Also i think it is extremely lazy analysis by Brolly in relation to the gooch and he is just trying to create a stir which he has obviously succeeded in. In the 2008 final vs Tyrone Gooch was top scorer with 6 points, 3 from play and had a very decent game. In the 2005 final, again gooch was joint top scorer with 5 points (2 from play) and and again had quite a good game. To say he was anonymous in these games is extremely lazy analysis and clearly inaccurate. It's a very easy thing to say about a player when a team lose a big game that a certain player was anonymous many years past the event. I would agree that the gooch had quiet games against Donegal in 2012 and in the 2015 final vs Dublin. The latter is more down to the cruciate injury he suffered at hisage and not being able to fully return to his peak which is completely understandable. When it comes to silverware won and what he has acheived in the game, Brolly isn't fit to lace his boots and there is a touch of begrudgery about his comments. He somewhat belittles his individual performances against Mayo and Cork in various AI finals as it was an easy thing to do... then why doesnt everybody do it?? He just loves the sound of his own voice. I also wouldnt say the gooch is the GOAT as it is a very subjective thing and impossible to compare different players but there is no doubt he is up there. The way modern football has gone we wont be seeing too many more of his ilk and it is a crying shame!

maximus02 (Longford) - Posts: 169 - 10/04/2017 11:13:55    1977840

Like him or hate him Brolly creates debate and brings an audience. The fact there is a thread on this proves it. Colm Cooper was an excellent player. The fact his 4 All Ireland's came against Mayo and Cork, two teams who never showed up on the big day is a point. The fact he failed to beat any of the northern teams in finals is also a point worth discussing but was more of a Kerry failing than anything cooper did or didn't do.

BTW - I have heard he hates the nickname "Gooch" so why does everybody keep calling him that?

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11232 - 10/04/2017 11:14:39    1977841

Ah now go easy on Joe. He was of course the greatest corner forward that ever played the game, yet no one gave him the praise that this upstart from Kerry is getting. Wouldn't you be annoyed if you were Joe,

neverright (Roscommon) - Posts: 1648 - 10/04/2017 11:14:45    1977842

galwaydublin (Galway) - Posts: 226 - 10/04/2017 11:18:07    1977844

galwaydublin (Galway) - Posts: 226 - 10/04/2017 11:21:44    1977846

galwaydublin (Galway) - Posts: 226 - 10/04/2017 11:25:44    1977849

My own increasingly vague memory of that superb 2005 final was that Gooch was terrific for a lot of it, and that it's well documented how Tyrone had to step outside the boundary of the rulebook to contain him at times. It's a shame that pundits, including Brolly, can't see outside the cliche that losing teams are fully stocked with losers, and winning teams with winners. It's more complicated than that surely? Tyrone 2003-2008 had Kerry's number. It's as simple as that. It was a squad over squad edge, and wasn't a Gooch issue specifically, nor does it spoil his legacy as a player imo.

Pope_Benedict (Galway) - Posts: 3426 - 10/04/2017 11:27:59    1977850

Read brollys article, well written, excellent, no problem, this is a democracy. His points on the Sunday game, equally so. But Joe, as whelo said, would ya shut up a second and let others finish. Other than that, no issues with anything you wrote or said, pretty much all correct.

galwaydublin (Galway) - Posts: 226 - 10/04/2017 11:29:15    1977853

Brolly is entitled to his opinion but a lot of what he says is as close to factually incorrect as you can get. Cooper was not 'anonymous' in the 2005 and 2008 finals. In fact, he was very very good in both. In his article he has a go at Gooch for his performances in he 2002 and 2003 finals. Really? When he was, what, 18 or 19 years old? I mean come on.

You can't be only selective when it suits. Brolly points the finger at Cooper when Kerry lose but basically credits the rest of the team when they win. He writes off games against Mayo or Cork getting people to believe that all Kerry have to do is show up in those games so Cooper's performances don't matter.

This whole 'grab the game by the scruff of the neck stuff' is just stupid. It's a team game and Cooper is the ultimate team player. You could never accuse him of being greedy on the ball and not passing to someone in a better position. There is a certain nostalgia about Canavan. He was a great player but I've seen him kept quiet of many occasions down through the years. By Brolly's assertions, if you don't star in every single game then you aren't great.

The question he asked Tomas O'Se was a loaded one. 'Name a game where Cooper stood up and changed it'. Firstly, when you have hundreds of games where you think Cooper was brilliant, as Tomas did, you are being asked to name one - that immediately degrades all of the other performances and makes it look like there is only 1 you can mention. Likewise, if you only name 2 or 3. Brolly knows what he is doing with that line of questioning. If you asked someone on the spot to name all the games where Canavan dragged Tyrone across the line they would have similar problems. It's a dishonest way of arguing your point.

benjyyy (Donegal) - Posts: 1422 - 10/04/2017 11:37:33    1977861

I see Monsignor Brolly is involved with the Derry u21s who play in Ulster final tonight. Interesting, very interesting.

ryan (Donegal) - Posts: 725 - 10/04/2017 11:55:20    1977874

Up there with Dunphy's anti ronaldo campaign when he played with United. Brolly like Dunphy is a lazy journalist, just throws out attention grabbing headlines with little to no research done.

Gooch was Kerry's most pivotal player last decade. He spearheaded a team who made 6 all irelands in a row, a feat we are unlikely to see again in our life time. Without him kerry wouldn't have had the same success.

While kerry were at the peak of their powers brolly said kerry don't win games when teams put it up to them, this in mind being a team who haven't lost a championship game in kerry since 1995, cork always put it up to us, a team that has a 100% record in the qualifiers and a team that made 6 finals in a row.

Brolly is a bad analyst, adds little to debate about the actual games and just sidetrack onto some controversial subject that will give him the attention he craves

as_ky (Kerry) - Posts: 535 - 10/04/2017 12:31:32    1977896

Whammo86 (Antrim) - Posts: 4226 - 10/04/2017 12:49:34    1977908

InishowenMan (Donegal) - Posts: 216 - 10/04/2017 13:06:49    1977920

s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 10/04/2017 13:16:34    1977928

After all these years listening to Brolly people are worse for entertaining him, let him off to hell with his opinions and don't rise to them

Bon (Kildare) - Posts: 1911 - 10/04/2017 13:19:07    1977930

Eamon Fitzmaurice cost Kerry potentially two all Ireland's by keeping gooch on the field in last years semi final agaisnt dublin and also the all Ireland final the year previous. Even Kerry people will tell you that. Lived on his reputation in the years after his knee injury.

shaggylegend (Monaghan) - Posts: 1928 - 10/04/2017 13:25:00    1977936

IrishGael3 (USA) - Posts: 1092 - 10/04/2017 14:00:18    1977972

I'd be more worried about his comments about Ciaran Kilkenny than anything he says about the Gooch.

gotmilk (Fermanagh) - Posts: 4971 - 10/04/2017 14:23:44    1977989

Look back through the stats of the games brolly mentioned and gooch is still Kerrys highest scorer from play(and he himself was likely fouled for some of the frees that he converted). Bar Donegal '12 where Donaghy got a goal. Brolly must have wanted gooch to win every single game. If you watch the '11 final, if Kerry had to give him the ball more in the last 10mins they would have won. Ifs and buts. I agree he was finished regarding inter county stage after the knee. Dublin exploited this with Philly

Frederick (Louth) - Posts: 479 - 10/04/2017 14:34:10    1977998

royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 10/04/2017 17:09:15    1978065