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Is Pat Spillane Right Or Wrong With His Three Improvement Suggestions .

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Gaelic footballers are more comfortable with the ball than previous generations, however, some games are awful to watch. Teams lining out in defensive lines across the pitch like a rugby league team. There are long periods where players just play keep ball, back and forth across the pitch and then a kick pass back to the keeper. I accept that not all teams nor games follow these patterns but when it happens, i wouldn't be a fan of it. I would replace the current rule of a free shot at the goals from a chest mark with the rule that you can't pass it back across the half way line.

wicklowsupport (Wicklow) - Posts: 1993 - 10/10/2022 18:09:54    2443468

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Replying To Viking66:  "The game has become a hard watch at all adult levels lad. Something has to be done about it. Not sure about Pats suggestions. No backward handpassing at all might be an easier rule for a ref and his linesmen to spot and implement. Would solve his 1 and 3 points. Kickouts to go over the 45 or to go 30 metres in u13 and u15?"
What games are you watching? Scoring averages higher than years ago at all levels. Including the very top level, all you need to do is go and look at the scoring in semis and finals over the past few years. Game is hard to watch at all levels is a comment from couch fans who see the odd bad game on TG4.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8078 - 10/10/2022 19:10:16    2443480

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Replying To wicklowsupport:  "Gaelic footballers are more comfortable with the ball than previous generations, however, some games are awful to watch. Teams lining out in defensive lines across the pitch like a rugby league team. There are long periods where players just play keep ball, back and forth across the pitch and then a kick pass back to the keeper. I accept that not all teams nor games follow these patterns but when it happens, i wouldn't be a fan of it. I would replace the current rule of a free shot at the goals from a chest mark with the rule that you can't pass it back across the half way line."
I'd agree with that. While some games are a hard watch some games are excellent. Thats the same with most sports. What makes some games a hard watch is as much the lack of adventure in forward play as the defensive setup.

The defensively minded team who are just as defensive with the ball as without it are the hardest to watch - I believe some kind of "use it or loose it" possession rule like this would have a lot of merit.

brianb (Kildare) - Posts: 331 - 11/10/2022 12:34:59    2443558

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Replying To brianb:  "I'd agree with that. While some games are a hard watch some games are excellent. Thats the same with most sports. What makes some games a hard watch is as much the lack of adventure in forward play as the defensive setup.

The defensively minded team who are just as defensive with the ball as without it are the hardest to watch - I believe some kind of "use it or loose it" possession rule like this would have a lot of merit."
Rather than rule changes I'd prefer to see teams devise strategies to take this type of play on and beat it.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6118 - 11/10/2022 15:34:20    2443588

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "What games are you watching? Scoring averages higher than years ago at all levels. Including the very top level, all you need to do is go and look at the scoring in semis and finals over the past few years. Game is hard to watch at all levels is a comment from couch fans who see the odd bad game on TG4."
I've gone to around 20 live football games this year at intercounty, club, and underage. And a further half dozen or so on TV. Hardly a couch fan. Modern football is like 30 lads on a pitch playing chess. Keep ball tactics are ruining soccer at the top level too btw.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13490 - 11/10/2022 16:41:39    2443599

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Did you find Kerry v Galway, Kerry v Dublin, Armagh v Galway hard watches? The county final in Louth yesterday was exceptional."
Watched all 3 of those games. Armagh v Galway was exciting. Kerry v Dublin was exciting in the last few minutes. Kerry v Galway had some exceptional performances from some players but wasn't as exciting as Armagh v Galway.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13490 - 11/10/2022 16:44:17    2443603

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I think this year has being a good year for football lots of exciting games a good few not so exciting either but thar has always being the way , they need stop messing with the rules the advance mark is a joke referee blowing whistle some players put up hand some play on a joke , and now talking about only so many hand passes I think referee has enough do beside trying count that also not kicking it back to goalie don't agree sure Is the goalie not part of the play it's up to opposite team to push up on there men thar will stop a lot of that , you would think the way some people portray football that it's worse game ever ,, look at hurling short puck outs lots hand passes and 100 yard frees or goalie drives it 100 yard forward get it over bar no. Great skill required there ,, stop messing with the rules and sure If u don't like the game don't go watch it simple as that ,,

Kickitout (Galway) - Posts: 930 - 11/10/2022 17:59:19    2443618

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Did you find Kerry v Galway, Kerry v Dublin, Armagh v Galway hard watches? The county final in Louth yesterday was exceptional."
Please explain 'exceptional'. Exceptional compared to what? Exceptionally good because all the other games in the county were bad. Exceptional because the crowd was the biggest ever? Exceptional because a streaker ran onto the pitch? Exceptionally bad, even?

You've left this hanging comment, without any proper context. The answer to your question is 'yes, I did find those games a hard watch' or 'no, I did not find those games a hard watch'. A person's perceived quality of those games has nothing to do with a county final in Louth.

So, please explain what you mean by exceptional, and why you deem this county final in Louth to have been exceptional.

foreveryoung (USA) - Posts: 2079 - 11/10/2022 18:22:33    2443624

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Referees are bad enough without implementing any more rules to make them worse.

Farney1990 (Monaghan) - Posts: 20 - 11/10/2022 18:51:11    2443633

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Replying To Kickitout:  "I think this year has being a good year for football lots of exciting games a good few not so exciting either but thar has always being the way , they need stop messing with the rules the advance mark is a joke referee blowing whistle some players put up hand some play on a joke , and now talking about only so many hand passes I think referee has enough do beside trying count that also not kicking it back to goalie don't agree sure Is the goalie not part of the play it's up to opposite team to push up on there men thar will stop a lot of that , you would think the way some people portray football that it's worse game ever ,, look at hurling short puck outs lots hand passes and 100 yard frees or goalie drives it 100 yard forward get it over bar no. Great skill required there ,, stop messing with the rules and sure If u don't like the game don't go watch it simple as that ,,"
Paragraphs.....

I think the constant changes to the rules is because people know changes are needed. If the game was as good as you are saying then why do coaches, players, and then the county boards always agree to so many changes.

Its not that difficult for a ref to count handpasses on top of rest that they do. they have 6 officials with them at a lot of games. give those more powers(combined with better training and assistance_

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3654 - 11/10/2022 19:09:29    2443636

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Replying To Viking66:  "I've gone to around 20 live football games this year at intercounty, club, and underage. And a further half dozen or so on TV. Hardly a couch fan. Modern football is like 30 lads on a pitch playing chess. Keep ball tactics are ruining soccer at the top level too btw."
Correct Viking. The Offaly football final was an example of modern day pass the ball, but don't dare shoot. It took Tullamore 18 minutes to score, and that was by a defender. A total bore.
I think Pat Spillane has a good suggestion. The endless passing, including back to the keeper should be ditched. The game is Football, not keepball.

thelongridge (Offaly) - Posts: 1879 - 11/10/2022 19:28:16    2443639

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Replying To Greengrass:  "Rather than rule changes I'd prefer to see teams devise strategies to take this type of play on and beat it."
It would be preferable for teams to change their tactics as oppose to having to change the rules all the time. The rules committee are working overtime in the last couple of years trying to negate coaching setups. A number of coaches are branded geniuses and have developed a reputation which probably increases the demand for their services and their fees. I do think that teams are coming to realise that being setup defensively with no attacking plan has a short shelf life. Hopefully this is the case and that more teams will introduce an attacking plan to compliment their defence. And that this will eliminate the need to be continously tinkering with the rules all the time.

wicklowsupport (Wicklow) - Posts: 1993 - 11/10/2022 19:30:52    2443640

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Replying To Kickitout:  "I think this year has being a good year for football lots of exciting games a good few not so exciting either but thar has always being the way , they need stop messing with the rules the advance mark is a joke referee blowing whistle some players put up hand some play on a joke , and now talking about only so many hand passes I think referee has enough do beside trying count that also not kicking it back to goalie don't agree sure Is the goalie not part of the play it's up to opposite team to push up on there men thar will stop a lot of that , you would think the way some people portray football that it's worse game ever ,, look at hurling short puck outs lots hand passes and 100 yard frees or goalie drives it 100 yard forward get it over bar no. Great skill required there ,, stop messing with the rules and sure If u don't like the game don't go watch it simple as that ,,"
It isnt messing with the rules.
The mark could be better but nothing wrong with some players choosing to take it and others choosing to play on. thats allowed so why is that an issue??
Limiting handpasses is a good thing. some teams and some games have far too many handpasses and not enough kick passes. its football... not handball....

KillingFields (Limerick) - Posts: 3654 - 11/10/2022 20:18:58    2443642

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Replying To Viking66:  "I've gone to around 20 live football games this year at intercounty, club, and underage. And a further half dozen or so on TV. Hardly a couch fan. Modern football is like 30 lads on a pitch playing chess. Keep ball tactics are ruining soccer at the top level too btw."
Playing chess yet the scoring average is way higher than ever and it's a way better product than years ago. But you go to games and seem happy to ignore the actual stats. I am a former player recently retired, went straight into coaching and the standard and product is better than ever. There will always be bad games. People tend to remember them more.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8078 - 11/10/2022 20:22:39    2443643

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Replying To foreveryoung:  "Please explain 'exceptional'. Exceptional compared to what? Exceptionally good because all the other games in the county were bad. Exceptional because the crowd was the biggest ever? Exceptional because a streaker ran onto the pitch? Exceptionally bad, even?

You've left this hanging comment, without any proper context. The answer to your question is 'yes, I did find those games a hard watch' or 'no, I did not find those games a hard watch'. A person's perceived quality of those games has nothing to do with a county final in Louth.

So, please explain what you mean by exceptional, and why you deem this county final in Louth to have been exceptional."
I wouldn't dignify your tripe with any response other than this.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6118 - 11/10/2022 21:08:38    2443650

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Replying To Viking66:  "Watched all 3 of those games. Armagh v Galway was exciting. Kerry v Dublin was exciting in the last few minutes. Kerry v Galway had some exceptional performances from some players but wasn't as exciting as Armagh v Galway."
Ah here. It's plain to see that you either can't be pleased or you don't want to be pleased.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6118 - 11/10/2022 21:12:02    2443652

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Replying To TheFlaker:  "Playing chess yet the scoring average is way higher than ever and it's a way better product than years ago. But you go to games and seem happy to ignore the actual stats. I am a former player recently retired, went straight into coaching and the standard and product is better than ever. There will always be bad games. People tend to remember them more."
I'm not saying scores are lower. I'm saying there's less excitement. Less balls into the square. Less kicking the ball. Less football and more handball. Less risk taking. Less drama. Less low percentage balls in when you really don't know what's going to happen next!

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13490 - 11/10/2022 21:37:17    2443655

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I enjoy all games. Negative low scoring keep ball ones and positive attacking high scoring ones alike.

Pat was some player - as someone said ferocious workrate and will to win. He was the main reason why Kerry beat us in 1986; he worked that hard in the last 1/4 you'd have sworn there was 2 of him. Mad biased about football of course, but a very decent man. I miss him and Brolly on the TV, the pair of them annoying all the sensible people : ).

points50swiththeargyllsonthewrongfeet (Tyrone) - Posts: 273 - 11/10/2022 21:53:32    2443658

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Replying To tomsmith:  "Tomsmith here
I have read Pat Spillances suggestions about his improvements in the GAA.
No 1 Kickouts to go over 45 M line
No2 No back pass to Keeper
No3 Curtail the number of hand passes

In his Sundat Wo--- article he gives us some wonderful stats which make interesting reading .
But Pat is Pat and while he played the game at a reasonably high level he had alot of work horses behind him that handed him a lot of ball on aplate.
I dont know Pat if you arer ight or wrong but as a Cavan man ( who beat youse in teh 1947 All iReland player in Newyork) I feel you are playing to the Gallery with these radical comments"
I started laughing at 'he played the game at a reasonably high level'

Maroonatic (Galway) - Posts: 1062 - 12/10/2022 08:58:17    2443664

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I honestly cannot believe there are people who still think limiting handpasses is an actual solution to anything. Of all the suggestions this is the most ridiculous one.

TheFlaker (Mayo) - Posts: 8078 - 12/10/2022 09:16:53    2443668

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