Judging our panel over the year I'd make the following observations.

Fanning- good year overall few astray puckouts but following instructions and a half forward line struggling to win ball at certain times played it's part.
Reck- good year does shows inexperience/naivety at times with risky passes but has serious ability long term better suited further out the field
Ryan- brilliant year 2nd best full back in the country after daithi burke
Firman- solid 1st year doesn't always stand out like others but the sort of corner backs were lacking this year
Paudie foley-struggled today but very good year overall
O'Hanlon- good year gets some underseved flack in my view as he's generally marking a marquee forward most days. E.g Reid, canning
O'Keeffe-didn't reach the heights of 2017 but could never be faulted for effort and attitude
Shaun Murphy- tough year teams have wished up to our system and how he plays, if Davy does stay this is something to be reviewed
Donohoe- adds pace and energy and improved on 2017 but would still worry about him on a marquee corner forward
Kevin Foley-brilliant league but tailed off a bit in the championship, maybe the long season with the club caught up with him,more than capable of mixing it at this level
Nolan- improved again on 2017, always up for the battle and 1 of my favourite players for that reason
Rory O'Connor- very good year best hurler in the county in my opinion
Mcgovern-didn't look fully match sharp today but hopefully back to full throttle in 2019
Dunne-great honesty of effort and adds alot with his pace but limited natural hurling ability can let him down
Chin-was flying in the 1st 3 league games but poor year after that, the reason he gets so much flack is there's so much more in the lad as proven in 2016 and 17, if his form hadn't dropped people wouldn't question his media commitments, endorsements etc. but given recent form all distractions have to be looked at.
McDonald- very good today but an erratic year overall, the 1 player who suffers most with our system, if he played at 14 with 2 corner forwards from morris, mcgovern, Dunne and Rory O'Connor playing off him he could cause mayhem
Jack O'Connor- mixed bag not a natural forward would be more suited midfield running onto the ball, don't think he's played much senior intercounty at half back so he's actually somewhat unproven there
Morris- actually had a poor league but good championship always could for a score or 2 was missed today but not enough to change the outcome
Harry Kehoe- made some good contributions coming off the bench during the year

bostonredsox (Wexford) - Posts: 4368 - 15/07/2018 01:16:22    2121891

hurler101 (Wexford) - Posts: 471 - 15/07/2018 09:27:25    2121933

890202 (Wexford) - Posts: 1278 - 15/07/2018 10:21:53    2121949

bostonredsox (Wexford) - Posts: 4368 - 15/07/2018 10:47:00    2121959

Very dissapointed with the performance yesterday . Totally mystified by some of the managements decisions yesterday . Why did we bunch around the 65 in the first half in the first half . The backs had no option bar a short pass. Why are we persisting with sweeper system when it doesn't suit our players and would free up some of the outstanding forwards we have i.e. Mac and Rory. The same as Waterford game last year persisted with sweeper when we needed to chase the game .Clare were there for the taking . We also brought on Donohue and Devereux two backs , hardly going to make the impact to win us the game when the likes of Tomkins left sitting on the bench . The management have clearly not learned from there mistakes from last year that's why I think it's time for change. I think we need go for a proven winner like Anthony Daly , Liam Sheedy or maybe even Dj Carey. With the addition of under 21s such as Darren Byrne , Seamus Casey and Ian Carty. Also get back players such as James Breen, Shore and Guiney if he regains form. Coupled with already. Davy has given us some great days but I just think the Davy factor is gone stale and new top manager can push us onto the next level and hopefully end our wait for silverware.

Afinestick (Wexford) - Posts: 999 - 15/07/2018 11:39:33    2121979

A few thoughts on things.

1. Davy Fitz has done an excellent job with our team over the last two seasons. In my opinion there are positives and negatives to his sweeper system. We don't have 15 players as good as most of the top teams. We just don't. We have about 10 who are really good, but there is a serious tail to our team. The sweeper system makes sure most games we play stay very close, and then we can see can we get over the line by a point or two. We struggle at the back, even with 7 players back there. Will we win an All-Ireland playing the sweeper? No. Would we win one playing any other way? Probably not. Davy has gotten the team fitter and better prepared (by a mile) than any team we've had since the mid 90's. We are in Division 1 and stayed up. This is a priority in order for us to keep developing.

2. Yesterday was the worst performance under Davy Fitz since he came in. I thought the team played really poorly on a number of fronts. Our puckouts were poor. When we went short we got closed down and made poor decisions. When we went long we lost more than we won. Liam Ryan had a decent game on John Conlan who will most likely be an All Star. But the other three players around the full back line area, two corner backs plus sweeper, played really poorly and those 3 didn't even break even with the 2 Clare corner forwards. That's like playing the match with 14 players. Our touch was poor throughout. Our shooting was poor. Even Conor Mac, who I thought along with Ryan was our best player, hit some bad wides. Malone and Galvin demolished our midfield from start to finish and Dee and Foley were closed down by their markers. I understand being beaten by a better player or tactics being wrong, but from a player point of view we weren't at the races at all - work rate, passing, touch, decision making are all controllable by players and we were awful.

3. Davy Fitz might not stay now. I believe we should keep him, 100%, if we can as he is a top manager and without a top manager we'll head back to where we were. But after watching the players play that badly yesterday he might not want it any more. All a manager wants is to keep making progress, and between yesterday and the collapse against Kilkenny it looks like we are going backwards.

4. The team does need a wee bit of surgery. Our pool of players who will surely start is: Fanning, Ryan, P Foley, Dee, O'Hanlon, K Foley, Reck, Nolan, Chin, Mac, Rory O, Jack O. After that nobody jumps out as a must-start. The full-back line, Ryan aside, is one of the poorer full-back lines in the country, whoever plays there. Who plays corner back, I don't know, but I haven't felt our corner backs have locked down opponents in any game even with a sweeper in front of them. Our sweeper has played poorly the last while and I'd like to see someone else tried there - could Dee, either Foley or even Nolan do a job there? We have 3 forwards in Mac, Chin and Rory who must start, but after that nobody has excelled: Morris, Dunne, McGovern, Jack O, Harry etc. And our bench has no impact. Harry and Willie coming in yesterday didn't inspire me that they'd make a big difference.

5. Are there others who could come into the panel or push to get in the team? Joe Coleman, Colm Kehoe, Tompkins, Dunbar. Are Byrne and Shore gone forever? I think there will be changes to the panel, whether Davy stays or goes.

Let's not forget where we were before Davy came in. Back in 2016, after too many years of Dunne, we were firmly rooted in Division 1B with little hope of promotion any time soon. We were hammered by Limerick, lost at home in the league to Offaly by 8 points, and needed a late few points to beat Laois. Followed by losing to Dublin in the championship by more than double scores and after two wins against bad teams were annihilated by Waterford by 0-21 to 0-11.

We need Davy to stay and he needs to make some changes to our tactics, our personnel and our structure of the team.

icehonesty (Wexford) - Posts: 2553 - 15/07/2018 11:44:46    2121982

I have tried to post a few times already about Davy but it hasn't been allowed so I leave it at that. Was wondering what the chances of getting james Breen, shore, guiney, podge Doran ands an byrne back into the panel? Anyone know any of these lads personally?

hunting (Wexford) - Posts: 952 - 15/07/2018 13:03:47    2122029

In its simplest terms I believe there are two big problems with our team:

1. Full back line not strong enough
2. No ball winners in the half forward line

These two problems have led to numerous players being played out of position and the use of the sweeper system.

Picking a team foe next year is nearly impossible because I reckon a few players will probably step away but if I was picking one I'd go with something like:

Fanning (If no other option)

D Byrne
L Ryan
S Murphy

P Foley
M Hanlon
J O'Connor

D O'Keefe
D Reck

R O'Connor
Lee Chin
S Tomkins

P Morris
Conor Mac
Liam Og

the_post (USA) - Posts: 185 - 15/07/2018 13:25:30    2122044

Couple of things.

It's lazy analysis to just say the problem is the sweeper system because it's the in thing amongst the hurling purists to belittle the system.

It's not the system is the problem. We are creating more than enough opportunities to win games in every game I've seen. It's not the fault of the system that inter county hurlers haven't the ability to hit a sideline cut properly, nor is the fault of the system when players in oceans of space are inexplicably hitting the ball back to the opposition, nor is it the fault of system that players with time and space to score from midfield are driving wide after wide, it's not the fault of the system that our free taking continues to hinder us.

Now people might not like the sweeper system which is fair enough but this belief that if we just go out and hurl 15 on 15 the issues we have will suddenly disappear is far fetched. We can hurl whatever system we want but as long as the fundamental flaws still exist it's simply just playing a different way.

If Davy goes he goes and someone else comes in plain and simply but with the hurlers we have are we going to improve significantly? Are we simply good enough? Let's be realistic what have we got to show in terms of our underage teams for the past 20 years and even further? Simply put have we the players to win silverware?

To be honest I'm not sure we do, this may be just the ceiling for these players when we come up against the better teams. Are there players out there apart from what's on the panel at the moment to rectify the issues we have?

tearintom (Wexford) - Posts: 1351 - 15/07/2018 13:30:02    2122050

So I said it after the second half collapse against Kilkenny and it upset a few on here. The sweeper system only works to stop us conceding the big scores we used to concede when up against the top teams. Playing an extra back and leaving us short up front doesn't need explaining. By its very nature it's going to restrict our creativity and threat. I have to say it's credit to our players that there hasn't been unrest in the camp over players not being allowed to express themselves. The sweeper makes one statement for me and that is "We are not good enough and the manager doesn't trust his players to go toe to toe and beat anyone. It has sucked confidence out of any attack minded players we have. It works a treat when the 60, 70 and 80 yard shots sail over the 5 forwards and over the bar but how's that worked out for us so far? Wide after wide after stupid long range wide!!!! But hey Davy can walk away and know he didn't lose big to anyone. Rory O was a breath of fresh air this year and a serious talent but continue to play to this system and watch the confidence seep out of just like it has with Mc with Chin and the rest. They've done what they're told for the team but where's the flair. Forwards need ball SIMPLE!!!
And don't forget players turned against Davy in Waterford and in Clare. Is the reason that the system he champions is too limiting?? We've shipped heavy defeats in quarter and semi finals before, can anyone tell me they feel much less disappointed after yesterday than after those defeats?

Northcountyman (Wexford) - Posts: 59 - 15/07/2018 13:43:24    2122064

My thoughts
I think we are punching at our weight and that's between 5th -8th in the country.
If we go fifteen on fifteen we are liable to ship a heavy thumping
Realistically away to Dublin and Galway home to Carlow and Kilkenny we will be very lucky to get out of the group. The Dublin game will probably define 2019.
Division 1 status secured in 2018, championship report was average could do better
A win at under 21 level would be huge for us.

hurlorhurley (Wexford) - Posts: 1660 - 15/07/2018 14:45:14    2122084

lets call a spade a spade.this year has been awful.
watching wexford hurling has not been enjoyable this year.i dont get to many games but i see enough.
we had lads training on christmas day and burnt out by may.they have looked tired throughout.
the sweeper works in the league because the ball cant get over the bar from 65 yards out.top teams are able to play around it and for me the writing was on the wall when kilkenny came down and bet us by 10 points.
we could have won every match this year if we had a reliable free taker.
look at the first half of limerick kilkenny.that is how you hurl.get the ball, move it,win your own ball.
i think we have a very strong 15-20 hurlers and we dont get the best out of them.
i think we have better players than the system we play.
i cant see davy coming back and i think we could do with a change.
i would love anthony daly,or depending on the U21s tom mullally?
eddie brennan managed a kk team who lost to westmeath.
no point worrying about who is not involved.
to be honest,i think the team should decide if they want davy back.
we also need our country board to stick up for us more.that match should never have been played in cork.

perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 15/07/2018 14:47:47    2122086

hurler101 (Wexford) - Posts: 471 - 15/07/2018 15:08:21    2122097

This time I wasnt gutted. Saddened that some of the players seemed to be tied by nerves. Yes , perfect 10, we have a good 15 to 20 players. But our full back line is too weak to play without a sweeper. And our pacy half backs are often looking forwards rather than backwards. 2 of our best players in recent years MOH and Lee Chin had poor enough seasons looked injured/tired. I dont think any other manager would have sone better in 2018 for us or will do better in 2019. Tbh if youd asked me would we stay up in 1a this season in January I wouldnt have been sure. And while we have reached 4 AIQFs in the last 5 years this is the first time that with 5 mins to go we were in with a shout of winning 1. And that despite many of the lads having an off day. I think its a mental issue with them most are goid hurlers. Be careful what you wish for lads we could well appoint some1 else, get relegated from div 1a, and not make the QF at all......

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12053 - 15/07/2018 16:02:30    2122125

This time I wasnt gutted. Saddened that some of the players seemed to be tied by nerves. Yes , perfect 10, we have a good 15 to 20 players. But our full back line is too weak to play without a sweeper. And our pacy half backs are often looking forwards rather than backwards. 2 of our best players in recent years MOH and Lee Chin had poor enough seasons looked injured/tired. I dont think any other manager would have sone better in 2018 for us or will do better in 2019. Tbh if youd asked me would we stay up in 1a this season in January I wouldnt have been sure. And while we have reached 4 AIQFs in the last 5 years this is the first time that with 5 mins to go we were in with a shout of winning 1. And that despite many of the lads having an off day. I think its a mental issue with them most are goid hurlers. Be careful what you wish for lads we could well appoint some1 else, get relegated from div 1a, and not make the QF at all......

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 12053 - 15/07/2018 16:03:10    2122126

I thought it was best to wait until today before expressing my views. Yesterday was a harrowing experience ,a truly awful tame way to exit the championship. I'm finding it quite amusing reading the views being expressed here from lads stating how much we've progressed under davy. My own view? the facts dont lie,our championship results are no better than they were under previous management. I personally couldnt give a toss about being promoted from 1b, i would give slightly more value to staying in division 1. Our championship performance this year was actually worse than last year and i thought our exit last year was pathetic but yesterday was without doubt the most depressing way to end a year of stagnation. We made a leinster final last year and lost the 1/4 by 4 points,this year we failed to make aleinster final and lost the 1/4 final by 7 points,being bullied out thought out fought by a very beatable clare team. Dress it however you like but Davy has simply stalled our progress and heres why.

1) System staganation. Ive been saying it for 2 years,i'm all for sweepers and attacking from deep and love tactical innovation however to play this position you need a hurler with good hurling ability and excellent decision making and disturbution. Unfortunatly for us, shaun murphy has neither. he,in my opinion is an average club hurler in terms of ability and his distrubition all year has been embarrassing. How or why davy stuck with him all year and yesterday when we were 7 down with 10 minutes left me speechless. I hate picking out players but some his disturbution yesterday cost us 5/6 points.

2) the systems inflexability and limiting our best hurlers;Simply put any system teams employshould be designed to best utilise the talent at your disposable,ours does the opposite. Lee chin standing wing forward all year watching the game by pass him,not hitting a ball at midfield where he gave a masterclass on june 2nd 2017 or at center forward where he destroyed cork in 2016. I felt for the lad all year. I dont particularly like lads using his off fields exploits as a stick to beat him with though. Chin needs to be more aggressive,show more desire,more leadership, be more involved and play either at midfield or at 11 end of story. This team wont progress playing him as we are.

2) O Keeffee wing back struggles ;Surprise surprise david reidy turned o keeffe,forced him to defend then all the problems start. Beautiful hurler and this wing back role suits him against weaker teams but against better teams he gets found out again and again. Midfield option or impact sub end of story. Square pegs in round holes suits nobody.

3) jack o connor misuse; Saying it all year again but lads were blinded by a few catches v clare& galway in the league. Play jacko wing back /midfield and let the lad drive forward.

4) Forward inability to wing clean possesion due to inaccurate puck outs and our instance or trying to bring the ball to ground. Anybody who cannot see how desperate with are for ball winning forwards are delluded. We simply have to get jack guiney & ian byrne back on board next year.

5) what is wrong with our shooting or can somebody explain how or why we shoot 10 + wides every single game?I'm at a loss.

6) Damien Reck; Outstanding young hurler but we are sacrificing and misusing his hurling ability and energy playing him corner back. I suggested pushing him further forward months ago and lads freaked out. Perhaps we should re visit this. Reck center back flanked by Paudie Foley and Jack O'Connor?.

As regards yesterday we got our team,our tactics,our match ups and subs all wrong. Davy on sse talking about trying this that and the other like he invented hurling was cringe worthy. We sacrifised our classiest defender paudie foley to chase tony kelly around the field so when kelly when roaming the hole pitch opened up and clares corner forwards relished the space. Awful match up.

What has liam og done to merit starting yesterday? Why has'nt cathal Dunbar , a natural fast forward with more hurling ability than david dunne and harry kehoe being given a chance? Cant win pucks,why not bring on Shane Tomkins or play chin at 11? What game was davy watching? Totally over complicates things.

Going forward I am not bothered whether davy stays or goes, davy will make sure its all about him anyway,nothing like some ego stroking.

We've 2 options now;

1)If davy stays then he needs to prove he aint a one trick poney and develop a system that doesnt cripple us and develop our training so we stop peaking and hitting our best form in may when nobody cares.

2) Save a fortune,give JJ or someone else they job, get the likes of Shore,byrne, guiney back, bring in Seamus Casey,Ian Carthy, Darren byrne,use to league to develop our style then drive on next summer with a fresh approach.

im 51/49 in favour of option b.

I do not agreee that 1/4 finals are our ceiling. We've shown in spells that we are right in the mix.

cragask (Wexford) - Posts: 892 - 15/07/2018 16:23:36    2122140

Finchfurlong996 (Wexford) - Posts: 255 - 15/07/2018 16:46:16    2122151

perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 15/07/2018 17:13:00    2122166

wexcore (Wexford) - Posts: 740 - 15/07/2018 17:35:29    2122186

perfect10 (Wexford) - Posts: 3929 - 15/07/2018 18:22:25    2122237