It just dawnwd on me as something that is lost in the ether amid the discussion of sweeper systems etc. Shaun Murphy actually had a breakout season at corner-back in Dunne's last year, and really looked to have nailed down that spot. Now he is being scapegoated for Wexford's limp exit when he wasn't the only one to hit stray ball now and again.

Which brings me to my encounter with I suppose you'd call a traditionalist last week down at the Park. 'Jaysus it would put you off hurling' he says to me as a forewarning that he was going to be a negative nancy. Proceeded to give out stink about the sweeper system and when I challenged him that surely our high wide count and lack of a consistent free-taker was as big a concern, he had no comeback. Then gave out about Davy not being there-surely the man is entitled to some time off and wouldn't learn much from round two of the championship anyway. I suppose my point is there seems to be a groundswell of criticism directed at one particular area when we are lagging behind in a few, as emphasised by the standard on the display in the two semis this weekend.

beano (Wexford) - Posts: 1421 - 29/07/2018 18:36:00    2127312

Well there we have it the only good thing we do is catch teams on the hop and ambush them at the start of the season.Davy mentioned at the start of the season that this would be a maintenance year and that was the mindset he had .I think we should have just drove on from last year but we didn't.Because we did not beat any big team in the championship this year we will be under more pressure next year.I would like to know what people think was this year a success.Yes or No ?

Wexpurebred (Wexford) - Posts: 205 - 29/07/2018 20:35:21    2127351

890202 (Wexford) - Posts: 1278 - 29/07/2018 20:46:49    2127354

I would like to know what people think was this year a success.Yes or No ?
Wexpurebred (Wexford) - Posts: 57 - 29/07/2018 20:35:21 2127351
No. The year was a poor one. The question to ask at end of every year is "did the team improve on last year" and the answer to that is an emphatic no.
I thought the same over the past 2 days, we would not have been able to live with the pace today and yesterday. Clare found a gear yesterday which I do not think we have.
I think the momentum of last year under Davy was lost this year. Nobody remembers the league.
Looking at Galvin yesterday, he was up and down the pitch, dropping back, but crucially he got ball, gave it, got it back, drove forward.
I know there is so much more in our team. We have an excellent full back, as good as there is, potentially some excellent defenders, a few elephants in the room, and a desperate need for a free taker and more contribution on the field from some players.
I would never scapegoat players, a team win and lose as a team.
We desperately need a reliable free taker, Seamus Casey is possibly the answer?
In my view, if Davy is not coming back, he should decide now and if not the county board will need to get somebody else in and they can see what is available to them. But with Davy, it will be a saga.....
The 4 teams over the weekend were mad for road, we were tired when it came to the crunch more than once this year.
I do wonder have we any Paul Kinnerk or something like him in our ranks? Why do we look so tired when push comes to shove? Are we training too hard at the wrong time for the wrong outcome?
Limerick is the model we need to look at though. 1 main school in Ard Scoil Ris, like Kierans a nursery of Limerick teams. We have no such nursery. We have 2 competitive schools, but you would have to ask what is going on in CBS Enniscorthy with all the hurling clubs in Enniscorthy district? And further north in the county?
A load of the Limerick lads are trainee teachers or teachers, how many of ours are? Dee O'Keefe?

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1737 - 29/07/2018 21:15:38    2127370

I think we would of been blown off the park yesterday or today in regards physicality towards and 4 of the teams... we should have a full time strength and conditioning coach in my opinion I know it's not all about that hurling is more important but it makes a big difference am I the only person that thinks Wexford is o e of the smallest intercounty teams out there...I really want Davy to stay but needs to work on our game like the short passing game every team seams to use it... I would just like to go 15v15 with lads picked in proper positions mac a 14 Dunbar and Casey in the corners for pace...just another few points people want shore back next year good hurler And all but if our half back line is foley o hanlon and shore next year we will be ripped to shreds as they lack serious pace... also someone was complaining that Davy wasn't as games last week man needs time off too and jj was at Gorey ferns and oulaet oilgate game... also is Ian Bryne back for good or just to help ferns out?? And to finish next years league we need to blood new players like Casey Dunbar Molly and Darren Bryne

gannett83 (Wexford) - Posts: 287 - 29/07/2018 21:31:21    2127377

hurler101 (Wexford) - Posts: 471 - 29/07/2018 22:48:47    2127404

I hate to say it but I think this travelling has taken its toll on David Fitzgerald he does not seem to have the same bite anymore.He says he cannot ask the lads for anymore and yet the only big game in the championship we were competitive against was Kilkenny. On a good note I think when at our best we CAN deliver and beat anybody provided we put them to the sword in the first 10min..We completely went down hill after kk beat us.Thats what kk do to you... But unfortunately there is this one little word called (Mojo).We lost it.Now we have to get it back .

Wexpurebred (Wexford) - Posts: 205 - 29/07/2018 23:43:38    2127413

Heres the thing, maybe its starting to dawn on people.

Following the defeat to Clare the rhetoric on here was that the only thing holding us back is we arent playing 15 on 15 and the sweeper is the problem lads.

Surely after the weekend of hurling we can recognise that we have bigger issues than just the sweeper being there and us not hurling 15 on 15.

Im not that fussed if Davy comes back in reality, i dont really think he can get much more out of them, i dont think we are really going to get much more until we get ourselves in order full stop. On the pitch It's not the fault of the system that inter county hurlers haven't the ability to hit a sideline cut properly, nor is the fault of the system when players in oceans of space are inexplicably hitting the ball back to the opposition, nor is it the fault of system that players with time and space to score from midfield are driving wide after wide, it's not the fault of the system that our free taking continues to hinder us.

Our club scene is an absoloute farce, 90 odd walkovers given in both codes since the 1st of June ( a lot of these by big traditional clubs and amalgamated clubs), our senior champions pulling out of the league. The amount of unerage walkovers is shocking.

We havent won a Leinster minor hurling title or reached an all ireland final since 1985 but our rivals are. U21 a little better but in reality no win since 1965, our rivals are building upon winning teams, all ireland winning teams.

We are getting there slowly but we are still a long way behind in reality.

One of the reasons im not fussed whether davy comes back or not is because i believe we need to develop a way of playing, a style which is consistent from underage up to adult level so when a corner back has been drilled to play a certain way at minor and u21 and he comes to senior that same way exists, that instinct doesnt need to be changed imho. With Davy you wont get that which isnt his fault as hes a temporary manager in reality who isnt here for the long haul, its his job to get the best out of what he has for as long as hes here.

But imho we are still a good bit off winning any silverware unfortunately.

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1351 - 30/07/2018 10:25:08    2127459

gannett83 (Wexford) - Posts: 287 - 30/07/2018 11:38:01    2127489

look at limerick yesterday,they had 5+ subs who were as good as the starters.
i think we can operate at a higher level than we have.
what has happened to eoin conroy?eoin moore (i accept he has injuries) is our best corner back in the county,yet never played there?
i dont care about guiney,breen,etc who dont or cant be involved.
at no time this year did we think we had subs who could win a game.
we have a full time S&C coach-he has questions to answer as to why we seemed so fit in feb and so jaded in july?
the amount of walk overs is shocking,and a damining indictment on the young people in our clubs.
looking at our minors the last couple of years,i dont know if we have the strentgh and depth coming through.
what happened the combined colleges?
why is on peters and good counsel competing?
had we any plan for post-davy?
we knew after leinster and all ireland quarter that our system was destroyed last year,how or why did we come back with the same game this year?
i meet a lot of gaa people in our clubs,suffice to say,these are the questions i am hearing time and again.
we beat all of the all-ireland semi finalists we played in the league,and nobody gives a rats.why are we targeting the league and ending up spent by july?

perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 30/07/2018 12:33:39    2127512

That was a great weekend of hurling. It does make you think about Wexford's situation. Two questions for you peoples ...

Has the league being demoted?
After watching those hurling semi finals at the weekend, you could argue that because of the new round robin format in the championship, that whether you are in Division 1a or Division 1b of the league is irrelevant. Is it all about priming your team for the Championship (the round robin and championship)?
Arguably there's very little between Galway/Kilkenny/Tip/Waterford/Clare/Limerick/Cork. You could still end up with all ireland final with two division 1b teams (limerick and Galway).
Also, three of the league semi finalists were not competing over this past weekend; Kilkenny, Tip and Wexford.
Wexford looked jaded in Pairc Ui Caoimh.
Should we be focusing on championship and give new players chances in the league?

Is pipeline our biggest problem?
We haven't won a minor or u-21 all ireland in many years.
Over the last 10 years - Galway/Kilkenny/Tip/Waterford/Clare/Limerick have won at least twice at these grades.
Cork are winning a lot at u-14/u-15/u-16 and won that u-17 all ireland last year. Given they have 100 clubs and a population of half a million, they will be even stronger in years to come.
Limerick's 5 subs made all the difference against Cork when they came on. Whereas Cork's subs didn't have the same impact.
Sweeper/no sweeper, Davy/previous managers/new managers, wexford park/thurles/croker/PUC, wet day/dry day/windy/hot day ... is it all secondary as it boils down to quality of players being produced internally by own clubs and schools?

Punter72007 (Wexford) - Posts: 315 - 30/07/2018 13:43:38    2127538

gannett83 (Wexford) - Posts: 287 - 31/07/2018 16:48:06    2127925

Punter72007 (Wexford) - Posts: 315 - 31/07/2018 18:00:15    2127963

gannett83 (Wexford) - Posts: 287 - 31/07/2018 19:17:03    2127989

Some good posts on here lately but also an awful lot of over analysed myths and overreaction to our perceived lack of quality. I think we need a bit of a reality check to be honest, We can dress it up however we like but we have totally under performed in both championship seasons under davy, The squad and playersat his disposal are the most talented hurlers we have produced in over 20 years. The quality we have is undisputed in my views and for lads to suggest ' 1/4 final is our limit are talking negative rubbish. Liam Ryan, Paudie Foley,Lee Chin,Aidan nolan,Conor mc,Rory O Connor are on their day as good as any hurler in the country in there positions. We have a squad packed with talent and when you add in Darren Byrne, Seamus Casey, Rory Higgins, Ian Byrne,Jack Guiney next year I feel with the adjustsments i've mentioned previously we are every bit as talented as all the other teams mentioned.

What we need is develop our training so we dont continual peak in March and burn ourselves out come the summer and to develop a style of play that maximises the talent at our disposal. Playing with a sweeper who is of poor quality ismoreof a hinderance to us than a help.Its not the sweeper that has been the problem,it has beenthe quality of the player playing it. Combine these factors and the fact that we are misusing our best players by playing them out of position then its no wonder we flopped against clare.

Going forward to next year I couldnt give a toss about the league. We need to use the league for its purpise,develop new players, try out different systems and work on issues that are holding us back. I would make 5/6 changes in every league game next year and blood Darren Byrne, Ian Carthy,Conal flood, Joe O' Connor,Seamus Casey, Rory Higgins,Cathal Dunbar, conor firman. These lads are very talented but need games. We played virtually thesame 15 in the same positions all year including a dead rubber of a league game in nowlan park where we again played a system which we knew was limiting us.

Personally I couldnt give a toss if davy stays or goes but one thing for sure davy will make it into a drama to feed his ego. Personally I think a change or direction and return to basics under a new management wouldnt be a bad thing as I feel davy is too narrow minded in his tactical outlook and his failure to develop another system or plan b left us looking pathetic in our last 2 quater finals. Its simple ,either change the system by re jigging our team and introducing new players or change the manger but its clear something needs to change.

I dont feel were a million miles away as we've shown we have all the tools to beat the best but we keep beating them at the wrong times. Focuson peaking for next summer,nothing else matters.

As regards the future,underage is the county is of a higher standard than anytime i remember. Granted our minor record is poor but our system is producing a good amount of quality hurlers asour under 21 record has indicated. The standard of club hurling particulrly senior has been very high, I attended a good fewof thesenior games 2 weeks ago and i was quite pleased. Rory Higgins was superb for rathnure and although light,he is super talented. Ian Byrne was excellent for ferns scoring 0-4. We have a lot of reasons to be optimistic going forward.

cragask (Wexford) - Posts: 892 - 31/07/2018 19:53:55    2128005

Reck could hurl centre-back with county from what I've seen in WSHC this year. Wasted in corner and can hold his own against bigger men. Smart hurler and an excellent reader of game.

youngroryjacob (Wexford) - Posts: 99 - 31/07/2018 20:04:46    2128007

StoreysTash (Wexford) - Posts: 1737 - 01/08/2018 14:19:25    2128245

Hopefully we can retain most of the panel for next year, looking back to 2017 we lost Redmond to retirement when he possibly had another year or 2 in him and doran, breen and carton left at there own accord. On top of that the likes of guiney and Andrew Kenny weren't there for whatever reasons. With increasing demands the average retirement age is decreasing nationally year on year, for example I know 1 player who figured quiet alot this year has a small baby and another is married with a child on the way other factors like this come into the equation.

Agree with the general consensus on next year's league needs to used better for developing the panel. I think with the exception of the kilkenny away game we had only 17 starters in this year's league, I'd imagine this figure was at the very least 22 or 23 with the other 1a teams. If Davy stays or not ( which im torn on) we have to at the very least try different systems and formations. For example instead of a sweeper have a covering midfielder like johnny coen with galway or a half forward dropping out to the middle akin to Daniel kearney with cork. I think someone like Dee O'Keeffe could easily take on those roles. Away from ourselves I find it interesting that Clare are been applauded for moving galvin to sweeper in the 1st half after the negative press that role has got nationally. Hindsight makes anyone look like a genius and if that move didn't work on Saturday there management would have been lynched over it.

bostonredsox (Wexford) - Posts: 4368 - 02/08/2018 01:48:52    2128393

a sweeper is grand if you want to stop the rot,not for 70 minutes as a game plan where you have no other plan.
clare were 9 points down when he dropped back.
the other difference,galvin was getting,giving,going,pushing up.as a result aiden hart had to come out.
but i still loved the 15 v 15 battle on sunday more

perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 02/08/2018 15:08:43    2128514

If you believe that the sweeper system gives an advantage even when sacrificing an attacker, then surely your giving your opposition an advantage as they'll have a sweeper and six attackers.

WEX98 (Wexford) - Posts: 381 - 02/08/2018 20:59:01    2128605