National Forum

Kerry Vs Tyrone

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Replying To CiarraiMick:  "While I hope Tyrone get to play in semi final I'm wondering if the gaa don't change date and Tyrone can't play does it open the door for Monaghan again? I think (although I might be wrong) it might have happened in the early days of the gaa during foot and mouth. If Tyrone can't play would nt it be better than a walkover where no one is a winner really. Anyway just a though. Anyone else have a view on it? Of course ideally we hope Tyrone can play and the gaa facilitate their plight."
That thought had crossed my mind as well. Monaghan probably wouldn't have trained collectively since their ulster final defeat and may not want to play a semi that they didn't earn just to suit the GAA however.

Ideally Tyrone should face Kerry whenever it's feasible and the GAA will probably need to give them the two week extension to facilitate that. The six day extension was a joke and was never going to work but they are going to look foolish if they back down now.

The whole thing is a bit of a disaster, nobody's fault of course, just a very unfortunate set of events. The GAA need to just get on with it and find the least bad outcome because there are no good ones from here.

GeniusGerry (Kerry) - Posts: 2117 - 10/08/2021 18:41:34    2369632

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Replying To wishfulthinkin:  "so highly contagious that no other intercounty team across male or female, camogie, football or hurling, at any age level have been so badly affected..sure. More likely some of the starters are struggling with injury than all struck down so badly with something they've been vaccinated against. Sure lets stay locked down and postpone everything in the future instead of getting on with life. There's more footballers in tyrone than these few"
Cork u20 hurlers.
So Tyrone would rather withdraw from championship than play without a few injured players.

Westfester (Limerick) - Posts: 980 - 10/08/2021 18:41:41    2369633

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Replying To tireoghainabu:  "I would just like to remind people that over 7,000 have died in Ireland due to Covid."
7,000 people have died from "covid related" illness. Not just from Covid.

The numbers of deaths in 2020 and so far in 2021 from all causes are not up to any significant degree.

So, on average those 7,000 covid deaths overwhelmingly of very old people would have been otherwise attributed to whatever underlying condition those people had, or simply to old age,

There are old people who have died who apparently were tested for Covid, but who also had serious heart, lung, and other conditions, including now apparently non-existent "rival" respiratory conditions like flu, COPD, bronchitis and pneumonia. All disappeared after generations of being the main cause of death in elderly people. The miracles of science, what?

There were 33,134 deaths in the Republic in 2019. There were 33,842.

There were not thousands of extra deaths due to Covid in 2020 and there have been none at all in the past three months.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3688 - 10/08/2021 18:42:31    2369634

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Tyrone will have a team out for Kerry even if they have to get players from outside the panel. To be fair there are a fair few intercounty standard players not involved who could play. I'd be v suprised if they don't play the match.

seanie08 (Monaghan) - Posts: 1912 - 10/08/2021 18:45:01    2369635

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Replying To Galway9801:  "Well for starters 5000 isn't a huge figure when you take into account that 93 (I think it's 93 but it might be more} die per day in Ireland pre covid,,multiply that by 365 and you'll get a figure considerably higher than 5000,, that's to start, then take into account the fact that those 5000 deaths were covid RELATED,, most of them simply died after testing positive, and had their deaths falsely attributed to covid.

Irelands death rate at the end of 2020 was 1% higher than at the end of 2019,, yet you'd have been forgiven for thinking we'd been struck by the plague the way people go on.

Crawl out from under your bed, and enjoy the match :)"
I've no problem, I'm vaxed. 5000 is a big number when you consider the restrictions, with no restrictions it could have been 10,000 plus in 18 months from a preventable disease. Look people have different views on it. I prefer to inform my views from scientists and scientific evidence and not from Youtube and Facebook experts. It's all academic now anyway, looks like they're playing weekend after next.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4749 - 10/08/2021 18:47:19    2369636

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Replying To Joxer:  "I've no problem, I'm vaxed. 5000 is a big number when you consider the restrictions, with no restrictions it could have been 10,000 plus in 18 months from a preventable disease. Look people have different views on it. I prefer to inform my views from scientists and scientific evidence and not from Youtube and Facebook experts. It's all academic now anyway, looks like they're playing weekend after next."
I wouldn't bother trying to use logic here, wasting your breath. The same people will deny human made climate change until their house is either under water or on fire.

Hopefully Tyrone lads are ok and can play the match if the match is rescheduled. If they have to pull out of the fixture, I respect that too.

HighKings (Meath) - Posts: 271 - 10/08/2021 20:13:58    2369645

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Replying To Joxer:  "I've no problem, I'm vaxed. 5000 is a big number when you consider the restrictions, with no restrictions it could have been 10,000 plus in 18 months from a preventable disease. Look people have different views on it. I prefer to inform my views from scientists and scientific evidence and not from Youtube and Facebook experts. It's all academic now anyway, looks like they're playing weekend after next."
???
I personally think that scientists and doctors could and should have done more to reassure people throughout this farce that as much as precautions must be taken, the virus has an extremely low mortality rate, but as health professionals I acknowledge that its their job to focus on the dangers,its up to ordinary people to figure that out for themselves.

My general point though is that this virus has an extremely favourable recovery rate, the hyper hysteria it has generated is unwarranted, the tyrone lads will be fine, that covid is being wrongly attributed to many deaths, and the threat has been disproportionately overblown in comparison to many other things that kill way way way way more people than covid (like hunger for example, that we do nothing about btw).

If you have scientific evidence to counter any of those claims I'm happy to hear it.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 10/08/2021 20:16:54    2369646

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In any event listening to Brian Dooher just now I'm guessing that kerry will be given a walkover, either that or play a 2nd string team.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 10/08/2021 20:42:37    2369652

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The only people denying anything in this discussion are those who throw out numbers that do not stand up.

33,134 deaths in 2019.

33,842 deaths in 2020.

So there are clearly not 5 or 7 or 10,000 people who have died from covid who would otherwise not have died.

If you cannot grasp the simple maths of this, then you should be enrolling in night classes.

Same people dying of same things, with "Covid related" tacked onto the same things that kill old people every year.

BarneyGrant (Dublin) - Posts: 3688 - 10/08/2021 20:45:50    2369655

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Replying To wishfulthinkin:  "so highly contagious that no other intercounty team across male or female, camogie, football or hurling, at any age level have been so badly affected..sure. More likely some of the starters are struggling with injury than all struck down so badly with something they've been vaccinated against. Sure lets stay locked down and postpone everything in the future instead of getting on with life. There's more footballers in tyrone than these few"
If you have some grand conspiracy theory behind this story then let's hear it. But I can't imagine for the life of me that Tyrone went through walls in Ulster to get to an AI semi just to come up with a sick note because one or two players are injured.

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2591 - 10/08/2021 20:53:25    2369658

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Replying To HighKings:  "I wouldn't bother trying to use logic here, wasting your breath. The same people will deny human made climate change until their house is either under water or on fire.

Hopefully Tyrone lads are ok and can play the match if the match is rescheduled. If they have to pull out of the fixture, I respect that too."
Humans arent helping for sure we are like parasites on the planet. But it doesnt change the fact that climate changes were happening long before humans were around and will no doubt long after we are gone.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16821 - 10/08/2021 21:03:09    2369660

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Replying To HighKings:  "I wouldn't bother trying to use logic here, wasting your breath. The same people will deny human made climate change until their house is either under water or on fire.

Hopefully Tyrone lads are ok and can play the match if the match is rescheduled. If they have to pull out of the fixture, I respect that too."
Logic? All he did was claim, wrongly, that people who disagree with him are getting their information from basement dwelling youtubers. Where exactly is the logic in that?

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 10/08/2021 21:20:47    2369665

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "The only people denying anything in this discussion are those who throw out numbers that do not stand up.

33,134 deaths in 2019.

33,842 deaths in 2020.

So there are clearly not 5 or 7 or 10,000 people who have died from covid who would otherwise not have died.

If you cannot grasp the simple maths of this, then you should be enrolling in night classes.

Same people dying of same things, with "Covid related" tacked onto the same things that kill old people every year."
The death rate has increased by 0.1 or 0.2 every year since 2014 so the increase from 2019 to 2020 is only in line with the increase in previous years.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16821 - 10/08/2021 21:20:51    2369666

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Replying To tireoghainabu:  "I would just like to remind people that over 7,000 have died in Ireland due to Covid."
How many of that 7000 were elderly people you would have died in that time frame anyway and how many died diagnosed with covid but not because of covid? I know of one case for definite that was put down as a covid death bit it wasn't what caused the death.
I'm no conspiracy theorist and I'm no medic, I followed the rules as best I could and got my jabs etc. but why was the covid death numbers exaggerated like this?
something like 75% of everyone over 16 is now fully vaccinated but still the daily drone goes on of case numbers, is the curve flattened yet I wonder?

Tirchonaill1 (Donegal) - Posts: 3408 - 10/08/2021 21:24:35    2369667

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Replying To Galway9801:  "In any event listening to Brian Dooher just now I'm guessing that kerry will be given a walkover, either that or play a 2nd string team."
Unfortunately I think you are right.

IsMise (Tyrone) - Posts: 119 - 10/08/2021 21:36:52    2369673

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Replying To IsMise:  "Unfortunately I think you are right."
From a tyrone point of view, would you rather a walkover, or would you still like to see your boys (the ones available) get a run out at Croker, even if it's an almost impossible task.

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 10/08/2021 21:40:22    2369676

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "The only people denying anything in this discussion are those who throw out numbers that do not stand up.

33,134 deaths in 2019.

33,842 deaths in 2020.

So there are clearly not 5 or 7 or 10,000 people who have died from covid who would otherwise not have died.

If you cannot grasp the simple maths of this, then you should be enrolling in night classes.

Same people dying of same things, with "Covid related" tacked onto the same things that kill old people every year."
I don't have the time to look into this but I'll just make a general observation.

The total number of deaths in Ireland for 2017 and 2018 inclusive were 61,558. (Pre-Covid)

The total number of deaths in Ireland for 2019 and 2020 inclusive were 66,976. (Half Post-Covid)

So if you are using excess mortality as a guide, then it clearly shows there were 5418 excess deaths even though three of the four years mentioned were pre-covid.

The figures that can't be argued with are the drastic increases in hospital admissions and particularly to the ICU's and it would be folly to say that these would still have happened if covid didn't exist.

AfricanGael (UK) - Posts: 1947 - 10/08/2021 22:06:12    2369681

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Replying To AfricanGael:  "I don't have the time to look into this but I'll just make a general observation.

The total number of deaths in Ireland for 2017 and 2018 inclusive were 61,558. (Pre-Covid)

The total number of deaths in Ireland for 2019 and 2020 inclusive were 66,976. (Half Post-Covid)

So if you are using excess mortality as a guide, then it clearly shows there were 5418 excess deaths even though three of the four years mentioned were pre-covid.

The figures that can't be argued with are the drastic increases in hospital admissions and particularly to the ICU's and it would be folly to say that these would still have happened if covid didn't exist."
Some fairly specific numbers there considering you didn't have the time to look into it, your 2019/2020 figures pretty much back up what Barney grant said, the difference between 2019 and 2020 was something along the line of 500,,far less than 7000,

Galway9801 (Galway) - Posts: 1942 - 10/08/2021 22:15:01    2369684

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Replying To Tirchonaill1:  "How many of that 7000 were elderly people you would have died in that time frame anyway and how many died diagnosed with covid but not because of covid? I know of one case for definite that was put down as a covid death bit it wasn't what caused the death.
I'm no conspiracy theorist and I'm no medic, I followed the rules as best I could and got my jabs etc. but why was the covid death numbers exaggerated like this?
something like 75% of everyone over 16 is now fully vaccinated but still the daily drone goes on of case numbers, is the curve flattened yet I wonder?"
So the elderly don't count,a person might of lost two months of their life cause of covid,we are nearly 18 months in and some people don't understand,it amazes me,some people might have a week,month,3 months,a year left but covid killed them off,if we didn't lockdown we would have alot more deaths,covid or long covid is affecting our youth,I'm not saying hid away,cause I'm not but please educate yourself first.

cityman73 (Limerick) - Posts: 783 - 10/08/2021 22:17:14    2369685

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Replying To BarneyGrant:  "The only people denying anything in this discussion are those who throw out numbers that do not stand up.

33,134 deaths in 2019.

33,842 deaths in 2020.

So there are clearly not 5 or 7 or 10,000 people who have died from covid who would otherwise not have died.

If you cannot grasp the simple maths of this, then you should be enrolling in night classes.

Same people dying of same things, with "Covid related" tacked onto the same things that kill old people every year."
Wrong. People have died from Covid in both June and July.

Greengrass (Louth) - Posts: 6193 - 10/08/2021 23:22:39    2369695

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