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Dublin v Donegal

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JayP

I totally agree that giving two yellows for handbags in a total cop out. As another thread says, its a pet hate of the OP's and its also a pet hate of mine. Its infuriating.

It doesn't change the fact that when you are on a yellow you cant go in for the kind of tackles Derm went in for. The offence he got his second yellow for, was as stonewall a booking as you will see.

We can complain all we want about the first booking, but that's not the offence that got him the line. Its called discipline, Derm didn't have it yesterday. I love the guy, he is an absolute genius, his two points yesterday where worth the admission fee on their own, the bloke is immense, But again his discipline was an issue.

waynoI (Dublin) - Posts: 13654 - 07/08/2016 15:26:23    1897381

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Replying To MuckrossHead:  "wayno is no brown noser but is instead a fair minded & generous poster the type of which we could do with a few more of on HS.

I have to tell you hill, that the sort of myopic posting you & a number of others, Donegal men included, engage in is boring in the extreme & part of the reason I generally skip past your posts. The world is not black & white, no team is always the best, fairest or hard done by. The opposing side have their merits & story to tell & hats off to wayno for recognising it."
If it's not brown nosing then its idiotic to suggest a player desrves a red card for an open palm shove and another player only deserves a yellow for a clear closed fist punch. Regardless of what colour Jersey that are wearing.
I fully was amazed bastick didn't get a yellow card he clearly hauled him down but to say Connolly is not targetted is just sheer silly and to suggest he deserves the same punishment is ridiculous. Yes trying to get in with the game while the guy is trying to get him sent off by whatever means possible that's not part of our game of Gaelic football and has no place in the game or the rules for that matter.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 15:27:02    1897382

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Replying To waynoI:  "JayP

I totally agree that giving two yellows for handbags in a total cop out. As another thread says, its a pet hate of the OP's and its also a pet hate of mine. Its infuriating.

It doesn't change the fact that when you are on a yellow you cant go in for the kind of tackles Derm went in for. The offence he got his second yellow for, was as stonewall a booking as you will see.

We can complain all we want about the first booking, but that's not the offence that got him the line. Its called discipline, Derm didn't have it yesterday. I love the guy, he is an absolute genius, his two points yesterday where worth the admission fee on their own, the bloke is immense, But again his discipline was an issue."
If you read my other posts on the last page you'll see I have already said whether he deserved it or not, Connolly was on a yellow card. At that point he has to be very careful as he is high profile and very easy to send off. He can't argue with the sending off, and only has himself to blame.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 07/08/2016 15:36:49    1897387

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Wayno your the one quoting the rule book if o gara was an attempt to strike then you surely know a closed fist strike is a red card which is what Murphy done so it doesn't matter as you say what our opinion is the rule states it's a straight red card. it's a clear fact he struck Fenton with a closed fist not an opinion so therefore he had to be sent off.
I said bastick should have got a black card but you seem to pick and choose the black card offences yourself as there is five offences a black card can be awarded for and the stuff that connolly and o gara receive is one of them offences and if refs actually done their job and used it then we wouldn't be having the situation Connolly and o gara get into

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 15:38:31    1897388

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Replying To hill16no1man:  "Wayno your the one quoting the rule book if o gara was an attempt to strike then you surely know a closed fist strike is a red card which is what Murphy done so it doesn't matter as you say what our opinion is the rule states it's a straight red card. it's a clear fact he struck Fenton with a closed fist not an opinion so therefore he had to be sent off.
I said bastick should have got a black card but you seem to pick and choose the black card offences yourself as there is five offences a black card can be awarded for and the stuff that connolly and o gara receive is one of them offences and if refs actually done their job and used it then we wouldn't be having the situation Connolly and o gara get into"
But whether Murphy "struck" is open to interpretation as his arm was with a straight arm - and if you look at the ref's positioning you can see how he would have considered it more a clothes-line than a strike. I'm not so sure he saw Murphy catching Fenton square in the jaw with the closed fist, but I'm also not sure that was Murphy's intention (so he can be exonerated of an attempted strike).

O'Gara's is only just a red by the absolute letter of the law and to be honest, if you were to give a red for every one of those, very few teams would end a game with more than 11 men.

cavanman47 (Cavan) - Posts: 5245 - 07/08/2016 15:52:51    1897398

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Replying To waynoI:  "JayP

I totally agree that giving two yellows for handbags in a total cop out. As another thread says, its a pet hate of the OP's and its also a pet hate of mine. Its infuriating.

It doesn't change the fact that when you are on a yellow you cant go in for the kind of tackles Derm went in for. The offence he got his second yellow for, was as stonewall a booking as you will see.

We can complain all we want about the first booking, but that's not the offence that got him the line. Its called discipline, Derm didn't have it yesterday. I love the guy, he is an absolute genius, his two points yesterday where worth the admission fee on their own, the bloke is immense, But again his discipline was an issue."
Wrong he got two yellow cards
So both cards resulted in him getting the line. If he hadn't of been given the first he wouldn't have got the line

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 16:20:43    1897425

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Replying To cavanman47:  "But whether Murphy "struck" is open to interpretation as his arm was with a straight arm - and if you look at the ref's positioning you can see how he would have considered it more a clothes-line than a strike. I'm not so sure he saw Murphy catching Fenton square in the jaw with the closed fist, but I'm also not sure that was Murphy's intention (so he can be exonerated of an attempted strike).

O'Gara's is only just a red by the absolute letter of the law and to be honest, if you were to give a red for every one of those, very few teams would end a game with more than 11 men."
Doesn't matter he struck to in the face whatever way you want to look at it the rule is a red card for that , if you think he ment it or not he committed the challenge in that manner so you take the punishement for connecting with the player in that way.

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 16:23:18    1897427

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I was seriously impressed with Dublin yesterday. Before the match I thought Donegal had a great chance for an upset, Dublin were untested and there was opportunity for an upset. When the chance came, Dublin didn't implode, they kept their heads so well and some of their players really stood up and were counted, Kilkenny, Small, their whole full back line and McMennamon in particular.
Donegal, like Tyrone earlier, were unable to change their game plan to come back when they needed to push on to win the game. Their rigidity in 'the system' was their downfall. Regardless of their keep ball sessions, Dublin's forwards showed how important it is to be able to kick the ball over the bar. Donegal management have to ask themselves, have they done enough work in this regard. On numerous occasions, shots were on that most other teams would have taken on but they constantly recycled when they could have been chipping away at the Dublin lead. Dublins defensive shape was very good even when they went down to 14.
Connolly would frustrate the hell out of you if you were a Dublin fan. On another day, he scores 2 goals along with those 2 superb points off either foot and probably a man of the match trophy too. If you're on a yellow, why on earth would you go in with a challenge like the one he did on Anthony Thompson. He goes into the Kerry game with an even bigger target on his back which you know some of the Kerry boys will love to aim for. A liability for this team with this kind of carry on. I know Gavin will defend him in public but I'd say he was fuming in the dressing room after.
All the same, take the freakish nature of the goal out of it and Dublin were miles ahead of Donegal. It will need something very special from Kerry to beat them now, that was the test to wake Dublin up and get them ready for the future challenges

keithlemon (Australia) - Posts: 920 - 07/08/2016 17:24:59    1897470

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Replying To hill16no1man:  "If it's not brown nosing then its idiotic to suggest a player desrves a red card for an open palm shove and another player only deserves a yellow for a clear closed fist punch. Regardless of what colour Jersey that are wearing.
I fully was amazed bastick didn't get a yellow card he clearly hauled him down but to say Connolly is not targetted is just sheer silly and to suggest he deserves the same punishment is ridiculous. Yes trying to get in with the game while the guy is trying to get him sent off by whatever means possible that's not part of our game of Gaelic football and has no place in the game or the rules for that matter."
I agree with you that Connolly is targetted but to listen to you you'd think he is the only player coming in for this sort of attention. He isn't.

Gooch. Star, O'Shea, McManus, Murphy Cavanagh & many others come in for special attention & it is going to continue until the linesmen & umpires man up & get involved.

Connolly is a great player but he is going to have to learn that football as it is now played is going to require him to have enormous levels of patience. If he reacts then teams will only get on to him even more.

MuckrossHead (Donegal) - Posts: 5028 - 07/08/2016 17:44:09    1897484

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This portrayal of Connolly as a victim yesterday is wearing thin. He received two yellows, one for a scuffle with Ryan McHugh, where he targeted McHugh, and the second for a high tackle. Both warranted. Reality is that Connolly like all top forwards (Murphy, Kavanagh, O'Donoghue, O'Shea, etc) will be targeted for special attention. Gavin knows this, hence the attempt to deflect from Connollys misdemeanours

PabloD007 (Donegal) - Posts: 11 - 07/08/2016 17:56:12    1897492

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Best Dublin performance I've seen in a long time, grit, determined, resilant, strength was very impressive great team performance. Dublins game management has come on leaps and bounds.

Feel far more confident after yesterday.

TheUsername (Dublin) - Posts: 4515 - 07/08/2016 18:03:26    1897499

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Replying To MuckrossHead:  "I agree with you that Connolly is targetted but to listen to you you'd think he is the only player coming in for this sort of attention. He isn't.

Gooch. Star, O'Shea, McManus, Murphy Cavanagh & many others come in for special attention & it is going to continue until the linesmen & umpires man up & get involved.

Connolly is a great player but he is going to have to learn that football as it is now played is going to require him to have enormous levels of patience. If he reacts then teams will only get on to him even more."
I'm not solely saying Connolly is the only player I never have.
the point im making in Connolly is simply because I go to all the Dublin matches and see it happening in person . I don't go to the other counties games so therefore I cannot see it happening as the camera only shows you what happens on the ball when I see them play on tv. So I cannot comment on them players week in week out. From my experience gaelic football and hurling are two sports that you cannot form a clear picture of from television you need to be there to take in everything as so much happens off the ball, be that movement or incidents

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 18:21:39    1897517

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Replying To hill16no1man:  "Doesn't matter he struck to in the face whatever way you want to look at it the rule is a red card for that , if you think he ment it or not he committed the challenge in that manner so you take the punishement for connecting with the player in that way."
In that case Philly McMahon deserved a red for what he did to Donaghy last year, whether it was intentional or not doesn't matter. Didn't hear you banging on about that. Just let it go man. Fenton ducked into the challenge and Murphy was lucky. O'Gara was unlucky but will no doubt get cleared anyway and it wasted 2.5 mins of the game. You played great and won comfortably. Just enjoy it.

benjyyy (Donegal) - Posts: 1428 - 07/08/2016 19:45:17    1897572

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Replying To benjyyy:  "In that case Philly McMahon deserved a red for what he did to Donaghy last year, whether it was intentional or not doesn't matter. Didn't hear you banging on about that. Just let it go man. Fenton ducked into the challenge and Murphy was lucky. O'Gara was unlucky but will no doubt get cleared anyway and it wasted 2.5 mins of the game. You played great and won comfortably. Just enjoy it."
I am enjoying it my friend

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 19:56:14    1897578

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Replying To hill16no1man:  "I'm not solely saying Connolly is the only player I never have.
the point im making in Connolly is simply because I go to all the Dublin matches and see it happening in person . I don't go to the other counties games so therefore I cannot see it happening as the camera only shows you what happens on the ball when I see them play on tv. So I cannot comment on them players week in week out. From my experience gaelic football and hurling are two sports that you cannot form a clear picture of from television you need to be there to take in everything as so much happens off the ball, be that movement or incidents"
Look the issue is lads are thumping Connolly dragging him to the ground in every game. The guys who instigate the scuffles get the same punishment as the guys who retaliate. I'm at every game, Connolly gets serious abuse. There have been games where he has turned to the umpire/linesman and was asking them to do something about the carry on of the opposition. The officials are looking at this stuff. Slapping him, punching him tripping him up. And when they wrestle him to the ground he is automatically given a yellow card. The guy who pulled him down gets a yellow.

Sometimes I get the feeling officials see it as a badge of honour to send Connolly off. Apparently you can do anything you want to him, but the moment he reacts the officials are all over it. None of the other stuff matters. It's Connolly, here's my chance. Now I'm not saying he didn't deserve the second yellow. 100% a yellow. The first one was a disgrace though.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 07/08/2016 19:58:03    1897580

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Replying To JayP:  "Look the issue is lads are thumping Connolly dragging him to the ground in every game. The guys who instigate the scuffles get the same punishment as the guys who retaliate. I'm at every game, Connolly gets serious abuse. There have been games where he has turned to the umpire/linesman and was asking them to do something about the carry on of the opposition. The officials are looking at this stuff. Slapping him, punching him tripping him up. And when they wrestle him to the ground he is automatically given a yellow card. The guy who pulled him down gets a yellow.

Sometimes I get the feeling officials see it as a badge of honour to send Connolly off. Apparently you can do anything you want to him, but the moment he reacts the officials are all over it. None of the other stuff matters. It's Connolly, here's my chance. Now I'm not saying he didn't deserve the second yellow. 100% a yellow. The first one was a disgrace though."
Haha I take it you didn't mean to attach my post as i basically said same thing haha

hill16no1man (Dublin) - Posts: 12665 - 07/08/2016 20:02:04    1897584

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Spot on Jayp. He was out and out targeted. Keegan came out last year and stated that he targeted Connolly. Cribbin came out this year and stated that his team targeted Connolly. This level of public acknowledgement is unprecedented in my experience. I've never heard of teams and players admitting that they target a specific individual to get him sent off. With that much publicity about it the least Connolly should expect is some form of protection from the officials. Instead he get's attention again yesterday and a yellow for his opponent dragging him to the ground and trying to pin him. Bizarre. Absolutely Bastick should have got a black yesterday. Anyway, water under the bridge now.

Joxer (Dublin) - Posts: 4742 - 07/08/2016 20:25:45    1897591

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People defending Diarmuid Connolly are giving him encouagement to continue with his ways. An opposing player need only put a hand on his hair and he is sucked into conflict. The reality is that his ways could cost Dublin an All-Ireland. Saying that he should not have got the first yellow is turning a blind eye to his subsequent play, it has been said here by other posters that he could have a yellow card on two other occasions. Jim Gavin surely erred in not substituting him, especially considering the array of talent he has on the bench.
Dublin had to win the game twice yesterday but it is players like John Small, Kieran Killkenny and Kevin McMenamin they need to thank most. Surely Kevin McMenamin has now secured his place on the starting team for the remainder of the championship.

fainleog (Limerick) - Posts: 602 - 07/08/2016 20:42:54    1897604

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Replying To fainleog:  "People defending Diarmuid Connolly are giving him encouagement to continue with his ways. An opposing player need only put a hand on his hair and he is sucked into conflict. The reality is that his ways could cost Dublin an All-Ireland. Saying that he should not have got the first yellow is turning a blind eye to his subsequent play, it has been said here by other posters that he could have a yellow card on two other occasions. Jim Gavin surely erred in not substituting him, especially considering the array of talent he has on the bench.
Dublin had to win the game twice yesterday but it is players like John Small, Kieran Killkenny and Kevin McMenamin they need to thank most. Surely Kevin McMenamin has now secured his place on the starting team for the remainder of the championship."
You say continue his ways? Like he's the problem? He might have a short fuse etc as you say. But you are saying a tap on the head sends him over the edge. The point posters are making, is before that, he's been dragged down twice, punched 4 times, tripped up.....and he gets zero protection. You should just see what you lads don't see on RTE and Sky. He is more sinned against.

Video ref is the way forward.

JayP (Dublin) - Posts: 1772 - 07/08/2016 21:05:31    1897624

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Replying To JayP:  "You say continue his ways? Like he's the problem? He might have a short fuse etc as you say. But you are saying a tap on the head sends him over the edge. The point posters are making, is before that, he's been dragged down twice, punched 4 times, tripped up.....and he gets zero protection. You should just see what you lads don't see on RTE and Sky. He is more sinned against.

Video ref is the way forward."
JayP and Joxer, all of your posts re Connolly suggest he was the victim yesterday and goaded into his first yellow. This is frankly a misrepresentation of what happened. He was booked after a tussle with Ryan McHugh initiated by Connolly who blocked McHughs run when Donegal were on the attack. Whatever about previous matches, this red was all of Connollys own making.

PabloD007 (Donegal) - Posts: 11 - 07/08/2016 21:19:29    1897636

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