shea, he's clearly a brilliant prospect but there's been too much talk about him. I think he's going to find it very difficult to have the impact during the summer he's had during the league.

I'm not as sure as others are that Kerry will win an All Ireland in the next few years, they've a lot of good younger players and lot of lads 28+. Nearly every team that wins the All Ireland has plenty of lads aged in an around the mid 20's. Mentioned it on here before but think we're approaching a great era for the game with 3 or 4 teams winning in the next 5 or 6 years."
One thing with O Shea that clearly stood out Sunday is he lacks pace, CP is not that place to be if you lack a yard.

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9861 - 05/04/2019 09:45:02    2177783

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Replying To tommy132:  "First time Ive seen Kerry with no attacking plan really, they were doing it the Mayo way which is off the cuff and see what happens. Bad ball going into Clifford and Walsh but they were being well marked too."
They probably had a plan but were on the back foot for most of the game and couldn't get time on the ball. I'm sure they'll be working on these scenarios in training in the coming months, I.e. what to do when you are being pressed. It was a bit all over the place Sunday alright.

On O'Sheas pace I have seen quite a bit of him, he is not fast but he is not what I'd call slow either. Kerry were gassed in that second half in particular and I think a bit much is being made of it. I heard them talking about it on GAA hour as well. The main thing with Sean is to ensure he stays as that link between defence and attack. He is no use to kerry playing in the full back line.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 1498 - 05/04/2019 12:28:51    2177810

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Replying To clondalkindub:  "One thing with O Shea that clearly stood out Sunday is he lacks pace, CP is not that place to be if you lack a yard."
O Shea does lack pace. Lovely footballer with the ball in the hand but I do agree his pace could be his undoing when the sod dries up.
I think it was more the national media that was blowing him up during the league but he did kick some outrageous score which were enjoyable to watch.

But it all counts for nothing when summers comes around, pitches are good and hard and fitness levels are at their peak let's see what O Shea is made of then.

A note on the match...it was awful to watch by both teams, I am a general critic of Galway's tactics but Mayo and Kerry produced some awful crap.
Kerry learnt nothing from the league defeat and again got physically blown away.
Glad it happened now as eyes should be wide open that major improvements are needed and a handful of lands that played in the league final are just not up to it at this level.

woops (Kerry) - Posts: 2045 - 05/04/2019 12:35:10    2177812

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Far too much is being made of this game. Kerry are getting too much criticism and people are losing the run of themselves about Mayo. As much as I like the league, the bottom line is it's only the league. New managers, experimental teams etc. Sure we could've beaten both Kerry and Mayo in the league with our own new manager and blooding players etc but we're not being talked of in any way good or bad and rightly so, we got relegated. Keep things in context lads!

Breffni39 (Cavan) - Posts: 11556 - 05/04/2019 14:17:41    2177816

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Replying To Breffni39:  "Far too much is being made of this game. Kerry are getting too much criticism and people are losing the run of themselves about Mayo. As much as I like the league, the bottom line is it's only the league. New managers, experimental teams etc. Sure we could've beaten both Kerry and Mayo in the league with our own new manager and blooding players etc but we're not being talked of in any way good or bad and rightly so, we got relegated. Keep things in context lads!"
That's the nature of football analysis these days (and maybe always was). It's generally all or nothing.
At half-time in the Tyrone game we looked well on course for a league final and all was rosy. 35 minutes later the sky is caving in. Now it was a shocking second half performance from us, but had a decent league overall.
The main takeaway from the league final is that Kerry are a bit short physically, particularly in the middle third. That's to be expected given the number of young players they've introduced.
On the other side, Mayo look very strong but probably should've closed the game out more comfortably.
We'll see the real lay of the land in July and August.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 538 - 05/04/2019 16:03:11    2177826

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Replying To alano12:  "wow, very impressive u21 side...what is also very notable is the majority guys who made the step up to senior are backs/midfielders/goalkeeper showing a lack of top level forward talent which has always been the achilles heel of this current mayo team who have lacked a top forward outside of andy moran the year he won player of the year."
If you're meaning ff line talent Alan, then I'd have to agree with you, though we've always produced enough good half-forwards good at getting possession, tracking back and linking up play. Even the ff talent we have produced has often under performed due to a lack of confidence at the top level. Coming into a successful team is a huge thing for a forward and your own side has been the ideal environment for young players to fulfil their potential due to the huge positivity reinforcing their self-belief. Even us winning one Sam would change that for the younger lads coming through.

Pericles (Mayo) - Posts: 1981 - 05/04/2019 18:18:03    2177845

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Replying To Breffni39:  "Far too much is being made of this game. Kerry are getting too much criticism and people are losing the run of themselves about Mayo. As much as I like the league, the bottom line is it's only the league. New managers, experimental teams etc. Sure we could've beaten both Kerry and Mayo in the league with our own new manager and blooding players etc but we're not being talked of in any way good or bad and rightly so, we got relegated. Keep things in context lads!"
I don't think Mayo people are getting carried away. Yes we were surprised to beat Kerry, as were the bookies. Yes we're delighted to win a national title and both players and supporters celebrated because it made such a change from losing finals. Yes we are a little more upbeat about this years championship because after last summer we felt we had an ageing team with very little new talent coming through. We still have an ageing team but maybe there is more talent coming through than we thought. Do we think that because we won the League we are going to win the All Ireland? Not at all. We will be second favourites to win Connacht and getting to the super eights would be an improvement on last year. As for Kerry, everyone knows that they are a work in progress and that they will be, at the very least, in a semi final this Summer. Before the League we knew that Dublin were well well ahead of a chasing pack that includes Galway, Tyrone, Kerry, Mayo and Monaghan. After the League we know that Dublin are well ahead of the chasing pack that includes Galway, Tyrone, Kerry, Mayo, Monaghan and Donegal.

Llaw_Gyffes (Mayo) - Posts: 1047 - 05/04/2019 20:45:55    2177855

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How crazy is it now that the football season apart from Mayo v Galway Monaghan/Donegal/Tyrone against each other the season is off til August bank holiday weekend. How can they still allow this ridiculousness continue every year?

clondalkindub (Dublin) - Posts: 9861 - 05/04/2019 21:13:04    2177858

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Replying To Pericles:  "If you're meaning ff line talent Alan, then I'd have to agree with you, though we've always produced enough good half-forwards good at getting possession, tracking back and linking up play. Even the ff talent we have produced has often under performed due to a lack of confidence at the top level. Coming into a successful team is a huge thing for a forward and your own side has been the ideal environment for young players to fulfil their potential due to the huge positivity reinforcing their self-belief. Even us winning one Sam would change that for the younger lads coming through."
yes a truly special forward on the level of ciaran mcdonald etc

alano12 (Dublin) - Posts: 2208 - 05/04/2019 23:12:27    2177872

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Replying To Breffni39:  "Far too much is being made of this game. Kerry are getting too much criticism and people are losing the run of themselves about Mayo. As much as I like the league, the bottom line is it's only the league. New managers, experimental teams etc. Sure we could've beaten both Kerry and Mayo in the league with our own new manager and blooding players etc but we're not being talked of in any way good or bad and rightly so, we got relegated. Keep things in context lads!"
No hype on mayo as much as you seem to like to big it up..we can't co trip what the media say. Horan experimented big time in the league so don't really get your point...

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 9820 - 06/04/2019 10:09:30    2177881

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It would be great to have a Ciaran Mc calibre of forward but I don't think we need one unless all the forwards are also contributing. We need 6 forwards to be able to kick points, goals at the right time, not to pass it off when opportunities are there in the last 10 minutes. Since 2011 we have been too reliant on Cillian's frees which I think has put an 'I can get a free here' mentality in some heads rather than taking a chance themselves. Past few years we've also become too reliant on Andy to do something up front. Similar to how we were with Ciaran, who was unreal mostly, but I think it upset the balance of the team. Last Sunday was only a League Final, preseason you could say. But I thought we went for it more than usual and for me part of that was because we didn't have the comfort blanket of a good freetaker. Better to be trying from play, missing some as we did, and improving for the championship.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 5406 - 06/04/2019 12:22:37    2177893

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