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Last week, a club footballer tweeted that its been 66 days since the last club league game in Cavan. Its mid July, and there has been only 4 rounds of league fixtures played, despite the promise of the Chairman that he would overhaul the entire club fixtures. The County Board will tell you that its to protect the County Players, yet, just as Cavan were knocked out of the Championship, the same County Players will now be expected to play 3 club games in the space of a week, commencing this weekend. The club scene is in total disarray, the County Board have shown very little respect for the ordinary club player, replacing the Mickey Mouse League (Breffni) with another Mickey Mouse league (Spring). Surely, it can only benefit the County Team if the players and more importantly, fringe players, are playing regular club football. When you look at the subs bench/panel, many of them wouldn't have played a match since the club fixtures, and it showed when some of them were brought on. Its time for the clubs to stand up, for the ordinary players to show their voice and demand change. deanmartin (Cavan) - Posts: 643 - 19/07/2016 09:55:03 1886042 Link
Replying To deanmartin: "Last week, a club footballer tweeted that its been 66 days since the last club league game in Cavan. Its mid July, and there has been only 4 rounds of league fixtures played, despite the promise of the Chairman that he would overhaul the entire club fixtures. The County Board will tell you that its to protect the County Players, yet, just as Cavan were knocked out of the Championship, the same County Players will now be expected to play 3 club games in the space of a week, commencing this weekend. The club scene is in total disarray, the County Board have shown very little respect for the ordinary club player, replacing the Mickey Mouse League (Breffni) with another Mickey Mouse league (Spring). Surely, it can only benefit the County Team if the players and more importantly, fringe players, are playing regular club football. When you look at the subs bench/panel, many of them wouldn't have played a match since the club fixtures, and it showed when some of them were brought on. Its time for the clubs to stand up, for the ordinary players to show their voice and demand change." The Spring League was brought in so that club players had games to play on the same weekend as the County team was playing. It replaced the Breffni league as that league resulted in too many games overall. Is anyone suggesting that county players should play a club game the same weekend as a county game? The ACFL has been held back by Cavan reaching a league final. There was supposed to be a round of fixtures that weekend. Again, should they have played the day before the league final? The clubs also voted to remove a full round of fixtures the weekend before the league final even though the county board fully intended to go ahead with them. I repeat, the clubs voted it. I'm not 100% certain on this one but I'm fairly sure that there was a full ACFL round of fixtures pencilled in for the week after the first Tyrone game. However, as it went to a replay the games were postponed. There have been five rounds of fixtures in the ACFL. Those clubs that have only played four (and they're in the minority across all divisions) must have had games postponed for other reason, weather etc. So, there are nine rounds of ACFL games, five have been played leaving four to be played. Three of them are accounted for above leaving one game. Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 19/07/2016 10:46:18 1886077 Link
Additionally, there's a full set of ACFL fixtures this weekend so the league should actually be finished were it not for the points I made in my last post. Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 19/07/2016 10:50:13 1886080 Link
Replying To Skelling: "Additionally, there's a full set of ACFL fixtures this weekend so the league should actually be finished were it not for the points I made in my last post." Isn't it great that everything is running so smoothly in our club scene...!!!! Ah sure isn't it reflected in the great progress our County team are making... "We are Blue" "Believe" ...and all that guff... Sean.66 (Cavan) - Posts: 293 - 19/07/2016 22:46:19 1886735 Link
Replying To Sean.66: "Isn't it great that everything is running so smoothly in our club scene...!!!! Ah sure isn't it reflected in the great progress our County team are making... "We are Blue" "Believe" ...and all that guff..." Have you anything of note to say? I just pointed out the genuine reasons why the club league is at the stage that it's at. What the hell has that got to do with anything you've just typed? Hoganstand, land of the "I know everything that's wrong but have no idea to fix it" people. Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 20/07/2016 10:10:59 1886835 Link
It is now July 20th and I have had a look at how the A.C.F.L. is going in various counties in Ulster. In Donegal and Derry there are 11 games played in Tyrone, Armagh, Monaghan and Fermanagh there are 9 games played. In Cavan there are 5 games played the last one was played on June 3rd. What does this tell us about the treatment of 98% of our players in Cavan who are club players only? Breffnisbest (Cavan) - Posts: 471 - 20/07/2016 13:05:46 1886943 Link
Replying To Breffnisbest: "It is now July 20th and I have had a look at how the A.C.F.L. is going in various counties in Ulster. In Donegal and Derry there are 11 games played in Tyrone, Armagh, Monaghan and Fermanagh there are 9 games played. In Cavan there are 5 games played the last one was played on June 3rd. What does this tell us about the treatment of 98% of our players in Cavan who are club players only?" Good work. To make sense of these facts and to make them comparable to the situation in Cavan I think we'd need to know more information. How many games are left in these counties' leagues? Do they play these games with or without county players? If the games are played with county players, what do the clubs do on the weekends that the county are playing? There are many solutions. The opening post mentions a club player saying there was no football for 66 days. What does he want to happen when Cavan are playing? Does he want a summer version of the Spring League to be played while Cavan are still active? Is it not a good thing that club players know that they won't be playing for this period (or part of it) so that they can organise holidays? Again, I'm looking for solutions and a bit of understanding as to the issues at hand. Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 20/07/2016 14:17:07 1887009 Link
If the CLUBS did not vote to stop a round of ACFL games before the NFL Final the league would be complete next weekend with a free run at Championship. As usual it was a couple of clubs shouting the odds because they were missing one or 2 players and using the County team success as an excuse, the same clubs who complain about player burnout, yet their actions lead to a backlog of fixtures been played over a few days. Having said that its not the clubs responsibility to look at the bigger picture, thats the job of the county board. They should have stuck by their guns, played the proposed round of fixtures before the league final and got on with it. Clubs will naturally look after number 1, ie themselves, and then have a goldfish memory when it comes to complaining about reasons for the fixture backlog. Re: Champ, with the relegation of 3 teams in Senior this year it will get rid of the 2 week loss for a preliminary round so at least that makes sense and shorten the durations. There has also been improvements in the reserve competitons, leagues are finishing now instead of December and champ is up and going. Over previous years the reserves had zero games over the summer months so there is some level of improvement. With all that said, we the club players, are bottom of the pile, and I'm sure you'll find the same complaints with any other club players in the country. ballygowanwater (Cavan) - Posts: 207 - 20/07/2016 16:54:00 1887147 Link
sure they are making up for it by cramming as many games as possible into a short time period. ACFL Sunday, Wednesday, the following Sunday and the championship the following weekend. The club scene is second string to the county team as far as the CB is concerned imo. They pay lip service to it every year, give us spring leagues and breffni leagues whether we want them or not. Starve the majority to please the minority and then ram as many fixtures as possible into a short period to keep the peasants happy !! What happened to p Duffy and Our Presidents promises to look after the clubs ? It's now wonder young people are moving to different sports. FrDougalMaguire (Cavan) - Posts: 152 - 20/07/2016 17:05:09 1887153 Link
ballygowanwater (Cavan) - Two things - (1) the clubs were given the ultimatum, play without your County Players or not at all. Why should they, what about clubs in danger of relegation, clubs hoping for promotion. If the Co Board were actually worried about club and county players, why are now cramming 3 games into a 7 day period. (2) you mentioned in your post about 'the County's Success' - what success are you actually talking about, did we win something that we all missed? deanmartin (Cavan) - Posts: 643 - 21/07/2016 10:11:35 1887426 Link
Replying To deanmartin: "ballygowanwater (Cavan) - Two things - (1) the clubs were given the ultimatum, play without your County Players or not at all. Why should they, what about clubs in danger of relegation, clubs hoping for promotion. If the Co Board were actually worried about club and county players, why are now cramming 3 games into a 7 day period. (2) you mentioned in your post about 'the County's Success' - what success are you actually talking about, did we win something that we all missed?" Dean, if I may, what exactly is it you're saying? You're saying that clubs shouldn't have to play their ACFL games without county players? I agree with this. On that basis, when should the ACFL games be played, considering the reasons already given for games being called off? Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 21/07/2016 10:39:55 1887445 Link
Replying To Skelling: "Dean, if I may, what exactly is it you're saying? You're saying that clubs shouldn't have to play their ACFL games without county players? I agree with this. On that basis, when should the ACFL games be played, considering the reasons already given for games being called off?" Skelling - Its very easy, get rid of the Mickey Mouse league, start the ACFL late February/early March and play the matches any weekend that Cavan arent playing, simple as. The County Board will spout the same gibberish about protecting the County players, yet now Cavan are out of the Championship those same County players are expected to play 3 games for their clubs in the next 7 days, and then straight into club championship for the next 9/10 weekends. As I said before, the Spring league was meant to start in February and finish the end of March, yet, the finals were held on the 21st May. Its not the 21 July and there has been only 1 ACFL game played since. The County Board are only interested in protecting the players whilst Cavan remain in the Championship, once Cavan are out, the players dont matter, and the forthcoming fixture list is proof of that. deanmartin (Cavan) - Posts: 643 - 21/07/2016 14:19:42 1887656 Link
Replying To deanmartin: "Skelling - Its very easy, get rid of the Mickey Mouse league, start the ACFL late February/early March and play the matches any weekend that Cavan arent playing, simple as. The County Board will spout the same gibberish about protecting the County players, yet now Cavan are out of the Championship those same County players are expected to play 3 games for their clubs in the next 7 days, and then straight into club championship for the next 9/10 weekends. As I said before, the Spring league was meant to start in February and finish the end of March, yet, the finals were held on the 21st May. Its not the 21 July and there has been only 1 ACFL game played since. The County Board are only interested in protecting the players whilst Cavan remain in the Championship, once Cavan are out, the players dont matter, and the forthcoming fixture list is proof of that." Ok, let's say in theory that the Spring League was scrapped and the ACFL started in late February and was completed by the time Cavan play in the Championship. Where does that leave club players from May to July? The opening post on this thread was yours and you referred to a club player saying there had been no games in 66 days. If the ACFL was completed by May I don't see how this would sort this individual's desire for games. What would be different for the period from mid-May to mid-July for club players? Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 21/07/2016 14:51:26 1887700 Link
Replying To deanmartin: "Skelling - Its very easy, get rid of the Mickey Mouse league, start the ACFL late February/early March and play the matches any weekend that Cavan arent playing, simple as. The County Board will spout the same gibberish about protecting the County players, yet now Cavan are out of the Championship those same County players are expected to play 3 games for their clubs in the next 7 days, and then straight into club championship for the next 9/10 weekends. As I said before, the Spring league was meant to start in February and finish the end of March, yet, the finals were held on the 21st May. Its not the 21 July and there has been only 1 ACFL game played since. The County Board are only interested in protecting the players whilst Cavan remain in the Championship, once Cavan are out, the players dont matter, and the forthcoming fixture list is proof of that." Deanmartin. Your a laugh, you pick up on 2 words and miss the point. 1. The Clubs postponed a round of ACFL games the weekend before the league final to give the county players every chance in the league final. (ie a couple of clubs had a few injuries and it suited them not to play the fixture) Both the CCC & County Board wanted the fixture to go ahead but the club delegates put it to a vote and got it passed. The Ultimatum was made by the clubs. The whole thing is a balls because Cavan got to a league final. 2 rounds of ACFL were lost. If they hadn't have made the league final the league would be wrapped next wknd. 2. County Success, see above, the clubs seen it as a success to get to a league final and therefore postpone a round of fixtures. On your point to skelling, I don't know what you are talking about. The Spring league games were only played on weekends Cavan were involved so ACFL could never happen on them dates anyway. ballygowanwater (Cavan) - Posts: 207 - 21/07/2016 15:28:36 1887737 Link
Club first was always the way, not any more now you have a polarized playing base where in many cases the clubs don't like the intrusion by the county and some less honourable county players resent their club obligations. Free all county players up to play club matches at any time bar the weekend of a county fixture (unless the county game is on a Saturday which would allow them play club on the Sunday) ramor101 (Cavan) - Posts: 289 - 21/07/2016 15:36:09 1887745 Link
Ballygowan - The clubs voted not play the ACFL because the Co Board told them that their Co Players wouldn't be available, that was the only ultimatum given. Hence my point, scrap the Spring League, and play the ACFL on any weekend where Cavan are not involved. Start your AFCL early, and your championship early, end of. As it stands, the Championship Final is scheduled for October. Hyland brought the players back to train in October 15, 9 months later, theyre knocked out of the Championship. The Co Board, who are meant to have the players welfare at heart, have now created a situation where club and county players have to play 3 matches in 7 days, and then 9/10 weeks of Championship matches. Why not run your ACFL and Championship during any free weekends earlier in the year, give players their rest, let them go on their stags, holidays etc they are amateur after all! deanmartin (Cavan) - Posts: 643 - 21/07/2016 16:43:15 1887784 Link
Replying To deanmartin: "Ballygowan - The clubs voted not play the ACFL because the Co Board told them that their Co Players wouldn't be available, that was the only ultimatum given. Hence my point, scrap the Spring League, and play the ACFL on any weekend where Cavan are not involved. Start your AFCL early, and your championship early, end of. As it stands, the Championship Final is scheduled for October. Hyland brought the players back to train in October 15, 9 months later, theyre knocked out of the Championship. The Co Board, who are meant to have the players welfare at heart, have now created a situation where club and county players have to play 3 matches in 7 days, and then 9/10 weeks of Championship matches. Why not run your ACFL and Championship during any free weekends earlier in the year, give players their rest, let them go on their stags, holidays etc they are amateur after all!" That is factually incorrect. County players would have been available for that ACFL round just like every other ACFL round. Could you address my question above? I'll paste it here again - "The opening post on this thread was yours and you referred to a club player saying there had been no games in 66 days. If the ACFL was completed by May I don't see how this would sort this individual's desire for games. What would be different for the period from mid-May to mid-July for club players?" Skelling (USA) - Posts: 289 - 21/07/2016 17:08:14 1887805 Link
The League final and Tyrone replay certainly didn't help the clubs this year. The whole lob sided nature of the All Ireland Championship in general is a bit cumbersome when it comes to scheduling. Until a more symmetric system is implemented by Croke Park unfortunately club players will suffer. I'd like to see League finals scrapped. Replays also scrapped with the exception of possibly the AI final. Also a 4 province 8 team Championship moving different counties every year. Fixtures would then be much easier to schedule. Club only weekends could be integrated into this calendar and adhered to. AI final could be played well before when it currently is. You could also have a two week break like the builders holidays around July/August. Not going to hold my breath though. Club players are a nuisance. If clubs weren't the feeder grounds for inter county players then Croke Park would never give them a seconds thought. Hardtimes (Cavan) - Posts: 1056 - 21/07/2016 17:39:22 1887826 Link
Cavan played league matches on 31 Jan,6 Feb,28 Feb, 5 March,12 March,27 March,3 April & 24 April. Championship games then on 29th May,19th June & 3rd,9th & 16th July. There isn't much of a window for playing ACFL games with the county lads involved, as it was there were games played in or around 20 March , 9th & 29 April, 7 May and 2/3 June. Probably could have fitted in a game on 16/17 April &14/15 May but can't really see otherwise when games could have being fixed, while also giving the county players a bit of rest before their county games. I see someone earlier said that Monaghan were well ahead on games played in their ACFL, but their clubs played without their county players, played a full round on Wed 4 May , again on the 26 June ,the day after playing Donegal, and 10th July day after the Longford game , they've also played a few games on Monday & Wednesday nights gone by. aceofspades (Cavan) - Posts: 256 - 21/07/2016 18:03:19 1887838 Link
Replying To Hardtimes: "The League final and Tyrone replay certainly didn't help the clubs this year. The whole lob sided nature of the All Ireland Championship in general is a bit cumbersome when it comes to scheduling. Until a more symmetric system is implemented by Croke Park unfortunately club players will suffer. I'd like to see League finals scrapped. Replays also scrapped with the exception of possibly the AI final. Also a 4 province 8 team Championship moving different counties every year. Fixtures would then be much easier to schedule. Club only weekends could be integrated into this calendar and adhered to. AI final could be played well before when it currently is. You could also have a two week break like the builders holidays around July/August. Not going to hold my breath though. Club players are a nuisance. If clubs weren't the feeder grounds for inter county players then Croke Park would never give them a seconds thought." this moving counties between provinces on a rotational basis is a ridiculous idea. I have seen it proposed before. either you scrap the provinces or you leave them otherwise it's making things MORe complicated rather than less. Personally I would scrap the provinces completely, have the championship as a 32 county knockout with div 3 and 4 competing against each other in round one. the 8 winners playing against the div2 teams in round 2. the 8 winners playing against the div 1 teams in round 3. then you are left with quarters, semis and a final. the league then takes on more importance as it should do. s goldrick (Cavan) - Posts: 5518 - 22/07/2016 14:23:17 1888207 Link