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Ulster Senior Club Championship

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This is madness. If managing against his sons is such an issue then it's not much of a leap to wonder if he'll be in their corner. Kilcoo couldn't have hoped for better insider knowledge of their opponents.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12116 - 09/11/2022 12:38:03    2446962

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "It's a tricky one for sure. In fairness to him he has done a great job up to now. I was very impressed with how they went about their business last Saturday night against Crossmaglen and they will give Kilcoo plenty to think about. It's a case of the heart ruling the head on this occasion and I think it's perfectly understandable.

Taking a more cyncial point of view I suppose there will always be those who consider the "expenses" angle. More often than not outside managers are compensated for their efforts. A delicate, if unique situation in this case."
You have to look at this from Ballybay's point., I'd say when he went for the Ballybay job, and he mentioned that if they were to meet Kilcoo in Ulster he would stand down for a match, the committee would have bit his hand off. This must have been the deal because news that he was standing down is out 2 weeks. Loyalty begins at home so you can't blame anyone.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2006 - 09/11/2022 12:56:05    2446968

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "Yeah but at the end of the day it's the players that cross the white line. It's not as though he's a player manager and was going to be man-marking one of his sons. I'm sure there are enough good football men in Ballybay to recognise Kilcoo's strengths and weaknesses. Plus there's only this week to prepare anyway."
True , there is plenty of good knowledge in football around Ballybay , I'm sure the players won't be forgetting tactics that has been drilled into them over a space of a week . Family rightfully comes first. If anything this will push Ballybay on a bit .. well capable of giving Killcoo a game of it , at worst

stoneygrey (Monaghan) - Posts: 213 - 09/11/2022 13:25:34    2446971

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Replying To Breffni40:  "This is madness. If managing against his sons is such an issue then it's not much of a leap to wonder if he'll be in their corner. Kilcoo couldn't have hoped for better insider knowledge of their opponents."
Possibly. Not casting aspersions on the man's integrity, and there's every chance he's saying nothing about the match this week to anybody in Kilcoo.

But there's also the chance that at some stage over the summer, somebody in Kilcoo asked "how are you getting on over in Ballybay?" and he'd have replied with information that they wouldn't have got from the horse's mouth any other way. Would all have been very innocent at the time, but all of a sudden, could be valuable information all right.

Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 2229 - 09/11/2022 13:28:41    2446974

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1. Naomh Conaill (Donegal)

2. Errigal Ciaran (Tyrone)

3. Enniskillen Gaels (Fermanagh)

4. Ballybay (Monaghan)

Byanthon (Tyrone) - Posts: 1780 - 09/11/2022 13:29:48    2446976

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Replying To Breffni40:  "This is madness. If managing against his sons is such an issue then it's not much of a leap to wonder if he'll be in their corner. Kilcoo couldn't have hoped for better insider knowledge of their opponents."
You talk some dung . At least he's got a bit of principle. He made it clear before he took the job that if Ballybay ever met Kilcoo he wouldn't manage against them.
It's not all about money thank god.

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 09/11/2022 14:05:37    2446980

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Replying To Breffni1969:  "You talk some dung . At least he's got a bit of principle. He made it clear before he took the job that if Ballybay ever met Kilcoo he wouldn't manage against them.
It's not all about money thank god."
If he was that principled he wouldn't manage another club. You can't have your cake and eat it as the saying goes.

Breffni40 (Cavan) - Posts: 12116 - 09/11/2022 14:50:03    2446995

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Its a v unique situation so I'd cut him some slack.

seanie08 (Monaghan) - Posts: 1798 - 09/11/2022 17:14:39    2447008

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We had a situation in Galway a few years ago where Val Daly was managing Salthill and came up against his own sons Michael and John playing for Mountbellew. Given it was local club level, he knew there was a good possibility of it happening. He stayed with Salthill for the game and from what I remember Mountbellew beat them.
He's managing Mountbellew now for the past few years and won the county title with them last year.
I'd say this situation has happened a few times within counties. It would be rarer at provincial level of course.
A different sport, but at a high profile international level we have Andy Farrell managing against his son Owen when Ireland play England.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 2034 - 09/11/2022 17:44:59    2447009

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Replying To Saynothing:  "You have to look at this from Ballybay's point., I'd say when he went for the Ballybay job, and he mentioned that if they were to meet Kilcoo in Ulster he would stand down for a match, the committee would have bit his hand off. This must have been the deal because news that he was standing down is out 2 weeks. Loyalty begins at home so you can't blame anyone."
Spot on ,,, Fair play to Jerome for having loyality to his 3 sons, 6 nephews, his club and his entire community , The man should be applauded for taking this stand,

germac (Down) - Posts: 533 - 09/11/2022 19:21:10    2447032

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As he's said he informed Ballybay before he took the job in the off chance they played his home club Kilcoo so its a non story, the players would have known this before the cross game i bet.

His co manager Doran is a Down man who would watch and know Kilcoo so there not really at a disadvantage, Ballybay players won't be talking about this or thinking about it the game is more important.

Yourjoking (USA) - Posts: 703 - 09/11/2022 20:45:37    2447037

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Replying To germac:  "Spot on ,,, Fair play to Jerome for having loyality to his 3 sons, 6 nephews, his club and his entire community , The man should be applauded for taking this stand,"
Agree 100%

Breffni1969 (Cavan) - Posts: 510 - 09/11/2022 20:52:31    2447038

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Replying To germac:  "Spot on ,,, Fair play to Jerome for having loyality to his 3 sons, 6 nephews, his club and his entire community , The man should be applauded for taking this stand,"
nonsense, if he had loyalty to his club and community he would be managing kilcoo and not ballybay. What persuaded him to manage ballybay as opposed to kilcoo?

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 10/11/2022 07:52:21    2447046

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Replying To Tom1916:  "nonsense, if he had loyalty to his club and community he would be managing kilcoo and not ballybay. What persuaded him to manage ballybay as opposed to kilcoo?"
If you know anything about football you will realise that you can only manage a team for so many years before a management team needs changed. He did the groundwork for this club for years. Also they have had such a successful management teams over the past decade. Why would you change this???. Did you ever think when his kids and nephews grew up to be part of the senior structure he thought it best to step away as he could have been accused of favouritism.

Its clear that you don't have a notion about how the football world and there communities work.

Ronanthehammer (Down) - Posts: 48 - 10/11/2022 10:20:26    2447061

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Replying To Tom1916:  "nonsense, if he had loyalty to his club and community he would be managing kilcoo and not ballybay. What persuaded him to manage ballybay as opposed to kilcoo?"
Kilcoo might have had their manager sorted, what do ye want him to do? Was Big Joe thinking less of Armagh when he went to Galway? If he's like's the management game why not.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2006 - 10/11/2022 10:40:33    2447065

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Replying To germac:  "Spot on ,,, Fair play to Jerome for having loyality to his 3 sons, 6 nephews, his club and his entire community , The man should be applauded for taking this stand,"
I get where he's coming from but I wouldn't say he's taking a stand. He's the one reneging on his commitment, not them.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1698 - 10/11/2022 11:03:27    2447068

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Replying To Ronanthehammer:  "If you know anything about football you will realise that you can only manage a team for so many years before a management team needs changed. He did the groundwork for this club for years. Also they have had such a successful management teams over the past decade. Why would you change this???. Did you ever think when his kids and nephews grew up to be part of the senior structure he thought it best to step away as he could have been accused of favouritism.

Its clear that you don't have a notion about how the football world and there communities work."
more nonsense, plenty of managers manage teams long term. Clubs like kilcoo go external for managers, do you think these managers are doing it for the love of kilcoo or do you think they may be benefitting in some way, if they are then that is the same as paying for success.

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 10/11/2022 12:32:41    2447080

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Replying To Saynothing:  "Kilcoo might have had their manager sorted, what do ye want him to do? Was Big Joe thinking less of Armagh when he went to Galway? If he's like's the management game why not."
Thats a silly argument, armagh had an armagh man managing when he went to galway (his mothers county), no comparison whataiever

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 10/11/2022 13:01:14    2447083

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Replying To Tom1916:  "more nonsense, plenty of managers manage teams long term. Clubs like kilcoo go external for managers, do you think these managers are doing it for the love of kilcoo or do you think they may be benefitting in some way, if they are then that is the same as paying for success."
Paying for success, did Morgan fuels let Joe because he was too hard to keep.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2006 - 10/11/2022 14:00:53    2447091

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Replying To Saynothing:  "Paying for success, did Morgan fuels let Joe because he was too hard to keep."
again, a silly argument and comparison, trying to change the subject from club management to county management to make excususes for the inexcusable. Clubs up and down the country don't have to pay external managers for success, it creates an unequal playing field and is paying to win competitions.

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 10/11/2022 15:23:20    2447107

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