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Replying To SS6: "Lads are not getting on with management same as when is was over the minors.
Now royaldunne your gone very quiet, this time last year Mc Entee was the saver and now you've players leaving because of him?
Micko doesn't look so bad now, 2 players left in Micko's time for one reason or another 5 have left already cause of McEntee and it's only the start of his second year, ouch" There was more than 2, two were high profile names but I have heard of at least two other players who wouldn't go back and play under MOD. The question really needs to be answered by the current and potential Meath players, do yous want to come into training two nights a week, struggle in the league, just about stay up in the last league game then play an easy team in Leinster come up against Dublin/Kildare and be comfortably cast aside. Then it's on to the qualifiers, get an away game against a low div 3 team and give good effort but lose the game by 3 points then repeat the whole process again next year.
Or do the county players want to be successful, go up to division one to test thuemselves, really challenge Dublin in Leinster(most likely not ready to beat them but we need to ready when the decline sets in for them) then go on a good run in the qualifiers and get to the super 8? To do this hard training will be required, listening to the manager and backroom teams plans and new ways of playing will need to listened to, they will need to accept criticism and improve as players.
And one last question for the anti McEntee supporters. Should a 4 point win over one of your neighbours in the Leinster championship result in a 2 day party? Just remember we had to play Dublin in two weeks after this game. In my opinion a win over Louth shouldn't be celebrated(no offence to louth).
I look forward to next year, anyone who is not 100% committed to the Meath cause can leave now and I will have absolutely no problem with them leaving, there is a lot of time and effort being an inter county player but at least next year we will have 30-35 players fully committed.
Barney123 (Meath) - Posts: 676 - 03/11/2017 21:16:30
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Replying To Barney123: "There was more than 2, two were high profile names but I have heard of at least two other players who wouldn't go back and play under MOD. The question really needs to be answered by the current and potential Meath players, do yous want to come into training two nights a week, struggle in the league, just about stay up in the last league game then play an easy team in Leinster come up against Dublin/Kildare and be comfortably cast aside. Then it's on to the qualifiers, get an away game against a low div 3 team and give good effort but lose the game by 3 points then repeat the whole process again next year.
Or do the county players want to be successful, go up to division one to test thuemselves, really challenge Dublin in Leinster(most likely not ready to beat them but we need to ready when the decline sets in for them) then go on a good run in the qualifiers and get to the super 8? To do this hard training will be required, listening to the manager and backroom teams plans and new ways of playing will need to listened to, they will need to accept criticism and improve as players.
And one last question for the anti McEntee supporters. Should a 4 point win over one of your neighbours in the Leinster championship result in a 2 day party? Just remember we had to play Dublin in two weeks after this game. In my opinion a win over Louth shouldn't be celebrated(no offence to louth).
I look forward to next year, anyone who is not 100% committed to the Meath cause can leave now and I will have absolutely no problem with them leaving, there is a lot of time and effort being an inter county player but at least next year we will have 30-35 players fully committed." Best post in a long time and good to see someone here still has cop in.
ziggy320001 (Meath) - Posts: 2432 - 03/11/2017 21:35:02
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Replying To grahamc9897: "Always liked paddy..Dont blame him for leaving one bit with the clowns on this abusing him..
Serious questions have to be asked off the management with all these players leaving..Must think there is no hope
Heard from a reliable source that Tobin could leave also..Not travelling or anything just doesn't want to go back" What you talking about clowns on this abusing him ?
Nobody on hoganstand abused P o'rourke ! They may have questioned his ability as a goalkeeper in the modern game ! Can it not be questioned or is it seen as abuse in the modern era of softness ?
And you didn't exactly write to many fairy tail novels about Graham Reilly on this if memory service me correctly !
So if you like a lad and someone questions his ability its seen as abuse ! But if you don't like a lad and questions his ability its fair game ?
Which is it ?
WhyTheLongFace (Meath) - Posts: 875 - 03/11/2017 21:59:10
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Firstly I'll qualify what I write by saying that I don't have any inside scoop on the Meath panel or individual players, so my opinion is based on what I read in the media, and my own gut feeling.
From speaking to people with a better inside track than me, and from reading about other counties, I think there is little doubt that the level of training that Meath has being doing for a good number of years has been significantly below that of the likes of Dublin, Mayo, Donegal, Kerry. The naked-eye test would tell you that - those teams just look a lot fitter and stronger than us. Thats not to say that we have not been putting in the work - Meath teams under other managers have trained hard and been fit. But those other counties have just taken it to a whole new level in terms of intensity and professionalism.
From listening to Andy McEntee in the media, there is no doubt that he does not accept being second best to Dublin or anyone else. He may be deluded, but he seems to completely believe that Meath can get back up to challenging at that level in the near future. Since he is not a stupid man, he will no doubt realise that if you want to compete with those counties, you have to match them in terms of fitness, speed, strength, skill, and organisation. Which means that you have to match them in the level of training that they are doing, both duration and intensity. I don't know this for certain, but I would guess that more is now being demanded off the players than at any time in the past.
anfearbeag (Meath) - Posts: 1134 - 04/11/2017 00:58:53
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there is also little doubt that if you keep pushing players and asking for more, some will just say enough is enough and walk away. I would disagree with Ziggy when he says that shows softness in players. Every player has their breaking point. Every player has their limit in terms of how much time they can give, how much work they can do, and how much punishment their bodies are able to take. So I certainly wouldnt knock any player who reaches that point where they just have to stop. My guess is that some players have reached that point now where too much is being demanded off them, and they fell they have no other option but to walk away.
It is certainly also possible that some players cannot put up with Andy McEntee himself. HIe can be an abrasive character at times, and from listenling to him, he doesn't seem like the sort of man who is willing to compromise on what he wants to do. I do know a couple of lads who played under him in Ballyboden, and they reckon there was no issue there with his personality. But I suppose a lad would put up with abrasiveness in a manager if they can see success at the end of it all. I am sure the current Meath players struggle to see where any success is likely to come from.
I suppose the question is, are we better with McEntee style of managing and accepting that he will lose players along the way, or with the methods of his predecessors where the players might have been happier. I am not sure of the answer to that. On the one hand, his predecessor didn't achieve much with the same group of playerss. On the other hand, we dont have so much talent in the county that we can afford to be losing a lot of players. Maybe neither approach is right. For now, I am prepared to give McEntee the benefit of the doubt for the next couple of years and judge him at the end of that. Things really cant get a lot worse than some of the calamities of the past 10 years.
anfearbeag (Meath) - Posts: 1134 - 04/11/2017 01:10:47
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Replying To anfearbeag: "Firstly I'll qualify what I write by saying that I don't have any inside scoop on the Meath panel or individual players, so my opinion is based on what I read in the media, and my own gut feeling.
From speaking to people with a better inside track than me, and from reading about other counties, I think there is little doubt that the level of training that Meath has being doing for a good number of years has been significantly below that of the likes of Dublin, Mayo, Donegal, Kerry. The naked-eye test would tell you that - those teams just look a lot fitter and stronger than us. Thats not to say that we have not been putting in the work - Meath teams under other managers have trained hard and been fit. But those other counties have just taken it to a whole new level in terms of intensity and professionalism.
From listening to Andy McEntee in the media, there is no doubt that he does not accept being second best to Dublin or anyone else. He may be deluded, but he seems to completely believe that Meath can get back up to challenging at that level in the near future. Since he is not a stupid man, he will no doubt realise that if you want to compete with those counties, you have to match them in terms of fitness, speed, strength, skill, and organisation. Which means that you have to match them in the level of training that they are doing, both duration and intensity. I don't know this for certain, but I would guess that more is now being demanded off the players than at any time in the past." Exactly and why do posters have a problem with that?
ziggy320001 (Meath) - Posts: 2432 - 04/11/2017 07:36:14
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Everyone very dramatic on here these days......POR is the only player that has just stepped away and even at that he may have a good reason . Jones and Ocaoileann are gone away as part of there study's and didn't have much choice as it's part of there career development.....harnan is going away on work experience same as last year. Donnacha Tobin isn't going anywhere. So bar POR... who I seriously doubt has left cause of anything mcentee is doing.....all the rest have had to leave due to work college/commitments.
southmeathgael (Meath) - Posts: 885 - 04/11/2017 07:46:29
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Replying To anfearbeag: "there is also little doubt that if you keep pushing players and asking for more, some will just say enough is enough and walk away. I would disagree with Ziggy when he says that shows softness in players. Every player has their breaking point. Every player has their limit in terms of how much time they can give, how much work they can do, and how much punishment their bodies are able to take. So I certainly wouldnt knock any player who reaches that point where they just have to stop. My guess is that some players have reached that point now where too much is being demanded off them, and they fell they have no other option but to walk away.
It is certainly also possible that some players cannot put up with Andy McEntee himself. HIe can be an abrasive character at times, and from listenling to him, he doesn't seem like the sort of man who is willing to compromise on what he wants to do. I do know a couple of lads who played under him in Ballyboden, and they reckon there was no issue there with his personality. But I suppose a lad would put up with abrasiveness in a manager if they can see success at the end of it all. I am sure the current Meath players struggle to see where any success is likely to come from.
I suppose the question is, are we better with McEntee style of managing and accepting that he will lose players along the way, or with the methods of his predecessors where the players might have been happier. I am not sure of the answer to that. On the one hand, his predecessor didn't achieve much with the same group of playerss. On the other hand, we dont have so much talent in the county that we can afford to be losing a lot of players. Maybe neither approach is right. For now, I am prepared to give McEntee the benefit of the doubt for the next couple of years and judge him at the end of that. Things really cant get a lot worse than some of the calamities of the past 10 years." The level of training at underage has significantly improved in the last number of years so the current crop on dev squads are more used to what is required and more significantly are beating the likes of Dublin or narrowly losing.
As you say Andy wants this level at senior level to try and compete. You must at least match the efforts of Dublin,Mayo,Kerry etc. I want a panel of Meath players who are fully committed to that cause and I am sure the players that are working with Andy are on the same page in that regard. Supporters should be too you would think...
ziggy320001 (Meath) - Posts: 2432 - 04/11/2017 07:50:11
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As the saying goes "The King is Dead, Long Live the King".
What I am wondering is what is the make up of the panel as it stands now, what new players have been brought into the panel and are there any others that were subs / panel members that have left or were dropped by Andy.
Posters may hear from within their own clubs who got the call up and who got dropped off.
Regarding those that have left we should just say thanks for the efforts and best of luck in the future.
oldsam_newsam (Meath) - Posts: 638 - 04/11/2017 09:51:55
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I dont comment much, but just wondering if ppl are not jumping the gun slightly. As i understand it, Jones & O'Caoliean are away for study/college, Harnan work experience/travelling and O'Rourke is work commitments. Other than that ive heard nothing.
David (Meath) - Posts: 567 - 04/11/2017 10:46:38
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Replying To David: "I dont comment much, but just wondering if ppl are not jumping the gun slightly. As i understand it, Jones & O'Caoliean are away for study/college, Harnan work experience/travelling and O'Rourke is work commitments. Other than that ive heard nothing." It's the attitude of some hoping that some players are leaving because of the manager that annoys me.
Are they really supporters?
ziggy320001 (Meath) - Posts: 2432 - 04/11/2017 12:11:31
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Replying To ziggy320001: "It's the attitude of some hoping that some players are leaving because of the manager that annoys me.
Are they really supporters?" Terrible attitude if that's what they're hoping for, you'll get some people to give out no matter who's in charge
Northsidegaels (Meath) - Posts: 237 - 04/11/2017 13:10:40
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Replying To ziggy320001: "It's the attitude of some hoping that some players are leaving because of the manager that annoys me.
Are they really supporters?" There does seem to be an element on this forum that are more interested in McEntee failing than in Meath winning. I don't really understand the reasoning behind it. Most managers in most counties do get stick from some of the supporters. Mick O'Dowd certainly got criticised plenty on here. However, my memory of it is that people were broadly supportive of him for the first couple of years. The attitude was one of "well he has very little experience but we will give him a chance to see what he can do". It was only in years 3 and 4 where there was no obvious improvement that the criticism started. Even then it was very much along the lines of "nice guy, but he hasn't a clue, he has to go". It wasn't personal. With McEntee it seems a bit different. There seems to be more spite to the criticism, and it seemed to start almost form the time he took over.
As I said, I am not sure why that would be the case. It may be personal - the McEntees are not afraid to speak their mind, which I'm sure might rub some people up the wrong way. It may be as a way of attacking some posters on here who were possibly a little over enthusiastic in welcoming McEntee to the job (yes that means you Royaldunne!). It could be coming from people who were loyal to Mick O'Dowd and are still bitter about the criticism he took, so now feel that they should do the same to his successor. It could even be political - old political loyalties die hard, and the McEntees would be on the other side of the divide from a lot of Meath GAA people.
Whatever the reason for it, it is a bit sad really. Whatever his faults and I am sure he has many, I don't think anyone could doubt McEntees committment to Meath football and to getting them back to the top, so its a shame that some people don't seem to want to get behind him.
anfearbeag (Meath) - Posts: 1134 - 04/11/2017 18:41:17
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I would like to make it clear that I do not blame Andy for any of the players that have pulled out. But random people sitting at a keyboard criticizing players' "lack of commitment" isn't on in my view.
If a player decides that the reward for putting your life on hold to play for Meath isn't worth it, then that's 100% their decision to make and it's not up to anyone to criticize them for it.
Ratoath Royal (Meath) - Posts: 1362 - 04/11/2017 20:28:27
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Replying To ziggy320001: "It's the attitude of some hoping that some players are leaving because of the manager that annoys me.
Are they really supporters?" No they are not!
joeblogs10 (Dublin) - Posts: 104 - 05/11/2017 10:16:36
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Replying To brian: "Not having a go at this poster or their post but of the players who haven't reported back many have reasons for not doing so.
Jones and O'Coilean are off to serve time doing internships etc - they are ensuring their future and work lives. Unfortunately staying home to play GAA is not going to pay their for their future. We can't hold that agaonst them. It happened to Dublin last year when Mannion, McCaffrey and O'Carroll all went at the same time for study/ work reasons to spend time abroad. Dublin got on with it and so should we.
Keoghan - i believe or read somewhere is doing likewise to complete his masters abroad. as above Gaa won't pay his future bills.
Harnan - has done headed off for the last two winters, again for study/ work experience reasons. He should be back for the later rounds of the league and championship. If Andy is ok with that then who are we to complain.
Tobin - haven't heard he's going but tbh he was a bit part player last year. His role coming in and closing the game out actually suited him in my opinion. Maybe Amdy told him that's his role and DT said not interested.
Paddy - has been there for 10 years and seems to have just had enough. Good luck to him
Anyone else leaving won't be a major diappointment.
The commitment required is massive and maybe Andy has laid it on the line to the panel and said this is whats expected if we want to be a top team and players aren't willing to give it. I can understand their point of view on it. Players are now retiring in their late 20's from nigh on exhaustion and burnout. Given our current position players possibly felt i'm not giving that effort for no chance of success and that's their choice. I'd prefer to not have people who want to half ass it pulling on a Meath Jersey." What a excellent post.
joeblogs10 (Dublin) - Posts: 104 - 05/11/2017 10:30:17
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Replying To anfearbeag: "There does seem to be an element on this forum that are more interested in McEntee failing than in Meath winning. I don't really understand the reasoning behind it. Most managers in most counties do get stick from some of the supporters. Mick O'Dowd certainly got criticised plenty on here. However, my memory of it is that people were broadly supportive of him for the first couple of years. The attitude was one of "well he has very little experience but we will give him a chance to see what he can do". It was only in years 3 and 4 where there was no obvious improvement that the criticism started. Even then it was very much along the lines of "nice guy, but he hasn't a clue, he has to go". It wasn't personal. With McEntee it seems a bit different. There seems to be more spite to the criticism, and it seemed to start almost form the time he took over.
As I said, I am not sure why that would be the case. It may be personal - the McEntees are not afraid to speak their mind, which I'm sure might rub some people up the wrong way. It may be as a way of attacking some posters on here who were possibly a little over enthusiastic in welcoming McEntee to the job (yes that means you Royaldunne!). It could be coming from people who were loyal to Mick O'Dowd and are still bitter about the criticism he took, so now feel that they should do the same to his successor. It could even be political - old political loyalties die hard, and the McEntees would be on the other side of the divide from a lot of Meath GAA people.
Whatever the reason for it, it is a bit sad really. Whatever his faults and I am sure he has many, I don't think anyone could doubt McEntees committment to Meath football and to getting them back to the top, so its a shame that some people don't seem to want to get behind him." What are you on about, in fairness not to many on here complaining about mcentee or looking for him to go, 99 percent of posters here are very supportive of the current management team
Royal.Legend (Meath) - Posts: 665 - 05/11/2017 17:18:56
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You go away for a week and all hell breaks lose.
First off their is no mass leaving of players. There is jones who we all knew about prior to Louth game this year. Roc who I knew about at end of campaign, por, who I think majority here called for his removal, harnan work experience but probably be back at latter end of league,
Now all of these have perfectly reasonable excuses that while we as fans might not like must accept, as it's there future.
Now yes Andy is demanding more from every player and if they don't give it then they can leave, or if they don't want success then they shouldn't have shown up. There is no more easy rides in Meath football and for that we owe Andy a huge debt of gratitude. Andy is there to manage, as a player you don't have to like him, you just have to commit to the county. Again I will say we have one of the best managers in country leading us, and by far best in Meath.
To those who have left be it from work, studies or just not been able to commit to the new professional set up in county, I wish them well and thank them for their services.
Hon the royal
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 05/11/2017 17:28:38
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Replying To royaldunne: "You go away for a week and all hell breaks lose.
First off their is no mass leaving of players. There is jones who we all knew about prior to Louth game this year. Roc who I knew about at end of campaign, por, who I think majority here called for his removal, harnan work experience but probably be back at latter end of league,
Now all of these have perfectly reasonable excuses that while we as fans might not like must accept, as it's there future.
Now yes Andy is demanding more from every player and if they don't give it then they can leave, or if they don't want success then they shouldn't have shown up. There is no more easy rides in Meath football and for that we owe Andy a huge debt of gratitude. Andy is there to manage, as a player you don't have to like him, you just have to commit to the county. Again I will say we have one of the best managers in country leading us, and by far best in Meath.
To those who have left be it from work, studies or just not been able to commit to the new professional set up in county, I wish them well and thank them for their services.
Hon the royal" That's a lie, Harnan is gone traveling and doing a bit of work, he left of Meath set up
SS6 (Meath) - Posts: 149 - 05/11/2017 17:57:38
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Replying To SS6: "That's a lie, Harnan is gone traveling and doing a bit of work, he left of Meath set up" If he can't commit to the new professional set up. Then it is better off for him.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 05/11/2017 18:35:59
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