National Forum

Jimmy's Coming Back!

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I think some of the comments on Jim are unfair.

I was enthralled by the 2011 semi final. 0-8 to 0-6 was a low score but if anything I think this set Dublin up for greatness. They had to find a way to win that game and they did. I think it has stood to them in many years since.

Didn't Jim's Donegal put 3-14 past Dublin in an all Ireland semi final also? Anyone who masterminds putting three goals past Dublin cannot be a bad coach.

I'm not a fan of his or anything I just think he is a born winner and an interesting character. It would be interesting to see him back all these years on.

slayer (Limerick) - Posts: 6480 - 18/08/2023 10:49:46    2501121

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Replying To FoolsGold:  "McGuiness will adapt as a different style of football now. Donegal played done good football in 2012. The first year was a slog in 2011 but they were more attacking the following year"
They had a great panel in 2012 McGees, Gallagher, Kavanagh, Murphy, Lacey, Paddy Mc, McHugh, McFadden….a golden crop. It's going to interesting to see how Jimmy adapts to having a less talented panel this year and will he attempt Mickey Harte Louth tactics or be more adventurous.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4743 - 18/08/2023 10:55:06    2501124

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Replying To Joxer:  "They had a great panel in 2012 McGees, Gallagher, Kavanagh, Murphy, Lacey, Paddy Mc, McHugh, McFadden….a golden crop. It's going to interesting to see how Jimmy adapts to having a less talented panel this year and will he attempt Mickey Harte Louth tactics or be more adventurous."
The point is that its not a less talented panel. When Bonner came in (after RG had made a mess of things) he brought in a load of young lads he had at minor and U21. There was a great bounce and immediate success followed which put us as genuine All-Ireland contenders. Things then went stale and we regressed after Rochford came in, the younger players weren't pushing on and we steadily went backways. In came Carr/O'Rourke and an utter disaster unfolded as we fell off a cliff!
The point being, the players that brought us recent success are all still young and available (apart from Murphy) and with the right man at the helm we can get back to that point very quickly. With McGuinness we then could push on from where we were 4 or 5 years ago and return as genuine All-Ireland contenders. The players are there, if they weren't McGuinness wouldn't be interested.

PeterQ92 (Donegal) - Posts: 154 - 18/08/2023 12:05:50    2501141

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "It's absolutely hilarious the rubbish spouted about McGuinness and Donegal under him. They were ultra defensive yes in the semi final in 2011 but if anyone had put forward the idea that they would be in a tight game with Dublin to make a final at the start of 2011 you would have been laughed out the door into the madhouse.

In 2012 they were still defensive but were far more adventurous breaking forward at speed. They put up some big scores and were most deserving winners that year. They were also excellent in 2014, just didn't perform in the final. A poor final it was. McGuinness didn't destroy football. He wasn't even the first manager to bring in a defensive system. Club managers trying to copy county managers tactics is the fault of the club manager. Nobody else. Tired of hearing lazy comments on that. McGuinnness has a massive job on his hands. If he gets them back to even a semi final in the next 2 years it would be a big achievement in my opinion but I wouldn't put it past him. He doesn't need to go back. But is willing to put his head on the block for the keyboard warriors to have a pop at him from their couches."
This is it. It's much easier to be a snivelling idiot making inane comments such as "RIP football", and watching Dublin or Kerry share out All Ireland's between them.

When someone comes along with a bit of gumption and balls to disrupt the established order he gets ridiculed.

I think back to when Pep's Barcelona were undisputed Kings of European football in the late 2000's. It was fantastic to watch, probably the best football I've ever watched. But I didn't want it to go on forever either. You wanted to see someone else come along to shoot them down from their perch. Mourinho's Inter were a hard outfit, who defended for their lives, but also had a lethal counter attacking edge with Eto, Sneijder & Milito. It may not have been as pretty to watch, but it was damn effective & very admirable in its own way.

This is sport. The fanciest way doesn't always prevail.

Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9754 - 18/08/2023 12:21:25    2501147

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Replying To realdub:  "Ah relax there now, I was having a laugh."
OK your forgiven lol
Always have great time for the Dubs .
It just gets quite annoying after after all these years when every team does it but Donegal are still blamed!

letterkennyGuy (Donegal) - Posts: 168 - 18/08/2023 12:50:07    2501153

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Replying To PeterQ92:  "The point is that its not a less talented panel. When Bonner came in (after RG had made a mess of things) he brought in a load of young lads he had at minor and U21. There was a great bounce and immediate success followed which put us as genuine All-Ireland contenders. Things then went stale and we regressed after Rochford came in, the younger players weren't pushing on and we steadily went backways. In came Carr/O'Rourke and an utter disaster unfolded as we fell off a cliff!
The point being, the players that brought us recent success are all still young and available (apart from Murphy) and with the right man at the helm we can get back to that point very quickly. With McGuinness we then could push on from where we were 4 or 5 years ago and return as genuine All-Ireland contenders. The players are there, if they weren't McGuinness wouldn't be interested."
I'd have to agree with you there.

I'd argue this Donegal Panel with everyone available is more talented than the All-Ireland winning panel.

Strong in every line of the pitch with options off the bench.

Whether they have the character of the All Ireland winning squad is yet to be proven but no better man than McGuinness to bring that out in them.

drumalee11 (USA) - Posts: 351 - 18/08/2023 12:59:21    2501156

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Replying To Joxer:  "They had a great panel in 2012 McGees, Gallagher, Kavanagh, Murphy, Lacey, Paddy Mc, McHugh, McFadden….a golden crop. It's going to interesting to see how Jimmy adapts to having a less talented panel this year and will he attempt Mickey Harte Louth tactics or be more adventurous."
There is a nucleus for a good team,
Patton
McCole
Mogan
McMenamin
Eoin Ban
Ryan McHugh
Jason McGee
C Thompson
Langan
McBrearty
Gallen
O'Donnells
It is an awful pity MM stepped away. If we get them all fit and out on the pitch together we will be very competitive, we may not be All Ireland ready but we are Ulster ready.

Ulsterchamps72 (Donegal) - Posts: 103 - 18/08/2023 13:36:38    2501163

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It's not only a manager the county needs but players of substance and there in lies the problem. As for McGuinness, he must be lacking his former spark when no one else is seeking his services. Deadwood comes to mind!

Up4it. (Tyrone) - Posts: 199 - 18/08/2023 14:03:34    2501175

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Replying To Ulsterchamps72:  "There is a nucleus for a good team,
Patton
McCole
Mogan
McMenamin
Eoin Ban
Ryan McHugh
Jason McGee
C Thompson
Langan
McBrearty
Gallen
O'Donnells
It is an awful pity MM stepped away. If we get them all fit and out on the pitch together we will be very competitive, we may not be All Ireland ready but we are Ulster ready."
I think Ulster match-ups will be very interesting. We know that Jimmy is a great tactician. Is an Ulster asking for too much too soon? Derry have a system but Jimmy's a tactician. Tyrone, Armagh and Monaghan will up it a level. If they get out of the province then it's open season. Mayo have derailed, Dublin are ageing, Kildare, Cork, Galway, Roscommon all unknowns. Could be a year for a dark horse but I'd expect Kerry to bounce back next year.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4743 - 18/08/2023 14:07:44    2501176

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Replying To Up4it.:  "It's not only a manager the county needs but players of substance and there in lies the problem. As for McGuinness, he must be lacking his former spark when no one else is seeking his services. Deadwood comes to mind!"
Yeah yeah.. you'll know all about it if he does land back!

Donegal_abroad (Donegal) - Posts: 1404 - 18/08/2023 14:10:22    2501177

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I really do find it a bit mad that some people claim this is a more talented team than the 2012 one. Absolutely no chance lads.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8375 - 18/08/2023 14:19:18    2501180

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Replying To Up4it.:  "It's not only a manager the county needs but players of substance and there in lies the problem. As for McGuinness, he must be lacking his former spark when no one else is seeking his services. Deadwood comes to mind!"
Deadwood, have you seen who back on the line for Tyrone and there lies the problem for Tyrone.

Saynothing (Tyrone) - Posts: 2289 - 18/08/2023 14:23:13    2501183

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Replying To TheRock2121:  "Why pretend you are from Donegal?"
He's from Mayo, he was caught out in the comments a way back, referring to Mayo as 'we' accidentally when commenting on a Mayo topic, just ignore him. Still salty after 2012 I suppose.

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 3183 - 18/08/2023 15:17:38    2501200

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Replying To PeterQ92:  "The point is that its not a less talented panel. When Bonner came in (after RG had made a mess of things) he brought in a load of young lads he had at minor and U21. There was a great bounce and immediate success followed which put us as genuine All-Ireland contenders. Things then went stale and we regressed after Rochford came in, the younger players weren't pushing on and we steadily went backways. In came Carr/O'Rourke and an utter disaster unfolded as we fell off a cliff!
The point being, the players that brought us recent success are all still young and available (apart from Murphy) and with the right man at the helm we can get back to that point very quickly. With McGuinness we then could push on from where we were 4 or 5 years ago and return as genuine All-Ireland contenders. The players are there, if they weren't McGuinness wouldn't be interested."
Biggest problem post 2019 was lacey stepping away, Rochford is a spoofer

totalrecall (Leitrim) - Posts: 1055 - 18/08/2023 17:31:56    2501223

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "I really do find it a bit mad that some people claim this is a more talented team than the 2012 one. Absolutely no chance lads."
Tbf the Donegal panel bar Murphy were not rated before 2011 and when they became champions they became rated. If they had nt won who knows! Winners are always rated higher than losers but I too think this Donegal panel have lots of talent and McGuinness is the man to get the most out of team.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3901 - 18/08/2023 18:16:32    2501230

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "This is it. It's much easier to be a snivelling idiot making inane comments such as "RIP football", and watching Dublin or Kerry share out All Ireland's between them.

When someone comes along with a bit of gumption and balls to disrupt the established order he gets ridiculed.

I think back to when Pep's Barcelona were undisputed Kings of European football in the late 2000's. It was fantastic to watch, probably the best football I've ever watched. But I didn't want it to go on forever either. You wanted to see someone else come along to shoot them down from their perch. Mourinho's Inter were a hard outfit, who defended for their lives, but also had a lethal counter attacking edge with Eto, Sneijder & Milito. It may not have been as pretty to watch, but it was damn effective & very admirable in its own way.

This is sport. The fanciest way doesn't always prevail."
Well said Lockjaw and tbf Donegal were nt as boring as was made out. It's true Kerry and Dublin are as defensive as any team around at the mó. I found Dublin even more defensive than Derry this year and often had all 15 players in their own half. Kerry also had 14 Because Dublin and Kerry attack quicker we gets a fools pardon. As Mark Twain said "A man that's known as an wary riser can stay in bed all day". McGuinness gets unfair press in my opinion and I think it will be great for football if he gets the gig.

CiarraiMick (Dublin) - Posts: 3901 - 18/08/2023 18:26:35    2501231

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Replying To letterkennyGuy:  "OK your forgiven lol
Always have great time for the Dubs .
It just gets quite annoying after after all these years when every team does it but Donegal are still blamed!"
How could I afford to slag Jimmy off after what ye did to us in 2014. He'll raise the bar for Donegal for sure!

realdub (Dublin) - Posts: 8746 - 18/08/2023 20:44:03    2501242

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "I really do find it a bit mad that some people claim this is a more talented team than the 2012 one. Absolutely no chance lads."
Talent wise, it is.

TheRock2121 (Donegal) - Posts: 1208 - 18/08/2023 21:43:03    2501248

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Replying To Lockjaw:  "This is it. It's much easier to be a snivelling idiot making inane comments such as "RIP football", and watching Dublin or Kerry share out All Ireland's between them.

When someone comes along with a bit of gumption and balls to disrupt the established order he gets ridiculed.

I think back to when Pep's Barcelona were undisputed Kings of European football in the late 2000's. It was fantastic to watch, probably the best football I've ever watched. But I didn't want it to go on forever either. You wanted to see someone else come along to shoot them down from their perch. Mourinho's Inter were a hard outfit, who defended for their lives, but also had a lethal counter attacking edge with Eto, Sneijder & Milito. It may not have been as pretty to watch, but it was damn effective & very admirable in its own way.

This is sport. The fanciest way doesn't always prevail."
Agree to a certain extent. People talk about styles. Mayo lauded in the media for years for playing off the cuff attacking football. Mayo have been in just short of ONE THIRD of all football finals since 1989.
Only Kerry have played in more finals .would take another style if it won us won. Result = zero wins.

The record books don't tell how a team played or setup. It's about winning.

All the nonsense about classic Dublin v Kerry finals and "it's the final everyone wanted" bull…only if you're from those two counties does it matter.

If Jimmy took over Mayo and won us Sam I wouldn't care if the players won playing with wellingtons.

yew_tree (Mayo) - Posts: 11558 - 19/08/2023 07:28:26    2501260

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Within the rules, every one of the successful managers, McGuinness included, have come up with something that gains a comparative advantage. That lasts as long as they have players to implement it, which Donegal had for a number of years, and until opposition counters it. Disciplined defence was basis, but efficiency in attack wins games and he had McBrearty and Murphy and the rest.

The worst offenders - and they shall remain nameless because they never won anything - were the teams that actually did "park the bus" and set out with intent of winning very low scoring games by the odd point and preferably after defending an early lead. We can probably all recall absolute abominations of that type. None of them other than by fluke ever beat a genuine contender and never will.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3512 - 19/08/2023 08:23:04    2501263

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