National Forum

Brian Cody 23rd Season

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Brian Cody staying on for 23rd season has equalled Sean Boylan's record. Some achievement.
Interesting that DJ Carey has stepped away, maybe he is in line for the Carlow job.

Maroonforever (Galway) - Posts: 382 - 12/01/2021 12:21:00    2327093

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Replying To Maroonforever:  "Brian Cody staying on for 23rd season has equalled Sean Boylan's record. Some achievement.
Interesting that DJ Carey has stepped away, maybe he is in line for the Carlow job."
Curious what kilkenny posters think of this?

Cody has a Phenomenal record that will probably never be equalled so Is it a simple case of he's earned the right to go whenever he wants
or is it time for a fresh approach?

The second half performance against both Dublin and Waterford was very "un-Kilkenny like"
what is that a reflection of?

Quality of players, coaching etc too dependant still on TJ Reid?
I've no answer's but the wider attitude seems to be that they won't be winning any more all Irelands with him at the helm.

skillet (Limerick) - Posts: 783 - 12/01/2021 12:39:05    2327099

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Replying To Maroonforever:  "Brian Cody staying on for 23rd season has equalled Sean Boylan's record. Some achievement.
Interesting that DJ Carey has stepped away, maybe he is in line for the Carlow job."
its a tough one wondering if Cody should have stayed, part of me is saying yes, but then is the whole thing gone a bit stale there maybe too Ime wondering...people are saying Kilkennys conveyer belt is not as good as it normally is, watch they U20 and minor games and there are still excellent young hurlers playing, like any other county not all are making it fully through to senior but there is still a substantial few that are and we are quick to point out players from Kilkenny who are "not at the level" yet these same hurler would more than likely walk onto any other hurling county team in Ireland...the bar is very high in Kilkenny, and I will pick one, Liam Blanchfield, while he may not be regular starter on Kilkenny team, bet your bottom dollar that is because you have your Walter Walshs (bad year this year fair enough) , Colin Fennellys and TJ Reids to name 3, its very hard break into a team with names like that..I dont think Kilkenny havent the talent, I just think the thing might be gone little stale and the set up while supposedly ultra competitve in training etc. might be just abit dead...interestingly if you did get a new manager in, its surprising some of the Liam Blanchfields and John Daltons might be more settled in working with management they came up from under age with etc...I dont like mentioning players, I only mention Blanchfield as I can say from memory he was excellent under age, and infairness is now senior, my fear is with Cody left too long, lads like Blanchfield may not hang around if things are stale, or worse still Cody may not keep them...a change is welcome, but I hate to see talent lost regardless of the county...

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 598 - 12/01/2021 12:47:11    2327101

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Extraordinary length of time as manager. People were saying Mickey Harte stayed on too long, but Cody is 5 years longer at the helm
A bit like when Ferguson left United, it will be a big change whenever Cody leaves.
If he stays for a 24th season he would pass Sean Boylan as longest serving manager in Inter County history.

FoolsGold (Cavan) - Posts: 2328 - 12/01/2021 13:01:02    2327105

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "Extraordinary length of time as manager. People were saying Mickey Harte stayed on too long, but Cody is 5 years longer at the helm
A bit like when Ferguson left United, it will be a big change whenever Cody leaves.
If he stays for a 24th season he would pass Sean Boylan as longest serving manager in Inter County history."
That could be true but Dr Éamonn Ó Sullivan was in charge of Kerry for long periods too. He took a break or two but I know he managed Kerry to win 1924 All ireland and was manager also when they lost to Galway in 1964 40 years later. However Cody s hunger is unbelievable and if players still buy into his methods then he can still win more.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 1608 - 12/01/2021 13:13:38    2327109

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What has Cody got to prove? Nothing.

baire (Galway) - Posts: 918 - 12/01/2021 13:20:28    2327112

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I think people forget how often a team actually wins an All Ireland. Maybe the success of Kilkenny and now Dublin have clouded our views. From 1980 to 2000 Kilkenny won 4 All Irelands. Doesn't sound like a lot over 20 years but the still share the lead for most All Irelands won over those 20 years. When Cody took over Kilkenny were an undisciplined team. The team left off players from the panel who were certain picks. In the time since Cody took over every team he put out conducted themselves in a proper manner on and off the field. Were they all angels absolutely not, but any problem was handled internally. Every team no matter how good or bad fought till the end, won some games they should have lost on pure determination. I never saw a Kilkenny hurler rolling around on the ground with an injury trying to get a player carded Cody wouldn't allow it. Right now they are short on talent which goes in cycles, but Cody will get the best out of what he has and as long as he is in charge Kilkenny will run their operation in the right manner. Last point the summer before last Kilkenny beat Limerick in the semi-final and it was called his greatest win ever. I will say I would love to see Tommy Walsh brought in listening to Tommy talking I think he would really bring some energy in especially to the younger players.

gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 247 - 12/01/2021 13:23:42    2327113

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "That could be true but Dr Éamonn Ó Sullivan was in charge of Kerry for long periods too. He took a break or two but I know he managed Kerry to win 1924 All ireland and was manager also when they lost to Galway in 1964 40 years later. However Cody s hunger is unbelievable and if players still buy into his methods then he can still win more."
I hear what your saying but I think the current crop are just jaded from his system, nothing personal, I think players know whats ahead of them when they opt in, and if thats an overly strict regime, lads go along with it rather than embrace it, you have to embrace it to win, Colin Fennelly being replaced against Galway I think it was, he was the first player I ever seen coming off a Kilkenny team thinking his team were beaten (which they were at the time if Galway held their nerve)...it just told me he (Fennelly) had no answers and to give that body language infront of Cody to me was a no no...Cody would pick up on that and no more than others before him, Fennelly, for all his excellent talent could be banished to history...it would not surprise me..

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 598 - 12/01/2021 13:46:38    2327115

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Replying To gatha:  "I think people forget how often a team actually wins an All Ireland. Maybe the success of Kilkenny and now Dublin have clouded our views. From 1980 to 2000 Kilkenny won 4 All Irelands. Doesn't sound like a lot over 20 years but the still share the lead for most All Irelands won over those 20 years. When Cody took over Kilkenny were an undisciplined team. The team left off players from the panel who were certain picks. In the time since Cody took over every team he put out conducted themselves in a proper manner on and off the field. Were they all angels absolutely not, but any problem was handled internally. Every team no matter how good or bad fought till the end, won some games they should have lost on pure determination. I never saw a Kilkenny hurler rolling around on the ground with an injury trying to get a player carded Cody wouldn't allow it. Right now they are short on talent which goes in cycles, but Cody will get the best out of what he has and as long as he is in charge Kilkenny will run their operation in the right manner. Last point the summer before last Kilkenny beat Limerick in the semi-final and it was called his greatest win ever. I will say I would love to see Tommy Walsh brought in listening to Tommy talking I think he would really bring some energy in especially to the younger players."
I hear what your saying, I dont like these players that are too polished when being interviewed or panelists etc..Tommy Walsh is the opposite, too much so, you would think he is out in the bog footing turf with some of his statements and "lads will be lads and the crack was good" and what have you...the profile is definitely getting him the panelist gigs..annoying to listen to, everyone to their own though, and if was an option, I am sure Cody would bring him in, but I doubt it...

Fairplayalways (Offaly) - Posts: 598 - 12/01/2021 13:50:04    2327117

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Replying To gatha:  "I think people forget how often a team actually wins an All Ireland. Maybe the success of Kilkenny and now Dublin have clouded our views. From 1980 to 2000 Kilkenny won 4 All Irelands. Doesn't sound like a lot over 20 years but the still share the lead for most All Irelands won over those 20 years. When Cody took over Kilkenny were an undisciplined team. The team left off players from the panel who were certain picks. In the time since Cody took over every team he put out conducted themselves in a proper manner on and off the field. Were they all angels absolutely not, but any problem was handled internally. Every team no matter how good or bad fought till the end, won some games they should have lost on pure determination. I never saw a Kilkenny hurler rolling around on the ground with an injury trying to get a player carded Cody wouldn't allow it. Right now they are short on talent which goes in cycles, but Cody will get the best out of what he has and as long as he is in charge Kilkenny will run their operation in the right manner. Last point the summer before last Kilkenny beat Limerick in the semi-final and it was called his greatest win ever. I will say I would love to see Tommy Walsh brought in listening to Tommy talking I think he would really bring some energy in especially to the younger players."
Agreed when Cody decides to go I think standards will drop in Kilkenny we've seen with even with average Kilkenny teams he has gotten every last bit of effort out of them in games that's why you never see Kilkenny getting hammered.

He has instilled that self belief and never say die attitude in all the teams he has managed it's gonna be hard for any manager to replicate that maybe Shefflin can but it's hard to know.

To be honest I wouldn't like to be the guy taking over straight after Cody, David Moyes taking over Sir Alex comes to mind.

Maroonforever (Galway) - Posts: 382 - 12/01/2021 16:17:10    2327147

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Replying To Maroonforever:  "Agreed when Cody decides to go I think standards will drop in Kilkenny we've seen with even with average Kilkenny teams he has gotten every last bit of effort out of them in games that's why you never see Kilkenny getting hammered.

He has instilled that self belief and never say die attitude in all the teams he has managed it's gonna be hard for any manager to replicate that maybe Shefflin can but it's hard to know.

To be honest I wouldn't like to be the guy taking over straight after Cody, David Moyes taking over Sir Alex comes to mind."
In fairness sír Alex left on a high,,, right now I think that any manager coming in would be reasonably confident of maintaining standards in kilkenny compared to the last 5 years.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 387 - 12/01/2021 19:33:16    2327162

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I don't know who's out there who would do a better job with the players available. I think he gets the best out of what he has. He's the only manager to have beaten Limerick in the championship in the last 3 years, where Limerick have hammered almost everyone. 2019 All Ireland final was close until Hogan was sent off. It might have finished closer, who knows. We won Leinster against probably a better Galway team.

He's not a master tactician but he's a good judge of player and sets the tone and standard for what's expected of the players. I firmly believe he expects every Kilkenny team he puts out to win, even if on paper they're a weaker team than the opposition, and I believe this mindset transmits itself to the players. Whether he can continue to maintain that level of self-belief in the players is the big question.

While he lives and breathes hurling (it's his only "hobby" really as far as I know!) I can't imagine he enjoys how the game in general is going in terms on the emphasis on possession, short stick passes, running and handpassing. In the most recent championship Kilkenny tried a shorter game plan in line with the current trend, but I got the impression we were slightly betwixt and between the "new" style and the "traditional" long ball game. I don't believe Cody buys into the shorter game but may have been shoehorned into it by some of the the players and selectors, hence the somewhat mishmash in styles this year.

Which is why I wouldn't have been surprised if he had walked away this year, for the simple reason that the game he wants to play is very different from the game that's being played now. Nobody could blame him if he said to the county board, "right, see if Shefflin can do any better!"

ballydalane (Kilkenny) - Posts: 1127 - 12/01/2021 20:15:08    2327174

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Well done to Brian, 1 of the best managers ever.23 years in the Kilkenny hotseat is some achievement

Best of luck to him and his team this year.

KingdomBoy1 (Kerry) - Posts: 12572 - 12/01/2021 21:08:23    2327182

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Replying To ballydalane:  "I don't know who's out there who would do a better job with the players available. I think he gets the best out of what he has. He's the only manager to have beaten Limerick in the championship in the last 3 years, where Limerick have hammered almost everyone. 2019 All Ireland final was close until Hogan was sent off. It might have finished closer, who knows. We won Leinster against probably a better Galway team.

He's not a master tactician but he's a good judge of player and sets the tone and standard for what's expected of the players. I firmly believe he expects every Kilkenny team he puts out to win, even if on paper they're a weaker team than the opposition, and I believe this mindset transmits itself to the players. Whether he can continue to maintain that level of self-belief in the players is the big question.

While he lives and breathes hurling (it's his only "hobby" really as far as I know!) I can't imagine he enjoys how the game in general is going in terms on the emphasis on possession, short stick passes, running and handpassing. In the most recent championship Kilkenny tried a shorter game plan in line with the current trend, but I got the impression we were slightly betwixt and between the "new" style and the "traditional" long ball game. I don't believe Cody buys into the shorter game but may have been shoehorned into it by some of the the players and selectors, hence the somewhat mishmash in styles this year.

Which is why I wouldn't have been surprised if he had walked away this year, for the simple reason that the game he wants to play is very different from the game that's being played now. Nobody could blame him if he said to the county board, "right, see if Shefflin can do any better!""
Is that clash of styles part of the reason that DJ has stepped away from the management team?

football first (None) - Posts: 1214 - 12/01/2021 21:53:06    2327185

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Replying To ballydalane:  "I don't know who's out there who would do a better job with the players available. I think he gets the best out of what he has. He's the only manager to have beaten Limerick in the championship in the last 3 years, where Limerick have hammered almost everyone. 2019 All Ireland final was close until Hogan was sent off. It might have finished closer, who knows. We won Leinster against probably a better Galway team.

He's not a master tactician but he's a good judge of player and sets the tone and standard for what's expected of the players. I firmly believe he expects every Kilkenny team he puts out to win, even if on paper they're a weaker team than the opposition, and I believe this mindset transmits itself to the players. Whether he can continue to maintain that level of self-belief in the players is the big question.

While he lives and breathes hurling (it's his only "hobby" really as far as I know!) I can't imagine he enjoys how the game in general is going in terms on the emphasis on possession, short stick passes, running and handpassing. In the most recent championship Kilkenny tried a shorter game plan in line with the current trend, but I got the impression we were slightly betwixt and between the "new" style and the "traditional" long ball game. I don't believe Cody buys into the shorter game but may have been shoehorned into it by some of the the players and selectors, hence the somewhat mishmash in styles this year.

Which is why I wouldn't have been surprised if he had walked away this year, for the simple reason that the game he wants to play is very different from the game that's being played now. Nobody could blame him if he said to the county board, "right, see if Shefflin can do any better!""
Agree with a lot of that, but he's not the only manager to beat Limerick in the championship in the last 3 years. Cork, Tipp and Clare have all beaten Limerick in that time. The only manager to beat them in a knockout match in that time, yes.

WanPintWin (Galway) - Posts: 940 - 12/01/2021 22:11:41    2327189

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Replying To ballydalane:  "I don't know who's out there who would do a better job with the players available. I think he gets the best out of what he has. He's the only manager to have beaten Limerick in the championship in the last 3 years, where Limerick have hammered almost everyone. 2019 All Ireland final was close until Hogan was sent off. It might have finished closer, who knows. We won Leinster against probably a better Galway team.

He's not a master tactician but he's a good judge of player and sets the tone and standard for what's expected of the players. I firmly believe he expects every Kilkenny team he puts out to win, even if on paper they're a weaker team than the opposition, and I believe this mindset transmits itself to the players. Whether he can continue to maintain that level of self-belief in the players is the big question.

While he lives and breathes hurling (it's his only "hobby" really as far as I know!) I can't imagine he enjoys how the game in general is going in terms on the emphasis on possession, short stick passes, running and handpassing. In the most recent championship Kilkenny tried a shorter game plan in line with the current trend, but I got the impression we were slightly betwixt and between the "new" style and the "traditional" long ball game. I don't believe Cody buys into the shorter game but may have been shoehorned into it by some of the the players and selectors, hence the somewhat mishmash in styles this year.

Which is why I wouldn't have been surprised if he had walked away this year, for the simple reason that the game he wants to play is very different from the game that's being played now. Nobody could blame him if he said to the county board, "right, see if Shefflin can do any better!""
A fair assessment. Maybe he needs to bring in a tactician but then does he want to embrace the new ways.

I actually don't like the current style of play out there at the moment - throwing the ball, extra steps, tactical fouling, short passing.

gahfan (Wexford) - Posts: 554 - 12/01/2021 22:12:59    2327190

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Replying To Galway9801:  "In fairness sír Alex left on a high,,, right now I think that any manager coming in would be reasonably confident of maintaining standards in kilkenny compared to the last 5 years."
Since 2015 Kilkenny have played in 3 All Irelands Finals won 1. Won 3 Leinster. Played in 4 semi finals won 3. This is with a team not considered as talented as the top 3 teams. If any manager has the confidence to say he will do as good fair play to him. There are a lot of managers out there right now that would love to have that record

gatha (Kilkenny) - Posts: 247 - 12/01/2021 22:39:07    2327193

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I was at a league final Kilkenny played against Tipp in Croker one year and Cody was being harangued by a small group of KK supporters for not starting Charlie Carter. Cody never flinched, played Carter when he was ready to play him and I think he came on and scored a goal that day. Seemed to me he was always his own man
On another note, I was surprised to read recently he doesn't top the list of Senior Hurling AI winning managers. He shares it with another Kilkenny man on 11 wins. Is that correct?

Maroonatic (Galway) - Posts: 972 - 13/01/2021 09:52:50    2327204

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A fair assessment. Maybe he needs to bring in a tactician but then does he want to embrace the new ways.

I actually don't like the current style of play out there at the moment - throwing the ball, extra steps, tactical fouling, short passing.

When was there not extra steps, tactical fouling , throwing the ball. Stop talking rubbish.
Cody is still Kilkennys best option. Most counties would be glad of his record current and past.

catch22 (USA) - Posts: 1906 - 13/01/2021 09:53:29    2327205

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The grass isn't always greener on the other side.

If i were KK i would keep him for another few years AT LEAST.

That KK team is as an average team (with the exception of TJ Reid of course) and have been for years. But Cody still manages to get the very best out of them. The fact that they are still winning Leinsters and are continually operating in the latter stages of the championships is a testament to Cody.

ConnollyDub (Dublin) - Posts: 1941 - 13/01/2021 11:38:53    2327224

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