Meath Forum

Pairc Tailteann

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Replying To latouche25:  "You're making no sense, if the job has not gone to tender and nobody on the finance committee knows what phase one will cost, then why are you talking about 10 to 14m."
It's an estimated figure based on the design, until the actual job goes to full tender you will not know the exact cost as building prices are fluctuating constantly and the type of spec will be decided upon at tender stage which also affects price.

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3601 - 23/12/2019 19:35:12    2256027

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Replying To brian:  "Not to be disrespectful, but the last work done on the ground was in the 80's, the whole place needs to be raised to the ground. I agree it needs to be done step by step and one stand at a time so we're not overly stretched financially. Getting floodlights won't be an easy thing either. Look at what we spent on the ones which then had to be taken down and i believe they're still out the back of the main stand as we can't sell them."
I think the floodlight poles that were taken down are going to be reused, there was nothing wrong with them it was the foundations that were the issue as I recall, not sure if the actual lights will be reused but being honest there probably no reason why they can't be

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3601 - 23/12/2019 19:36:56    2256028

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Replying To brian:  "Not to be disrespectful, but the last work done on the ground was in the 80's, the whole place needs to be raised to the ground. I agree it needs to be done step by step and one stand at a time so we're not overly stretched financially. Getting floodlights won't be an easy thing either. Look at what we spent on the ones which then had to be taken down and i believe they're still out the back of the main stand as we can't sell them."
To my mind it is faster and cheaper to start from a greenfield site than it is to destroy a stadium and rebuild it which is what we are doing here. Rather than selling tickets with draws etc, why not sell the stadium for apartments, shops etc while prices are high and while country is losing run of itself and then build a stadium off the motorway somewhere between Dunsaughlin and Kells... might even make economic sense to wait a few years after the sale of PT for another economic dip when it can be built cheaper and any land acquired is also cheaper. If Meath GAA was a company or an investment fund that's what they would do.

Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1008 - 24/12/2019 12:36:48    2256075

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Replying To Richieq:  "I think the floodlight poles that were taken down are going to be reused, there was nothing wrong with them it was the foundations that were the issue as I recall, not sure if the actual lights will be reused but being honest there probably no reason why they can't be"
I cant imagine they would use the existing lights as the technology today compared to the old lights is miles apart. New system will be much cheaper to run and maintain I'd imagine.

StickFan (Meath) - Posts: 193 - 24/12/2019 15:08:09    2256085

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Replying To Crinigan:  "To my mind it is faster and cheaper to start from a greenfield site than it is to destroy a stadium and rebuild it which is what we are doing here. Rather than selling tickets with draws etc, why not sell the stadium for apartments, shops etc while prices are high and while country is losing run of itself and then build a stadium off the motorway somewhere between Dunsaughlin and Kells... might even make economic sense to wait a few years after the sale of PT for another economic dip when it can be built cheaper and any land acquired is also cheaper. If Meath GAA was a company or an investment fund that's what they would do."
Green field sites are a disaster for atmosphere. Owenbeg in Derry is very poor for it. Dunganny, Grangegodden and Ashbourne not great

LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 889 - 24/12/2019 17:02:02    2256095

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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99:  "Green field sites are a disaster for atmosphere. Owenbeg in Derry is very poor for it. Dunganny, Grangegodden and Ashbourne not great"
I'm pretty sure that the NRA would not allow a link road to a motorway for a football pitch! A new pitch in the middle of nowhere would require 100+acres for parking. Brownfield sites can mean many different things and it is pretty obvious what is under the pitch (drainage) and anything which would require special treatment is above ground (roof over the stand) and this will always have to be dealt with. Then you have the special place that Pairc Tailteann is in Meath GAA- I could not see many clubs allowing it to be tossed, or sold of for a few pieces of silver.

browncows (Meath) - Posts: 2224 - 24/12/2019 19:08:10    2256101

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Replying To Crinigan:  "To my mind it is faster and cheaper to start from a greenfield site than it is to destroy a stadium and rebuild it which is what we are doing here. Rather than selling tickets with draws etc, why not sell the stadium for apartments, shops etc while prices are high and while country is losing run of itself and then build a stadium off the motorway somewhere between Dunsaughlin and Kells... might even make economic sense to wait a few years after the sale of PT for another economic dip when it can be built cheaper and any land acquired is also cheaper. If Meath GAA was a company or an investment fund that's what they would do."
Also Pairc Tailteann is close to the M3 and is in between Kells and Dunshaughlin haha

LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 889 - 24/12/2019 20:01:30    2256107

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Replying To Crinigan:  "To my mind it is faster and cheaper to start from a greenfield site than it is to destroy a stadium and rebuild it which is what we are doing here. Rather than selling tickets with draws etc, why not sell the stadium for apartments, shops etc while prices are high and while country is losing run of itself and then build a stadium off the motorway somewhere between Dunsaughlin and Kells... might even make economic sense to wait a few years after the sale of PT for another economic dip when it can be built cheaper and any land acquired is also cheaper. If Meath GAA was a company or an investment fund that's what they would do."
I have a funny feeling your sh*t stirring here buy you know what ill indulge you, firstly how would it be cheaper? Buying a site, planning and associated costs and construction, what do you think the figure would be there? And why would we move or buy a site when we already are the only county within a considerable radius with a sufficient existing site and suitable scope to redevelop into a modern mid size stadium, Louth, Kildare, Longford, Westmeath etc would love to have the site we have to develop, why would we move, what economic sense would it make? And why destroy history? Enough towns and villages in Meath have been historically desecrated by over development, believe me I know I'm from Ratoath, we have very little of our own county left, PT is one of the last surviving hallmarks of traditional Meath, why in gods name would you even want to mention disposing of it

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3601 - 27/12/2019 03:40:54    2256192

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Replying To Richieq:  "I have a funny feeling your sh*t stirring here buy you know what ill indulge you, firstly how would it be cheaper? Buying a site, planning and associated costs and construction, what do you think the figure would be there? And why would we move or buy a site when we already are the only county within a considerable radius with a sufficient existing site and suitable scope to redevelop into a modern mid size stadium, Louth, Kildare, Longford, Westmeath etc would love to have the site we have to develop, why would we move, what economic sense would it make? And why destroy history? Enough towns and villages in Meath have been historically desecrated by over development, believe me I know I'm from Ratoath, we have very little of our own county left, PT is one of the last surviving hallmarks of traditional Meath, why in gods name would you even want to mention disposing of it"
I don't know what is wrong with Mullingar as it stands, I would settle for a replica in Navan at this very minute.

MillerX (Meath) - Posts: 787 - 27/12/2019 12:10:10    2256210

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Replying To Richieq:  "I have a funny feeling your sh*t stirring here buy you know what ill indulge you, firstly how would it be cheaper? Buying a site, planning and associated costs and construction, what do you think the figure would be there? And why would we move or buy a site when we already are the only county within a considerable radius with a sufficient existing site and suitable scope to redevelop into a modern mid size stadium, Louth, Kildare, Longford, Westmeath etc would love to have the site we have to develop, why would we move, what economic sense would it make? And why destroy history? Enough towns and villages in Meath have been historically desecrated by over development, believe me I know I'm from Ratoath, we have very little of our own county left, PT is one of the last surviving hallmarks of traditional Meath, why in gods name would you even want to mention disposing of it"
good man richie I reckon your spot on

Brownepat (Meath) - Posts: 471 - 27/12/2019 13:16:25    2256218

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Replying To Crinigan:  "To my mind it is faster and cheaper to start from a greenfield site than it is to destroy a stadium and rebuild it which is what we are doing here. Rather than selling tickets with draws etc, why not sell the stadium for apartments, shops etc while prices are high and while country is losing run of itself and then build a stadium off the motorway somewhere between Dunsaughlin and Kells... might even make economic sense to wait a few years after the sale of PT for another economic dip when it can be built cheaper and any land acquired is also cheaper. If Meath GAA was a company or an investment fund that's what they would do."
Ridiculous stuff. An economic boom by definition is when companies spend,build, buy, sell etc. on a massive scale. If, as you're saying companies and investment funds only built during dips, it wouldn't be an economic dip because everyone would be spending and building!

It's also pretty unbelievable to say "just wait till the next recession and cash in". During a recession belts are tightened, government funding disappears, the GAA could cut capital funding, banks will reduce lending etc. and there'll be no funding to build any stadium.

CastleBravo (Meath) - Posts: 1430 - 27/12/2019 15:14:33    2256230

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Replying To Richieq:  "I have a funny feeling your sh*t stirring here buy you know what ill indulge you, firstly how would it be cheaper? Buying a site, planning and associated costs and construction, what do you think the figure would be there? And why would we move or buy a site when we already are the only county within a considerable radius with a sufficient existing site and suitable scope to redevelop into a modern mid size stadium, Louth, Kildare, Longford, Westmeath etc would love to have the site we have to develop, why would we move, what economic sense would it make? And why destroy history? Enough towns and villages in Meath have been historically desecrated by over development, believe me I know I'm from Ratoath, we have very little of our own county left, PT is one of the last surviving hallmarks of traditional Meath, why in gods name would you even want to mention disposing of it"
It is rumoured to cost between 10 and 14 million EUR just for one stand at the new PT. One stand. By that metric, it will cost close to 50 million EUR to complete the stadium to the envisaged spec.

PT is in the centre of the biggest town in the county and its worth is considerable.

I personally think that it shouldn't be refurbished simply because we cannot afford it and any money we have should be pumped into coaching and upgrading club grounds. PT is only full max 2/3 times a year (the odd league match or a qualifier or two). Its only half full on county final day.

However, IF you are going to start spending close to EUR 50 million (that you don't have!), then its better to think like a corporate and get the best bang for your buck, which is starting from scratch on a greenfield site. There are examples of that all over the world where we see clubs and national organisations trying to decide whether to upgrade their existing staida or start from scratch.

Just an opinion lads. But sure by all means, build the white elephant if ye like. Sounds like there's a lot more houses to raffled off the way things are developing.

Crinigan (Meath) - Posts: 1008 - 27/12/2019 16:54:39    2256236

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Replying To Crinigan:  "It is rumoured to cost between 10 and 14 million EUR just for one stand at the new PT. One stand. By that metric, it will cost close to 50 million EUR to complete the stadium to the envisaged spec.

PT is in the centre of the biggest town in the county and its worth is considerable.

I personally think that it shouldn't be refurbished simply because we cannot afford it and any money we have should be pumped into coaching and upgrading club grounds. PT is only full max 2/3 times a year (the odd league match or a qualifier or two). Its only half full on county final day.

However, IF you are going to start spending close to EUR 50 million (that you don't have!), then its better to think like a corporate and get the best bang for your buck, which is starting from scratch on a greenfield site. There are examples of that all over the world where we see clubs and national organisations trying to decide whether to upgrade their existing staida or start from scratch.

Just an opinion lads. But sure by all means, build the white elephant if ye like. Sounds like there's a lot more houses to raffled off the way things are developing."
Word is the whole project is a pipe dream. They have actually got a cost from what i hear of just under €400,000 to renovate the existign stand and re do the changign rooms. Not toss the stand but renovate it. Their is no all seater stadium or new stand as Meath dont have any money

Talking_Sense (Meath) - Posts: 209 - 27/12/2019 21:20:53    2256268

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The idea of starting with the terrace wasn't a great idea anyway. The only good part of the stadium was going to demolished and we would still be left with the current stand for years.

Barney123 (Meath) - Posts: 676 - 27/12/2019 22:55:44    2256279

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Replying To MillerX:  "I don't know what is wrong with Mullingar as it stands, I would settle for a replica in Navan at this very minute."
Very small stand, little covered accommodation and it's on a very restricted site

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3601 - 28/12/2019 02:00:10    2256288

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A 20,000 seater stadium for Navan would be behond ridiculous and unnecessary. When would it ever be full? And what about club games being played in a completely empty stadium. What we need is a completely new stand/dressing rooms/media room/medical room/food outlet space and feeding capacity for teams after matches and training etc with a stand capacity of no more than 5,000 and terracing built behind both goals and the current terrace renovated.

BigJoe14 (Meath) - Posts: 569 - 28/12/2019 11:12:32    2256298

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Replying To Richieq:  "Very small stand, little covered accommodation and it's on a very restricted site"
I didn't say 'build it in Mullingar' what I meant was a similar style stadium ON THE PRESENT site in Navan. If that site is restricted for a Cusack Park style stadium then it is also restrictive for all others as well. What I did not like really was you comparing a fine facility like Cusack Park with out of date facilities that are presently in Newbridge and Drogheda. Cusack Park is miles ahead of those places and the town has a railway link....very important if our multi-honoured neighbours in blue were scheduled to visit but then so is Newbridge and Drogheda and Longford.

MillerX (Meath) - Posts: 787 - 28/12/2019 12:00:56    2256300

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Replying To Talking_Sense:  "Word is the whole project is a pipe dream. They have actually got a cost from what i hear of just under €400,000 to renovate the existign stand and re do the changign rooms. Not toss the stand but renovate it. Their is no all seater stadium or new stand as Meath dont have any money"
Your user name is a contradiction in the extreme......

Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3601 - 28/12/2019 17:55:10    2256332

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I know everyone is entitled to their opinions but some of the waffle being dished out on this matter would make you want to walk into a wall repeatedly.

First thing is first. Existing stadium not fit for purpose.

GAA Hq have earmarked Navan for redevelopment. The 20,000 seater stadium "masterplan" is the final end product. The planning permission is a 10-year permission to allow such. The idea is that Pairc Tailteann will be the No. 2 venue in Leinster and therefore taking over from Portlaoise. Therefore the venue will host 2 more neutral leinster fixtures and will be a venue for Super 8 and Round 4 qualifier matches.

The all-seater ideal is the safeguarding of stadia into the future and enabling the ground as a multi-purpose arena. Not just Meath GAA. A multi-purpose use.

The stand cannot be the first part to go as it holds the existing changing rooms/medical facilities/media area toilets and seating. If that gets demolished first as part of an 18 month project then you have to try accommodate the loss of the facilities.

Greenfield site is ridiculous. The extent of so called dead work and provision of service infrastructure would be in the millions before you even turn a sod for a stadium.

The project, if anyone cared to notice includes for a town enhancement scheme bringing retail use up to the Brews Hill area and would benefit Navan. Moving a stadium away to a Greenfield site is utterly ridiculous and cannot be entertained with a justification.

Look beyond the redevelopment as a club/county matter and see the potential this redevelopment could bring

Royalio11 (Meath) - Posts: 752 - 30/12/2019 18:46:43    2256553

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Replying To Royalio11:  "I know everyone is entitled to their opinions but some of the waffle being dished out on this matter would make you want to walk into a wall repeatedly.

First thing is first. Existing stadium not fit for purpose.

GAA Hq have earmarked Navan for redevelopment. The 20,000 seater stadium "masterplan" is the final end product. The planning permission is a 10-year permission to allow such. The idea is that Pairc Tailteann will be the No. 2 venue in Leinster and therefore taking over from Portlaoise. Therefore the venue will host 2 more neutral leinster fixtures and will be a venue for Super 8 and Round 4 qualifier matches.

The all-seater ideal is the safeguarding of stadia into the future and enabling the ground as a multi-purpose arena. Not just Meath GAA. A multi-purpose use.

The stand cannot be the first part to go as it holds the existing changing rooms/medical facilities/media area toilets and seating. If that gets demolished first as part of an 18 month project then you have to try accommodate the loss of the facilities.

Greenfield site is ridiculous. The extent of so called dead work and provision of service infrastructure would be in the millions before you even turn a sod for a stadium.

The project, if anyone cared to notice includes for a town enhancement scheme bringing retail use up to the Brews Hill area and would benefit Navan. Moving a stadium away to a Greenfield site is utterly ridiculous and cannot be entertained with a justification.

Look beyond the redevelopment as a club/county matter and see the potential this redevelopment could bring"
Very well said. Really really hope that we can just start to get things going with it and the government grant is given. Stops all the speculation. And once it's started and people see progress the negativity stops

LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 889 - 30/12/2019 22:22:44    2256581

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