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Why Are Dubliners Choosing To Give The Greatest Dublin Team Ever A Miss

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Replying To legendzxix:  "The post you quoted did say that if an area can have 3 county councils and a city council, having 4 Regions like that should mean it's something to be looked at."
This split you speak of, would it have 4 separate county boards? four stadiums? Four Club leagues and championships? Would a split be exclusive to football? The idea of a split would be to create viable county structure, not to simply to weaken a county to extinction.

FOB (Dublin) - Posts: 912 - 18/08/2018 11:19:17    2134201

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Replying To essmac:  "Simple answer - none of the other teams are good enough to beat Dublin. Or, in the case of most counties' teams, even to give them a decent game. Dublin are now so hard to beat that we more or less know the result before any game involving Dublin is played. It's not quite as bad as a 100 metres final involving Usain Bolt and a bunch of dart players, but you get the idea. Sport thrives on unpredictability of outcome. Take that away, and much of the interest goes with it. People are keen to go to matches - they're just not that keen on going to mis-matches.

None of this is Dublin's fault, of course. This Dublin team has an excellent panel, a smart manager, a sophisticated understanding of match strategy and a 100% competitive mentality. Time for the other counties to up their game instead of looking for excuses."
You're fully right that counties have to look at themselves. We neglected our youth. We have taken responsibility for that as seen by the minor All-Irelands won in recent years.

Again though, in 2001 there was a valid argument for Dublin entering the Railway Cup. This was 10 years before they won their next All-Ireland.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 11:23:15    2134202

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Replying To arock:  "What awful inaccurate rubbish you have peddled here. I urge everyone to read this:
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/here-are-the-2320-clubs-that-will-get-a-share-of-the-56m-sports-capital-grants-816499.html

These are a listing of everything spent by Government on all sporting clubs and bodies. These are govt and tax payers money they have to be distributed FAIRLY to all tax payers the vast majority of them live in Dublin nearly 33%. So are Dublin taxpayers not entitled to what every one else?

These are capital grants for individual clubs to build and help them out, Plunkets for instance to repair a damaged roof and flood damage to a hall - nothing in list of clubs will give Dublin county teams the edge on the playing field.

So what you are advocating is denying Dublin clubs taxpayers money to improve their infrastructure because they are from Dublin? that is in effect what you are advocating. If clubs have special needs around the country they can apply like everyone else to obtain Govt grant aid. But i suspect you and your won't, can't grasp any of this."
To me this is the point. If Dublin has 33% of the taxpayers as you say - or say 20% of the total population of the island of Ireland - then they should be entitled to roughly 20% of the sport's funding across the island of Ireland same as they are entitled to 20% of the Hospitals or anything else. Otherwise it is unfair on the taxpayers and families living in Dublin.

But if Dublin does get 20% of the funding then it can't have only 3% of the teams or that one team will have 7 times the funding of any other team.

tyroneed (Tyrone) - Posts: 753 - 18/08/2018 11:36:47    2134206

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Replying To tyroneed:  "To me this is the point. If Dublin has 33% of the taxpayers as you say - or say 20% of the total population of the island of Ireland - then they should be entitled to roughly 20% of the sport's funding across the island of Ireland same as they are entitled to 20% of the Hospitals or anything else. Otherwise it is unfair on the taxpayers and families living in Dublin.

But if Dublin does get 20% of the funding then it can't have only 3% of the teams or that one team will have 7 times the funding of any other team."
Spot on. Not difficult to understand but a blind eye has been turned for so long that irreversible damage has been done.

Those who pedal out the same crap about 'cycles' need to wake up and understand that this is Dublin's second dominant team of this decade and it will be gradually replaced by the next one and the one after that.

The scales have been loaded too heavily on one side and if nothing is done about it, Dublin will win 4 out of every 5 all irelands for the foreseeable future!

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5012 - 18/08/2018 12:56:45    2134215

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Replying To tyroneed:  "To me this is the point. If Dublin has 33% of the taxpayers as you say - or say 20% of the total population of the island of Ireland - then they should be entitled to roughly 20% of the sport's funding across the island of Ireland same as they are entitled to 20% of the Hospitals or anything else. Otherwise it is unfair on the taxpayers and families living in Dublin.

But if Dublin does get 20% of the funding then it can't have only 3% of the teams or that one team will have 7 times the funding of any other team."
20% of the population and 20% of the funding to go with it equates to being the 5th province of Ireland.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 13:36:22    2134224

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Replying To cavanman47:  "Spot on. Not difficult to understand but a blind eye has been turned for so long that irreversible damage has been done.

Those who pedal out the same crap about 'cycles' need to wake up and understand that this is Dublin's second dominant team of this decade and it will be gradually replaced by the next one and the one after that.

The scales have been loaded too heavily on one side and if nothing is done about it, Dublin will win 4 out of every 5 all irelands for the foreseeable future!"
I suppose how long do we have to wait? Does it take two decades to a generation? It's an important discussion to be had.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 13:38:44    2134225

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Replying To cavanman47:  "Spot on. Not difficult to understand but a blind eye has been turned for so long that irreversible damage has been done.

Those who pedal out the same crap about 'cycles' need to wake up and understand that this is Dublin's second dominant team of this decade and it will be gradually replaced by the next one and the one after that.

The scales have been loaded too heavily on one side and if nothing is done about it, Dublin will win 4 out of every 5 all irelands for the foreseeable future!"
something will be done and it needs to be done on the football field. Changing a sport or organisation simply to oust a top side is simply sour grapes.

FOB (Dublin) - Posts: 912 - 18/08/2018 13:46:29    2134228

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The issue will only be "solved" when counties other than Dublin get their game up. So predictability and boredom are potential assassins of Gaelic Football. This is why the Dub fans skipped the semi. I do respect Mayo and hopefully Tyrone for having a go and drawing the crowds, but more counties need to get competitive. Galway were mauled in the second half of the semi and some of my western mates expected it in the last 10 minutes not after 50 minutes as it transpired, and knowing many had to travel to the hurling final a week later was not helpful. Still, Dub fans need to fill HQ, what else would they be at in August? Celebrate this great Dublin team please.

suckvalleypaddy (Galway) - Posts: 1669 - 18/08/2018 13:55:41    2134232

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Replying To FOB:  "something will be done and it needs to be done on the football field. Changing a sport or organisation simply to oust a top side is simply sour grapes."
The Railway Cup is a higher level of competition. Dublin being rehoused there brings natural bragging rights for whoever is top dog at that level.

The Munster hurling championship was a strong 5 county round robin.

The Railway Cup can be a strong 5 team inter-provincial round robin.

Natural and respectful changes can come about over time.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 14:22:11    2134236

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Replying To FOB:  "This split you speak of, would it have 4 separate county boards? four stadiums? Four Club leagues and championships? Would a split be exclusive to football? The idea of a split would be to create viable county structure, not to simply to weaken a county to extinction."
Yes, 4 county boards. Stadium wise, it's a discussion to be had. Waterford didn't play their Munster hurling home games in Waterford.

The Dublin leagues and championship can assume provincial status and remain as they are. That's open to discussion.

It should be both codes so that each of the 4 areas establish an identity. If an area is weak in one code, like any other county, it'll be up to them to address that as they see right based on their respective priorities.

The discussion on the best approach to the split is for Dublin people really and has respectful of their identity.

One option is the the 4 Regions of city and 3 county areas as mentioned.

Another option is using the river Liffey as one boundary. North and South of the Liffey can both be split in two starting the boundary from where the Liffey meets the Irish Sea;

North Dublin - Northeast triangle north of the Liffey.
West Dublin - Southwest triangle north of the Liffey.
South Dublin - Northwest triangle south of the Liffey.
East Dublin - Southeast triangle south of the Liffey.

The boundary lines north and south of the river would have to take factors into account relating to identity, long established postcodes, the number of clubs etc. It's something to be teased out in time and not at the stroke of a pen.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 14:32:52    2134238

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So much effort.

On gibberish.

Much be a slow rip off the yanks day down there

jimbodub (Dublin) - Posts: 20600 - 18/08/2018 15:28:29    2134246

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Replying To tyroneed:  "To me this is the point. If Dublin has 33% of the taxpayers as you say - or say 20% of the total population of the island of Ireland - then they should be entitled to roughly 20% of the sport's funding across the island of Ireland same as they are entitled to 20% of the Hospitals or anything else. Otherwise it is unfair on the taxpayers and families living in Dublin.

But if Dublin does get 20% of the funding then it can't have only 3% of the teams or that one team will have 7 times the funding of any other team."
Is the funding disproportionate for other counties also though. What's Kerry's (one code county) spend for example? We know that Mayo receive more money per head of population than Dublin. Should this be addressed also? Maintain Dublin's level of funding, split them in two and two Dublin's will contest the AI final each year perhaps. At present they can only assemble one panel and field 15. If other counties want them to maintain two panels and field two teams then it won't be a problem, the net will just be cast further and more talent will be unearthed and two Dublins will be at the business end each year. Is this what some people want? Anyway back to the Kerryman's council based county teams. Should Cork and Galway be split in two and what happens to the wee 6 where there are 11 councils?

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4700 - 18/08/2018 15:37:47    2134248

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Replying To legendzxix:  "20% of the population and 20% of the funding to go with it equates to being the 5th province of Ireland."
That is is NOT what I was saying, as usual lazy replies, picking items out of context is in no way an honest attempt to reach at the truth. We have still to establish the financial advantage Dublin is getting from these capitol grants. You clearly have no idea of the number of clubs, players in Dublin or were they are distributed. The Govt Capitol Sports grants are available to ALL who apply for them and put up some money themselves. If Blackrock lawn tennis club is entitled to 120K then surely Plunkets are entitled to a grant to repair flood damge? Take Kickhams they got 150K, to resurface an existing all weather, as I stated Plunkets to replace and fix flood damage. Not sure how these given Dublin the edge!!! Dublin taxpayers are entitled to apply for and receive these grants as say Mallow GAA is entitled to receive grants to improve its car parking or Kilrush Yatch club receive an upgrade to its marina. So once that is established that Dublin taxpayers are the equal of taxpayers elsewhere then we can deal with other issues.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4896 - 18/08/2018 15:40:58    2134249

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Replying To tyroneed:  "To me this is the point. If Dublin has 33% of the taxpayers as you say - or say 20% of the total population of the island of Ireland - then they should be entitled to roughly 20% of the sport's funding across the island of Ireland same as they are entitled to 20% of the Hospitals or anything else. Otherwise it is unfair on the taxpayers and families living in Dublin.

But if Dublin does get 20% of the funding then it can't have only 3% of the teams or that one team will have 7 times the funding of any other team."
Hold on a minute, 33% of IRISH taxpayers not IRISH AND BRITISH taxpayers, by lumping in 1.5 million people from 6 counties you are changing the percentages. So please if they are the stats you are working off forget the argument. I repeat Dublin CLUBS get no more or less what anyone else gets or is entitled too. IBTW Irish sports grants are subject to being 1.) All inclusive to both genders, 2.) a percentage of funding must come from clubs 3.) alleviating a disadvantaged area to increase sports participation. Irish taxpayers money goes to Irish taxpayers the Irish republic is not a charity the Brits have far more money than us.

arock (Dublin) - Posts: 4896 - 18/08/2018 15:53:17    2134254

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Yes, 4 county boards. Stadium wise, it's a discussion to be had. Waterford didn't play their Munster hurling home games in Waterford.

The Dublin leagues and championship can assume provincial status and remain as they are. That's open to discussion.

It should be both codes so that each of the 4 areas establish an identity. If an area is weak in one code, like any other county, it'll be up to them to address that as they see right based on their respective priorities.

The discussion on the best approach to the split is for Dublin people really and has respectful of their identity.

One option is the the 4 Regions of city and 3 county areas as mentioned.

Another option is using the river Liffey as one boundary. North and South of the Liffey can both be split in two starting the boundary from where the Liffey meets the Irish Sea;

North Dublin - Northeast triangle north of the Liffey.
West Dublin - Southwest triangle north of the Liffey.
South Dublin - Northwest triangle south of the Liffey.
East Dublin - Southeast triangle south of the Liffey.

The boundary lines north and south of the river would have to take factors into account relating to identity, long established postcodes, the number of clubs etc. It's something to be teased out in time and not at the stroke of a pen."
absolute nonsense, there aren't enough clubs in dublin to even consider 4, it'd be 2 or nothing and I'd imagine nothing is more likely.

establishing identity would be even more ridiculous, nobody identifies themselves with those areas in Dublin and they never will.

FOB (Dublin) - Posts: 912 - 18/08/2018 16:20:37    2134259

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Replying To FOB:  "absolute nonsense, there aren't enough clubs in dublin to even consider 4, it'd be 2 or nothing and I'd imagine nothing is more likely.

establishing identity would be even more ridiculous, nobody identifies themselves with those areas in Dublin and they never will."
Fair enough. A motion goes to congress. Motion is passed for Dublin to be re-classified as a province and to enter the Railway Cup. How do you split Dublin in 4 in this new era?

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 16:37:42    2134264

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Replying To legendzxix:  "Fair enough. A motion goes to congress. Motion is passed for Dublin to be re-classified as a province and to enter the Railway Cup. How do you split Dublin in 4 in this new era?"
you don't. and if such a thing ever happened it'd be the end of the GAA in Dublin and would be met with protests and ultimately the exclusion of Dublin. Probably what people would want?

FOB (Dublin) - Posts: 912 - 18/08/2018 17:26:52    2134269

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Replying To arock:  "What awful inaccurate rubbish you have peddled here. I urge everyone to read this:
https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/here-are-the-2320-clubs-that-will-get-a-share-of-the-56m-sports-capital-grants-816499.html

These are a listing of everything spent by Government on all sporting clubs and bodies. These are govt and tax payers money they have to be distributed FAIRLY to all tax payers the vast majority of them live in Dublin nearly 33%. So are Dublin taxpayers not entitled to what every one else?

These are capital grants for individual clubs to build and help them out, Plunkets for instance to repair a damaged roof and flood damage to a hall - nothing in list of clubs will give Dublin county teams the edge on the playing field.

So what you are advocating is denying Dublin clubs taxpayers money to improve their infrastructure because they are from Dublin? that is in effect what you are advocating. If clubs have special needs around the country they can apply like everyone else to obtain Govt grant aid. But i suspect you and your won't, can't grasp any of this."
I'm not advocating anything simply laying out facts.

Earlier this year did 11 gaa clubs receive the maximum of 150k with 10pf those from Dublin, yes they did, plain and simply. So clubs getting money to spend will have no relevance at all to maybe improving the lot of that club?

https://www.independent.ie/sport/gaelic-games/gaelic-football/ewan-mackenna-cracks-are-appearing-in-the-dublin-gaa-model-and-its-time-to-ask-if-their-house-really-is-in-order-37223231.html

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1338 - 18/08/2018 17:30:08    2134270

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Replying To legendzxix:  "20% of the population and 20% of the funding to go with it equates to being the 5th province of Ireland."
I had the misfortune to watch a tv3 weather forecast one time, and the fella that does the weather/birthday wishes bit referred to the '4' provinces, Munster, Connaught Leinster and then Dublin.
us nordies aren't part of Ireland at all apparently.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 2749 - 18/08/2018 17:41:27    2134271

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Replying To FOB:  "you don't. and if such a thing ever happened it'd be the end of the GAA in Dublin and would be met with protests and ultimately the exclusion of Dublin. Probably what people would want?"
Noone's looking to exclude Dublin. Dublin have brought the game to a new level of fitness and quite rightly are making full use of resources at their disposal.

The Railway Cup is the only competition to provide Dublin a fair level of competition. Dublin assuming the role of a province is just a natural development. It's a matter of rolling with it and working on the advantages that can bring for the game.

6 Nations Rugby gets great coverage and is a great competition.

A 5 team Railway Cup in the round robin format similar to the hurling provincial championships can bring the game to a whole new level.

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 7853 - 18/08/2018 18:05:03    2134276

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