Meath Forum

2018 Club Championships

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Replying To Ashrules:  "RichieQ one of the few real analysts here.
But a laugh to read ridiculous comments from Royaldunne, Northsidegael, and other bitter pills whose clubs are on their last legs and are jealous of emerging talent"
Correct me if I am wrong but is RD not a Cilles man, one of the clubs under attack on this forum ?

LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 647 - 14/09/2018 14:43:39    2141725

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Replying To Ashrules:  "RichieQ one of the few real analysts here.
But a laugh to read ridiculous comments from Royaldunne, Northsidegael, and other bitter pills whose clubs are on their last legs and are jealous of emerging talent"
Correct me if im wrong but isn't north side gaels from Siomonstown, the reigning champions and favourites to win it again. They are hardly on their last legs?

Maestro (Meath) - Posts: 448 - 14/09/2018 16:13:32    2141758

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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99:  "Correct me if I am wrong but is RD not a Cilles man, one of the clubs under attack on this forum ?"
He is, and like myself has defended the ratoath county players on here many times. Ashrules clearly didn't do any research into who he was making comments about but that seems to be the way these days! Oh by the way ash the club I follow are going for 3 county titles in a row with a young team not quite what i'd describe as a club on their last legs!!

Northsidegaels (Meath) - Posts: 221 - 14/09/2018 16:51:45    2141764

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Replying To Richieq:  "Psychic now are you? Able to determine outcomes of potential matches are you? Your ill informed comments remind me an awful lot of what's been wrong in this county for a while, most supporters want, and should want, to see club football and all clubs improve and thrive for the betterment of the county as a whole, your comments seem to contradict that idea. The progress that Ratoath and Colmcilles have made in recent years is massive, Ratoath senior in both codes with the hurlers still with a semi final to play and a fair amount of underage success, it's not that long since our trade was being plyed in the junior grade of both codes and now both are established senior sides, Ratoath's day will come as will Colmcilles of that I have little doubt but revelling in their failure at quarter final stage points to a selfish and self centred approach and a lack of willingness to see the old order of Meath football change, it has to change or as a county we will remain static for years and the players that clubs like Ratoath and Colmcilles and other well populated areas will provide to the county in years to come when that new population are embedded as Meath people, will be very important. We will always have good players produced from all over the county but the population increases in the east and south and the players derived from those areas will be crucial, I would suggest that should be bore in mind before putting the boot in......."
Where are you going with this outburst? Have you mistaken some of the previous posters comments for mine? Are you suggesting the people of meath should hope for Keegan to land in ratoath or cilles so that meath football will improve? I don't know where to start with this!

Northsidegaels (Meath) - Posts: 221 - 14/09/2018 17:30:59    2141771

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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99:  "Correct me if I am wrong but is RD not a Cilles man, one of the clubs under attack on this forum ?"
RD a Bracks man

thelutch (Meath) - Posts: 789 - 14/09/2018 17:41:02    2141774

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Replying To Northsidegaels:  "Where are you going with this outburst? Have you mistaken some of the previous posters comments for mine? Are you suggesting the people of meath should hope for Keegan to land in ratoath or cilles so that meath football will improve? I don't know where to start with this!"
Never suggested such a thing, please highlight where I did? If you don't know where to start then I suggest you don't.......

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3459 - 14/09/2018 21:34:48    2141809

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Vincents v Dunboyne in the junior final. Dont think anyone predicted that one

TakeYourPoints6 (Meath) - Posts: 218 - 17/09/2018 10:53:14    2142158

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Replying To TakeYourPoints6:  "Vincents v Dunboyne in the junior final. Dont think anyone predicted that one"
if Dunboyne win this and kilbride or slane win the junior b then what does that mean for the teams in the relegation mix?

In the regulations it says that there will be 12 first teams and 8 second/third teams in the JFC every year. How do they rejig the teams to faciltate that?

Greenfield (Meath) - Posts: 367 - 17/09/2018 15:14:31    2142246

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Replying To Greenfield:  "if Dunboyne win this and kilbride or slane win the junior b then what does that mean for the teams in the relegation mix?

In the regulations it says that there will be 12 first teams and 8 second/third teams in the JFC every year. How do they rejig the teams to faciltate that?"
They will do the following things as they always do:

1. Hope St Vincents win Junior A and Kilbride or Slane Junior B
2. If step one fails they will then just do what they have done with all issues regarding championship structures for far, make it up as they go along and ignore all logic coming from other areas!

The championship structures are a mess and need to be sorted out as soon as possible! Four groups of four in the Senior, Intermediate, Junior A and Junior B. Then combine Junior C and D. Play A leagues and B leagues from end of February/start of March through to the end of June/start of July. Also abolish the cup games (Feis, Corn na boine and Tailteann Cup) which has been a complete disgrace this year with teams giving walk overs even in the Feis Cup because they are out of the championship and have lost all motivation. Use July as a holiday period for 2/3 weeks and then commence all championships in August, when teams will not be missing players who are on holidays/travelling etc. It would take the month of August to complete the group stages, September for the knockout stages and early October for the finals. Team are guaranteed competitive league games from end of February to July, with games every second weekend, and they know exactly when the championship is on which is August where you will be all teams, with the exception of those who come third in there group, guaranteed 4 championship matches! However none of the above can happen until we have 16 teams in the Senior, Intermediate and Junior Championships.

BigJoe14 (Meath) - Posts: 445 - 17/09/2018 15:39:58    2142258

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Replying To BigJoe14:  "They will do the following things as they always do:

1. Hope St Vincents win Junior A and Kilbride or Slane Junior B
2. If step one fails they will then just do what they have done with all issues regarding championship structures for far, make it up as they go along and ignore all logic coming from other areas!

The championship structures are a mess and need to be sorted out as soon as possible! Four groups of four in the Senior, Intermediate, Junior A and Junior B. Then combine Junior C and D. Play A leagues and B leagues from end of February/start of March through to the end of June/start of July. Also abolish the cup games (Feis, Corn na boine and Tailteann Cup) which has been a complete disgrace this year with teams giving walk overs even in the Feis Cup because they are out of the championship and have lost all motivation. Use July as a holiday period for 2/3 weeks and then commence all championships in August, when teams will not be missing players who are on holidays/travelling etc. It would take the month of August to complete the group stages, September for the knockout stages and early October for the finals. Team are guaranteed competitive league games from end of February to July, with games every second weekend, and they know exactly when the championship is on which is August where you will be all teams, with the exception of those who come third in there group, guaranteed 4 championship matches! However none of the above can happen until we have 16 teams in the Senior, Intermediate and Junior Championships."
I think you a missing a few major points is all of your plans:

1. If there is championship starting first week of August, teams wont be going on holidays in July, if there is a break then is should be in June.
2. you are saying August to complete all the group stages, that based on your 4x4 groups requires 3 weekends, then into knock out would require another 3 weekends, and plan to run it off in 8 weeks. Things you are not considering
1. Hurling needs to be played as well (as much as some people want to ignore it)
2. Meath happen to go further in the championship i.e. Super 8s, there is no time to complete the championship.
3. Basically your saying to lads, no point in doing anything major until its summer cause championship isnt until august, sure go away play another sport and then come back when your finished that season.

In my opinion cups games should not be gotten rid of. There are only 3 competitions to be played for and to get rid of one of them is the wrong thing, They need to be played at a consistent time in early/mid season, allow teams to deal with them how they wish.

juicy (Meath) - Posts: 357 - 17/09/2018 16:33:17    2142270

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Junior B final fixed for 12 o clock is very unfair i think, some people will only be coming out of Mass.

thelutch (Meath) - Posts: 789 - 17/09/2018 16:41:00    2142271

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Replying To juicy:  "I think you a missing a few major points is all of your plans: 1. If there is championship starting first week of August, teams wont be going on holidays in July, if there is a break then is should be in June. 2. you are saying August to complete all the group stages, that based on your 4x4 groups requires 3 weekends, then into knock out would require another 3 weekends, and plan to run it off in 8 weeks. Things you are not considering 1. Hurling needs to be played as well (as much as some people want to ignore it) 2. Meath happen to go further in the championship i.e. Super 8s, there is no time to complete the championship. 3. Basically your saying to lads, no point in doing anything major until its summer cause championship isnt until august, sure go away play another sport and then come back when your finished that season. In my opinion cups games should not be gotten rid of. There are only 3 competitions to be played for and to get rid of one of them is the wrong thing, They need to be played at a consistent time in early/mid season, allow teams to deal with them how they wish."
"Basically your saying to lads, no point in doing anything major until its summer cause championship isnt until august, sure go away play another sport and then come back when your finished that season." Whats wrong with that? God forbid some lads might get to play maybe another bit of sport or enjoy their summer! Real dog in the manger stuff..."we can't provide a proper championship so lets stagger it and have lads hanging around and training all summer just so they won't be able to go on holidays, play another sport or enjoy themselves!" Its this kind of attitude that has the club game where it is.

Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 578 - 17/09/2018 16:54:08    2142274

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Replying To BigJoe14:  "They will do the following things as they always do:

1. Hope St Vincents win Junior A and Kilbride or Slane Junior B
2. If step one fails they will then just do what they have done with all issues regarding championship structures for far, make it up as they go along and ignore all logic coming from other areas!

The championship structures are a mess and need to be sorted out as soon as possible! Four groups of four in the Senior, Intermediate, Junior A and Junior B. Then combine Junior C and D. Play A leagues and B leagues from end of February/start of March through to the end of June/start of July. Also abolish the cup games (Feis, Corn na boine and Tailteann Cup) which has been a complete disgrace this year with teams giving walk overs even in the Feis Cup because they are out of the championship and have lost all motivation. Use July as a holiday period for 2/3 weeks and then commence all championships in August, when teams will not be missing players who are on holidays/travelling etc. It would take the month of August to complete the group stages, September for the knockout stages and early October for the finals. Team are guaranteed competitive league games from end of February to July, with games every second weekend, and they know exactly when the championship is on which is August where you will be all teams, with the exception of those who come third in there group, guaranteed 4 championship matches! However none of the above can happen until we have 16 teams in the Senior, Intermediate and Junior Championships."
Don't agree the club championship structure is a mess. I think the county championship structure is a mess and is the root cause of the demise of the club scene. What you are suggesting is less competitive games for club players and hold the competition later in the year. Just think about that scenario-half the teams would be out of the major club competition by the end of August and wouldn't be playing again in the major club competition until the next August. That's eleven months. Think even more players will head to the USA for the summer or give up GAA altogether. The leagues at the moment are very much a secondary competition. They are not taken seriously by the vast majority of teams particularly those that have players involved with the county. For anyone to say otherwise is delusional. Perhaps that needs to be looked at first instead of the championship. Make it a meaningful competition. The winners perhaps could also represent the county in the All Ireland club championship or in a separate all Ireland competition. That would get interest back in the leagues and then perhaps we could look at changes to the club championships,

Poormouth (Meath) - Posts: 182 - 17/09/2018 18:59:16    2142289

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Replying To Crinigan:  ""Basically your saying to lads, no point in doing anything major until its summer cause championship isnt until august, sure go away play another sport and then come back when your finished that season." Whats wrong with that? God forbid some lads might get to play maybe another bit of sport or enjoy their summer! Real dog in the manger stuff..."we can't provide a proper championship so lets stagger it and have lads hanging around and training all summer just so they won't be able to go on holidays, play another sport or enjoy themselves!" Its this kind of attitude that has the club game where it is."
For a start you are not going to improve the quality of football or players if they are not playing. Simple as that.

Maybe youre a bit out of the loop, but there is a fixture schedule released which from what i can see this year, it was stuck to. This would have allowed players to plan their holidays should they have wished to do it.

juicy (Meath) - Posts: 357 - 18/09/2018 08:39:51    2142354

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Replying To juicy:  "For a start you are not going to improve the quality of football or players if they are not playing. Simple as that.

Maybe youre a bit out of the loop, but there is a fixture schedule released which from what i can see this year, it was stuck to. This would have allowed players to plan their holidays should they have wished to do it."
No it wasn't stuck to. They brought a league final forward a week with 2 weeks notice in July! Preventing 1 pivotal player to miss the final to attend a 1st cousins wedding.
On a side note playing a knockout competition towards the end of the year is crazy!

Jackpauric30 (Meath) - Posts: 10 - 18/09/2018 13:07:46    2142447

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Replying To BigJoe14:  "They will do the following things as they always do:

1. Hope St Vincents win Junior A and Kilbride or Slane Junior B
2. If step one fails they will then just do what they have done with all issues regarding championship structures for far, make it up as they go along and ignore all logic coming from other areas!

The championship structures are a mess and need to be sorted out as soon as possible! Four groups of four in the Senior, Intermediate, Junior A and Junior B. Then combine Junior C and D. Play A leagues and B leagues from end of February/start of March through to the end of June/start of July. Also abolish the cup games (Feis, Corn na boine and Tailteann Cup) which has been a complete disgrace this year with teams giving walk overs even in the Feis Cup because they are out of the championship and have lost all motivation. Use July as a holiday period for 2/3 weeks and then commence all championships in August, when teams will not be missing players who are on holidays/travelling etc. It would take the month of August to complete the group stages, September for the knockout stages and early October for the finals. Team are guaranteed competitive league games from end of February to July, with games every second weekend, and they know exactly when the championship is on which is August where you will be all teams, with the exception of those who come third in there group, guaranteed 4 championship matches! However none of the above can happen until we have 16 teams in the Senior, Intermediate and Junior Championships."
Agree with some of this. The problem for most players at the moment is that the season starts in January and if your lucky enough to make a county final its October at the earliest before the year is done. Personally I think that all Cup competitions should/could be played before the leagues in Feb, possibly cut leagues down to 10 teams (9 games each) and create a Division 5 League as we have 49 teams competing in A league at the minute, and then Championships down to 16 teams with 4 groups of 4 as stated above. All of a sudden we go from needing 21 wekends for just football to only needing 15!! (Cup comps not included in either calculation). Hurlings has a similar number of weekends I think with 7 league games and 8 championship games, so thats both codes in 30 weekends rather that I think its 40 or so at the moment.

This is only an idea by the way, same as everyone has and is based on rough calculations.

But no matter what way its set up and organised the problem is that with the amount of games that are needed to be played at the minute the County Board fixtures committee are on a hiding to nothing when county teams and holidays space are taken into account. We have to remember this is still a hobbie for people, they have to be able to go on holidays and organise their ACTUAL lives.

ratlag (Meath) - Posts: 279 - 18/09/2018 15:24:46    2142507

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Replying To Poormouth:  "Don't agree the club championship structure is a mess. I think the county championship structure is a mess and is the root cause of the demise of the club scene. What you are suggesting is less competitive games for club players and hold the competition later in the year. Just think about that scenario-half the teams would be out of the major club competition by the end of August and wouldn't be playing again in the major club competition until the next August. That's eleven months. Think even more players will head to the USA for the summer or give up GAA altogether. The leagues at the moment are very much a secondary competition. They are not taken seriously by the vast majority of teams particularly those that have players involved with the county. For anyone to say otherwise is delusional. Perhaps that needs to be looked at first instead of the championship. Make it a meaningful competition. The winners perhaps could also represent the county in the All Ireland club championship or in a separate all Ireland competition. That would get interest back in the leagues and then perhaps we could look at changes to the club championships,"
Nothing wrong with our club championship?It started in April, we played two games, one in August and three in September. Four months gap. Ate you for real? Dead right that senior intermediate and junior should be 16 teams. Four groups. Top two quarter final. Bottom relegation playoff. Three games is plenty enough, more than most counties. Play five and win two, fluke a draw and still be in the championship? No wonder our county players do not have a winning mentality. It starts at club level.

Greensheen (Meath) - Posts: 12 - 18/09/2018 15:47:46    2142516

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Replying To Greensheen:  "Nothing wrong with our club championship?It started in April, we played two games, one in August and three in September. Four months gap. Ate you for real? Dead right that senior intermediate and junior should be 16 teams. Four groups. Top two quarter final. Bottom relegation playoff. Three games is plenty enough, more than most counties. Play five and win two, fluke a draw and still be in the championship? No wonder our county players do not have a winning mentality. It starts at club level."
How anyone could say there is nothing wrong with our championships is baffling to me. 4/5 games to just get out of the group stage, along with a possible Preliminary quarter final! Kells had to play 6 games just to get to a quarter final! In Monaghan championships don't start until August and they have probably the best club championships in the country. Our championships start in April, where county players are half minding themselves just after the league and are not even released fully to train with there clubs two weeks before championship matches! Dublin championships went to four groups of four this year and worked very well.

BigJoe14 (Meath) - Posts: 445 - 18/09/2018 16:25:08    2142529

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Replying To Greensheen:  "Nothing wrong with our club championship?It started in April, we played two games, one in August and three in September. Four months gap. Ate you for real? Dead right that senior intermediate and junior should be 16 teams. Four groups. Top two quarter final. Bottom relegation playoff. Three games is plenty enough, more than most counties. Play five and win two, fluke a draw and still be in the championship? No wonder our county players do not have a winning mentality. It starts at club level."
I agree with most of the above. Sixteen teams max in Senior, ideally I would reduce this to twelve Senior Clubs with four Divisional teams - North, South, East and Mid or Central, note No West Division so as we don't get mixed up with our neighbours. Sixteen Intermediate teams and maybe twenty Junior teams. Also Junior B and C.

However presently our delegates don't appear to understand the concept of Divisional teams. It has been working in Kerry and Cork for years but with distinct differences. In Cork the county is divided into 8 administrative divisions with their own committee structures that run their own Junior Championships in both hurling and football. Their winners then go on to play in the County Championships.

In Kerry the divisions are not as structured and exist to serve the Kerry Senior football. By permitting Divisional teams the best Junior and Intermediate club players get a chance to play at the highest level within the county and also put themselves in the "shop window" namely being tested against the best in Championship fare and before the Kerry selectors.

As we don't have administrative divisions this model would suit us best. We would the 12 best Senior Clubs competing with each other and 60 + of the other best players in the county also competing at the highest level. Now there could well be some anomalies and teething problems, like for example it is possible that a Senior club could beat a Divisional team in the Senior Championship and still be relegated while the Divisional team would continue in the Senior Championship. My answer to this is simply that there are two criteria for participation in the Senior Championship namely as a club with Senior status and as a Divisional team. Of course we could introduce the Divisional teams to the Championship at the knockout stage thereby avoiding the scenario outlined above. Teething problems may include some Divisional teams not getting their act together such as not preparing properly or selecting the best available team. An instance like this should not mean that the idea is a failure but that some of the people in charge failed so those people should be changed for the next year.

The benefits would be threefold, more competitive games, the top players in the county getting to play Senior football and our Intermediate and Junior Champions would be that bit stronger to compete in the Leinster and All Ireland Club Championships. I know that we compete well in those championships in Leinster but in recent years have not been competitive enough at All Ireland level.

MillerX (Meath) - Posts: 590 - 18/09/2018 20:55:22    2142578

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So we're a week out from the senior semi finals, who do people reckon will get through?

Simonstown v Dunboyne : very hard to call. Dunboyne have been my champ favourites since before the first ball of the championship was thrown-in and strengthened that claim with a big win over the champions in the group but Simonstown were impressive in the qf and look like they could be timing their run nicely. Could easily go either way but ill plump for simonstown...just

Don/ash v Summerhill : in this one, I can't see past Summerhill. I think they just have too much in their locker for Don/Ash but if Ashbourne click on the day, they could cause an upset. Summerhill for me to set up a rematch of last year's final (which wont be as one- sided as last year, if it comes to pass)

royalranter (Meath) - Posts: 1 - 21/09/2018 20:44:03    2143207

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