HoganStand GAA Football and Hurling

National Forum

Brolly on Gooch

(Oldest Posts First) - Go To The Latest Post

You need to Login to Post

Replying To Awwwwnow: "There plenty of 1 trick ponies giving their opinion on RTÉ and SKY. Some were lucky enough to win 1 all Ireland and some never won anything at the highest level. The secret is ... don't listen to them . Especially the 1 trick 1,footers..Then their opinion won't rag" There are even some one-trick ponies on here. Complain/whinge/negativity. Most people ignore them as you say. Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 11/04/2017 14:31:10 1978403 Link
Replying To Awwwwnow: "There plenty of 1 trick ponies giving their opinion on RTÉ and SKY. Some were lucky enough to win 1 all Ireland and some never won anything at the highest level. The secret is ... don't listen to them . Especially the 1 trick 1,footers..Then their opinion won't rag" A good player but no where near the greatest to ever play the game. The tributes are way over the top, Kilkenny have lost players who have won 7/8/9/10 all irelands and there was maybe a piece in the papers and bit online and rightly so and that was it , they didn't get the RTE treatment. Brolly was 100% right. ke40 (Kildare) - Posts: 209 - 11/04/2017 14:32:26 1978404 Link
Replying To ziggy32001: "how??? he scored points from play in some of those games against tyrone.." Those points were scored early in the game when play was settling and a little looser. By the key moments of the game he wasn't scoring. For example like Canavan's corner flag point at the corner of the canal end very late in the 2005 final. Gooch, as we all recognise, was one of the most skilled footballers of all time, but he lacked the physical hardness of other greats. He could never make an impact on Compromise Rules like Canavan, Geraghty, Ciaran McDonald etc. Laois76 (Laois) - Posts: 1270 - 11/04/2017 14:34:48 1978407 Link
Replying To suckvalleypaddy: "Joe's GAA world view is that if you are not a top player or a top 4 team you have serious deficiencies. Winning a division 4, 3 or 2 title is offends his mindset. His contribution to analysis is limited to the top 4 a la carte." In a sense he's right though. We have about 12-16 teams playing the same old slow lateral football style. It's hard to take when the likes of Brolly says that about your own county team. I remember Laois beat Meath to get into the all-ireland quarter final of 2012 against the Dubs. Colm O'Rourke said in analysis after the game 'look Laois in reality are going nowhere'. I was highly offended at the time. But in hindsight he was right. we had a highly defensive system. We ran the Dubs to 3 points in the quarter final but never looked like winning. Too many teams are playing for respectability rather than to win. Tipp are an exception, lacking a bit in panel resources. Having said that, Laois getting to the division 2 final against Donegal in 2011 and the all-ireland quarter in 2012 is better than being in division 4!! Galway have potential to do something different in my opinion though. Hard to see a great football county looking as fearful as they did in the first half on Sunday. Laois76 (Laois) - Posts: 1270 - 11/04/2017 14:42:19 1978411 Link
Replying To ke40: "A good player but no where near the greatest to ever play the game. The tributes are way over the top, Kilkenny have lost players who have won 7/8/9/10 all irelands and there was maybe a piece in the papers and bit online and rightly so and that was it , they didn't get the RTE treatment. Brolly was 100% right." Yes Cooper was a good player and he would probably get into anyone's 6 forwards if we had to pick a team. But the greatest ? Not in my eyes. But if I was from Kerry I might think different . Awwwwnow (Cavan) - Posts: 1050 - 11/04/2017 15:04:29 1978426 Link
Replying To Laois76: "In a sense he's right though. We have about 12-16 teams playing the same old slow lateral football style. It's hard to take when the likes of Brolly says that about your own county team. I remember Laois beat Meath to get into the all-ireland quarter final of 2012 against the Dubs. Colm O'Rourke said in analysis after the game 'look Laois in reality are going nowhere'. I was highly offended at the time. But in hindsight he was right. we had a highly defensive system. We ran the Dubs to 3 points in the quarter final but never looked like winning. Too many teams are playing for respectability rather than to win. Tipp are an exception, lacking a bit in panel resources. Having said that, Laois getting to the division 2 final against Donegal in 2011 and the all-ireland quarter in 2012 is better than being in division 4!! Galway have potential to do something different in my opinion though. Hard to see a great football county looking as fearful as they did in the first half on Sunday." I can never remember Gooch grabbing a game and stamping himself all over it like Henry Shefflin did for Kilkenny in the drawn all-ireland hurling final of 2012. Roy Keane did the same against Juventus in the Champions League semi final of 1999. He was moderately skilled when compared with the Zidanes, Ronaldinhos, Messis and both Ronaldos. But he was a great player. True greatness calls for more than being extremely skilled. Laois76 (Laois) - Posts: 1270 - 11/04/2017 15:14:04 1978432 Link
Replying To Awwwwnow: "There plenty of 1 trick ponies giving their opinion on RTÉ and SKY. Some were lucky enough to win 1 all Ireland and some never won anything at the highest level. The secret is ... don't listen to them . Especially the 1 trick 1,footers..Then their opinion won't rag" What has winning all Ireland's got to do with being able to analyse a match? You don't have to have played inter county to be able to read a game and give your opinion, same as you didn't have to be a great player to be a great manager there different roles hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 11/04/2017 15:25:08 1978443 Link
Replying To hill16no1man: "What has winning all Ireland's got to do with being able to analyse a match? You don't have to have played inter county to be able to read a game and give your opinion, same as you didn't have to be a great player to be a great manager there different roles" But you do need hours of TV analysis and pages of stats. Why then don't RTÉ bring an ordinary Joe Soap from the match up to join Brolly and co on a Sunday night? I spoke with a certain pundit who managed last year at club level and he couldn't name the oppositions goalkeeper. But he could remember how much someone like Colin Cooper could score 10 years ago in a particular match.. Awwwwnow (Cavan) - Posts: 1050 - 11/04/2017 15:40:05 1978454 Link
I can't understand why so much attention to an individual who scored the grand total of 1 point in an AI Final and another mighty one point in an AI Semi Final where there were no sweepers or blanket defences to contend with I think people, particularly ourselves in the Kingdom should pay no heed and let him blabber what he wants KYTotalFootball (Kerry) - Posts: 280 - 11/04/2017 16:20:51 1978484 Link
Don't know why my original comment didn't make it through the filter, so shall try again ;) Brolly is being very selective with some of his comments IMO, as several posters have pointed out that Cooper had a very respectable return against the top Ulster sides. Brolly also claimed that he hadn't performed on the big day for Dr. Crokes in an All-Ireland club final, but that claim has been put to bed now. That Tyrone side were one of the best of all time IMO, and few forwards ran riot against them from play, due to their individual excellence and the system they used at the time. Kerry were also put to the test during that period by the likes of Galway, Monaghan, Dublin, Armagh (2006) and Cork (2009) and Cooper usually came up with the goods. He also claims to be against the deification of Cooper by the national meeja, but is IMO also a bit simplistic with his analysis of Canavan. Wee Peter was a truly great footballer, no doubt, but he also did occasionally cross the line, as his late "tackle" on Cooper in the 2005 All-Ireland final showed. Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 11/04/2017 16:59:14 1978511 Link
Replying To KYTotalFootball: "I can't understand why so much attention to an individual who scored the grand total of 1 point in an AI Final and another mighty one point in an AI Semi Final where there were no sweepers or blanket defences to contend with I think people, particularly ourselves in the Kingdom should pay no heed and let him blabber what he wants" Thought Gooch scored more than that? IrishGael3 (USA) - Posts: 1092 - 11/04/2017 17:11:27 1978512 Link
Replying To KYTotalFootball: "I can't understand why so much attention to an individual who scored the grand total of 1 point in an AI Final and another mighty one point in an AI Semi Final where there were no sweepers or blanket defences to contend with I think people, particularly ourselves in the Kingdom should pay no heed and let him blabber what he wants" why, have you scored more than one point in an AI Final? Is that the going rate for a valid opinion? I don't agree with what Brolly said about Gooch but I get where he's coming from as far as a debate on the matter goes. But this hierarchy sh#te about having a certain status in the game before your worth listening to is nonsense. I think some of the the best to play the game can be terrible analysts and vice versa. I'm sorry but your post reeked of snobbery. You can surely do better than that my friend. SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2386 - 11/04/2017 18:18:09 1978542 Link
Maurice Fitz didn't score much from play in All Ireland Finals either, suppose he's best ignored too. Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 11/04/2017 19:07:38 1978548 Link
Replying To Breffni39: "Maurice Fitz didn't score much from play in All Ireland Finals either, suppose he's best ignored too." ? Fitz scored 9 points in the 97 final! Gleebo (Mayo) - Posts: 2208 - 11/04/2017 20:25:43 1978573 Link
Replying To Gleebo: "? Fitz scored 9 points in the 97 final!" Yeah I said from play. Brolly didn't take the frees at the time. He wasnt a corner forward at the time either. Just trying to highlight the stupidity of the post. Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12120 - 11/04/2017 20:36:03 1978574 Link
Replying To Laois76: "Those points were scored early in the game when play was settling and a little looser. By the key moments of the game he wasn't scoring. For example like Canavan's corner flag point at the corner of the canal end very late in the 2005 final. Gooch, as we all recognise, was one of the most skilled footballers of all time, but he lacked the physical hardness of other greats. He could never make an impact on Compromise Rules like Canavan, Geraghty, Ciaran McDonald etc." Hilarious. So first he was anonymous. Then when it was proven that he put up very respectable scores in those games only points late on count!! If we are going to those lengths did anybody consider that Canavan was introduced as a sub against a tiring Kerry defence in 2005, surely making it easier for him to have an impact on things. Ridiculous argument I know, but hardly any less relevant than the above. GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2105 - 11/04/2017 20:38:22 1978575 Link
Replying To Awwwwnow: "But you do need hours of TV analysis and pages of stats. Why then don't RTÉ bring an ordinary Joe Soap from the match up to join Brolly and co on a Sunday night? I spoke with a certain pundit who managed last year at club level and he couldn't name the oppositions goalkeeper. But he could remember how much someone like Colin Cooper could score 10 years ago in a particular match.." They don't have average Joe's because big names bring in viewer's regardless of if they are good at it. Teams win all Ireland's not individuals. its like saying Mattie forde wasn't a brilliant player because he didn't win an all Ireland which is ridiculous hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 11/04/2017 21:15:03 1978585 Link
Replying To Breffni39: "Maurice Fitz didn't score much from play in All Ireland Finals either, suppose he's best ignored too." Yeah only the 9 points in 1997 KYTotalFootball (Kerry) - Posts: 280 - 11/04/2017 21:56:49 1978594 Link
Replying To GeniusGerry: "Hilarious. So first he was anonymous. Then when it was proven that he put up very respectable scores in those games only points late on count!! If we are going to those lengths did anybody consider that Canavan was introduced as a sub against a tiring Kerry defence in 2005, surely making it easier for him to have an impact on things. Ridiculous argument I know, but hardly any less relevant than the above." canavan started the final in 2005. remember his great goal in the first half? southtyronegael (Tyrone) - Posts: 19 - 11/04/2017 22:41:37 1978604 Link
Replying To SaffronDon: "why, have you scored more than one point in an AI Final? Is that the going rate for a valid opinion? I don't agree with what Brolly said about Gooch but I get where he's coming from as far as a debate on the matter goes. But this hierarchy sh#te about having a certain status in the game before your worth listening to is nonsense. I think some of the the best to play the game can be terrible analysts and vice versa. I'm sorry but your post reeked of snobbery. You can surely do better than that my friend." I'm sorry but if you are going to try and attack someone's character , someone who is greatly respected in Kerry but beyond you had better have something to back it up From an individual who claims to love club football , hates the scientific elements of modern football and so on and yet disparages someone of class, intelligence and skill proves he should be ignored. Cooper was top scorer in the 05 and 08 finals and yet he is a choker according to the 1 point passenger from Derry KYTotalFootball (Kerry) - Posts: 280 - 11/04/2017 22:44:40 1978606 Link